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Also, given J_Bs posting history it's pretty clear what he means. 
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm very familiar with Johnny's campaigns and posting history, but I'm just not clear on what the inference is.
Whether or not any powers ever get alternate animations has nothing to do with luck. I've never personally been against the idea of having alternate power animations, quite the opposite. We've simply lacked the tech to do that and the time to create said animations.
The infamous knockout blow animation wasn't even something that I animated, so I have no attachment to it and don't feel any need to defend it's quality. I happen to like it, I know plenty of others do as well, and I know a great deal of people who don't.
What any of that has to do with 'knowing BABs' and the likelihood of this happening at any time is where I'm confused.
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You hear it here! BAB's confirmed that alternate animations are coming!!! ZOMG!
Kidding 
@bpphantom
The Defenders of Paragon
KGB Special Section 8
The animation for KO Blow does not seem to be that bad to me. It would be nice to take a look at Punch's animation first. For that one I would like to see the same animation used for Charged Brawl or Energy Punch.
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Whether or not any powers ever get alternate animations has nothing to do with luck. I've never personally been against the idea of having alternate power animations, quite the opposite. We've simply lacked the tech to do that and the time to create said animations.
[/ QUOTE ]
Funny how you say that in past tense. It's almost as if your subconcious was screaming that you now have the tech and the time and that we may see this in I16 along with color customization.
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Now you're just baiting.
Some say you're a master of it.
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I'm merely an apprentice.
Slot KO Blow with Kinetic Crash, and you slot it for [i]Awesome!!![i]
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Whether or not any powers ever get alternate animations has nothing to do with luck. I've never personally been against the idea of having alternate power animations, quite the opposite. We've simply lacked the tech to do that and the time to create said animations.
[/ QUOTE ]
Funny how you say that in past tense. It's almost as if your subconcious was screaming that you now have the tech and the time and that we may see this in I16 along with color customization.
[/ QUOTE ]
My subconscious is currently eating pretzels. I'm not sure if this is significant.
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
[ QUOTE ]
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Also, given J_Bs posting history it's pretty clear what he means.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm very familiar with Johnny's campaigns and posting history, but I'm just not clear on what the inference is.
Whether or not any powers ever get alternate animations has nothing to do with luck. I've never personally been against the idea of having alternate power animations, quite the opposite. We've simply lacked the tech to do that and the time to create said animations.
The infamous knockout blow animation wasn't even something that I animated, so I have no attachment to it and don't feel any need to defend it's quality. I happen to like it, I know plenty of others do as well, and I know a great deal of people who don't.
What any of that has to do with 'knowing BABs' and the likelihood of this happening at any time is where I'm confused.
[/ QUOTE ]
It is actually very easy to explain.
You see, you and the Devs are all part of a massive conspiracy to undermine the comic book theme that Tankers should be following.
Now, I know you are going to deny it because I have a deep understanding of the nature of this conspiracy. It has roots in the old Everquest trinity of Damage/Heal/Tanker. Back then it was decided that a council of elders must make sure this "Holy Trinity" is maintained for not just EQ but all MMO's.
So, hidden as Developers, this council of elders has worked there way deep into every major MMO since that time. Some they pass there influence upon, such as WoW. Others they destroy as a threat to the trinity, such as Auto Assault. Always the holy trinity has been kept in check.
This is why you and the evil devs try so hard to force tankers into a non-super hero mold. If ever a hero were to figure out that the trinity is not necessary, like J_B, this person must be ignored and have the community turned against him. Such is the decree of the great elders of all MMO.
But what not even you know is that you are a Nemesis Automation. Yup, you were replaced several years ago..sometime between avatar #4 and 7 from my calculations.
So, to answer your confusion, you do not know yourself because you are part of a Nemesis plot to make tanks unplayable so that he can finally forcebolt the defenders.
Any questions?
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Awesome power I agree...but the wind-up is very cartoony.
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Just imagine hearing "IT'S CLOBBERING TIME!" during the animation.
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Yeah, I agree, KoB is awesome. It's great for the SS set.
JB can go jump in a lake. Seriously, why do people even respond to his nonsense?
Only one... WTF???
GIVE TANKS DARKNESS/ELECTRICAL MASTERY! =3
Level 50's: Komrade Kommunism (T); King Darksource (T); Burning Red Star (T); Komrade Kosmonaut (WS); Vredesbyrd (Br); Anarchery (Bl)
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Whether or not any powers ever get alternate animations has nothing to do with luck. I've never personally been against the idea of having alternate power animations, quite the opposite. We've simply lacked the tech to do that and the time to create said animations.
[/ QUOTE ]
Funny how you say that in past tense. It's almost as if your subconcious was screaming that you now have the tech and the time and that we may see this in I16 along with color customization.
[/ QUOTE ]
My subconscious is currently eating pretzels. I'm not sure if this is significant.
[/ QUOTE ]
It's only significant if they are somebody else's pretzels or your subconscious is naked while eating them or your subconscious is thinking about your mother. 
"I am a Tank. I am your first choice, I am your last hope." -- Rune Bull
"Durability is the quintessential super-power. " -- Sailboat
I like KO Blow. Reminds me of Popeye Even so more animations would be nice for every power.
more. More. MORE!!!!
*Grabs a whip and starts chasing BABs*
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Man I love Knock Out Blow on my SS tanker. Nothing better in the world then a wind up upper cut that sends you foe flying.
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My personal favorite is when you deliver an attack like this at night outdoors and the lights in the building behind your foe go out just as you hit them. LIGHTS OUT! lol
----------------------------
You can't please everyone, so lets concentrate on me.
One of the most fun things to do with KOB (which I do on occasion when I'm bored and passing through low level zones) is to click on the Vanguard accolade power (if you have it) which amplifies all secondary effects (such as knock-up in this particular instance) and go hit some little lvl 5 guy with a KOB. The hang time is just spectacular.
�Life's hard. It's even harder when you're stupid.� ― John Wayne
�Just think of how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of them are even stupider!� - George Carlin
Lets get back tom the point...custom power animations! This would be sheer AWESOME and an excellent way to expand customization.
"Samual_Tow - Be disappointed all you want, people. You just don't appreciate the miracles that are taking place here."
Agreed! So would being able to change the fetter for your powers!
"I am a Tank. I am your first choice, I am your last hope." -- Rune Bull
"Durability is the quintessential super-power. " -- Sailboat
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Agreed! So would being able to change the fetter for your powers!
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Yeah! New fetter! New...uh...what?
If we are to die, let us die like men. -- Patrick Cleburne
----------------------------------------------------------
The rule is that they must be loved. --Jayne Fynes-Clinton, Death of an Abandoned Dog
LOL! The ability to change where the powers are tied to(i.e. blasts from the hands or eyes etc...)
"I am a Tank. I am your first choice, I am your last hope." -- Rune Bull
"Durability is the quintessential super-power. " -- Sailboat
[ QUOTE ]
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Also, given J_Bs posting history it's pretty clear what he means.
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I'm very familiar with Johnny's campaigns and posting history, but I'm just not clear on what the inference is.
Whether or not any powers ever get alternate animations has nothing to do with luck. I've never personally been against the idea of having alternate power animations, quite the opposite. We've simply lacked the tech to do that and the time to create said animations.
The infamous knockout blow animation wasn't even something that I animated, so I have no attachment to it and don't feel any need to defend it's quality. I happen to like it, I know plenty of others do as well, and I know a great deal of people who don't.
What any of that has to do with 'knowing BABs' and the likelihood of this happening at any time is where I'm confused.
[/ QUOTE ]
It is actually very easy to explain.
You see, you and the Devs are all part of a massive conspiracy to undermine the comic book theme that Tankers should be following.
Now, I know you are going to deny it because I have a deep understanding of the nature of this conspiracy. It has roots in the old Everquest trinity of Damage/Heal/Tanker. Back then it was decided that a council of elders must make sure this "Holy Trinity" is maintained for not just EQ but all MMO's.
So, hidden as Developers, this council of elders has worked there way deep into every major MMO since that time. Some they pass there influence upon, such as WoW. Others they destroy as a threat to the trinity, such as Auto Assault. Always the holy trinity has been kept in check.
This is why you and the evil devs try so hard to force tankers into a non-super hero mold. If ever a hero were to figure out that the trinity is not necessary, like J_B, this person must be ignored and have the community turned against him. Such is the decree of the great elders of all MMO.
But what not even you know is that you are a Nemesis Automation. Yup, you were replaced several years ago..sometime between avatar #4 and 7 from my calculations.
So, to answer your confusion, you do not know yourself because you are part of a Nemesis plot to make tanks unplayable so that he can finally forcebolt the defenders.
Any questions?
[/ QUOTE ]
AC2, Tabula Rasa and Matrix Online didn't have the holy trinity ... the truth is out there.
*nods*
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AC2, Tabula Rasa and Matrix Online didn't have the holy trinity ... the truth is out there.
*nods*
[/ QUOTE ]
No Trinity in The Matrix? Is she still dead?
"I am a Tank. I am your first choice, I am your last hope." -- Rune Bull
"Durability is the quintessential super-power. " -- Sailboat
I see what you did there.
[ QUOTE ]
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Also, given J_Bs posting history it's pretty clear what he means.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm very familiar with Johnny's campaigns and posting history, but I'm just not clear on what the inference is.
Whether or not any powers ever get alternate animations has nothing to do with luck. I've never personally been against the idea of having alternate power animations, quite the opposite. We've simply lacked the tech to do that and the time to create said animations.
The infamous knockout blow animation wasn't even something that I animated, so I have no attachment to it and don't feel any need to defend it's quality. I happen to like it, I know plenty of others do as well, and I know a great deal of people who don't.
What any of that has to do with 'knowing BABs' and the likelihood of this happening at any time is where I'm confused.
[/ QUOTE ]
This thread passed way under my radar since that post.
Allow me to clarify.
Knowing that:
-You've implied in the past the animation and power systems effects were held together by Elmer's glue and thumbtacks, and that changing animations was cumbersome.
-Cast times for animations are not standard, greatly cutting down what animations could be swapped around without impacting power balance. Unless a system was created to auto re-time them and assuming they still looked OK...or unless you created dozens of versions of the KO Blow animation to fit every conceivable cast time, I wouldn't see the work involved being worth it just for something as minor as every attack having one alternate animation.
-You're already swamped with work doing just the particle effects tinting aspect of power customization, which as far as we know is the extent of the customization i16 will offer(the already existing weapon customization system not withstanding).
-Melee sets without weapons are the minority. There's more bang/buck ratio for putting work in to custom weapons and tinting particle effects.
...and combining that with the answers you've commonly given about things like power customization and your posting history, I suspected that you and the other devs would deem swapping cast animations, along with things like changing emination points (ie Laser Eye Beams from my hands) or entire particle types (Ice Blast being able to shoot fire balls) as being beyond your means to deliver.
In short, alternate cast animations seems like a long shot given the things you've said, and we'd have to very very lucky to roll that seven.
Also...I don't know... something something the devs hate Tankers. Whatever you expect me to say.
.
I think J_B is just frustrated that his mechanic told him it wasn't easy to drop a 442 V8 into his Honda Civic.
His Civic being held together by chewing gum and hated by Honda and all.
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Knowing that:
-You've implied in the past the animation and power systems effects were held together by Elmer's glue and thumbtacks, and that changing animations was cumbersome.
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Actually, BaB never implied the power and animation systems were held together by Elmer's glue and thumbtacks. Actually, they are held together by (arrays of) PFXs. The animation system *itself* is a very complex system, but the connection between the powers system and the animation system is, if a bit Rube Goldbergian, not very complex or fragile.
Changing animations isn't cumbersome per se. Actually making animations themselves, whether for power customization or just a brand new power itself, is somewhat cumbersome.
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-Cast times for animations are not standard, greatly cutting down what animations could be swapped around without impacting power balance. Unless a system was created to auto re-time them and assuming they still looked OK...or unless you created dozens of versions of the KO Blow animation to fit every conceivable cast time, I wouldn't see the work involved being worth it just for something as minor as every attack having one alternate animation.
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Actually, due to the mechanics of animation rooting and cast time enforcement, balance isn't really an issue. If the player picks an animation that is shorter than the cast time, cast time will still be enforced. If the player picks an animation time that is longer than the cast time, the rooted time of that animation will be enforced. The player could theoretically nerf themselves with a longer animation, but they could not buff themselves with a shorter one.
The issue was never stated as a balance issue for that reason. The real issue (for BaB, anyway) is aesthetic, since picking animations that are too short would induce pauses at the end of attacks, and picking animations too randomly can create transition problems in some unusual cases where powers were not designed to follow each other.
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-You're already swamped with work doing just the particle effects tinting aspect of power customization, which as far as we know is the extent of the customization i16 will offer(the already existing weapon customization system not withstanding).
-Melee sets without weapons are the minority. There's more bang/buck ratio for putting work in to custom weapons and tinting particle effects.
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Hmm: assuming you count spines and claws as weapon sets for this purpose then by my mental count 3 of 8 scrapper primaries, 6 of 9 tanker secondaries, 6 of 9 brute primaries, and 4 of 8 stalker primaries are essentially unarmed melee attack sets: that's 19 of 34 or 56%. That doesn't count melee attacks in dominator assault sets, blaster secondaries, or power pool attacks like boxing and air superiority. Melee attacks without weapons are actually in the majority, and melee attack powersets are also in the majority.
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...and combining that with the answers you've commonly given about things like power customization and your posting history, I suspected that you and the other devs would deem swapping cast animations, along with things like changing emination points (ie Laser Eye Beams from my hands) or entire particle types (Ice Blast being able to shoot fire balls) as being beyond your means to deliver.
[/ QUOTE ]
It was always said that it would require a tech change to deliver. Although I will grant you that I've always been much less pessimistic about the actual work game-engine side than BaB has been.
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In short, alternate cast animations seems like a long shot given the things you've said, and we'd have to very very lucky to roll that seven.
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In terms of what BaB has actually said about the subject, three things would have been actual impediments to customized power animations:
1. The game engine would need to be modified to support alternate animations
2. New animations would take a significant amount of time to create
3. Power customization (on that level) would have to be made a sufficiently high priority to allocate resources to do both.
Given the stated direction of I16, both #1 and #3 are now on shaky ground and the conditions surrounding both shouldn't be presumed to be the same any more. #2 is the only bottleneck, and its impossible to judge how much of one it is relative to the priority that power customization might now have.
Without speaking to Knockout Blow itself, I'd say my own estimate for the probability that I16 either introduces custom power animations or creates the opportunity to customize power animations (in at least some limited form) is something between about one in ten (and I don't actually know if it is or is not coming: that's a genuine guestimate). Low, but not astronomically low. My guess that such a feature is added in some form within the next twelve months is much, much higher (better than even money: I'd take that bet).
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
In one little corner of the universe, there's nothing more irritating than a misfile...
(Please support the best webcomic about a cosmic universal realignment by impaired angelic interference resulting in identity crisis angst. Or I release the pigmy water thieves.)
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Without speaking to Knockout Blow itself, I'd say my own estimate for the probability that I16 either introduces custom power animations or creates the opportunity to customize power animations (in at least some limited form) is something between about one in ten (and I don't actually know if it is or is not coming: that's a genuine guestimate). Low, but not astronomically low. My guess that such a feature is added in some form within the next twelve months is much, much higher (better than even money: I'd take that bet).
[/ QUOTE ]
Agreed! At this point it's not a question of if they will be adding more power customization, it's a question of when they choose to add it. Cryptic goes to open beta in about 3 weeks or so and DCUO is just starting their pre-alpha testing so the proverbial wolves are at the door.
NCSoft ponied up alot of cash to buy CoH from Cryptic and then went on a hiring spree. I honestly can't see them wasting that investment by ignoring something like power customization. I personally think we will see it earlier rather than later, probably no later than the first of the year.
"I am a Tank. I am your first choice, I am your last hope." -- Rune Bull
"Durability is the quintessential super-power. " -- Sailboat
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The animation system *itself* is a very complex system, but the connection between the powers system and the animation system is, if a bit Rube Goldbergian, not very complex or fragile.
[/ QUOTE ]
You're contradicting yourself.
Rube Goldberg:
2. deviously complex and impractical
If the connection is "Rube Goldbergian" as you put it, that implies it is also complex and impractical(to change).
Consiering the number of animation and effect breaks the seem to have happend recently, I'm thinking it's more fragile than you're giving it credit for.
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The real issue (for BaB, anyway) is aesthetic, since picking animations that are too short would induce pauses at the end of attacks, and picking animations too randomly can create transition problems in some unusual cases where powers were not designed to follow each other.
[/ QUOTE ]
Which is why I said "if they still looked OK" after being re-timed, assuming BaBs wasn't re-timing them each by hand.
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My guess that such a feature is added in some form within the next twelve months is much, much higher (better than even money: I'd take that bet).
[/ QUOTE ]
I wouldn't lay any money down until I saw how Going Rogue performs. It's quite possible there will be some "team restructuring" if GR doesn't live up to what NCSoft hopes, and that would alter the scope of any subsequent development of the game.
.
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Thank you for the dev interpretation. Handy as always.
In another thread Moonlighter said:
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Things that really should be banned (temporarily):
~ If your response makes assumptions on what the devs are thinking instead of the changes they implemented you need a break.
~ If your response is more about the devs and less about the change you need a break.
~ If your response is driven by self righteous indignation you need a break.
~ If your response word smiths or twists the devs words when my 8 year old nephew understands exactly what they mean you need a break.
~ If you waste time actually fabricating a fictional exchange in the Paragon office then you *really* need a break.
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But who would post on the boards then?
*smirk*