PvP - Could it BE more imbalanced?
By
Aggravator,
Posted on: 2005-12-09 22:26 in Everything about PvP
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how do you go from a zone with tumbleweeds rolling past to a thriving zone where there's usually a team with the right skillset about?
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You put Bridger and Jawbreaker in the zone 
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LOL, well said 
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(O.O) Bunny: Our time is coming
(> <)
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Tender spot? not really as its not applicable to me, I just think its narrow minded and ignorant to issue any kind of blacket statement regarding anyone or anything as you cannot possibly know the people involved to such a degree. I consider such blanket statements bigoted.
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Would you be more comfortable if a labelled PvP novices as "stalker-fodder"? That was the general tone I've been picking up - along the lines of, "if you find stalkers a problem then you obviously don't know what you're doing. I never suggested that stalkers went out of their way to hunt novices, only that their success rate would rise sharply if their target was a Pvp-noob.
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No, I would be happier if you respected people as individuals before attaching your labels to them. And by coming up with your own idea of remaning the Stalker AT to "n00b-hunter" you DID suggest that stalkers go out of their way to hunt novices, as indeed you suggest that I indulge in this practice by suggesting that you hit a nerve with a crass generalisation.
Innigo, I go out of my way to avoid labeling people be they new to the whole game, pvp or anything. I fail to see a reason for it. New Stalkers are fodder for heroes as they dont know how to utilize their alt, aside from the usual suspects in Sirens whenever a new stalker comes in they face a very stiff learning curve as they gets bashed back to the hospital with alarming regularity. Perhaps this is why stalkers become an issue as they die so much they learn to adapt damn fast, as indeed anyone can.
At NO point whatsoever have I said anything along the lines of "if you cant beat stalkers you dont know what you are doing" I offer advice on both sides in a reasoned and objective manner.
Speaking of being objective, what lvl stalker do you have Innigo? Given that you are remarkably vocal on this issue I am presuming you do in fact have a stalker of approximately lvl 30 with whom you can make these statments with. I personally would find it hypocritical to make comments such as you have without having the knowledge or experience to back it up, of course this is just me and my own ethics.
I would respect your comments a lot more if they were not written in an aggresive, argumentative and confrontational manner, its not even nescessarily what you have said but the way you say it.
**Acceptable "support" responses**
Its your fault
Its your computers fault
Its your ISPs fault
Bored with this thread and Innigo...
You want everyone to have the same chance? But you want Stalkers chnaged so they have less of a chance? So how is that the same as a controller? Or any of the other ATs. At the moment the stalker has one chance, if it loses that then it'll disadvantaged against the other ATs.
Or as you have siad you don't want the stalker to be nerfed... How, pray tell, can they change the stalker in line with your overall them and not nerf it?
And while we're at it lets nerf all those other ATs, well not MMs they suck already, but the regens need to be nerfed they're almost as bad as tanks. And defenders get them nerfed, oh up their damage but decrease their defenses.... Oh why do I bother?
We know that once you have made your mind up you won't change your views, right or wrong you'll stand by them to the bitter end...
Whcih I have reached on this thread, the discussion is solving nothing. The reasoned debate is hitting a brick wall, or your head. Face it people Innigo is right and we're all wrong.
Abandon hope! 
Heh, I only really read this thread up to the 6th page and then skipped to the end to see if it got anywhere, which it hasn't really, though I've seen some good advise.
As many others have said there are ways to protect yourself from Stalker attacks, IR goggles help you to see them from a distance, inspirations give you that boost when you need it and working in a team can provide extra eyes and much needed support... but personally I've developed some of my own tricks with my defender.
Being a completely non-PVP build Empath I can hardly jump into PVP and expect to not to be targeted by the villians and other heroes (in the case of Warburg, my first PvP experience). So understanding this, I usually spend alot of my time in the air, using flight (note you can buy this as a temp power) to keep my distance when not performing my role as a defender and quickly swooping in and doing my thing when I need to throw out some of the green good stuff. In higher level zones I have stealth powers to use in order to make it harder to target me (note this is also a temp power in Sirens Call) and I'll even use invisibility when in a higher level zone so I can hover near the group without providing a easy target.
Heh, I used to do this little thing with a old temp power the conficated bean bag... I can't count the number of times I've surprised players by blasting them with that when they come for me. Of course it only works on Controllers and some of the weaker or less prepared Stalkers, but it leaves them open for a horrible mauling.
I don't think anyone who gets killed by a stalker is a bad PvPer... I've died countless times from alert stalkers who know how to do their thing and I accept that they are doing the best with their build. It just means I have to work harder on spotting and dealing with them... and just occasionally helping teams hunt the little gits down.
I admit it's annoying when the zone is filled with Stalkers just praying on any lose hero they can find... but sometimes it's just like that and I figure I can always leave it for a while and continue playing PvE.
Grumbles after readin your post 5 stars for you.
I think I would be slightly offended if no stalkers atacked me at all in pvp, at least when they are attacking me I know where they are
Besides now Ive gone upa few lvls I like them to get close so I can smash them with melee powers (which are better than my sonics..stupid powersets..me a blaster and the most damage I do is with a punch..) , I might still be pvp fodder for the higher lvl chars (but happy fodder) but I can still maim the careless,stupid and weak
Thats partialy why I did so well in the recent sirens callinvasion thing...over confidant villains would immob me,get in close..and then get hurt
Its a game, have fun,be nice..and turn off your defences so I can get some pvp rep points
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Bored with this thread and Innigo...
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SO bored you were compelled to post.
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You want everyone to have the same chance? But you want Stalkers chnaged so they have less of a chance?
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Clearly you missed the post where I said I didn't want ANYONE nerfed. That, in case you were wondering, includes stalkers.
(\_/)
(O.O) Bunny: Our time is coming
(> <)
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Bored with this thread and Innigo...
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SO bored you were compelled to post.
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You want everyone to have the same chance? But you want Stalkers chnaged so they have less of a chance?
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Clearly you missed the post where I said I didn't want ANYONE nerfed. That, in case you were wondering, includes stalkers.
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Blah Blah!
UP DEFENDER DAMAGE!!!!
Make me Uber! and nerf everyone else! 
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Heh, I used to do this little thing with a old temp power the conficated bean bag... I can't count the number of times I've surprised players by blasting them with that when they come for me.
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I love that bean bag
Was a bit dissapointed when it ran out
Is there a place to buy a new one, thats something i'd always have,
My MA IDs:
Fiend Space: 211464
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Bored with this thread and Innigo...
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SO bored you were compelled to post.
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You want everyone to have the same chance? But you want Stalkers chnaged so they have less of a chance?
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Clearly you missed the post where I said I didn't want ANYONE nerfed. That, in case you were wondering, includes stalkers.
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Then perhaps you should finish quoting the rest of my post!:
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Or as you have siad you don't want the stalker to be nerfed... How, pray tell, can they change the stalker in line with your overall theme and not nerf it?
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Care to answer?
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Bored with this thread and Innigo...
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SO bored you were compelled to post.
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You want everyone to have the same chance? But you want Stalkers chnaged so they have less of a chance?
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Clearly you missed the post where I said I didn't want ANYONE nerfed. That, in case you were wondering, includes stalkers.
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Then perhaps you should finish quoting the rest of my post!:
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Or as you have siad you don't want the stalker to be nerfed... How, pray tell, can they change the stalker in line with your overall theme and not nerf it?
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Care to answer?
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Nerf them ALL!!!!
Defenders FTW!!!!!!
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I think I would be slightly offended if no stalkers atacked me at all in pvp, at least when they are attacking me I know where they are
Besides now Ive gone upa few lvls I like them to get close so I can smash them with melee powers (which are better than my sonics..stupid powersets..me a blaster and the most damage I do is with a punch..) , I might still be pvp fodder for the higher lvl chars (but happy fodder) but I can still maim the careless,stupid and weak
Thats partialy why I did so well in the recent sirens callinvasion thing...over confidant villains would immob me,get in close..and then get hurt
Its a game, have fun,be nice..and turn off your defences so I can get some pvp rep points
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Always a pleasure to see you in Sirens and you are certainly much more of a threat now Spurr 
Its nice to see your progress from missing everything in sight to actually stacking really annoying sonic debuffs, they are more a cause for concern than you think.
**Acceptable "support" responses**
Its your fault
Its your computers fault
Its your ISPs fault
Ignore him ninja. His posts contain barely anything worthwhile, and when on the off chance he does post something worthwhile it tends to be over shadowed by what seems to be a need to argue for no other reason than he enjoys it. Rather than answer a question he's more likely to ignore the point of your post and scrutinise it for any lines that he can pick on.
Innigo - [ QUOTE ]
A false assumption. Whilst I may get passionate about certain things on these boards losing the pvP zone doesn't bother me, and stalkers are nothing more than a minor annoyance.
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Why pray tell are u constantly posting on this thread then? If u couldnt care less and you dont want stalkers nerfed, then what DO you want?
I've noticed a few who whinge about stalkers and try to say they are over powered then try to cover up their 'whinge' by making a statement saying things like "this isnt a whinge, dont get me wrong, i dont want them nerfed... but they are too over powered, i cant do anything when stalkers are around, Stalkers are putting me off PvP, nothing should be able to 1 shot me! and i'm slamming my bedroom door on the way in!!.....whinge whinge whinge"
Back on topic of the thread..
I do feel that PvP is slightly imbalanced, but thats the way the cookie crumbles. You cant choose to play a support role then expect to be a PVP machine at the same time. Most of the people who think that PvP is unfair tend to be trollers or defenders, those that get one shotted. Now in PvE i wouldnt think of jumping into the frontline on my Empath as i'd just get squished. This is the same in PvP.
Imo it would be impossible to balance PVP to suit everyone. As in all walks of life, trying to keep everyone happy is a massive task and i'd say that the devs should be given more credit than they have. What they have done is create dynamic and fun PVP zones. While it would be wonderful if we could all be pleased with PvP i'm sure that the devs are working towards at least trying to please some of the disallusioned.
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Or as you have siad you don't want the stalker to be nerfed... How, pray tell, can they change the stalker in line with your overall theme and not nerf it?
Care to answer?
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I have, several times.
The point is to not change ANYONE but to allow toons to buff, using temp powers, the holes in their build. We keep hearing about how you need a time with this and that. And we see it go quiet when I ask "what if there's no one suitable on". Siren's is hardly a bustling concourse of heroes, so what do you do? Should I just leave and wait for some ppl with the right powers to come on?
OR do the devs offer some useful temp powers? Ones a little less generic?
I suggested a shield that stops critical hits, and only available to squishies. The AS to death would still be possible but only if the target is injured first. I don't agree than an AS should NEVER kill.
So there you have it, a little imagination and you could probably come up with a slew of temp powers to ensure that any team, regardless of composition could buff itself to put up a good fight with a team, regardless of THEIR composition.
I posted elsewhere that PvP could be really dull if you have "incompatable" ATs facing off to each other. Imagine, 2 scrappers and a tank facing 2 stalkers - no temp powers for the heroes since the villains control the zone (for the sake of this example).
So, not a perception power or hold between us. We can't see them coming and we can't stop them getting away. (Yes I realise yellow insps are useful but I have to go to IP to get insps so I have to be a little sparing with them).
The IR googles and web grenades DO make things better, considerably better, but they don't go far enough.
Every travel power *should* be represented by a temp power. I don't know why SS was excluded.
As I've said MANY times, most of the issues raised will slip into the ether is and when Siren's becomes busy, but until then I believe better temp powers are a good way of compensating.
And not a nerf in sight.
(\_/)
(O.O) Bunny: Our time is coming
(> <)
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Why pray tell are u constantly posting on this thread then? If u couldnt care less and you dont want stalkers nerfed, then what DO you want?
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How MANY times do I have to post the same thing?!? I've explained it, IN DETAIL, several times. If you can't be bothered to read them, although you feel qualified to offer critique on my posts, then continue in ignorance. I don't care.
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Stalkers are putting me off PvP, nothing should be able to 1 shot me! and i'm slamming my bedroom door on the way in!!.....whinge whinge whinge"
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Ah, the same old tired accusation. It's like a broken record droning forever on. The thing so many people seem so keen to forget is these whingers are also paying customers.
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(O.O) Bunny: Our time is coming
(> <)
i have noticed u keep mentioning pvp zones are never that busy, did u bother to attend the big pvp event in sirens last night, they needed to make 3 sirens calls to cope with the number of players, now that would mean the zone was busy right??
and speaking of stalkers, i made the cardinal sin of standing still with my blaster, to adjust my graphic settings, next thing i know a big AS comes on my screen, followed by a big miss, so i turned round and battered the [censored] outta him with my energy meelee, u win some u lose some basically, if he had hit, i would have been boned.
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i have noticed u keep mentioning pvp zones are never that busy, did u bother to attend the big pvp event in sirens last night, they needed to make 3 sirens calls to cope with the number of players, now that would mean the zone was busy right??
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Yes I "bothered" to be there. What point are you trying to make? That the zone is busy during organised events?
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(O.O) Bunny: Our time is coming
(> <)
And another thing!
Why dod people as soon as they get murdered a few times shout NERF This, NERF That.
The correct thing to do would be to come on these boards, explain the problem and see if anyone can come up with a solution to the problem. Instead of shouting Nerf from the get go and assuming that there is some hideous imbalance in the game.....and it certainly can't be due to the fact that they are complete donkey schlongs when it comes to PvP!
@Sweet Chilli
im saying that there are a lot more pvpers out there,the arena wasnt very popular at first, then we had the s4 compitition, and pvp in the arena became very popular, so i be expecting somthing similar with the pvp zones following the sucess of the event yesterday
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im saying that there are a lot more pvpers out there,the arena wasnt very popular at first, then we had the s4 compitition, and pvp in the arena became very popular
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Thats absolutely rubbish. The most people I ever saw at our Arena nights after S4 was twenty players.
thats union, try coming to defiant
I think we had more BEFORE S4...
World of Jackcraft.
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thats union, try coming to defiant
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Name the nights that you regularaly have 20+ people turn up and I'll happily pop on over.
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how do you go from a zone with tumbleweeds rolling past to a thriving zone where there's usually a team with the right skillset about?
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You put Bridger and Jawbreaker in the zone