Posi on Abusing Mission Architect
By
2wabbits,
Posted on: 2009-05-05 13:14 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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I notice in the US thread announcing this someone posted:
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I have always been curious if the game could track how fast or even how a toon leveled up (I know we can click a mob to hear how many hours played). It sounds here that more information is available.
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Which reminded me that a while back (IIRC may have been when xp-curve was smoothed) the devs stated that they do have data on how long (in time) characters stay at every level. Between xp earnt or time it takes to level there ought to be a reasonable way to spot characters doing a lot of levelling outside 'accepted tolerances'.
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So I can 'lose access to' (how exactly is that different to deleting?) characters I may have used the MA to level up faster with?
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Is a lvl1 character the same as the level 50 it becomes? Could just be character demotion.
By my mohawk shall ye know me!
my toons
Funny: Ee-Ai-Ee-Ai-Oh! #3662 * The foul-mouthed Handyman! #1076 * City of Norms #132944
Serious: To Save A Single World (#83744) * Marketing Opportunity (#83747)
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So...punishing the players for their mistake of not thinking the MA through well enough before release?
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Only players abusing the system.
I'm not getting punished 
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Are you sure so maybe you never knowingly farmed but what if they judge that you have? after all there's no clear designation on what they view as farming or power leveling
(has sudden image of numerous players having there characters suspended even tho they never went neer MA)
To me, it seems wrong to punish players for something that was created for the game, that the developers made a mistake on and didn't spot the obvious problems with it. Suspending people for using powerlevelling services is one thing, but for using something developed for the game?
Guessing losing access to characters will be same as losing access to the arc.
It's still there but you cannot do anything to it?
Perhaps they'll give you the option to delete it yourself to free up the slot.
Meh, playing silly wotsits with my account would just be an immediate cancellation. I've got better stuff to do than get worked up about being punished for minding my own business and going to quiet zones to do some personal farming entirely solo on stalled toons.
Otherwise I'll just go on playing like usual. *shrug*
Chairman of the Charity of Pain; accepting donations of blood and guts.
Prophet of the Creamy Truth; "If it's empty, fill it with cream."
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Awesome.
I like it.
And anyone who disagrees... go read the EULA. NC can do this.
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I disagree, and I am aware they can do it. It's the 'rawr we can change anything we like at any time we like' section. If they don't touch my toons (of which I have many more than any who have teamed in MA) then I won't complain.
Selfish, yes, but it's my bank account (and theirs, too) at the end of the day.
Blueside Union: Starblayde (Blaster), Pax Imperia (Tanker), Pax Britannia (Defender)
Redside Union: Natasha Redshade (Stalker)
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So...punishing the players for their mistake of not thinking the MA through well enough before release?
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Only players abusing the system.
I'm not getting punished
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The question is what they would count as "abuse"? If it's, say, "anyone ever gaining any rewards in a bannable (under the new rules) arc" it would be IMO too harsh. Or even somewhat milder "anyone gaining a 50 faster than X, retroactive indefinitely."
On the other hand, I don't want those ban threats to be just slaps on the wirst either. PLing got to ridiculous levels, whether it was dev's fault or not.
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Awesome.
I like it.
And anyone who disagrees... go read the EULA. NC can do this.
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^ This.
I like it too. It's partially restored my faith in the Devs.
I wonder if the mission-rating cartel on Sal's badgehunters channel will be in trouble - any channel mods might want to wrap that up asap. It certainly left a bad taste in my mouth seeing it justified as (and I paraphrase) "well the farmers have already wrecked the rating system, so it doesn't really matter that we're doing this to farm the badges". With those badges gone there'll be no need for it, and with other rating cartels and farming being hit hard as well (hopefully), MA ratings can go back to being about the quality of the story in the arc and how fun the gameplay is, instead of being about badges/farming or popularity contests.
I admit to using the MA farms to bump up two or three chars who had become a little stale (only a few levels though), but if this ends in deletions then I'll be going, hopefully it's just a level/ticket rollback 
I am the Blaster, I have filled the role of Tank, Controller and Defender
Sometimes all at once.
Union EU player! Pip pip, tally ho, top hats and tea etc etc
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Suspending people for using powerlevelling services is one thing, but for using something developed for the game?
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The only part that mentions account bans/suspensions is this:
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Players who knowingly use an exploit when creating an arc, run the risk of having access to MA suspended, or worse- depending on the severity of the action, their account banned.
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IIRC The EULA has always covered NC being able to ban accounts if they use exploits. So nothing new there.
By my mohawk shall ye know me!
my toons
Funny: Ee-Ai-Ee-Ai-Oh! #3662 * The foul-mouthed Handyman! #1076 * City of Norms #132944
Serious: To Save A Single World (#83744) * Marketing Opportunity (#83747)
I want to know on what grounds someone would loose access to a character.
How do they determine it?
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I want to know on what grounds someone would loose access to a character.
How do they determine it?
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A data mine - that's the soluton to everything 
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
lol, I said this might happen and nobody believed me...
Thing is, the exploit brought the game to a near death, the fix might kill it.
Imagine people loosing access to some characters etc for basically using what's there - no they where not cheating, they where using an exploit, not the same thing - will they stay in the game? I'm not talking about the mad 6 account farmers that abused it for hours a day, I'm talking about old players that might've taken the chance to get a widow 10-40 levels and realized they really liked it.
Now, I did try out some of the grinds and I must admit I found it... interesting... I doubt I'll be smacked with some sanctions for that (4-6 levels methink it was) but i'd be rather annoyed if I did get a smack, no matter what size.
I see a huge bit of the playerbase leaving the game when this happens basically. I don't agree with the INSANE PLing lately, but killing of a bunch of players won't really help the game even if it satisfies the "pure" players (and with that I mean whiners, not quality moaners like me)
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I want to know on what grounds someone would loose access to a character.
How do they determine it?
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At NC's discretion.
They will have guidelines, sure, but they'll never tell us what they are, and there looks to be an appeals process in place for arcs, so there's bound to be an appeals process in place for characters, too.
The wisdom of Shadowe: Ghostraptor: The Shadowe is wise ...; FFM: Shadowe is no longer wise.
; Techbot_Alpha: Also, what Shadowe said. It seems he is still somewhat wise 
; Bull Throttle: Shadowe was unwise in this instance...; Rock_Powerfist: in this instance Shadowe is wise.; Techbot_Alpha: Shadowe is very wise *nods*; Zortel: *Quotable line about Shadowe being wise goes here.*
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Suspending people for using powerlevelling services is one thing, but for using something developed for the game?
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The only part that mentions account bans/suspensions is this:
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Players who knowingly use an exploit when creating an arc, run the risk of having access to MA suspended, or worse- depending on the severity of the action, their account banned.
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IIRC The EULA has always covered NC being able to ban accounts if they use exploits. So nothing new there.
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How do Paragon Studios define an exploit though.... A map full of level 51 bosses offers plenty of risk vs reward and i personally don't see that as an exploit as it is a feature of the MA.
I can seriously see this getting complicated if they pursue those threats.
CoH PvP SG = SuperUnion - Co-Leader - Union/Freedom
CoV PvP VG = Disruption - Co-Leader - Union/Freedom
Global = @Rent & @Rent.
Playgroup are all **** - Global Handle
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I want to know on what grounds someone would loose access to a character.
How do they determine it?
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I'm not sure they'll ever give the exact rules - doing so would be inviting people to go right up to the edge of what's allowed, look for technically legal exploits, etc...
Keep the rules unknown and they can act with more discretion.
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Guessing losing access to characters will be same as losing access to the arc.
It's still there but you cannot do anything to it?
Perhaps they'll give you the option to delete it yourself to free up the slot.
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If that would ever happen half the players would leave the game in a blink of an eye. I think its kinda wierd how they can miss such a big issue with MA after all the testing put into it. Either the testers are complete morons or NC just hoped they wouldnt find the bug. Because thats what it is a bug. Just because you use the bug when its around doessnt mean your a bad guy. Whats really sad and poor tho is that it takes NC or Paragon or what ever, over a week until they even adress it. And to do it like this is just utterly wrong
...aaah, but was it an exploit? Exploit suggests something that is a tad harder to find than a farming ARC mission. My main point still is that a development cockup and mistake should not be taken out on the players. I don't think the speed you get to 50 matters, what matters is if you can play the toon.
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I admit to using the MA farms to bump up two or three chars who had become a little stale (only a few levels though), but if this ends in deletions then I'll be going, hopefully it's just a level/ticket rollback
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This, getting punished for using an exploit that was so blatant and used by such a large part of the community is silly [censored].
Shadowplay - Scrapper DM/DA SL 50
Doctor Storm- Brute SS/Elec SL 50
"speed boosts someone in the face" - Cognito
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I think its kinda wierd how they can miss such a big issue with MA after all the testing put into it. Either the testers are complete morons or NC just hoped they wouldnt find the bug. Because thats what it is a bug.
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Well, the normal testers were testing the system for bugs and seeing if it'd work as intended - but any farming testers who found an exploit would be unlikely to report it, as they'd want to use it once the MA went live.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
All i can say is im not surprised, yes there may have been some new players who "may2 have got involved in the "wrong" crowd but if this, however harsh, sorts out certain issues that have become prevelant recently, then I for one support this move, if you know there is nothing you have done to get yourself on any of these lists of exploiters then there is nothing to worry about.
Simply put they will never get rid of farming but at least this is some form of ackowledgement to the fact that it shouldnt be the "only" way to play.
Art of War Co-Leader - Union *Global@Warscythe*
"The box said Windows Vista or better - so I installed Linux"
if they removed badges why not remove XP?
would get rid of the farmers and would leave MA for the people who are interested
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How do Paragon Studios define an exploit though
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Well, I think the easiest one for them is probably the number of hours it takes to get to 50 - if even the pedestrians can tell you, then I'm sure the GMs will have access to the same info
Also, as there seems to be some form of tracking system to flag which arcs you've already voted on, there may be a similar way for them to track which arcs you've played - and playing one a huge amount of times might also be thought suspicious.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
The people who have just bought the game, PL'd their way to various 50s and don't have a clue or, more importantly, aren't bothered about how to play their 50 "properly" (rawr I R vet + I no how 2 play teh proper) will just simply not re-subscribe past their free month or whatever they've already paid for. They're no real loss to the game, as they wouldn't have bothered anyway, I'd imagine.
Simply, NC broke their game and people who didn't like that punished them where it hurts, in their bank accounts. I (and I'm not alone) played their broken game regardless and if they expect to punish me for it (even though I *still* don't have a 50 to my name), I can do it right back along similar lines.
Though that might be outweighed by those who come back to paying for the newly-fixed game
Blueside Union: Starblayde (Blaster), Pax Imperia (Tanker), Pax Britannia (Defender)
Redside Union: Natasha Redshade (Stalker)
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So...punishing the players for their mistake of not thinking the MA through well enough before release?
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Only players abusing the system.
I'm not getting punished