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Currently, it appears that the process takes the existing body and rebuilds it. It has been demonstrated that it is technically possible to guide it into specific forms (In the old series a Time Lady named Romana did this by copying someone she had seen previously, and the Time Lords themselves forced the Doctor through one to a pre-selected form [Second to third]). It is apparantly possible to disrupt the regeneration so as to kill the person 'for reals', as well as there being an unspecified amount of time after the event that the new body has heightened survivability (increased strength, ability to heal fairly significant damage, etc.) but also likely some mental instability.|
Originally Posted by Le Blanc
So when they do the Regen or Renewal thing are they jumping into somebody elses body, who was already walking around and had a life, or do they just appear fully formed in a new body out of nowhere?
If having that info is a spoiler thing feel free to say so and I will wait till I see it on the shows. Think I will pick up the first season of 05 today. |
Some other interesting factiods from the original series that may or may not be canon:
It was mentioned during the first Doctor's tenure [Dalek's Master Plan] that his appearance was not his 'true form'. This was before the regeneration idea was introduced, so what exactly they were referring to is unknown.
When Romana regenerated, while all the forms she was 'trying on' were humanoid, and most of them could pass as human, there were a few that were 'alien' by the standards of the show at that time.
On a two occasions 'projections' have needed to be present to 'boost' the regeneration to get it to activate. One being a projection of some future Doctor [Logopolis] and the other being a projection of a more experienced Time Lord [Planet of the Spiders].
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I was actually kinda intrigued by the idea behind Colin Baker's Doctor. Something goes wrong during the regeneration making the Doctor even more unbalanced than usual. I also thought it would've been a great character builder for Peri, who wasn't really much of a companion up till then.|
Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
On the other hand, the Sixth Doctor, basically everyone's least favorite, was supposed to have some kind of psychological breakdown during his regeneration, one of producer Jonathan Nathan-Turner's worst ideas.
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I liked the idea of a companion having to use their wits and persuasion to keep this semi-insane Time Lord in line. Suddenly, the standard roles of Doctor and companion are almost reversed. The Doctor is still getting involved in crazy and deadly situations, and if the companion wants his knowledge and expertise to survive, they'll need to keep him focused.
Sadly, the negative feedback seemed to make them back off that darker tone, leaving Colin Baker's Doctor rather undefined. Rather sad, since I thought "Trial of a Time Lord" proved that Baker could play a very good Doctor.
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Personally, though the golden glowy effect is cool, I liked the transformation in the movie. Shifting his jaw around trying to fit it into the changing shape of the skull was rather awesome, in a disquieting sort of way.|
Originally Posted by Thug_Two
In the early days the SFX were very limited: The first few doctors regenerated off-camera. Then were some regenerations where they basically defocused the camera while looking at the old actor, and re-focused with the new one wearing the same clothes (it helped that he was usually lying down at the time).
In the 'modern' series they do it with a gold glowy effect and morphing software. |
One other point about Time Lord regenerations: The regeneration energies the Time Lord unleashes during the process linger in his/her body for several hours after the transformation. Its like a massive release of adrenaline, it doesn't go away immediately. The Doc is usually a bit barmy for a while after the shock of the tranformation, since his altered personality is still settling in.
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I always thought those were Morbius' previous regenerations.
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Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
Another example is the parade of never-before-seen-and-never-seen-again images of previous Doctors during the Time Lord "mind-bending" contest between the Fourth Doctor and Morbius in "The Brain of Morbius".)
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The idea wasn't necessarily bad, but the execution was terrible. (Eccleston's Doctor may owe more to the Sixth than than most fans like to admit.) Supposedly Colin Baker has done good work properly characterizing the Sixth Doctor in various Big Finish audio adventures, though I haven't listened to any of these.|
Originally Posted by Cowman
I was actually kinda intrigued by the idea behind Colin Baker's Doctor. Something goes wrong during the regeneration making the Doctor even more unbalanced than usual.
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Likewise, there are a lot of spin-off Doctor Who media, e.g. audio plays, comics, and novels, that can be fun but aren't a good starting point for new fans.
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Well, the Master became a body-snatcher after he ran out of regenerations...
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
No. Still the same body. They're not body-snatchers.
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Goodbye may seem forever
Farewell is like the end
But in my heart's the memory
And there you'll always be
-- The Fox and the Hound
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Some of them were. The way the 'duel' was explained in-show was that the faces displayed were of the previous regenerations of the person losing the fight. The worse the loser was doing, the farther back in their own time stream the images would go. |
Originally Posted by Cowman
I always thought those were Morbius' previous regenerations.
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The problem was that when the Doctor was losing, it went through Pertwee, Troughton, Hartnell, and then *kept going* showing a bunch of other faces, all the while giving the audience the impression that the Doctor was still losing and Morbius was winning.
Now, it's been since ret-conned by fans that what happened was that Morbius was the one losing, but that Morbius *thought* he was winning because of the whole disimbodied brain bit was messing up the signals. Unfortunately, it wasn't presented that way.
What new people watching the old show need to keep in mind is that these characters were being defined on the fly most of the time. The actors were adding stuff ad-lib, writers made up stuff forgetting about, or simply ignoring, previous stuff, directors and producers throwing more stuff in on a whim. There wasn't a Canon Bible the way modern shows have. Consistancy wasn't as big a deal. It was all about the story of the moment.
Yeah there's a lot of spin off material.
Heck I OWN one of them which I picked up at a bootfare (that would be a Garage sale for ye Americanas) and its...well...kind of awful...
Absalom Dakk: Dalek Killer.
Thinkg gritty mid-90's antihero meets Dr Who (literally...one character is the antihero and the other is the Doctor..),
Badge Earned: Wing Clipper
A real showstopper!
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I dunno. I figure it was just simpler for the writers to say she'd used up her regens. Maybe they'll elaborate later down the road, or they'll just leave it be and let the fans speculate.|
Originally Posted by DarkGob
I thought the entire point was that being conceived within a Time Vortex made you a Time Lord regardless of your genetic origin.
And I don't think "I'm giving you all my regenerations (but what I actually mean is my ability to regenerate" is simpler than "I'm giving you my ability to regenerate". I think if they had meant that they would have just said it, but then it could just end up being a plot hole if they ever decide to address the Doctor's throw-away line from SJA on the main show. |
Whatever the case, it's a moot point considering what eventually happened to River.
Goodbye, I guess.
@Lord_Nightblade in Champions/Star Trek Online
nightblade7295@gmail.com if you want to stay in touch
On the topic of River, I would have gladly given up the whole twisted plot about her true identity and origin for a more well-planned romance in reverse with the Doctor. The first time she meets her she dies, and I would have loved for the first time she met him to be the day he died, and having her fall in love with him at the time of his death. And, yes, they threw some elements of that in, but they took the "She's a Time Vortex Baby" plot as the more important one, and allowed their timelines to jumble a bit more than a straight back-to-front line. Their romance is very cool to me, and very sad, and I wish that it could have continued as strongly as it had started.
Also, bring back Gen from "The Doctor's Daughter". She was way cool.
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They're a lot better if you're familiar with those Doctors first.
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Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
These crossover episodes are a bit of a mixed bag. Probably not a good place to start Who-viewing, although they have a lot of fun moment. Pertwee's and Troughton's Doctors played off one another quite amusingly in The Three Doctors and The Five Doctors.
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The second rule of Doctor Who club.|
Originally Posted by Head_Kracker
god I hope moffet didnt start a new rules meme
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WE DON'T TALK ABOUT DOCTOR WHO CLUB!
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Well yes. But he's The Master.|
Originally Posted by Tenzhi
Well, the Master became a body-snatcher after he ran out of regenerations...
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Hello? Villain?
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Originally Posted by DarkGob
I thought the entire point was that being conceived within a Time Vortex made you a Time Lord regardless of your genetic origin.
And I don't think "I'm giving you all my regenerations (but what I actually mean is my ability to regenerate" is simpler than "I'm giving you my ability to regenerate". I think if they had meant that they would have just said it, but then it could just end up being a plot hole if they ever decide to address the Doctor's throw-away line from SJA on the main show. |
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Originally Posted by Lord_Nightblade
I dunno. I figure it was just simpler for the writers to say she'd used up her regens. Maybe they'll elaborate later down the road, or they'll just leave it be and let the fans speculate.
Whatever the case, it's a moot point considering what eventually happened to River. |
The one thing that always bothered me is that the Doctor always seems to be younger than his previous regeneration.
Who knows how far this could go.
Father Xmas - Level 50 Ice/Ice Tanker - Victory
$725 and $1350 parts lists --- My guide to computer components
Tempus unum hominem manet
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No. She wasn't actually regenerating each time. The regeneration process, when not pushed by being critically wounded, is a more sedate event that the Time Lord can actually control. Additionally the process doesn't complete as soon as the form is changed. There's a 24 hour period during which some modicum of control can be exerted (such as the 10th Doctor regrowing a hand which was cut off).|
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
I was under the impression that Time Ladies didn't have any restrictions on the number of times they can regenerate. I distinctly remember Romana going thru half a dozen regenerations in the space of ten minutes, trying on new bodies/species for the Doctors approval before finally settling on the Lalla Ward version of Romana.
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So she was "trying on" new forms all as part of the SAME regeneration.
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The first one is kind of fun, but the second is terrible. Either way, both are non-canon and were never intended to be part of the actual Doctor Who story.|
Originally Posted by Ironblade
I haven't seen anyone mention the two feature films starring Peter Cushing as the Doctor.
muahahahahahahaha! |
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Originally Posted by Rodoan
Incidentally, though its not mentioned much of late, not every Gallifreyan is a Time Lord. I think it was the 4th Doctor and Leela who interacted with some "standard" Gallifreyans.
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Originally Posted by Thug_Two
In the early days the SFX were very limited: The first few doctors regenerated off-camera. Then were some regenerations where they basically defocused the camera while looking at the old actor, and re-focused with the new one wearing the same clothes (it helped that he was usually lying down at the time).
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I actually plotted it out once based on the ages of the actors when they started and although that is the general trend, it doesn't quite hold (Colin Baker after Davison, McCoy after Baker, Eccleston after McGann).
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Originally Posted by Father Xmas
The one thing that always bothered me is that the Doctor always seems to be younger than his previous regeneration.
Who knows how far this could go. |
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
Actually, I have a theory about that.
If you watch "The Green Death", look how the 3rd Doctor reacts when Jo tells him she is marrying "a younger version of you".
After that point the Doctor started regenerating younger.
I really should do something about this signature.
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An interesting theory. Somewhere out on the 'net there's another one that goes into great detail about how each regeneration's new persona is a reaction to the previous one's experiences, but this Reddit discussion is the best I could find at short notice. Meanwhile, back in reality, the casting choices for replacement actors over the years have been the decisions of the various Who producers on the basis of their plans for the next installment, the audience's preferences, and the pool of available candidates.
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
Actually, I have a theory about that.
If you watch "The Green Death", look how the 3rd Doctor reacts when Jo tells him she is marrying "a younger version of you". After that point the Doctor started regenerating younger. |
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mmm.... |
Originally Posted by DarkGob
I actually plotted it out once based on the ages of the actors when they started and although that is the general trend, it doesn't quite hold (Colin Baker after Davison, McCoy after Baker, Eccleston after McGann).
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Eccleston after McGann, though... he's been through quite a bit. That is, after all, where he destroys/locks away the Daleks and Time Lords and goes to the "disillusioned warrior" attitude.
If he'd ever have a right to be a bit worn looking... which rather fits TG's comment.
This should clear up the confusion about regenerations...
Part 1 of 4...
Story Arcs I created:
Every Rose: (#17702) Villainous vs Legacy Chain. Forget Arachnos, join the CoT!
Cosplay Madness!: (#3643) Neutral vs Custom Foes. Heroes at a pop culture convention!
Kiss Hello Goodbye: (#156389) Heroic vs Custom Foes. Film Noir/Hardboiled detective adventure!
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My theory to explain this away...Time Lords can see all of time, everything that was, everything that is, everything that will be. There is a future version of the Doctor that is human on his "mother's" side ( Donna). Maybe Doctor Eight saw that and got confused... |
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Welllllllllll.... if you listen to the Eight Doctor, he's human on his mother's side. But that, IIRC, kind of came out of nowhere.
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Kyle Al'Mordu - Lvl 50 MA/SR Scrap
Fusion Force!
TRIUMPH
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I remember there was a comic where Eight made a passing mention to once tricking an enemy into believing that he was half-human. Ha. |
Originally Posted by Kyle_Al_Mordu
My theory to explain this away...Time Lords can see all of time, everything that was, everything that is, everything that will be. There is a future version of the Doctor that is human on his "mother's" side ( Donna). Maybe Doctor Eight saw that and got confused...
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I think it was part of the mini-series "The Forgotten" where Ten has amnesia in a museum dedicated to his past lives. Which actually sort of echoes episodes like "Turn Left" and "The Doctor's Wife" in certain plot points/reveals. Good stuff.
There is an art, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. --The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
Now we aren't ready quite yet to let the catgirls out of the bag.... (quote from ex libris)