AE has caused a resurgence of the word "Healer"

I think the general rule of thumb is that a team looking for a healer is a bad team.

Seeing this thread and the hate that is being generated makes me a sad panda.... a very sad panda indeed.

Yes, I will agree with one overwhelming theme:

EMPATHY IS NOT MERELY A HEALING SET AND THERE IS MORE TO THIS GAMES DEFENDING THAN HEALZ .

That fact can not be overstated to newer players. Yes, it has 3 heals in the set and a rez, however, it also has 2 awesome aura buffs as two wonderfully fantastic buffs in AB and Fort a great mez protection tool with CM. I think we can all agree that far.

However, here is where I stop agreeing with this thread. Why do you hate Empathy so bad just because there are retards playing? I mean really, lets stop and think like the logical defenders we claim to be. Empathy is not as useless a set as its being made out to be. I really get as tired of hearing "can u heal me in AE plz?" as I do of "go roll a real defender" remarks. An Empathy Defender is not a useless tool on an experienced team. A real empath defender is throwing out fort as much as possible, guarding the squishies from mez, mitigating that damage that does manage to get through, and blasting the crap out of baddies.

Oh and before you say "but Sonic, a well built player already has the tools they need to manage there own HP by lv50" and I have this to say, forget not that they also have the tools to manage there own damage mitigation. Lets be real, the tools we get to use take the power they have, magnify it, and make the baddies cry. This is true of all the defender sets. Seriously, all of the defenders sets do things well and when played right can amplify a teams ability to take spawns and cause them to steamroll and/or steamroll faster. Now, when played without finess or skill they can help cause the team to drop just as fast.

Now, with that out of my system just remember this, there are idiots with prebuilt bias to each set. Said players think only the heals from empathy are what they need, why is force fields knocking down and knocking back enemies, why shouldn't I kill the glowing green or black baddie first, why would I want SB, who think the only trick in trick arrow is that you call yourself a defender or the ever classic "ick this buff hides my costume, turn it off" kinda players. The reason why they remain idiots is their limited view. They see instant gratification when the green numbers go up but don't understand the multitude of benefits they get from debuffs, buffs, and the damage we do as well. They honestly believe that the reason they don't need the buff/debuffs is that there killing things to fast on there own. Lets ignore those people and work on developing the strengths and effectiveness of ALL defender sets and combinations instead of beating on Empathy like the red headed step child.

(or to be politically correct and non-targeting let me rephrase that) :
.. instead of beating on Empathy like the [insert color of hair and form of guardianship].

That would be my 2 inf.... I also wonder how many the few that glance at this post will only look at the little yellow and bold comment...

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I think the general rule of thumb is that a team looking for a healer is a bad team.

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Generally. Good teams don't often ask for anything specific, since they already have what they need. A bad team can often become tolerable and even good with the right addition; although a simple healer is usually not enough, most "healers" do at least a little something else which makes it enough.

A good "healer" (one who also, probably primarily, does other stuff besides heal) can often turn a bad team into a good one or even very good one. That is the simple reason people continue to ask for them, many bad teams are not that far from working and do not need much help for people to start having fun.

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A good "healer" (one who also, probably primarily, does other stuff besides heal) can often turn a bad team into a good one or even very good one. That is the simple reason people continue to ask for them, many bad teams are not that far from working and do not need much help for people to start having fun.

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Point and case on my Empathy/Psi. I had no reservations in any way shape or form when running team of placing it on Tier 4 difficulty. It was either a heal fest for me (when the team wasn't gelling) or I was just buffing when it's up and attacking (when the team is good, and adding a bit of crowd control via secondary effects). Granted, there has been a spectrum from hardly having a chance to buff (though I still did it) from healing so much to having to remind myself to buff because the team was functioning so well that I only really needed to blast.

I know how to play my Empath well, my point is that Empathy is the "healing" set, and no other set can heal as well as it. What I mean has been that even though Empathy can buff and do many other things than heal, there's a lot of sets that have a lot more buffs or debuffs. Storm and Radiation Emission have 1 heal, Thermal has 2, Trick Arrow and Force Fields have none, etc. If each set is played well, they add a lot to a team. Asking for a specific power set shows a weakness to the team in my opinion. Sure, a Rad, Kin, or Emp is a great addition, but FF, TA, Storm, Cold, etc. are also a great addition. It's the bias towards certain power sets that get me going.

Other than Statesman, I can't think of another TF or anything else in the entire game that needs a specific power set. Sure, a bad Rad or Kin versus a good Empath, I'll take the Empath every time. A good of any other power set besides those three versus a spamming Healing Aura, SB only, etc. Defenders, I'll take the one that's better. The teams I run don't need anything specific. Sure, a tanker would be nice, but if I have a team full of Defenders and Controllers or have a Scrapper that can tank just as well as a tanker *shrugs*. It's more about how well the players work together and use tactics more than what their team composition is. If the team is full of Blasters, sure it'll be "glass cannon" and "kill them before they kill us" mode. Even then, the secondary effects of the primaries and the secondaries of the blasters give a bit of crowd control as well. It really is the bias for certain power sets that really get to me.

Edit: For clarification.

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Why do you hate Empathy so bad just because there are retards playing?

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Who said they hated empathy? This is something that usually happens in the "healer" threads; people who are disgusted with the "healer" mentality generally aren't anti-empath, but rather anti-poorly-played-defender. Every person I have seen who describes themselves as a "healer" has built themselves to be just that (there are probably exceptions, but they're too rare for me to make an effort to find). No "healer" is of any use to me, regardless of what character I'm playing. But an actual defender is, every time.

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Empathy is not as useless a set as its being made out to be.

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It is if all someone is built to do is heal. But that has nothing to do with the set and everything to do with the player at the controls. A buffing, healing, blasting empath contributes at every stage of the game. I may have missed it, but I don't believe anyone has said otherwise.

Wow this thread is still going?

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Wow this thread is still going?

[/ QUOTE ]Of course! Why create a new anti-healer thread when this one will serve just fine?

I heart my anti-healer thread! Don't take it away from me!

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Why do you hate Empathy so bad just because there are retards playing?

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Who said they hated empathy? This is something that usually happens in the "healer" threads; people who are disgusted with the "healer" mentality generally aren't anti-empath, but rather anti-poorly-played-defender. Every person I have seen who describes themselves as a "healer" has built themselves to be just that (there are probably exceptions, but they're too rare for me to make an effort to find). No "healer" is of any use to me, regardless of what character I'm playing. But an actual defender is, every time.

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Empathy is not as useless a set as its being made out to be.

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It is if all someone is built to do is heal. But that has nothing to do with the set and everything to do with the player at the controls. A buffing, healing, blasting empath contributes at every stage of the game. I may have missed it, but I don't believe anyone has said otherwise.

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Oh Gawd this!!!

As Happy said... no one hates Empathy!! It's the "I r Teh H34Lz0R" Mentality. One attack all of the empathy pools + Medicine pool + all the flight pools +... you get my point.

I don't hate empathy defenders. Heck I have one at lvl 50, Emp/Psi. All of the buffs 3/4 of the heals and a very full attack chain!

The funny thing is that Empathy is, at least in my opinion, one of the easiest Defender sets to play. Compared with something like say, Storm Summoning, it's not really hard to play properly. The only real judgement you need is deciding who gets Fortitude and Adrenalin Boost.

I think that's one of the reasons bad Empaths rile people so much. Ignoring the buffs in the set and building a h34lz0r is like a Scrapper skipping his mez protection and then trying ferociously to cap his defense because he's always mezzed and being pounded on. There's something galling about watching someone playing on easy mode and managing to continually screw it up.

Fun story from last night...

Grabbed a level 6 rad defender out of broadcast as I started up a 53's farming team to level my shield tanker. He was the first player I picked. "Do you have EF?" "Yes" "Ok. Bear with me while I build a team."

He hit 41 after a four or five hour session. Most dependable player on the team. <3 Defenders. <3 that people are looking for healers and leaving me the good stuff.

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Fun story from last night...

Grabbed a level 6 rad defender out of broadcast as I started up a 53's farming team to level my shield tanker. He was the first player I picked. "Do you have EF?" "Yes" "Ok. Bear with me while I build a team."

He hit 41 after a four or five hour session. Most dependable player on the team. <3 Defenders. <3 that people are looking for healers and leaving me the good stuff.

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this is what it's all about!! I'll take a defender with Rad/ or TA/ or even Sonic/ over an emp yelling that they are "teh bestest H34lZ0r" anyday! Even to try to teach one that there is more than the green numbers over heads

(Didn't read anything but the title)

AE has caused a resurgence of me making only Sonic Defenders.

Take that!

People are still farming AE missions?

*tsk* When will people learn that every mob killed in a farm, a kitten dies.

Think of the old school farming and how many kittens where saved by that one mob between the buildings...

Think of the kittens and go back to old school farming!

*chomps on a carrot menacingly*

There, take that!!

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People are still farming AE missions?

*tsk* When will people learn that every mob killed in a farm, a kitten dies.

Think of the old school farming and how many kittens where saved by that one mob between the buildings...

Think of the kittens and go back to old school farming!

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I say, "Good Show!"

Because anything that helps end the 'Kitten Conspiracy', I'm all for.

Just because they're cute, doesn't mean they're owed world domination.

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Grabbed a level 6 rad defender out of broadcast as I started up a 53's farming team to level my shield tanker. He was the first player I picked. "Do you have EF?" "Yes" "Ok. Bear with me while I build a team." <3 that people are looking for healers and leaving me the good stuff.

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Ended up on a team tonight whose leader was deliberately looking for as much damage buffing as possible -- Fulcrum Shift + EF + Tar Patch + /sonic defender AoEs. Much lovely melting of mobs.

*sighs*

Why must some Tankers be stupid when it comes to this? I mean really. A Empath, a Cold Dom, and a Inv/Mace tanker in the lower 30s (the tanker a friend of the Empath being Exemplared to 32). We only got about 6 mobs into it before things... umm... blew up.

I'm, personally, a very aggressive Defender player. As such, when the tanker decided several times to not head into the group after a bit, I moved in to pull (some if not all) of the group. I finally made a tactical mistake of doing an AoE debuff, causing all aggro instantly on me with Dannan green tree/earth things. Naturally, I got ranged attacked by all of them and instantly fell.

He asked why I went in first, to which I responded, "Well, someone had to do it." He then said he was waiting on his Healers before jumping in. I responded "Healers?" He asked if I were new, to which I responded "No. Are you?" He said no and that Empathy are Healers, to which I responded that Defenders do more than heal. The Empath buffs, heals, and attacks, which is called a defender. In my mind, I was screaming that I was playing Cold Domination... a power set without a heal. The tanker said thanks for the lesson and sarcasm, to which I said I give it when it's due. He turned me on ignore, then the Empath ended up kicking me from the team because the Tanker was a friend of his.

*shrugs*

I was only somewhat sarcastic with his calling us Healers. However, the gloves were off when he asked if I were new. When I've played every power set of the Defender AT and have several Defenders and Controllers at or above 30, but naturally, me scoffing at the word Healer with an Empath in the team, automatically makes me new?

The other thing that make me smile was the fact that he was complaining about his blue bar as well. I know my Cold Dom didn't have Heat Loss (level 30), but we had an Empath using Recovery Aura. I have the feeling that we had an Empath that knew what he/she was doing and myself along with a buddy AE baby. Heck, when the tanker dropped, my Energy Blast was causing enough mitigation (along with my Debuffs and the Empath's Buffs) that me and the Empath almost duo'd the rest of the group, until the Tanker took the 2nd rez by the Empath. For some odd reason he missed the first one... Probably wanted to see us fail and then laugh at us to let him do his thing.

Do all Tankers really have this ego streak? I don't believe I do with my one level 40 Dark Armor/Mace Tanker, but I'd be willing to chalk that up to being a Defender and having that mentality. Any else have this problem recently?

...most Tankers should know the value of buffs and debuffs better than anyone.

You teamed with a moron who happened to be playing a Tanker.

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Ended up on a team tonight whose leader was deliberately looking for as much damage buffing as possible -- Fulcrum Shift + EF + Tar Patch + /sonic defender AoEs. Much lovely melting of mobs.

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Chuckle, and I didn't think it was that optimal a team, either!!! Other tanker was terrible, someone kept KBing mobs, and we kept getting folks immob'd out of camp which took longer to kill. Still, we clocked in at a decent pace.

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Do all Tankers really have this ego streak? I don't believe I do with my one level 40 Dark Armor/Mace Tanker, but I'd be willing to chalk that up to being a Defender and having that mentality. Any else have this problem recently?

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I rather loathe playing with tankers for this reason. The tanker boards are, in that way, a guilty pleasure to me - lots of hard heads, lots of ego, general diva mentality. As someone that's been tanking content in every raiding MMO I've played at the top tier, I'm used to dealing with the prima dona mentality, but it's annoying nonetheless - especially because the majority just don't have the skills to back up the ego.

I have a few tankers. I just got a new one to 50 yesterday. I think the AT has become much more desirable since the AE came out, but it's still a subpar AT in my opinion. I've run plenty of PUG 54 boss farms blue side with no tanker. Every TF in the game has been completed (at breakneck pace) with no tanker. etc, etc.

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He then said he was waiting on his Healers before jumping in. I responded "Healers?" He asked if I were new, to which I responded "No. Are you?" He said no and that Empathy are Healers, to which I responded that Defenders do more than heal.

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This kind of player lets me build the teams I like. Please don't disabuse them of the notion.

What's old is new again.

In this case, ignorance.

I had the worst experience on Saturday with an AE bunny. We made the mistake of advertising our Synapse in Atlas and got a 17 Kin/Arch. He assured us he was a good Defender since he had 2 x 50’s both Defenders. Being the only Defender in a melee heavy team we told the Tank and Scrappers to stick together and for the Kin to hit them when he can with Transfusion. First engagement tank and 2 scrappers die with zero coming from the Kin other than lots of arrows, so we look at his build..OMG! He has all Archery powers up to Aim , Stealth, Kick, Flurry and Siphon Power!! One whole power from his primary !! We asked him why he didn’t take any of his primary powers , he said and I quote. “ I never needed taht stuff b4 the blobs never attack us” .....Ugh.......I died a little inside

P.S. should have looked at him ahead of time then I would have seen his 14 total badges ( no vet badges ) 11 of them AE badges and his power choices. Ah well.

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I had the worst experience on Saturday with an AE bunny. We made the mistake of advertising our Synapse in Atlas and got a 17 Kin/Arch. He assured us he was a good Defender since he had 2 x 50’s both Defenders. Being the only Defender in a melee heavy team we told the Tank and Scrappers to stick together and for the Kin to hit them when he can with Transfusion. First engagement tank and 2 scrappers die with zero coming from the Kin other than lots of arrows, so we look at his build..OMG! He has all Archery powers up to Aim , Stealth, Kick, Flurry and Siphon Power!! One whole power from his primary !! We asked him why he didn’t take any of his primary powers , he said and I quote. “ I never needed taht stuff b4 the blobs never attack us” .....Ugh.......I died a little inside

P.S. should have looked at him ahead of time then I would have seen his 14 total badges ( no vet badges ) 11 of them AE badges and his power choices. Ah well.

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Always look at the badges before a task force. They aren't always an accurate picture of a person's play experience, but they will let you know when something is way way wrong.

This is why I like using Global Channels for my TF needs. Sure there will be the occasional jerk or somewhat uneducated person who doesn't know exactly what you do, but most of the time the uneducated tend to be happy to learn. Most of the time you'll get decent players. At least that's my experience.