It's easier to manipulate when there's less participants. For Red side the market has gone from support of approximately 50,000 people to 150,000.
Blue side is going from 100,000 to 150,000. THis wil lmake manipulating the market harder. People will also find it almost impossible to corner the market on items.
Overall Red side should see an reduction in prices and blue side will probably see an increase.
Also if you sell things on the market instead of just buying stuff you'll be able to make tons of inf.
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Based on my experience, probably the reverse. I normally play redside but I've lately been working up a defender and every time I walk into the market I end up with an "OMG I can sell this for that much?!" face. And I mean on everything, dud recipes aside.|
Originally Posted by DMystic
Overall Red side should see an reduction in prices and blue side will probably see an increase.
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Edit: I forgot! DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOM!
I assure you that the near unanimous marketeer support for a merge is altruistic. Well, sort of. While it will be much harder to do some types of marketeering, there will also be more things to do with that cash.
Coming to such realization is just a sign of TRUE EBIL. Even if you lose you win! MWAHAHAHAHA.
A game is not supposed to be some kind of... place where people enjoy themselves!
Good point that I missed about more peeps = harder to corner things unless...more peeps create larger EBILMANIPULATINGMARKETEERCLUBS.
Masterminds annoy everybody, sooner or later. Heck, Masterminds annoy themselves.
-ShadowsBetween
I think what will happen is people that aren't willing to use the market will continue to complain about the prices of things they want on the market.
People that use the market will continue to have more inf than they need to outfit their toons with everything short of purps/pvp IO's.
People that focus on the market will continue to have more INF than the twenty email slots can hold.
Prices as a whole are just digits, whether they move up or down is all relative.
It will probably have a side effect of drawing people redside as well.
A lot of people I've seen have mentioned that they like the story arcs redside, but the market prices are a deterrent to playing there. Once the market is all the same they can play the story arcs they like and won't have to worry about not being able to buy the stuff they want.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
I predict more availability and lower prices for recipes at the BM and lower prices for Magic salvage at WW. Things will fluctuate wildly for a bit and then settle down to a new "normal". Then GR will hit and everything will be tossed into the air again to fall where it may and restabilize. Such is a supply and demand system.
Dec out.
I honestly don't care what this does to prices red-side, for a simple fact of life - no amount of money can buy what isn't being sold.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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*raises fingers to temples* I predict much joy, peppered with doom.
The intended effects expected are of course for the redside economy to become more stable with prices trending downwards. Because so many smart people have written long explanations about how this works (most of it going straight over my head) I'm going to take their word for it until the nay-sayers are proven right by the evidence.
K5K - The Killbot 5000
A Spanner In The Works Part One, ArcID: 336662, A Spanner In The Works Part Two, ArcID: 336665, Enter Japes, ArcID: 96001
In The Darkness Creeping, ArcID: 347709, When Dimensions Collide, ArcID: 412416.
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The market merge is due at the same time as GR comes out.
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Originally Posted by Decorum
I predict more availability and lower prices for recipes at the BM and lower prices for Magic salvage at WW. Things will fluctuate wildly for a bit and then settle down to a new "normal". Then GR will hit and everything will be tossed into the air again to fall where it may and restabilize. Such is a supply and demand system.
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Character index
Supply will go down, and prices will go up.
Then supply will go up and prices will go down.
Then it will happen again.
50s: Inv/SS PB Emp/Dark Grav/FF DM/Regen TA/A Sonic/Elec MA/Regen Fire/Kin Sonic/Rad Ice/Kin Crab Fire/Cold NW Merc/Dark Emp/Sonic Rad/Psy Emp/Ice WP/DB FA/SM
Overlord of Dream Team and Nightmare Squad
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For a lot players, I suspect the difference will be ... not much. You don't know who is buying your stuff and who you are buying from, same as always. I doubt most players notice that the markets are seperate (or that they are server wide for that matter) and I doubt they'll notice that they are joined. Some prices might go up, some might go down. There might be more of some stuff and less of others. Same as always.|
Originally Posted by Blunt_Trauma
I'm too lazy to read through the Market megathread, so...
Market merger = what? for Joe Average (me). Keep it simple: Hoarding?, Higher prices on most everything forever?, higher prices and lower stock?, more wild swings slowly settling down to slightly higher prices?, lower prices (yeah right)?, etc. My completely spontaneous and unscientific prediction: Blueside peeps will buy up everything even remotely popular in sight and hoard for resale. Most everything usefull will dissappear from the Market. What does appears will be much more expensive than now for popular items. This won't change for a long time as manipulation will continue unabated. This will also spawn numerous wails and gnashings of teeth from n00bs, rookies and casuals. |
From my point of view, its just a backend change (like the server optimisation ones they occaisionally have patches for).
Always remember, we were Heroes.
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This^^^.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
I honestly don't care what this does to prices red-side, for a simple fact of life - no amount of money can buy what isn't being sold.
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There are no words for what this community, and the friends I have made here mean to me. Please know that I care for all of you, yes, even you. If you Twitter, I'm MrThan. If you're Unleashed, I'm dumps. I'll try and get registered on the Titan Forums as well. Peace, and thanks for the best nine years anyone could ever ask for.
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Red side should see a reduction in prices. And I've got some land for you; guaranteed to have water on at least one side.|
Originally Posted by DMystic
Overall Red side should see an reduction in prices and blue side will probably see an increase.
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I recently got a character to 12 redside and converted her to level-15 IOs; I bought the recipes and most of the Luck Charms on the Black Market, paying 5,000 inf each for them. During the same period blueside while I had the bids in on redside, the market for Luck Charms never dropped below 50,000. Explain to me how 100,000 potential buyers blueside willing to pay 50,000 and up for a Luck Charm will, when the redside supply of Luck Charms gets merged into the blueside supply, are going to reduce prices redside.
"But in our enthusiasm, we could not resist a radical overhaul of the system, in which all of its major weaknesses have been exposed, analyzed, and replaced with new weaknesses."
-- Bruce Leverett, Register Allocation in Optimizing Compilers
Was thinking in regards to IO Recipes and Crafted enhancements. Not Salvage. In fact Redside has never had problems with Arcane Salvage being unavailable or too ridiculously priced..
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Well there is that pesky fact that Luck Charms do not an entire market make, and salvage going for the thousands is fairly irrelevant in the grander scheme of the market. When we are talking about rare IO sets which go for astronomical prices redside and even then are rarely available, the merger will be an extremely positive thing. Individual spot prices may well go up, but the overall costs redside will go down and availability will certainly go up.
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Originally Posted by srmalloy
Red side should see a reduction in prices. And I've got some land for you; guaranteed to have water on at least one side.
I recently got a character to 12 redside and converted her to level-15 IOs; I bought the recipes and most of the Luck Charms on the Black Market, paying 5,000 inf each for them. During the same period blueside while I had the bids in on redside, the market for Luck Charms never dropped below 50,000. Explain to me how 100,000 potential buyers blueside willing to pay 50,000 and up for a Luck Charm will, when the redside supply of Luck Charms gets merged into the blueside supply, are going to reduce prices redside. |
Too many alts to list.
Going Rogue will cause 50s going for Incarnates and new characters hitting Praetoria and others crossing over.
Now if the markets were not merged where would the drops of the Praetorians and crossing characters be sold? Where would those people buy?
Sure there will be a lot of chaos as people adjust to the new merged markets but most chaos will be caused by those non-market related things.
So if you go to the market and see something is much higher than you were used to or much lower do not assume that is the prime buying/selling price.
By October we should have a better idea of where the prices have shaken out to and hopefully the red side hoarders will have unlearned years of behavior.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
Oh and let's not forget it isn't just merged markets, it is trading and emailing between factions.
There's going to be a lot of unusual things going on come August.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
My predictions:
In the short term, there will be a period of normalization. Items with a moderate supply disparity (Luck Charms) will see a rise from their low price and a fall from their high price. Items with a high supply disparity (Pool C/D special-use recipes) will see a considerable price spike as the existing supply becomes available to a pool of highly motivated buyers.
In the long term, with a higher supply base, prices will be more stable over time. The periodic supply droughts (mostly natural, occasionally artificial) that drive price spikes on common items will be more rare and less severe. With the ability to migrate freely and without the powerful motivator of market disparities, more players may end up redside. More frequent play of SFs, particularly by less experienced players, may drive up the median completion time, ameliorating the vicious cycle of decreasing merit rewards driving decreased median completion times (this is, perhaps, excessively optimistic).
In the final accounting, the market merger will not be sufficient to deal with the pinched supply of Pool C/D recipes brought about by the peculiarities of the Merit system. But most other items will probably end up more broadly available at more consistent prices. What those prices will be depends on what measures are taken with regards to the inf supply, but one thing is certain: they will have an extremely tenuous relationship at most with the fixed prices offered by vendors.
@SPTrashcan
Avatar by Toxic_Shia
Why MA ratings should be changed from stars to "like" or "dislike"
A better algorithm for ordering MA arcs
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Y'know, I was just rereading my statement and noticed that myself. No predictions, then, as I don't know what Praetoria will offer, but still hanging with "tossed up in the air to restabilize itself".
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Silver Gale calls me on it: The market merge is duet the same time as GR comes out. |
Dec out.
One thing I think we may be overlooking is old bids and listings not getting resubmitted by some people due to either they won't be able to login all their characters or won't want to.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
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That's a good point.|
Originally Posted by SwellGuy
One thing I think we may be overlooking is old bids and listings not getting resubmitted by some people due to either they won't be able to login all their characters or won't want to.
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When did they change the market holding period from 60 days to forever? It's only stuff listed 59 days or less from that date that we have to worry about.
I am not terribly worried about old bids though. If you bid 1 inf on an LoTG +recharge a year ago on a lark thinking that you might get lucky, that is not a terrible loss. Most reasonable bids are filled within 30 days, as long as it's not a super-rare PvPIO.
At least for me, the only items I have as bids or sales that have not filled are items that I am severely underbidding, items that are extremely rare, or items for which there is almost no demand and I have priced more than 1000 inf.
I do think there may be the odd thing here or there that may get eaten up by the merge and then sit in someone's tray for a long time or forever. It might be a nice surprise for them if they ever return. But even if they don't, I am happy to pay that price for a merged market.
50s: Inv/SS PB Emp/Dark Grav/FF DM/Regen TA/A Sonic/Elec MA/Regen Fire/Kin Sonic/Rad Ice/Kin Crab Fire/Cold NW Merc/Dark Emp/Sonic Rad/Psy Emp/Ice WP/DB FA/SM
Overlord of Dream Team and Nightmare Squad
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I just noticed I typoed "due" as "duet". D'oh.
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Originally Posted by Decorum
Y'know, I was just rereading my statement and noticed that myself. No predictions, then, as I don't know what Praetoria will offer, but still hanging with "tossed up in the air to restabilize itself".
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Character index
I'm too lazy to read through the Market megathread, so...
Market merger = what? for Joe Average (me).
Keep it simple: Hoarding?, Higher prices on most everything forever?, higher prices and lower stock?, more wild swings slowly settling down to slightly higher prices?, lower prices (yeah right)?, etc.
My completely spontaneous and unscientific prediction:
Blueside peeps will buy up everything even remotely popular in sight and hoard for resale. Most everything usefull will dissappear from the Market. What does appears will be much more expensive than now for popular items. This won't change for a long time as manipulation will continue unabated. This will also spawn numerous wails and gnashings of teeth from n00bs, rookies and casuals.
Masterminds annoy everybody, sooner or later. Heck, Masterminds annoy themselves.
-ShadowsBetween