A world without evil?


AzureSkyCiel

 

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Originally Posted by Gehnen View Post
In your example, it’s the greatest evil that gets defeated. So presumably the next greatest evil becomes the greatest. Zealous heroes would eventually bust jaywalkers, (as all other evils have been eliminated) and reveal the great paradox that is a hero. By nature, heroes want to instill control, and that’s fairly evil. Social control is very fascist.
See, I don't really like this theory at all, because it assumes that all heroes are lawful stupid, which is quite a sweeping generalization. It's much more likely that most heroes will get the concept of "retirement" just as well as most ordinary people. That is a sweeping generalization as well, but one based on how real people think.

I think that a lot of heroes, if not most or all of them, fight to create a world where they aren't needed. Heroes desperate to feel needed seem to go the Superboy-Prime route sooner or later.

That aside, I doubt it'll ever get to the point that jaywalking or other minor crimes are the "greatest evil", because people are stupid. Someone is always going to try to conquer the world or explode something important. That's why there's still so many criminals in Paragon City even though you can't throw a brick in this town without hitting two Tankers and killing a Blaster.


BackAlleyBrawler: I can't facepalm this post hard enough.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
If only, if only.
We have quite a few furries here, I think - but the costume creator doesn't encourage them the way the CO one does


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
We have quite a few furries here, I think - but the costume creator doesn't encourage them the way the CO one does
Mesmerized... by catgirl's... flicking tail...

--NT


They all laughed at me when I said I wanted to be a comedian.
But I showed them, and nobody's laughing at me now!

If I became a red name, I would be all "and what would you mere mortals like to entertain me with today, mu hu ha ha ha!" ~Arcanaville

 

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Originally Posted by NuclearToast View Post
Mesmerized... by catgirl's... flicking tail...

--NT
That's just a trap - she's there to lure you into a nightclub where between two and three ragingly unstraight werewolves will uses a number of amusing emotes in inappropiate ways around your avatar's personal space.


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

Evil is really a matter of perspective. Which is why it weird me out so much that Arachnos refers to themselves as "Villains" and their enemies as "Heroes".

It makes "Captain Mako, Hero of Sharkhead Isle" seem almost sane...

Almost.

But that's beside the point. Even if we did somehow manage to eradicate every single villain group in the game, then new villain groups would show up. Some (not all) formerly good people would become corrupted, aliens could invade, another extradimensional portal could open up, et cetera.

And even then, completely eradicating all that is evil would require massive genocide/reprogramming, which is evil in itself. It's a paradox.


 

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Originally Posted by EU_Damz View Post
Now how would martial arts stop an earthquake?

Oh look the volcano is erupting! Dont worry we'll kick it!

If theres one thing i learnt, its never to kick a volcano . . . .
Anyone who can jump six feet in the air, kick a Council Adjutant in the face, and use his head as a springboard to do a backflip would have to be in excellent physical shape, which make them very useful in a rescue operation, especially if paired with something like regen or invul.


Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
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Originally Posted by Vincent Morse View Post
Evil is really a matter of perspective. Which is why it weird me out so much that Arachnos refers to themselves as "Villains" and their enemies as "Heroes".
But they know they're evil - they just don't try hiding it


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincent Morse View Post
Evil is really a matter of perspective. Which is why it weird me out so much that Arachnos refers to themselves as "Villains" and their enemies as "Heroes".
Lord Recluse isn't blind, he's just sensitive to bright light. So he can see himself in the mirror every morning, if he doesn't turn on the light bulb surround over the sink, and not being an ********, he says to himself, Holy crap, am I evil. Just look at that guy. Brrrrr. It's all downhill from there!

(That's what the new boards consider a curse word?)


 

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Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
We have quite a few furries here, I think - but the costume creator doesn't encourage them the way the CO one does
Aside from animated tails and a ripoff of Beast from Beauty and the Beast, it isn't actually all that much better. Trust me, I tried, and the only half-way decent canine face I could find was bald, with a large snout and sabertooth fangs, which didn't allow you to have hair on it. That right there put a stop on my pink, winged bunny girl, which works pretty well here. That, and their monster feet are WORSE than ours, hard as it may be to imagine. They look more like your tibia and fibula have a right angle in them.

Then again, I heard somewhere that Paragon Studios were hiring an artist to deal with animalistic costume pieces specifically. That gives me a lot of hope for some movement on that front.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

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Originally Posted by EU_Damz View Post
Would the PPD/Longbow be able to curb the minions of the enemy groups without superhero help?
Are you referring to the people who fly around Atlas Park in heavily-armed squads and don't even seem to be able to prevent purse snatchings?


Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project

 

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I honestly don't think you 'could' defeat all the big name threats.

The only reason the 'Conference of evil' didn't even get past the initial meeting was because Nemesis was his usual idiotic self, if he'd have kept his ego in check there might have been something which could be born from that meeting...

Admittedly there is a major flaw in the conference of evil plan, villains don't generally get along well...let alone villain organisations, each one is out for the biggest share.

Villains are rarely unified, which is what seperates them from heroes. Heroes will band together and team up to defeat a problem greater than their own skills can, Villains will go it alone and try to take out the threat on their lonesome due to them wanting all the glory and evil recognition.

Arachnos and The Council are the 'rule the world types' and meglomaniacs never get along well with sharing, especially when Arachnos is a splinter group of the Council, old rivalries die hard.

Freakshow and the Carnival of Shadows are the 'watch the world burn' type group, they're both out to have destructive fun and either steal souls or loot, pillage, burn and generally cause havok. They make great pawns when you point them in a direction and let them go but they're not really awesome allies as they're far too whimsical and unpredictable to be relied on.

Malta (with the help of the Knives of Artemis) seek to control super powered beings, they're not going to get along well with ANY group and at most will make use of them as pawns.

Circle of Thorns...well...they're not likely to ally with anyone due to their old 'we're really millenia old spirits stealing bodies and practicing arcane arts...' schtick. They want to return to their former glory as world rulers and don't want anyone to stand in their way, hero or villain.

It's interesting that up until level 30 all the gangs are interconnected. Skulls, Trolls and the Family are all linked through the sale and use of Superadine while the competing cartel is formed from the Hellions, Outcasts, Warriors and Tsoo all deal with Rage and mystical artifacts (do NOT mix Rage and Superadine...the effects are unpleasant to say the least).

Past level 30 the threats seem...more fragmented with no real connection to each other.

Of course there's two evils you can't really defeat...Radio and Television, the two fight but neither can really wipe out the other despite the actions each one takes (Radio doesn't stop existing because you've beaten up an Stereo that attacks with Sonic blasts, that's just a manifestation the same way TV wouldn't stop if you blew up a television that attacked with Illusions).

How do you defeat villains like that? They are pervasive, ever present and somewhat malign entities that exist just beyond the fringes of human conception whose insiduous tentacles have spread far enough that if some righteous hero tried to ban television the general public would call him nuts and being force to give up their television for 'the greater good' comes across as if they're trying to supress freedom...

There simply is no way to defeat 'all evil' even if the villains we defeated were permenatly killed off....you're left with threats that are far more subtle and secretive but slowly working to use people in a war between them because they can't be killed off...an unending battle between the Radio waves and the Satellite beams that nobody could stop until 'The Internet' decides it's time to show those old timers that they're not needed in the modern world...then it becomes a three way battle...


 

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World War One....


The war to end all wars.......


How'd that work out anyway?


A ship in harbor is safe, but that's not what ships are for.


 

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If all of the "great evils" are destroyed never to return, there still WILL be evil. It will be just a redefinition of what IS evil...


...like jaywalking, or something.


 

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My heroes? (As well as a number of my villains who are a little far off from evil)

Akuma Ryu: Would marry his girlfriend, take night classes and eventually become a teacher of some kind. (Either history or martial arts)

Sakura Tenshi: Would found a school for magical girls to learn how to be more than just Sailor Moon with different power sets.

Revi: Probably start an autoshop.

Kadin: Might work for her.

Redcoat: Take night classes and eventually practice medicine, like he wanted to before his grandfather pressured him into becoming a hero.

Operative Roosevelt: Depends on how the person who takes over the Rogue Isles runs things. If they're an idiot, he'll run for President himself, if they're doing a good job, he'll return to retirement with his wife.

Midnight Frosts: Start out working for Wizards of the Coast on making DnD books, eventually would make his own game systems, move into video game development, eventually starts his own MMORPG.

Tenshi Ryu: Joins the Mythbusters.


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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
City of Heroes is a game about freedom of expression and variety of experiences far more so than it is about representing any one theme, topic or genre.

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
Then again, I heard somewhere that Paragon Studios were hiring an artist to deal with animalistic costume pieces specifically. That gives me a lot of hope for some movement on that front.
That's not quite correct - they're looking to hire an animator who has experience with non-human body-types - which sounds like they're looking for animal animations for either enemies, or maybe some sort of summoned pets.


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Mechano View Post

Of course there's two evils you can't really defeat...Radio and Television, the two fight but neither can really wipe out the other despite the actions each one takes (Radio doesn't stop existing because you've beaten up an Stereo that attacks with Sonic blasts, that's just a manifestation the same way TV wouldn't stop if you blew up a television that attacked with Illusions).

How do you defeat villains like that? They are pervasive, ever present and somewhat malign entities that exist just beyond the fringes of human conception whose insiduous tentacles have spread far enough that if some righteous hero tried to ban television the general public would call him nuts and being force to give up their television for 'the greater good' comes across as if they're trying to supress freedom...

There simply is no way to defeat 'all evil' even if the villains we defeated were permenatly killed off....you're left with threats that are far more subtle and secretive but slowly working to use people in a war between them because they can't be killed off...an unending battle between the Radio waves and the Satellite beams that nobody could stop until 'The Internet' decides it's time to show those old timers that they're not needed in the modern world...then it becomes a three way battle...
The Internet is (so far, mostly) on the heroes' side. Once we deal with Crey she can devote all her time to making sure everything good is available for download, making both Radio and Television obsolete.


Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
Darkfire Avenger DM/SD/Body Scrapper

Arc ID#161629 Freaks, Geeks, and Men in Black
Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
Aside from animated tails and a ripoff of Beast from Beauty and the Beast, it isn't actually all that much better. Trust me, I tried, and the only half-way decent canine face I could find was bald, with a large snout and sabertooth fangs, which didn't allow you to have hair on it. That right there put a stop on my pink, winged bunny girl, which works pretty well here. That, and their monster feet are WORSE than ours, hard as it may be to imagine. They look more like your tibia and fibula have a right angle in them.

Then again, I heard somewhere that Paragon Studios were hiring an artist to deal with animalistic costume pieces specifically. That gives me a lot of hope for some movement on that front.
Worse? Gods...I didn't think that was possible...

I wouldn't get your hopes up, although it would be nice to make anthro characters that arent stupidly monster looking.

FYI, GG, it IS possible to make an anthro character without going down the...f-word path. There is a large difference. I agree that way is...eh..yeah -flappy handwave-
But what about someone who wants to make a werewolf that looks a bit more humanoid and traditional? Or a believable dragon-hybrid, without the crappy mis-matching scales?
And what about tails that dont need a belt slot and dont look like utter, utter failcake? The 'tails' are the things I hate most in costume editor right now, tbh.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

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Originally Posted by Eva Destruction View Post
The Internet is (so far, mostly) on the heroes' side. Once we deal with Crey she can devote all her time to making sure everything good is available for download, making both Radio and Television obsolete.
Ah, but behind all the goodness you have a supperating well of scum, villany and inter-continental and galactic filth
Thats what the internet is FOR, right?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
That's just a trap - she's there to lure you into a nightclub where between two and three ragingly unstraight werewolves will uses a number of amusing emotes in inappropiate ways around your avatar's personal space.
You spend a lot of time reading the CO forum, you know that?


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Posted

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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha View Post
Worse? Gods...I didn't think that was possible...

I wouldn't get your hopes up, although it would be nice to make anthro characters that arent stupidly monster looking.

FYI, GG, it IS possible to make an anthro character without going down the...f-word path. There is a large difference. I agree that way is...eh..yeah -flappy handwave-
But what about someone who wants to make a werewolf that looks a bit more humanoid and traditional? Or a believable dragon-hybrid, without the crappy mis-matching scales?
And what about tails that dont need a belt slot and dont look like utter, utter failcake? The 'tails' are the things I hate most in costume editor right now, tbh.
I'm going to just say it: Why give a damn whether furries can make anthro characters? What does it matter? Who does it hurt?


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Originally Posted by KaliMagdalene View Post
You spend a lot of time reading the CO forum, you know that?
Not that much time

I mostly have info passed to me


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigFish View Post
Wouldn't a "world without evil" require the extinction of our species?
That's what the Devouring Earth believe.


The backstory of Ace Barnstormer and his technical-based crew is that they were stunt pilots and support crew for the globe-hopping Ragwing Aerocircus until shortly after Rikti War I. I believe they'd return to that life probably doing airshows for charitable causes like the orphans of the Rikti Wars. But they'd probably keep their powered armor undersuits handy, just in case.

Of all my others, probably the only other one to comment on would be Ray Gunn. The man spent a small fortune acquiring rights to reverse engineered tech and also a formerly obscure 1930's serial movie sci-fi character of the same name. The hero has been using his adventures to relaunch the franchise, from costume to lunch boxes to movies. If all evil ended, I suspect he'd continue promoting the Ray Gunn brand, though he'd spend more time on the convention circuit than seeking trouble.


 

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Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
Not that much time

I mostly have info passed to me
Yeah, just keep saying that while popping up with highly specific examples.


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the Devouring Earth is just another offshoot of humanity

they'd have to go too


There is no such thing as an "innocent bystander"