7th, could you please explain why you disliked the old PvP so much? Just wondering. Using the whole 'old PvP was crap and you know it' argument just makes you look ignorant.
Im reminded of a famous quote. "If someone forms an opinion that is not based on facts, then he is a fool"
Here are a couple facts about i13 PvP:
-There are less viable sets now than what existed in Prei13 PvP.
-Teaming isn't important in i13 PvP, which goes against the mantra of all MMO's
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7th, could you please explain why you disliked the old PvP so much? Just wondering. Using the whole 'old PvP was crap and you know it' argument just makes you look ignorant.
Im reminded of a famous quote. "If someone forms an opinion that is not based on facts, then he is a fool"
Here are a couple facts about i13 PvP:
-There are less viable sets now than what existed in Prei13 PvP.
-Teaming isn't important in i13 PvP, which goes against the mantra of all MMO's
[/ QUOTE ]
Well said...
Teaming has gone down the pooper! 
Hmm.. Ive only just came to the game.. only been here for about a week.. Been playing WAR alot, got sick of it because all the end of game PvP was CC and nothing else..
When I first started playing this tho, I thought wow.. hehe, PvP here is gonna be cool.. so I challenged a mate to a duel at the arena.. My first toon being a dominator you can imagine my surprise when my Confuse only lasted 4 seconds on his Minions.. the minion just stood there staring at everything not even attacking.. I can understand a little with what they were trying to do.. CC in WAR is a big issue.. but 4 seconds? lol.. EVEN MY SLEEP IS 4 SECONDS!! And that wears off if anything hits it.. sure you can increase the time (Can you?) but some of it does seem a bit drastic, and that was my first impression of PvP..
Now, looking on here, PvP sounded alot more fun without the gnarly power suppression.. and Ive read some things about Stalker super jump/speed combos? Damn, that woulda been fun to hunt down one of them.. And someone mentioned somewhere about using superspeed to just constantly run some-one over until they were dead? Your intelligent people... ... ... surely you can find a way to stop the speedy little bastad in his tracks.. sounds like it'd be part of the fun..
I had a guildie on WAR who left this game because of its PvP changes.. Im beginning to understand why.. Im not goin anywhere tho, the cool factor for this game is still there.. and I'll stalk the PvP zones most likely because Ive never tasted the sweetness of this earlier PvP and know no difference.. but I WONT be doing it on my Dominator.. I'll be doing it on my Brute..
Oh yeah, and I spose I should ask a question.. Does anyone think that they will re-think the changes they made to PvP? And bring back some of the supposed magic they took out of it?
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Mac:
The irony of your post is - you have answered the question your expecting me to answer. Why would I need to when you unknowingly already have? Hehehe..
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I guess so... basically what you're saying here is, "I have no idea what I'm talking about, but because I say it's better without any evidence to back up my claims - just trust me guys, it's better, ok?" Most of my posts in response to you in this thread, and others, have shown time and time again that you are logically and factually wrong on several subjects. But, I forgot - it seems that, as of late, in this game logic and facts aren't what dictate change. Knowingly lying to try and prove your point and getting called out on it didn't help your credibility one bit.
Ignorance really is bliss, huh?
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
[ QUOTE ]
Oh yeah, and I spose I should ask a question.. Does anyone think that they will re-think the changes they made to PvP? And bring back some of the supposed magic they took out of it?
[/ QUOTE ]
Im pretty sure there is no chance of that happening since Castle and Posi truly believe PvP is better now.
Idiots.
[ QUOTE ]
7th, could you please explain why you disliked the old PvP so much? Just wondering.
[/ QUOTE ]
Thats a loaded question based on my original, and really only, point.
Lets try this in baby steps:
Its obvious by many posts that those that hate the changes, enjoyed how PvP was before. Thats not to say that they didnt think there were any probs, just not as many as there probably really were. (Sure thats subjective, but its a guaranteed majority opinion.)
With that said, its a safe bet that any changes made to PvP, much less drastic ones, would not be welcome by the more 'hardcore' PvP community. Why overhaul something that was working well, right?
So if I were to list the issues that made original PvP broken, most of those said people would just disagree with me.
Instead, we should try and anwer this question: Why dont/didnt people PvP?
And lets start with Macs list of answers: Because some people...
1. didn't like the lack of reward. (Rewards added - check)
2. didn't like that they had to build their character differently. (Dual builds added - check)
3. didn't like the unpredictability. (And those people still dont)
4. didn't like that their Superman clone could die in half a second. (Answer for that: Slow down the game, as the devs are trying to)
5. just didn't want to PvP. (And those people still dont)
6. might've even been turned off by the people they met while PvP'ing. (Very true, but quite possible that some of those people have since left)
Now let me add my own:
7. didnt like how seemingly unbalanced it was between ATs. (still lingering issues here)
8. didnt like how you had to tailor your toon around pvp, and not pvp around your toon. (read: carbon copy characters w/acro, 2+ travel powers, etc - seems to have been replaced w/hibernate, PS, etc)
9. didnt like the hit-and-run tactics. (travel suppression - check)
10. cant accept others are better than them. (And those people still dont)
I think thats a fair list of possible answers, whether or not you agree with them. Have they all been resolved? No, and some will never be. Did it creat new probs? In some cases yes. But it is obvious that it has gotten generally better, and that the devs have worked, and are still working in PvPs best interest.
Also for additional details on what was fixed, check out Project_X593 nice list on page 9.
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2. didn't like that they had to build their character differently. (Dual builds added - check)
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Dual builds are good but it means 2xtimes much IOs to spend on my toon to make it work in pvp and pve(and yes i want IOed toons to run TFs sry :P)...in i12 i still could have buffs on my pvp toon and do great in TFs, just example fire/em blasters. Fire ball was great in both pvp and pve now it is junk. Thanks.
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4. didn't like that their Superman clone could die in half a second. (Answer for that: Slow down the game, as the devs are trying to)
[/ QUOTE ] yeah now they don't die at all unless you drain them to 0 or have 10 ppl attacking them...is THIS balance??????
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6. might've even been turned off by the people they met while PvP'ing. (Very true, but quite possible that some of those people have since left)
[/ QUOTE ] trust me i see lotsa noobs in pvp now with bigger mouth than hardcore pvp'ers ever had. GG.
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7. didnt like how seemingly unbalanced it was between ATs. (still lingering issues here)
[/ QUOTE ] i13 didn't fix it and won't ever then why waste program space anyway?
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8. didnt like how you had to tailor your toon around pvp, and not pvp around your toon. (read: carbon copy characters w/acro, 2+ travel powers, etc - seems to have been replaced w/hibernate, PS, etc)
[/ QUOTE ] yah well if everyone could remake pvp into what they want we would get broken i13 every day in different way... flying invul/ss tankers RPing superman cried a lot about pvp enviroment here we go now...try to kill one in zone solo...
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9. didnt like the hit-and-run tactics. (travel suppression - check)
[/ QUOTE ] kk then explain me WHY IN THE WORLD DO I GET SUPRESSED BY CASTING ICE SHIELDS ON MY TEAMMATE????????????????? WHERE IS HERE HIT AND RUN????
i could only say LEARN2WEBNADE.
So from all this i don't see how game mechanics for pvp got better in generally or fixed anything (all this arena options, rewards and fluff don't count they could be added to old pvp too w/o breaking anything :P)
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EnD:
Did I say the majority of people like the changes?
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you said that there are more players in pvp now..i would assume from this comment that ppl like new pvp otherelse why would they try to hard to pvp...according to you..sry i have to LOL here.
4. didn't like that their Superman clone could die in half a second. (Answer for that: Slow down the game, as the devs are trying to)
Um...by slowing the game down, death is much faster. IMO gamers wanted suppression because they didn't like how people would run away when they were in trouble. Hmmm...that makes a lot of sense?
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all this arena options, rewards and fluff don't count they could be added to old pvp too w/o breaking anything
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Here is the issue @ hand. So you wanted extra arena options and rewards, but PvP mechanics left untouched? My point is made. I mean really, why even bother to reply?
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you said that there are more players in pvp now..i would assume from this comment that ppl like new pvp otherelse why would they try to hard to pvp...according to you..sry i have to LOL here.
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I still dont see where the majority is. You know, I dont really LOL, but if I did, Id prolly LOL here. HA!
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7th, could you please explain why you disliked the old PvP so much? Just wondering.
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Thats a loaded question based on my original, and really only, point.
Lets try this in baby steps:
Its obvious by many posts that those that hate the changes, enjoyed how PvP was before. Thats not to say that they didnt think there were any probs, just not as many as there probably really were. (Sure thats subjective, but its a guaranteed majority opinion.)
With that said, its a safe bet that any changes made to PvP, much less drastic ones, would not be welcome by the more 'hardcore' PvP community. Why overhaul something that was working well, right?
So if I were to list the issues that made original PvP broken, most of those said people would just disagree with me.
Instead, we should try and anwer this question: Why dont/didnt people PvP?
And lets start with Macs list of answers: Because some people...
1. didn't like the lack of reward. (Rewards added - check)
2. didn't like that they had to build their character differently. (Dual builds added - check)
3. didn't like the unpredictability. (And those people still dont)
4. didn't like that their Superman clone could die in half a second. (Answer for that: Slow down the game, as the devs are trying to)
5. just didn't want to PvP. (And those people still dont)
6. might've even been turned off by the people they met while PvP'ing. (Very true, but quite possible that some of those people have since left)
Now let me add my own:
7. didnt like how seemingly unbalanced it was between ATs. (still lingering issues here)
8. didnt like how you had to tailor your toon around pvp, and not pvp around your toon. (read: carbon copy characters w/acro, 2+ travel powers, etc - seems to have been replaced w/hibernate, PS, etc)
9. didnt like the hit-and-run tactics. (travel suppression - check)
10. cant accept others are better than them. (And those people still dont)
I think thats a fair list of possible answers, whether or not you agree with them. Have they all been resolved? No, and some will never be. Did it creat new probs? In some cases yes. But it is obvious that it has gotten generally better, and that the devs have worked, and are still working in PvPs best interest.
Also for additional details on what was fixed, check out Project_X593 nice list on page 9.
[/ QUOTE ]
I read your reasons and I can't understand why we are having arguments here. Your reasons for disliking the old PvP are almost the exact same as some of the most hardcore people I know.
Instead, we should try and anwer this question: Why dont/didnt people PvP?
And lets start with Macs list of answers: Because some people...
1. didn't like the lack of reward. (Rewards added - check) - Good thing about i14
2. didn't like that they had to build their character differently. (Dual builds added - check) Good thing about i13
3. didn't like the unpredictability. (And those people still dont) PvP isn't for everyone
4. didn't like that their Superman clone could die in half a second. (Answer for that: Slow down the game, as the devs are trying to) This is where the overkill started, ill get to it later
5. just didn't want to PvP. (And those people still dont) Again, you can't please everyone
6. might've even been turned off by the people they met while PvP'ing. (Very true, but quite possible that some of those people have since left) I have little sympathy for people with thin skin
Now let me add my own:
7. didnt like how seemingly unbalanced it was between ATs. (still lingering issues here) Some of the i13 changes fixed this its the additional crap that caused worse lingering issues than what existed
8. didnt like how you had to tailor your toon around pvp, and not pvp around your toon. (read: carbon copy characters w/acro, 2+ travel powers, etc - seems to have been replaced w/hibernate, PS, etc) Dual builds kinda fixed this issue but it doesn't address the heart of it. Some people just got pissed that their concept toon didn't fair well in PvP. PvP will never be 100% balanced amongst AT's, but these changes have taken it a step away from balance
9. didnt like the hit-and-run tactics. (travel suppression - check) Travel supression was buffed in i13. Yep, you heard it correctly - you can travel faster while attacking then you could before. The problem is that supression was buffable before - which required teamwork. That aspect is now gone. I do think that the person being attacked should be supressed if they were hit by a melee attack though.
10. cant accept others are better than them. (And those people still dont)
Player vs Player combat has never been balanced in any MMO out there. Where City of Heroes shined was that good teamwork and skill will stomp out anything. Having the game being based on skill and teamwork made it competative. Sure, there are going to be AT's that shined in either system, but if you were going around to have a casual night PvPing, you could bring any AT and still not suck, as long as you had the skill to play it.
In my opinion The new PvP is training wheels that can't be removed. People didn't want to spend the small ammount of effort necessary to be decent at the old system and just screamed for change. My first toon was an invul/ss tank and it would irritate me how squishy he was. It wasn't until I learned how to play my dude differently in PvP that I really began to get a certain sense of enjoyment out of it. I also was considered amongst the PvP crowd to not be very good, and that's an accurate statement. So take it how ever you want, but this isn't coming from someone who is upset that they aren't the best anymore (Infact, im better at the new PvP than I was at the old and I still dont like it).
I can't fault you for liking the new system. It would be like me faulting someone for liking mayo and Jelly sandwiches instead of Peanutbutter and Jelly. But the fact remains that I can cite several examples of how the changes went completely overboard and how it has hurt, rather than helped, PvP from my perspective.
People will argue that they would be happy if we went back to i12 and I would be among them. I would gladly lose the things that I like about the new PvP to get rid of the several dealbreakers that exist today. I personally would like a re-evualation of the new PvP and take the best things from it and combine them with the best things from the old system.
New system good things:
Dual builds
PvP rewards
Hero/Villian Balance of epics
Making more viable APPs/PPPs
New system things that have pros/cons:
Damage changes - Increased the number of viable toons, yet really hurt some
Dealbreakers:
Unbuffable travel supression - The old system was fine just tweak it to make melee be unresisted supression.
Mez resistance
Diminishing returns
Heal Decay
At the end of the day, You will have your opinion and I will have mine. I currently based my opinion on having played the old way from the casual fights to the highest level. I also have played the new way, beta'd it, quit the game, got over the knee jerk reaction, and I am currently fighting for change. I might be willing to bet that I have spent more time either PvPing or thinking about PvP (lineups, builds, etc) than most of the forum cartels have spent posting on this site. I don't know how much time you put into the old system. You could have been in the arena or zones every day or you just tried it acouple times and didn't like it at all. I will say that PvP has a very steep learning curve. Really, only the thickheaded who don't mind getting beaten over and over again end up sticking around long enough to become decent themselves.
Again, you are very right that this is all subjective. I would like to see some datamining from the devs if PvP has been more active now than in i11 (i12 beta really killed the test PvP community because of how long it took, we were fairly active in i11 though)
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Here is the issue @ hand. So you wanted extra arena options and rewards, but PvP mechanics left untouched? My point is made. I mean really, why even bother to reply?
[/ QUOTE ]
Is there something inherently wrong with wanting incentives or tweaks added without a wholesale change to the system? You seem to think so.
PvP rewards/new arena options and a complete overhaul of the PvP system did not need to happen at the same time, but the latter somewhat necessitated the former.
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
[ QUOTE ]
Here is the issue @ hand. So you wanted extra arena options and rewards, but PvP mechanics left untouched? My point is made. I mean really, why even bother to reply?
[/ QUOTE ]
My point was all this reward fluff won't make it good for the reatrded pvp changes we have right now...Yes some changes were good, but there were way too many of them that didn't make happy any of us.
You claimed more ppl pvp now = they like it (i mean why else would they try to pvp)..i do NOT see it though, sry.
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Tell me this, in fact tell all of us, how has Suppression, DR, Heal Decay, Mez Resistance, removal of -Max Run Speed and overpowered NPCs helped to make PvP viable and fun for all ATs?
[/ QUOTE ]
3 posts in a row just to ask this? How weak considering its already been answered. And ironically by one of those fluffy pad posts of yours: Simple, to slow it down.
[/ QUOTE ]
Weak? Your entire counter argument is because you couldn't keep up, it had to be slowed down. That's like saying the NBA should ban people taller than 6ft because you aren't tall enough.
[/ QUOTE ]
Overall I think your arguments are good, but this particular one is a bit weak. The NBA makes their money off the enjoyment their customers get watching their product. COH makes their money off the enjoyment their customers get playing their product. Its in the NBA's intrest to develope elite talent for this reason. Theoretically COH has a bigger chance at profit shooting for the mediocre PvP player versus the elite players. I guess I understand the move to change PvP for this reason.
What puzzles me is the way in which the game seems to have disregarded what appears to have been a loyal customer base. Long time customers are worth making happy. You should at least make them fell like they've been heard.
Just my take, but there seems to be as much agreement that the present system needs to be fixed as there was for the old system to be fixed. If the fix generated more PvP players that's fine, but the million dollar question is "Did it?" Also, I wonder how much and what kind of resources were allocated to PvP in the first place. I imagine it is not the foundation of CoH's profitablity. That probably has more to do with the state of PvP then anything else.
I wonder why they just didn't set up zones based on differnet rules rangeing from total balance, to equal to PvE and then let players decide which they prefered.
Anyway, just my thoughts, and I admit I don't have much experience to back them up so I'm open to correction.
As a disclaimer I do PvP and like it, but never played under the old system. I probably would have had problems with the speed. But I would have tried.
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Where City of Heroes shined was that good teamwork and skill will stomp out anything. Having the game being based on skill and teamwork made it competative. Sure, there are going to be AT's that shined in either system, but if you were going around to have a casual night PvPing, you could bring any AT and still not suck, as long as you had the skill to play it.
[/ QUOTE ]
This ... stilll seems to be the case from my perspective. More so then before actually. I know PvP 2.0 has open the door to PvP for many of my alts that I wouldn't have dreamed of PvPing with months ago. The problem now isn't with the PvP system IMO, but those playing who only roll FoTM or high HP Offensive toons and ignore every other role a good team needs by using one excuse or the other.
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People didn't want to spend the small ammount of effort necessary to be decent at the old system and just screamed for change.
[/ QUOTE ]
Sounds familiar. It's kind like whats happning now
I disagree that the new PvP is like adding training wheels... it seems more like they took the training wheels off. Those who had invested time and influence/infamy to get super duper at PvP 1.0 were left once agin having to adapt to the changes in order to be as good as they were before... or not die as much like they did before.
There have been dozens and dozens of PvP changes that have affected me and my characters over the years, but none that I have ever thought were greater than my skill as a player... I just find a better way, just like everyone else I know. We've all done it and most players (including those that speak against PvP 2.0 here on the forums) will continue to do it. Its called adapting no?
All of this reminds me of ED when it came along... months of complaining and then BAM! IOs came and everyone was like... "oh! now I see why they did that!"
Am I the only one who thinks that the Devs see the game on a level we players don't... and that maybe changes made today are to better implement future changes to come? I mean there are a couple of seemingly intersting things to come right?
Change Happens: Some deal with it... some dwell on it. Seriously folks... lets just stop talking and go PvP.
"Situational power? Sure. Although in a sense... all powers are situational. It's just that some situations occur more than others." Understand the situation needed in order for the power to be most effective... and make that situation happen.
Maybe you are right and devs do plan on something..or maybe not...i prefer to stay pessimistic...
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Tell me this, in fact tell all of us, how has Suppression, DR, Heal Decay, Mez Resistance, removal of -Max Run Speed and overpowered NPCs helped to make PvP viable and fun for all ATs?
[/ QUOTE ]
7thCynic
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3 posts in a row just to ask this? How weak considering its already been answered. And ironically by one of those fluffy pad posts of yours: Simple, to slow it down.
[/ QUOTE ]
Pretty weak answer there.
This community would like to see the answers in your own words. Now unless you are a complete idiot, I'm sure you can come up with something better then what you have provided up to this point.
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7th, could you please explain why you disliked the old PvP so much? Just wondering.
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7thCynic
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Thats a loaded question based on my original, and really only, point.
[/ QUOTE ]
No, that's a pretty straight forward and simple question. Once again we would like to see your answers, not all the gibberish and spin doctoring of these subjects.
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So if I were to list the issues that made original PvP broken, most of those said people would just disagree with me.
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If you don't want to be conisidered an troll I suggest you provide more information for this community to discuss.
Also, If you can't stand up for your "issues" or what you believe in, then you are a pretty pathetic individual.
A very sad story about War Witch and the neglected kitty. http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=219670
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Black_Barrier
Guess it's hard to click while actively trying to keep the drool away from the keyboard...
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Am I the only one who thinks that the Devs see the game on a level we players don't
[/ QUOTE ]
You're sure as hell not the only one. Look at the fiasco surrounding Mission Architect and you'll see exactly the level at which the devs see the game - in that case, we are told "we expected something to happen, but nothing like this." Or, despite numerous ticket drop rates and item cost changes in closed beta, they slap a cap on the ticket gain per mission, claiming it's too high.
The devs have datamines and numbers. We have countless hours of real, in-game experience. You can have all the data in the world, but it's useless if you interpret it wrong. And I've noticed a massive disconnect between the devs' thought process and that of the players since around the time I13 launched.
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
[ QUOTE ]
All of this reminds me of ED when it came along... months of complaining and then BAM! IOs came and everyone was like... "oh! now I see why they did that!"
Am I the only one who thinks that the Devs see the game on a level we players don't... and that maybe changes made today are to better implement future changes to come? I mean there are a couple of seemingly intersting things to come right?
[/ QUOTE ]
Let me ask a few simple questions.
1. Do the devs recall ed ?
2. If you were in their position would you handle things in the same way again and again or would you vary your strategy ?
3. If you knew you were going to tick off your customerbase and you had something great coming out might you try to entice them into not leaving by telling them about the great thing.
1.Yes
2.Yes
3.Yes... btw theres a new expansion coming this year that allows heroes and villains to switch sides.. and new ATs and other stuff like that. PvP wise... I'm enticed!
"Situational power? Sure. Although in a sense... all powers are situational. It's just that some situations occur more than others." Understand the situation needed in order for the power to be most effective... and make that situation happen.
i don't think you can answer 2nd question just with yes....=.=
You speak of balance. Well here goes
This game has AT that means they are stronger in some fields then other AT and weaker in other. The game was made to have people team for a reason.
I do not think a blaster should be able to take as much damage as a tank. Or for the tank to but out as much damage as a scrapper. But people cried it wasn't fair that there toon wasn't god and wanted it changed.
The AT were made the way they were to have people from teams and to run togather. It is known that if you get people to play togather they will play longer on a MMO. Why do you think they made SG/VG. They didn't do out of the kindness of there hearts. But they wanted people to feel like they are part of something.
What we have now is a system that was made by whinners for whinners. We have lost what AT was suppose mean. AT was suppose to be different. You weren't suppose to be the best healer and damage dealer. You were suppose to find some that made of what you lacked in. But not that not the case now its broke. You can say all you want it is not but it is.
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2.Yes, and yes
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fixed.
Rousing up the playerbase before new and exciting stuff comes is nothing new.
"Situational power? Sure. Although in a sense... all powers are situational. It's just that some situations occur more than others." Understand the situation needed in order for the power to be most effective... and make that situation happen.
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3.Yes... btw theres a new expansion coming this year that allows heroes and villains to switch sides.. and new ATs and other stuff like that.
[/ QUOTE ]
which will not solve any of the existing problem or fix anything.
will only brings new issue /unbalance
[ QUOTE ]
You speak of balance. Well here goes
This game has AT that means they are stronger in some fields then other AT and weaker in other. The game was made to have people team for a reason.
I do not think a blaster should be able to take as much damage as a tank. Or for the tank to but out as much damage as a scrapper. But people cried it wasn't fair that there toon wasn't god and wanted it changed.
The AT were made the way they were to have people from teams and to run togather. It is known that if you get people to play togather they will play longer on a MMO. Why do you think they made SG/VG. They didn't do out of the kindness of there hearts. But they wanted people to feel like they are part of something.
What we have now is a system that was made by whinners for whinners. We have lost what AT was suppose mean. AT was suppose to be different. You weren't suppose to be the best healer and damage dealer. You were suppose to find some that made of what you lacked in. But not that not the case now its broke. You can say all you want it is not but it is.
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QFT
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And the 'hardcore' pvpers may be surprised to hear that this is probably the majorty's concensus, and thus, who the devs are listening to.
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This statement, combined with the utter lack of attention the devs paid to the people who bothered to work with the system and make it work for them, speak volumes to why we have the giant steaming pile of [censored] we have today.
Yes, let's listen to the lowest common denominator. Screw trying to keep up with Joneses, let's just drag them down to our level!
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It's called the 80% rule of business. You cannot appeal to 100% of your customers, so you aim for 80%. If you're not in that 80%, you're a niche market and odds are a product designed for mass appeal is simply not taking you into account. Sorry if that upsets you, or if you feel slighted, but businesses exist to make money and a game like this has to use the 80% rule if they want to stay afloat, even if a small portion of that other 20% leave in a huff.
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Originally Posted by eltonio
This is over the top mental slavery.
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Wow you guys are awesome @ spotting sarcasm. Really.
Gibson:
Sure when CoV came out - but I already said that unfortunately - even for me - it died long before i13.
Mac:
The irony of your post is - you have answered the question your expecting me to answer. Why would I need to when you unknowingly already have? Hehehe..
EnD:
Did I say the majority of people like the changes?