COH2 predicted by Massively
By
Alvan,
Posted on: 2008-12-27 20:23 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Post deleted by GhostRaptor
Post deleted by GhostRaptor
Post deleted by GhostRaptor
Post deleted by GhostRaptor
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No, PvP was brought in for the Korean launch, because the Korean market is very different, and a MMO without PvP is unthinkable. Why where Cryptic told to adapt CoH to the Korean market? Because NCSoft is a Krean company.
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Just to clear this point up once and for all. PvP was planned way way way before the game launch. The arenas were announced pre beta as part of the planned game.
that they didnt actually develop the PvP aspect of the game at that point, even though they planned to introduce it, has actually proven to be one of many many own goals cryptic are responsible for. And to be fair, in hindsite, they admit this.
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To improve something you need to change something. Changing a game some people enjoy playing is bound to tick off those people, even if those changes are, generally, an improvment.
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Like Ed you mean? the big question has to be do ENOUGH people enjoy, over a sustained period of time, City of Heroes as it is?
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Sometimes things are better left alone, even if they aren't perfect.
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I personally dont think this applies to CoH, though I accept that changes to the gameplay of CoH must be handled in a very delicate way.
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
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In most games now (MMO wise) PvP is just as important than PvE. Due to the potential customers it brings.
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CoH does seem to be an exception, though.
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Does it? Where is the massive player base then? I do think its suffering because it doesnt understand PvP properly.
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
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um, we know for a fact that there are 130k active accounts that log in to CoH...
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there are 124,000 (last count) subscribers.
As there are an average of only 13,000 players active at any given time over 15 servers that leaves a lot of lee way for inactive accounts too.
Actually i wonder how that metric compares to other games? Are those figures available?
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
According to whom is 130k? Show me sources that confirm it and not MMOGChart because is not a source to trust. I agree with lionsbane, if pvp is not a big part of the game where is the massive ammount of players? Even PvE sucks on this game now.
Numbers from NC soft actually, and MMOG chart is a pile of [censored], those [censored]'s think rune scape has 13 million subscribers...
from here on the boards a link to the quarterly connection numbers
What aggravates me is all it takes is a little thought and planning.
Take base raids for example. Why do they have to be limited to bases? Why cant two SGs, of either villian v hero or same side v same side duke it out in a city zone? And i dont mean an instanced one. I mean in the same zone that we play but they, having been allocated, can fight and any other player cant join in?
Why cant the devs invent some incentive for these battles?
They dont even have to invent em. There are hundereds of JLAvJSA or X men v Avengers stories they can swipe to create a compelling reason to fight.
Who knows? Maybe some PvE players would get the PvP bug.
The players would love it. And they'de be great to watch too. I could go on and on.
Just a bit of imagination and forward planning is required to spruce this game up no end.
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
Back to the main point, If they are, behind the scenes creating CoH2, that would explain why there is so little (given the staff expansion and the upcoming competition) in i13 and i14 (as proposed.)
It would also explain the lack of imagination they have put into the last few issues, because maybe theyre saving the really cool stuff for COH2.
Aa I'm writing its making so much sense I actually think that may be what's going on.
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
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Back to the main point, If they are, behind the scenes creating CoH2, that would explain why there is so little (given the staff expansion and the upcoming competition) in i13 and i14 (as proposed.)
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Well you have to remember that I13 (which was said to be huge) was originally meant to have the VEATs (moved up to issue 12), all the stuff that was put in (including shields and pain domination) and the Mission Architect that's now in I14. The original I14 is now I15, and who knows what's going to be in that one.
First, I think PvP is an important part of any multiplayer game, as there will always be some players who want to test themselves against other players, no matter how good NPC AI might be.
Second, a game with superheros and supervillains is simply crying out for PvP way more than, say, a typical fantasy game - in a typical fantasy setting, like LotR, for example, the enemy forces are usually hordes of evil creatures, and only the good side has a big variety of characters, but in a comicbook setting, it's very much about a battle between individual heroes and villains - so the ability for powerful individuals to face off against each other is needed much more in a comicbook game than in a fantasy game.
Second, I really don't think it's possible to ever have a totally balanced PvP system in any game that has a wide variety of powers and weapons.
If everyone can have ranged weapons, or all ranged weapons are banned, then it's possible to be pretty equal - but if you allow someone with a sword to fight someone with a laser blaster, then the ranged fighter will start with a very big advantage.
SUre, you can make the map in such a way that it evens things out a bit, like making it a maze, so it's very hard to get a good distance between the shooter and the target, but in any normal map, the ranged fighter should easily win.
Also, AT/class restrictions don't lend themselves to totally balanced PvP - in a comicbook or movie, charcters and powers are unique, fights are decided by what the story requires - so if a healer/defender style character was required to defeat one or more brute/scrapper types, then they'd do so, using some kind of move or trick that's beyond the capability of any videogame to make allowances for.
But in the same situation in PvP, then the lone healer/defender would get ganked by the gang of brutes/scrappers - because it's simply done by math, and not story needs.
So no matter how much you might love your squishy avatar and it's concept, it just might not be able to cut it in PvP, because math has to be the deciding factor in PvP, not story.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Second, I really don't think it's possible to ever have a totally balanced PvP system in any game that has a wide variety of powers and weapons.
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I tend to agree. I actually think they got it round about right first time around. Tankers were the toughest to beat unless you had psionics, and certain defenders were squishys. that made a certain thematic sense. After all, the scarlet witch isnt gonna do all that well in a fight with Thor is she? - Unless she gets that one hex in.
It was more scissors / rock and they admited was designed more for teaming PvP than solo.
My opinion is , if youre playing a defender then you shouldnt really expect to do that well in solo PvP anyway.
But I dont know if that approach, as thematic as it is, is a populist approach with a typical player. Its a hard call.
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
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After all, the scarlet witch isnt gonna do all that well in a fight with Thor is she? - Unless she gets that one hex in.
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Which she will succeed in doing 100% of the time if the story requires it 
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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After all, the scarlet witch isnt gonna do all that well in a fight with Thor is she? - Unless she gets that one hex in.
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Which she will succeed in doing 100% of the time if the story requires it
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Yeah but that's the point. this isnt a story. It's live playing so you cant apply your point here.
I do think that conceptually they were on the right road initially and there are ways of evening up an imbalanced fight.
My feeling revolves around 2 things that are just that-feeling cause theyde require massive playtesting.
Firstly, a kind of adrenaline blow, similar to critical hit but even more powerful- the downside being it leaves you wped out. Like that final superman doomsday punch.
Secondly a much wider array of temp powers or weapons players can craft or buy that would help them out if they know theyre up against an opponent theoritically stronger than them (ie a psionic bomb if a defender know they are likely to face a tanker.)
these last ditch attacks give you a mathematical chance of a hit. And a win.
As I say it would take quite a while to work out the details and then play test, even if itwas deemed viable.
But I dont know of a better way. Then again, I'm not paid to do a 9 to 5 job thinking these things up with all the information and data that I need at my disposal.
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
Post deleted by GhostRaptor
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Right until proven wrong.
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I'd go with "Dubious until proven right". With weighting based on the poster's previous history.
Given that the poster in question's previous history goes back all of 5 days, had at least 3 forum name chances, a currently flamey name and started a few majorly flamey threads (now deleted - welcome back, GR 
), I'm inclined to regard that poster as "damned dubious". If anyone's going to be doing work to prove themselves right, the poster Sinergy_X was replying to is the one that needs to.
And if he doesn't? Does that mean what he says is wrong? I don't think so.
This could go back and forth til the end of the world comes. But until someone proves him wrong, then no-one can say his statement is false. You don't have to go searching for his source to do this, find your own. But so far no-one has posted anything. (if they have then i've missed it because i'm tired) 
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But so far no-one has posted anything. (if they have then i've missed it because i'm tired)
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How can they post something that doesn't exist?
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First, I think PvP is an important part of any multiplayer game, as there will always be some players who want to test themselves against other players, no matter how good NPC AI might be.
Second, a game with superheros and supervillains is simply crying out for PvP way more than, say, a typical fantasy game - in a typical fantasy setting, like LotR, for example, the enemy forces are usually hordes of evil creatures, and only the good side has a big variety of characters, but in a comicbook setting, it's very much about a battle between individual heroes and villains - so the ability for powerful individuals to face off against each other is needed much more in a comicbook game than in a fantasy game.
Second, I really don't think it's possible to ever have a totally balanced PvP system in any game that has a wide variety of powers and weapons.
If everyone can have ranged weapons, or all ranged weapons are banned, then it's possible to be pretty equal - but if you allow someone with a sword to fight someone with a laser blaster, then the ranged fighter will start with a very big advantage.
SUre, you can make the map in such a way that it evens things out a bit, like making it a maze, so it's very hard to get a good distance between the shooter and the target, but in any normal map, the ranged fighter should easily win.
Also, AT/class restrictions don't lend themselves to totally balanced PvP - in a comicbook or movie, charcters and powers are unique, fights are decided by what the story requires - so if a healer/defender style character was required to defeat one or more brute/scrapper types, then they'd do so, using some kind of move or trick that's beyond the capability of any videogame to make allowances for.
But in the same situation in PvP, then the lone healer/defender would get ganked by the gang of brutes/scrappers - because it's simply done by math, and not story needs.
So no matter how much you might love your squishy avatar and it's concept, it just might not be able to cut it in PvP, because math has to be the deciding factor in PvP, not story.
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I never thought i'd say this, but i agree. lmao
Wow I guess GR got some new 'Thread Clippers' for xmas! I would dearly love to know what all the deleted posts were about 
Golden-Phoenix - Lvl 50 Fire/Fire Tank
Oodja Nikabolokov - Lvl 50 SS/WP Brute
Baby-Phoenix - Lvl 50 Peacebringer
How much wood would a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could Chuck Norris?
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Wow I guess GR got some new 'Thread Clippers' for xmas! I would dearly love to know what all the deleted posts were about
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Some dirty dirty trolls that came on forums with trial accounts ='(.
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Wow I guess GR got some new 'Thread Clippers' for xmas! I would dearly love to know what all the deleted posts were about
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You didn't miss much. Some were personal shots at others, the rest was just spam.
LOL
) The COX engine was custom built. NCSoft own it completely since they bought it off Cryptic (Who technically no longer exist since being bought) and they've thrown a team of 30+ eager developers at it. Nothing personal, but I13/I14 (While substantial) is not full time employment for such a large team of developers. Maybe 4-5, but not 30+!
)
9 pages, and most of it is spawned by trollers. PvP aside, Massively are usually on the ball as far as predictions are concerned. SWTOR is number one in their recent successful predictions.
I'm thinking that the COX old dog has plenty of life left in her still, and she's got loads of new tricks up her sleeves. Take a good look at the AION trailers. I can see the shadow shard, lots of move from COX (Including plenty of new ones) gorgeous landscapes and distance fog (
2009 is going to ring in the changes in more ways than one. I'm seriously looking forward to what the Dev's have in store for us all, and I think it's going to be bigger than anyone imagined. I have my suspicions that the game engine was used to generate the original trailers that can be found on YouTube. Heck, take a look at Doom3, Crysis and its current brethren. There's a level of realism there that the game deserves to have, and by previous comments is more than capable of producing! Bring it on Dev's! Make it shine! Let's really see what COX is made of, and put CO and DCUO to shame. You have the engine, you have the capability and above all you have the community of players... Do us proud!!
(edited to correct drunken grammar
Union: @Ban-Sidhe