Feedback: "Who Will Die?" Part 1
By
Agent White,
Posted on: 2011-09-20 02:41 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
I don't see a change to the market coming just because you can earn two alignment merits in two days or four in six days if you change alignments.
It's 2 Reward Merits the first time through, then 5 after that. You can get a maximum of 40 merits in one week by doing both sides.
The rewards are not overblown when they're on a 1 week cooldown.
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It's a nearly effortless way to earn alignment merits that didn't exist last week.|
Originally Posted by Mr. DJ
I don't see a change to the market coming just because you can earn two alignment merits in two days or four in six days if you change alignments.
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Whether or not that can impact the economy I leave for others to discuss, as it wasn't at all my point.
Doesn't matter if it wasn't your point, you opened it up and I dropped my 2 cents concerning it.
These arcs operate differently than standard content. I thought that was made obvious months ago.
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Then I guess you never bothered to read the contact's dialogue? Aside from the last mission, most of the story is there.
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Originally Posted by fallenz
There was a story in this? I was too busy running from stuff trying to beat a clock in two missions and the last mission, I was too busy trying to fight ambushes to notice a story. Kinda reminds of writing on Khan TF: a cure for sleepness.
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The -fly of the Lava didn't affect the Rocket Board?
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Originally Posted by SlickRiptide
I'd just like to say that Super Speed + Lava = Thank Deity for Rocket Board!
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Speeding Through New DA Repeatables || Spreadsheet o' Enhancements || Zombie Skins: better skins for these forums || Guide to Guides
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Hmm, -fly of the Lava didn't affect my Fly. So I'm guessing it's only a problem if you dive into the lava or are particularly close.
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Originally Posted by Zombie Man
The -fly of the Lava didn't affect the Rocket Board?
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Let's Dance!
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Doesn't matter what you thought was obvious months ago. The arcs went live yesterday and I commented on them.|
Originally Posted by Mr. DJ
Doesn't matter if it wasn't your point, you opened it up and I dropped my 2 cents concerning it.
These arcs operate differently than standard content. I thought that was made obvious months ago. |
And the only parts I see operating differently than standard content are the rewards.
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Ditto. I actually stopped to fight a few pumice heads and scored some extra time. So I took out the pretty looking boss. Then ran like hell and barely even noticed there were people in the last room.|
Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
Amazingly enough - I did. I had no spoilers, no advice, just GET THE HELL OUT. Ninja Ran thru the cavern, jumped over any pumicite in my way, tried to open the door, no dice, saw the big rock door next to it, figured "what the hell", tried that "hey it works!", ran like hell some more, and made it to the true door with 40 seconds to spare. In fact, I beat the CoT and whassername OUT the door.
Michelle aka Samuraiko/Dark_Respite |
Then I ran it on a villain last night. Fine, it was a villainous WS with stealth so I really had no problem evading the rockheads, but anyway, made it to the last room with time to claim the glowie and get the clue.
@Johnstone & @Johnstone 2
ediblePoly.com
All my characters
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Actually, it does matter, since we had a idea of what the awards would be ahead of time. Don't include information that has nothing to do with your point.|
Originally Posted by Chaos_String
Doesn't matter what you thought was obvious months ago. The arcs went live yesterday and I commented on them.
And the only parts I see operating differently than standard content are the rewards. |
dun dun dun...gratz on just repeating what I said
I admit that I think the reward tables seem excessive (one IO worth 150 million for 40 minutes of play!!), but this might be due to the "first time" reward (If I understood Posi correctly).
I am making 2 Hero Merits in 40 or so minutes on every alts now because they have never done this arc. After this week, all they can hope to attain is 1 Hero merit a week. And since all episodes of the arc share the cooldown, I can't run all episodes back to back and get 7 merits in 2 hours.
I still think it might be a lot, but not drastic enough, nor available enough to cause massive farming and dry other parts of the game as other content has done.
After all my alts have run this, I'll treat it as a sort of weekly stipend of one H merit.
I am confused.....about what Positron said about Double rewards for the first time playing it....
I did this for the first time last night with a little help....4 other players...=^_^=
Thought it would be neat to have other with me getting confused or helping me along when i got confused....
It was ok....the story on the first mission was a little confusing as it seamed things happened with no explanation.....someone in the Team said we needed to slow down and savor the missions more to get more out of it...so we did...
Ran the second mission...it was ok.....thrid was really neat with a great map.....hope to be able to actualy go to the real area sometime inthe furtue.
But as for the rewards....I dont understand the double rewards reference at all.....not sure what the double reward is that is being refered to.....had a choice of 4xmerits a astral merit a hero merit and some threads......so i dont think i am understanding double rewards for first time doing this....
Did i get the wrong rewards?
And if i didnt...how exactly are these considered double?
Also what was the deal with the comic book screen...just said press enter......was there supposed to be more to it?....I noticed no one else could read the dialogue much if they where not the team leader...so i am thinking there was supposed to be a comic book thing...so everyone could stay up to speed with the dialogue and mission things.....but guess not.
As for amount of time it took.....thats about right.....been doing other multi-chapter stories in other games and its about the same....might seam short just doing this chapter....but for some people they do alot of chapters all at once in those other games.
oh one thing that might be kind of neat to add if its not already going to be put in....maybe some puzzles or mini-games.....ok...I admit it...i am spoiled fromthe star trek online adventures they do....go figure.
An unavoidable pair of questions:
1: Are the rewards (including the content itself) worth the cash price paid by Preems for access?
2: Without the reward table, what would need to be added to the arc to make it worth it.
Infinity bonus points for answering question 2 non-subjectively.
Story Arcs I created:
Every Rose: (#17702) Villainous vs Legacy Chain. Forget Arachnos, join the CoT!
Cosplay Madness!: (#3643) Neutral vs Custom Foes. Heroes at a pop culture convention!
Kiss Hello Goodbye: (#156389) Heroic vs Custom Foes. Film Noir/Hardboiled detective adventure!
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If I was a high enough Tier Preem that I could use loot and if I had access to Fort Trident (not sure if you need GR for that) then I could see this arc being a value.| Are the rewards (including the content itself) worth the cash price paid by Preems for access? |
It takes 2 trips through the sewer trail to get to level 10 and then 45 mins to an hour to run the 1st SSA twice. That's an LoTG every 2 hours.
Outside of this small group of Preems I don't see this being worth $5 bucks. If I wasn't Vip I'd just hang out at Theodan or whatever contact is needed to start that months SSA and join a team.
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| Without the reward table, what would need to be added to the arc to make it worth it. |
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Good points. There is a danger here of getting the rewards nerfed to the point that they are useless to Preems, and thus useless to NCSoft.|
Originally Posted by warden_de_dios
For the amount of content you get for purchasing First Ward (which is a steal IMO) I don't see how any arc can ever be a value.
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By the same token, I'm not sure how much monetary value you can put on an arc based on content alone. Is this a $ per hour thing? Per xp? Per zone?
On the other hand, I bet NCSoft knows exactly how much that content costs to produce and maintain, and exactly how long they have to break even on it.
Personally, though, I don't have a problem with a 'buy this Merit, get free content included' situation. That's quantifiable, rather than saying an arc is not worth money because an individual player doesn't like that kind of content or the storyline, for instance.
Story Arcs I created:
Every Rose: (#17702) Villainous vs Legacy Chain. Forget Arachnos, join the CoT!
Cosplay Madness!: (#3643) Neutral vs Custom Foes. Heroes at a pop culture convention!
Kiss Hello Goodbye: (#156389) Heroic vs Custom Foes. Film Noir/Hardboiled detective adventure!
Something else I was wodnering about is if premiums/freebies have to buy the parts in order - like they can't buy part 3 without buying part 1 and 2 first, and if there'll be a discount for the whole story as a "bundle"?
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
okay.. I just did the villain side solo... as a squishy corruptor.
Died twice during the get 3 obelisk missions as the spawns were too much.
Died twice during the final mission as I couldn't beat Lemkin... then I figured the only way to fight someone who can only speed run is by kiting him. So I defeat him mostly by flying and having him run around in the lava... BUT.. I did finally beat him on land.. I think.
However, I lost the body and I had no idea how to get synapse's powers, so I had no choice but to finish the mission without his powers. I couldn't remember if I needed to stand next to Lemkin or the obelisk or Synapse's body to acquire Synapse's powers.. but nothing seemed to work, so I missed out on the fun.. or if the powers automatically transferred to me, I couldn't find any power icons in either the tray or power list.
I'll try it with another toon that's not so squishy.
You don't hit smiling monsters - Sister Flame
Maybe I'm just crazy but with just ninja run and sprint I was able to ditch the ambushes, dash past the mobs, and click the glowies before they could stop me. If I was really worried about ANY of my toons that I would take solo on a map, I'd just grab some purples. Bang ambushes over, gathered mobs dealt with. Mission continues as normal. Also I noticed someone complained it was hard with their UNSLOTTED dom. I just LOL at that. Why would you even try to judge the difficulty of an arc on an UNSLOTTED character anywhere past level 12?
As for the EB? Pretty much 1 word sums up how to beat the EB if your a poor solo character. Inspirations. They are all you need.
I swear it's like nobody remembers how we used to roll old school. Where we dealt with death on a daily basis and the good blasters were the ones not in perma debt lol. We are all so spoiled today that a little challenge comes our way and "omg, too hard".
Just like the occasional superspeeder or even ninja runner that says they can't make it through terra volta lol. I'm just sitting there thinking that I used to do it back in the day with swift/cj without significantly slowing the team down and btw Wire running in TV is awesome.
Yeah... my Stalkers are going to *love* this arc.
Level 15 (and change) Stalker. 10 or so minutes. 13 kills total = level 16 and a villain merit. Another 13 kills, 10 minutes or so. Another villain merit. So, at level 20, I can expect to be able to turn those in for a *very* tidy nest egg... and I'll be reaching 20 pretty darn fast if I run this again.
Heroside it's a little more hectic - you don't have a choice to not kill anyone in the first mission, apparently (have to look again,) the second has some ambushes that seem to come much quicker (of course, they are Igneous.) It's going to take longer.
Still, I do think something's off with being able to beat on the Lost EB at the end with no risk just by having hover or fly and ranged attacks. My Khelds love this, thanks.
You can go turn your hero merits in now if you want. I've already spent my merits at level 14.
Although at such low levels the good recipes aren't available and rolls aren't really a good idea.
Fighting bosses and elite bosses surrounded by lava with my mind/kin was a blast.
I tk'ed and repelled them right into the lava. 
Global Chat: @Prime Knight
Liberty
{Heroes}
Panthera Knight - Claws/SR/BM scrapper 50!!
Prime Knight - Mind/Kin/Psi controller 50!!
Pshun Keru - Triform peacebringer 50!!
Pius Knight - BS/DA scrapper +20
{Villains}
Kaiser Presul - Rob/FF mastermind +30
I'm totally confused by everyone saying it takes 40 minutes to run this arc twice.
The first time I did it, totally without having any idea what was coming or the layout of the maps, yeah. 20 minutes.
I've got a lot of alts. Everyone did it twice. My average time was about 10 minutes, my best time was 8. For 2 AMs. nom nom nom.
To those of you who DID do the redside arc, what did you have todoto acquire Synapse's powers?
You don't hit smiling monsters - Sister Flame
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All I had to do was fight an elite boss and the group that was there with it. There was one guy that it took me a sec to find though as it didn't aggro on me when I engaged the EB like its buddies.
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Originally Posted by Chuckers
To those of you who DID do the redside arc, what did you have todoto acquire Synapse's powers?
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MA Arcs: Yarmouth 1509 and 58812
matt ol' buddy there you go again... you've made coh a rich mans game. anyone with a lot of money can now buy their way to invincibility by purchasing credits for on line store and using them for super enhancements, enhancement buffs, etc...
some players dont have a thousand dollars or more to spend on credits. we actually play the game and earn our rewards,powers, etc...
you nerf builds and come out with other builds more powerful than the ones that were nerfed. ie: fire tanks/invulnerable tanks = nerfed and Stone Tanks were the new ones that were more powerful than the tanks being nerfed.
you nerfed ice trollers from 5 hack frosts dwn to one with absolutle no control capabilities and come out with masterminds with about 8 pets that can be controlled.
you nerf farms. why? almost everything we do in the game can be considered a farm. oh you dont want the game to be compromised? well then why do you allow us to buy exp boosters that last one hour?
rnjoy the extra money yu make from the one's who can afford the moneu to buff up all their lvl 50s, lol.
It's a bird no a plane , no it's Head Hunter!
There is a "First Time Played" reward, that is independent of the 1-week cooldown. Thus when you first play an SSA, it will seem like you can get two rewards. In the following weeks it will only be one.
All SSA's share the same week-long cooldown, so when you have SSA 1.1 and SSA 1.2 and SSA 1.3, you can only get one week-long cooldown reward, not one for each.
The above is the reason for the "First Time Played" reward. A player who starts playing SSAs in the middle or the end of the arc isn't gated by the week-long cooldowns. They can play each SSA and get the good reward table every time. Only after they have done the "First Time" will they be gated further by the week-long cooldown.
A hero merit for 5-10 minutes of breezy gameplay isn't remotely in keeping with the rewards for any other content.
Even the reward merit award is overblown. If you can do the arc in ten minutes--which anyone earnestly attempting to speed the content should be able to do--the twenty merit reward translates to 2 merits per minute or 120 merits per hour, comparable to a 14 minute ITF, a feat which requires a pretty solid team.
Yet hilarously, people in this thread are complaining about being "underwhelmed" by this reward for rogues and vigilantes, as it compares so poorly to the alignment merit reward.
Now, I'm not bringing this up because I forsee it'll change the in-game economy (although it might), but because of what it says about the game design principles being applied here.
These missions are quite good. But there are only three of them. No, there aren't six. There are two versions of one three-mission arc. The parts that excite us as players--and require actual developer man-hours to implement--namely, the new maps, the gameplay elements, the cutscene, characters and story--are pretty much if not entirely identical between the hero and villain versions. They're just presented with subtle differences, which I guess were easy to implement once the framework was in place. And the loot table--well, it's just a loot table. Nothing particularly interesting there.
So unless the goal is simply to create a marketable product on as low a budget as possible, why make the loot table the selling point? Why not make the content itself the selling point?
Just some food for thought, from one entertainer to another.