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Unfinished COH Plot threads

Adeon Hawkwood

By Adeon Hawkwood,
Posted on: 2010-10-31 07:08 in CoH and CoV General Discussions

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by cursedsorcerer View Post
The only reason why Gyrfalcon is in the game is that in the beta, Gyrfalcon was Akarist of the Circle of Thorns, who the beta testers criticized as not actually being a villain.
Oh, I know WHY he's there in terms of the development cycle, he still bugs me .

 

Posted

Good thread, meets with my approval!

There's a number of "unfinished plots" - I had a list once but I lost it but there's also been some other questions...

Frostfire, one of the signature lowbie encounters, is suddenly appearing in high level content and fighting along side you against Malta.

Who is Dr Kahn? Almost all other TFs and most trials are delivered by a signature character, a member of Freedom Phalanx. Even the opposite version is delivered by a signature character - Baracuda - and yet here we have an odd scenario where somebody we have no idea who they are, nor who they are connected to - gives you a mission to save the world. This may not be an unfinished plot but it's certainly incongruous.

Quote:
(Edit to add I've just gotten this from Paragon Wiki:

Information

Portal Corp. Historian
Dr. Scott Kahn is one of Portal Corporation's top researchers and historians. While his particular field of study is the strange world of parallel dimensions, he's also very interested in the history of heroes and villains in Paragon City.)


Why isn't Blue Steel featuring in the Clockwork King's Revenge? CK seems quite happy to totally ignore his effective creator. What?


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarlet Shocker View Post
Frostfire, one of the signature lowbie encounters, is suddenly appearing in high level content and fighting along side you against Malta.
Well his bio always made him out to be a fallen wannabe-hero rather than an out and out villain (link) so it's not entirely unreasonable that after the events in the Hollows he reformed. It would be nice to have a little more info on it though.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarlet Shocker View Post
Why isn't Blue Steel featuring in the Clockwork King's Revenge?
Because the CK isn't totally dumb

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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood View Post
Oh, I know WHY he's there in terms of the development cycle, he still bugs me .
What's wrong with him? I think it's cool to see one of Malta's leaders show up.

@Golden Girl

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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
What's wrong with him? I think it's cool to see one of Malta's leaders show up.
the problem is this is the only time he shows up and he's never mentioned anywhere else before this TF.

 

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Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
What's wrong with him? I think it's cool to see one of Malta's leaders show up.
DMystic covers one reason, but the other is that it doesn't really fit with the rest of the Malta lore. In the Project World Wide Red arc you go to a huge amount of effort just to track down one of Malta's Directors, the idea that Reichsman can just waltz into our dimension and make contact with a member of the "Council of Leaders" (who presumably outrank the directors) is really hard to believe.

The other AVs are more realistic, both Vanessa and Countess Crey would be relatively easy to find and the Nemesis robot present is established to be a fake but Gyrfalcon has no justification other than "we need a replace AV, fast". If they'd put something in to establish that he was just a random senior Malta operative I wouldn't mind but making him "the Malta Group's top general and the only known member of the organization's mysterious Council of Leaders" doesn't really fit with the rest of the Malta content unless Reichsman is a heck of a lot better at finding people than Crimson, Indigo and the rest of their organization (some vaguely defined governmental counter-espionage group)

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by DMystic View Post
the problem is this is the only time he shows up and he's never mentioned anywhere else before this TF.
Malta likes to be secretive

@Golden Girl

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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood View Post
DMystic covers one reason, but the other is that it doesn't really fit with the rest of the Malta lore. In the Project World Wide Red arc you go to a huge amount of effort just to track down one of Malta's Directors, the idea that Reichsman can just waltz into our dimension and make contact with a member of the "Council of Leaders" (who presumably outrank the directors) is really hard to believe.

The other AVs are more realistic, both Vanessa and Countess Crey would be relatively easy to find and the Nemesis robot present is established to be a fake but Gyrfalcon has no justification other than "we need a replace AV, fast". If they'd put something in to establish that he was just a random senior Malta operative I wouldn't mind but making him "the Malta Group's top general and the only known member of the organization's mysterious Council of Leaders" doesn't fit with the rest of the Malta content.
But maybe Malta made contact with Reichsman first, rather than him making contact with them?

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Posted

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Originally Posted by Olantern View Post
"cursed artifacts being smuggled into the city for some reason" group, consisting of the Hellions, the Outcasts, and being run (?) by the Warriors.
I always wanted a satisfactory conclusion to that arc - it just kind of fizzled out as you got distracted with higher level arcs.

But all things considered, I'd much rather have a whole issue devoted to what happened to Dark Astoria and some attempts to resolve it (in fact, I wonder if the new tech which allows contacts to disappear could apply to whole zones and we could have a restored Dark Astoria).

(Yeah, I know - so unlikely, but it could be so awesome).

Ironically, I normally don't like magic plots (Science! for me please), but Dark Astoria needs some kind of resolution.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
But maybe Malta made contact with Reichsman first, rather than him making contact with them?
Well first off why would they do that? Malta's goal is to eliminate all super-powered individuals who won't work for them. Reichsman represents a pretty serious threat since he's trying to take over the multi-verse and doesn't seem like he'd be willing to join Malta. Even if they did decide to try and convince him to join them having their top general go to negotiate directly goes completely against their modus operandi. They have a heavily compartmentalized cell structure for a reason. Their top leaders set things up so that finding one of them is almost impossible simply because their own troops don't know who they are. Having one of them voluntarily go to meet with Reichsman goes completely against that.

If they'd setup a dialogue/background for Gyrfalcon that established he was a moderately senior operative that Reichsman was trying to "convince" to divulge information on Malta's leadership I'd be fine with it. Establishing him as one of Malta's top leadership doesn't fit with the lore.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood View Post
Well his bio always made him out to be a fallen wannabe-hero rather than an out and out villain (link) so it's not entirely unreasonable that after the events in the Hollows he reformed. It would be nice to have a little more info on it though.
Here's the funny thing. The Tip missions actually form kind of a loosely knit story arc for certain characters, and Frostfire is one of them. There's a whole story in those alignment missions of Frostfire's fall from power after losing his street cred for being, you know, beaten up by every hero in town. At first he tries revenge and bitterness, but over the course of losing more he eventually hits rock bottom and then starts to claw his way out of that and make something of himself. All of this takes place in tip missions ranging from the early ones you receive in the 20s to the level 40+'s.

I rather like it. Frostfire is someone who deep down wants to be a hero, but has made a lot of bad choices.

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RE; Frostfire: There's actually a (kind of) coherent storylin to him progressing through the tip missions. (Starting out as having escaped to th Rogue Isles after one too many beatings by heroes, and ending with the villain Morality mission where he is apparently, a God in the future, and the greatest champion of justice history will ever know)

"Men strunt �r strunt och snus �r snus
om ock i gyllne dosor.
Och rosor i ett sprucket krus
�r st�ndigt alltid rosor."

 

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Originally Posted by Arilou View Post
* Nemesis plots. Assuming he has a big one, and not just a couple of smaller schemes.
Like causing the rikti to invade?

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Originally Posted by Terminal Velocity View Post
Like causing the rikti to invade?
The Rikti Plot always felt more like something he kept thinkering with than his grand Master Plan. Especially since uploading himself into the Rikti Hivemind was his backup-plan.

It would be interesting if we could get a collection of the tip missions and the info you get from them going, and heck, a chart of the development of arious characters (like Frostfire and Miss Thystle)

"Men strunt �r strunt och snus �r snus
om ock i gyllne dosor.
Och rosor i ett sprucket krus
�r st�ndigt alltid rosor."

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood View Post
Well first off why would they do that? Malta's goal is to eliminate all super-powered individuals who won't work for them. Reichsman represents a pretty serious threat since he's trying to take over the multi-verse and doesn't seem like he'd be willing to join Malta. Even if they did decide to try and convince him to join them having their top general go to negotiate directly goes completely against their modus operandi. They have a heavily compartmentalized cell structure for a reason. Their top leaders set things up so that finding one of them is almost impossible simply because their own troops don't know who they are. Having one of them voluntarily go to meet with Reichsman goes completely against that.

If they'd setup a dialogue/background for Gyrfalcon that established he was a moderately senior operative that Reichsman was trying to "convince" to divulge information on Malta's leadership I'd be fine with it. Establishing him as one of Malta's top leadership doesn't fit with the lore.

I never understood why they didn't just substitute Baron Zora (or is Zoria?) for Akarist.

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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arilou View Post
RE; Frostfire: There's actually a (kind of) coherent storylin to him progressing through the tip missions. (Starting out as having escaped to th Rogue Isles after one too many beatings by heroes, and ending with the villain Morality mission where he is apparently, a God in the future, and the greatest champion of justice history will ever know)
If that's the case I sure hope he gets a new costume at some point. His old one is fine for a gang leader, but rather unimpressive for a hero.

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Posted

This sounds like a Job For (Oh where did I put that Signal) ARBIE FAB!

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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by StormSurvivor View Post
Sorry to be off topic, but I was not aware of this. What level range do I need to try and get myself a morality mission on as soon as possible?
It's the level 20-30 villain Morality mission.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood View Post
DMystic covers one reason, but the other is that it doesn't really fit with the rest of the Malta lore. In the Project World Wide Red arc you go to a huge amount of effort just to track down one of Malta's Directors, the idea that Reichsman can just waltz into our dimension and make contact with a member of the "Council of Leaders" (who presumably outrank the directors) is really hard to believe.
I think they're supposed to be the same thing. You know, a bunch of guys who were working in intelligence during the cold war. They are old and even with the Eyepatch and Hat of DOOOOMMM and guns held sideways their aim probably sucks by now. Also a bunch of guys who NEVER NEED TO SHOW THEMSELVES, because they can kill you with a phone call. Or if you're a real threat, they'll sic a giant robot on you.

Really though, I just shrug off any "loose threads" from the Khan and Barracuda TFs as bad writing and/or did not do the research. The whole thing should be done over. And Vanessa De Vore and Countess Crey will take offense at their portrayal in the train wreck that was Khan v 1.0, and erase everyone's memories of the event. It'll be like none of it ever happened.

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Originally Posted by warden_de_dios View Post
thats a bummer, I always thought there was some other Big Bad just off camera. Knowing it's just a Nictus kinda kills the cut scene.
I'd like to point out that it's a Nictus without a host, and with nothing around it to allow it to exist for more than a moment without one.

Romulis is taken off guard when it merges with him, so he's never seen it do that before. He's used to it being the floating ball of dark energy, despite the lack of life support.

A normal Nictus can't do that. A normal Nictus can't splinter off parts of itself and then reabsorb them to revive its host. If there's an Incarnate level Nictus, that one's it.

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Posted

Y'know, I used to play the game with the mentality "click here to beat things up" and didn't read anything but the Trial Zone dialogue (Hollows, Faultline, Striga, Croatoa); but lately I've been reading as much contact dialogue as possible. It all kind of mixes because I can't tell which contacts are older than each other, but it's nice to be getting all these facts that I've been missing up until now.

I also found it interesting that by "updating" the Praetorian arcs (which I did read through the first time), they didn't just retcon it all.

EDIT: They should really pay the storywriting dev(s) overtime to play through every storyarc in the game before they write anything new.

 

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The Blood of the Black Stream and the Dark Astoria situation (which I think will be dealt with at some point soon given the amount it's mentioned in the tip missions) are definitely up there for me.

One that nobody mentioned so far is the interfaction strife within the Freakshow. Yes, you put a stop to it in the level 30-35 Freakshow arc and then you get to beat up Dreck in a lvl 45+ mission, but it doesn't really feel like a good ending to it. I think we really need to see Upstart bust out of prison and be taken down in a story arc at some point.

 

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Originally Posted by New_Age_Ronin View Post
The Blood of the Black Stream and the Dark Astoria situation (which I think will be dealt with at some point soon given the amount it's mentioned in the tip missions) are definitely up there for me.
I think it is kind of doubtful we'll EVER see the Blood of the Black Stream finished. It is kind of annoying because there are several hints during the lower level arcs and the fact the oil spill actually forms an Eye of Ra when viewed from the air obviously means they were going to be included back when CoV was still in planning and then dumped.

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabid_Metroid View Post
I'd like to point out that it's a Nictus without a host, and with nothing around it to allow it to exist for more than a moment without one.

Romulis is taken off guard when it merges with him, so he's never seen it do that before. He's used to it being the floating ball of dark energy, despite the lack of life support.

A normal Nictus can't do that. A normal Nictus can't splinter off parts of itself and then reabsorb them to revive its host. If there's an Incarnate level Nictus, that one's it.
So when we beat Rommi do we also defeat the nictus that Rommi is talking to in that cut scene?