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It's not. It's one thing to think it's more efficient and another to insist that it always be. This game is far too flexible and, let's face it, easy to force that stuff.|
Postagulous is locked in: I was going to wait until I'd read everything here, but this is wrong. |
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| I've been on teams where an AR blaster [and it's always an AR blaster] thinks they're the tank. I've been on teams where the Tank thinks they're a scrapper. Defenders as blasters. Controllers as scrappers. |
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| Know your role. |
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| As I, who sometimes plays a fire blaster, needs a tank with taunt to do my best work. |
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| I can dish it out, but I can't take it. That's my role. Aggroing half the earth with AoE is an issue if I don't have anyone to help me, and I will aggro half the earth. |
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| Taunt is a very good tool for a tank. Only thing better is holds or mucho killer debuffs. Best is all. |
What works is all. What's best is bonus.
Dec out.
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Well, Warshades, Peacebringers and Brutes have single target Gauntlet, but can only get AoE Gauntlet from AoE attacks -- and Warshades don't even get that, with Mire. So Antagonize is really necessary for Kheldians to tank in Dwarf form since it serves the purpose of their Taunt aura. Brutes get Taunt auras and at least a few AoE attacks they can use to draw aggro, but they certainly don't get Gauntlet to the extent a Tanker does anyway. |
Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA
My Warshade slotted up Dwarf Antagonize for much the same reasons. I don't want to be lumbering around chasing things thank you. I just want them up close so they can be Mired to death.
On Brutes the only one I took it with was my Dark/WP because people were stealing my lovely aggro and hence my Fury. He wants things beside him to help make him immortal. My Claws/Elec has plenty of fury generation ability and the ability to attack from range anyway, so no need for it. My Stone/Fire has Fault up every 12 seconds or so and an excellent damage aura. |
Does a Tanker need Taunt? Well, does a Tanker need Gauntlet, a Taunt aura, and Taunt Enhancements slotted in his powers? No, probably not ALL of that. But you certainly need SOME of that. Certainly MORE THAN ONE of that. But you can get by with only three of the four, or even two of the four. And Gauntlet is built in, and it's unlikely that you'll skip your Taunt aura powers. So to me it comes down to "should I either take Taunt or slot my attacks for Taunt?" Well, yeah, but maybe not. It certainly won't hurt.
Taunt for tanks and most half of the brutes is like Speed boost and AM, its needed and important.
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Originally Posted by American_Angel
To me, a tank that teams for missions that doesn't take taunt is a selfish tank...thinking only of him/her self. |
With no offense intended I support this idea.
A tank *can* get by just fine without Taunt, but if you're a conscientious type player, you'll find uses for it - as mentioned above, pulling where necessary, and saving squishies from unwanted attention without disturbing a good-for-AoEing mob grouping.
I take it on all my tanks but its more of a way to pull back anything that may start to stray than a requirement.
My SD Tanks have Against all Odds which taunts and once surrounded by a mob actually increases my damage output based on how many minons, lieutenatnts, etc I have around me. Shield Defense knocks everything down and taunts them while it damages. And on my DS/SS Footstomp knocks them all down again and taunts as well. When I rush into a mob and use all those actually hitting taunt it about number 4 or 5 on my list of things to do.
My WP Tank has Rise to the Challenge which increases my Rgen rate and debuffs the mobs surrounding me making them easier to hit... different affects but the same principle as Against all Odds since the bigger the mob the more benefits I get from it.
Don't forget every attack you have, slotted for it or not, also tends to taunt a bit but I still always take taunt. Comes in handy even solo when you have a runner since you can force them to turn and come back to you.
Really it is up to you and what you want from your Tank. I take it and will use it even with all those other taunts going just to add to the aggro control but it is certainlt possible to control a mob without having to use it. :-D
If you are doing everything you can to herd and hold aggro its up to the rest of the team to hit that mob hard and fast and put them all down. And remember AVs tend to resist just about anything if they have enough time. During an STF on two seperate occasions a good friend of mine was the tank (and IMO a very good one) but as the team battled Black Scorpion twice he broke from the tank and since my Emp Controller was the next closest target guess who got to go to the hospital? LOL
�We�re always the good guys. In D&D, we�re lawful good. In City of Heroes we�re the heroes. In Grand Theft Auto we pay the prostitutes promptly and never hit them with a bat.� � Leonard
�Those women are prostitutes? You said they were raising money for stem cell research!� � Sheldon
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That was great; I almost thought you were sincere.
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Originally Posted by Dr_HR
Taunt for tanks and most half of the brutes is like Speed boost and AM, its needed and important.
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[JFA2010]Mod08: And I will strike down upon thee (enrious) with great vengence and .... oh wait wrong script
@enrious, @sardonicism, @MyLexiConIsHugeSon
If you haven't joined a global channel, you're not really looking for team.
Yes, I always take it on every tank. I find it critical to MY playstyle. I wouldn't go so far as to classify it as "essential", or to ostracise the tank that doesn't take it, though.
Thank you, Champion.
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I never said they were. They both have access to the power and they both should take it, words in mouth etc.
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Originally Posted by DarkGob
Brutes aren't Tankers.
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That's like saying anyone with Dark Blast has access to the Dark Pit power, and they should all take it. Well, yeah, they have access to it, but not everyone wants to take it, and not everyone *SHOULD* take it.|
Originally Posted by Silverado
I never said they were. They both have access to the power and they both should take it, words in mouth etc.
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Everything in this game is about you (each individual player) having fun, not appeasing some cranky other player who wants to tell you how to play your character.
If you don't want to play with tanks/brutes that don't take taunt, quit the team, don't tell them they're doing it wrong.
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Originally Posted by Dispari
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.
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Why would a tank need to slot taunt enhancements when all their secondary attacks have an inherent taunt effect? Making sure their attacks are slotted for damage is much more important, IMO; it increases the amount of threat generated and provides some additional DPS to the team.|
Originally Posted by Jade_Dragon
Does a Tanker need Taunt? Well, does a Tanker need Gauntlet, a Taunt aura, and Taunt Enhancements slotted in his powers? No, probably not ALL of that. But you certainly need SOME of that. Certainly MORE THAN ONE of that. But you can get by with only three of the four, or even two of the four. And Gauntlet is built in, and it's unlikely that you'll skip your Taunt aura powers. So to me it comes down to "should I either take Taunt or slot my attacks for Taunt?" Well, yeah, but maybe not. It certainly won't hurt.
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FWIW, I do take Taunt on my tanks, but Gauntlet and the Taunt aura will do the job just fine if the player is proficient at aggro management. The possible exception to that is for WP tanks since their Taunt aura is so much weaker than that of other tank primaries. I'd recommend that a WP tank either take Taunt or slot Taunt enhancements in RttC.
My Characters
Knight Court--A CoH Story Complete 2/3/2012
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The key.
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Originally Posted by Bramphousian
Yes, I always take it on every tank. I find it critical to MY playstyle. I wouldn't go so far as to classify it as "essential", or to ostracise the tank that doesn't take it, though.
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[JFA2010]Mod08: And I will strike down upon thee (enrious) with great vengence and .... oh wait wrong script
@enrious, @sardonicism, @MyLexiConIsHugeSon
If you haven't joined a global channel, you're not really looking for team.
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(shrug) My ice tank has 2 taunt auras and 4 ranged attacks. He does a lot more than "get by".
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Originally Posted by RobertoLyon
A tank *can* get by just fine without Taunt, but if you're a conscientious type player, you'll find uses for it - as mentioned above, pulling where necessary, and saving squishies from unwanted attention without disturbing a good-for-AoEing mob grouping.
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Bill, combining your opening and closing statements in that post makes for an excellent sig quote... I'm not one to use them normally, but I *may* make an exception for this one |
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Taunt is a tool, and anyone who judges a tank solely on if they have taunt or not is, like the power itself, a tool.
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That said, all of my tanks don't have taunt... some do, some don't, and it really doesn't make a difference in performance. Tanks without taunt just need to move around a bit more. I use taunt most often when I'm fighting lots of ranged enemies, or if I just want to be lazy at the controls. It certainly has it's uses, but it's not necessary.
As far as stealing aggro from tanks, if the tank isn't doing it's job well, anyone can steal aggro. heck, I've stolen aggro from tanks that have taunt with my electric blaster & gravity troller, and even on my elec. melee stalker and earth dom in RWZ... but that says absolutely nothing about the tanks actual ability, or whether taunt itself is good or bad... that just says I was probably playing with a bad tank, or maybe even a good player that was having a bad day.
Looking this thread over, there are some fairly credible players on the other side of this issue. I will admit that.
HOWEVER... My pesonal experience with tauntless tanks has (and I'm a 54 month veteran at this point) that they just CANNOT hold aggro the same as a tank with it.
Again, maybe it's just my bad luck to wind up with idiots who build Scrankers and think just because they're hitting they're taunting enough, OR the guys who's used to running with nothing but 50s with a dozen purple sets each. Either way, the result is the same...
Team faceplant with the tank still standing, wondering what everybody else's problem is since HE is still alive. THAT is a tool. Me personally, until I see a tauntless tank that can keep Rommie off of my high DPS blaster, I have to remain highly skeptical.
And yes, before some noob comes back with the smart *** and wrong assumption that I don't know how to play blasters, I *DO* I spent almost my first year and a half soloing with one. Made every dumb mistake in the book back when the game was alot less forgiving of them too. But I learned from them and I'm damned good now. Not the best, but I know my ****.
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I think it's very clear who the cranky person is here |
Originally Posted by Aggelakis
That's like saying anyone with Dark Blast has access to the Dark Pit power, and they should all take it. Well, yeah, they have access to it, but not everyone wants to take it, and not everyone *SHOULD* take it.
Everything in this game is about you (each individual player) having fun, not appeasing some cranky other player who wants to tell you how to play your character. If you don't want to play with tanks/brutes that don't take taunt, quit the team, don't tell them they're doing it wrong. |
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I think I know who is reading into a post what is not written there. Note: I am, in fact, NOT cranky. I'm not even bothered by your posts. I am, however, moderately bemused that you insist on pushing your ideals on others by belittling those who do not adhere do said ideals. As if belittling people makes them want to learn more about your ideals.
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Originally Posted by Silverado
I think it's very clear who the cranky person is here
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Originally Posted by Dispari
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.
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Calm down, it's just an opinion
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Condescending and belittling, a wonderful combination. Also: stop attributing emotion to my posts. I'm nothing but calm; telling me to calm down is just silly.
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Originally Posted by Silverado
Calm down, it's just an opinion
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Originally Posted by Dispari
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.
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Ok, whatever you say
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Yes. Now's a good time. And as soon as it stops raining for long enough to put their new BBQ to work, my parents are giving me their old one!
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Originally Posted by Decorum
Iz time nao for BBQ?
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"My inner mind has become a reality-cracking overgod. He torments me! Help!"
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There are four reasons why the willpower tank would have been a better choice for tanking Posi:|
Originally Posted by Decorum
Well, keep in mind that at that level, hardly anyone's a "good" tank anyway.
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1) 50% more hitpoints
2) Always-on mez protection
3) An extra eight levels of powers
4) Enhancements in those powers.
Taunt seems to be a personal preference, and I took it on my sole high-level Tank. It's very useful for positioning.
However, whoever it was earlier in the thread that 'tanks don't have to take aggro' is wrong. That's like rolling an Emp/Elec defender and then only taking the attacks - if you wanted to do that, why the heck didn't you roll a Blaster?
I mean, if you want to solo on your hilariously-gimped build, go ahead, but don't expect me to be happy teaming with your useless butt.
~union4lyfe~
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Originally Posted by Silverado
Ok, whatever you say
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Hey! Are you using the Golden Girl Defense here Silverado?
Unclean unclean!!
No one has mentioned BBQ yet? I'm ashamed of you all.
DRY RUB!!!!
Dec out.
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