and the NPC's then XP inf and prestige free ?
No thanks.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
Yes. Also no XP or Prestige in PvP zones.
Wavicle, Energy/Energy Blaster, dinged 50 in Issue 4, summer of 2005.
@Wavicle, mostly on the Justice server.
no thank you
I don't there should be NPCs in PvP zones anyway.
They aren't "player versus enemy with the occasional player"
they are "player versus player"
The entire PvP system of CoX is completely and utterly flawed.
If they removed the Debt factor from PvP, many more people would partake in it.
[ QUOTE ]
I don't there should be NPCs in PvP zones anyway.
They aren't "player versus enemy with the occasional player"
they are "player versus player"
The entire PvP system of CoX is completely and utterly flawed.
If they removed the Debt factor from PvP, many more people would partake in it.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, PvP is flawed atm. Should debt be removed? No, don't be silly.
I'll say this once...if you die in a PvP zone and get debt, It. Is. Your. Fault.
"But he ran into some bosses while I had a debuff on him!"
Uh, turn it off.
"He stunned me while I was chasing him through a mob!"
Uh, don't run through a mob of enemy NPCs then.
"I was TKed into a mob and held there!!"
Ok, that is pretty cheap, but with teammates and inspirations, that should only work on you once.
"I got ASed while trying to get away from the Arachnoids with my scientists!"
Yeah, that happens. So? In Warburg you're at least level 30, and should be running Invincible missions anyway. Debt is negligible.
Just remember. Debt is a badge. Nothing more, nothing less.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Don't like the way PvP in CoH is set up? Don't come in.
Don't want the debt? Don't come in.
Don't think you should be targetted without some sort of rules to meet your maker? Don't come in.
Don't understand basic concepts? Don't come in.
Can't read the WARNING at the entrance or understand the WARNING given by the Security Office? Don't come in. Or if you do, don't come on here cryin' about "unfairness" or "unsportmanship playing" or "TPing you into a mess of NPC's is nasty". You got busted up, annihilated, a** whacked bright blood orange red... suck it up, write down the nasty buggers name who did it to you, go lvl up some, then challenge that player to a one-on-one. Jeesh...
As a lvl 33 who got their butt kicked yesterday in pvp...to coin a phrase to that sob that totalled me "I'll be back." lol! He got his shortly after anyway. Sucka!! 
He'll get it from me soon too... 
Really, all the whining about PvP attacks, what part of Player versus Player are those people missing??
PLAYER VERSUS PLAYER.
Hmmm... this concept seems pretty self explanatory and simple to me.
Justice
Everwood
Triumph
The Trust
i think there should be npcs in these zone however there should be alot less of them , especialy in RV cant go 5 feet without running into one of those nasty spider bosses
Debt is good. It brings you closer to the Deathless badge. Never complain about debt if only because of that badge.
[ QUOTE ]
I don't there should be NPCs in PvP zones anyway.
They aren't "player versus enemy with the occasional player"
they are "player versus player"
The entire PvP system of CoX is completely and utterly flawed.
If they removed the Debt factor from PvP, many more people would partake in it.
[/ QUOTE ]
Sorry, but I like the Hot spots in Siren's Call. With NPC's backing you up, you actually get the feeling of helping one side out. I say Keep the NPC's in zone.
i agree with everyone above but i think its stupid that u get from other players in RV
Lets say ur fighting 1 on 1 and 4 other heroes jump in and kill you
woop 35k debt
Yeah debt from PC kills in RV is a "feature" I didn't know about til last night.
Wish I had known sooner so I could have avoided RV and the debt I got...
Why not just give prestige for NPC kills? Not like we ever get that much prestige normally anyway 
Or don't have PvP Rep degrade at all and just make a death by NPC take some of it away.
Just added this patch note to PvP section:
Being defeated in a PvP zone will carry debt if any of the damage to you was caused by NPCs. The amount of debt is directly proportional to the amount of damage you took from NPCs vs. how much was done by opposing Player Characters. The more damage dealt to you by NPCs means more debt when you are defeated.
* This means that you can no longer escape debt by being defeated by a PC after taking massive damage from NPCs, nor will you be penalized with a massive amount of debt if you are defeated by an NPC after taking a huge amount of damage from a PC.
[ QUOTE ]
Being defeated in a PvP zone will carry debt if any of the damage to you was caused by NPCs. The amount of debt is directly proportional to the amount of damage you took from NPCs vs. how much was done by opposing Player Characters. The more damage dealt to you by NPCs means more debt when you are defeated.
[/ QUOTE ]
Whoa, wait a moment. Let's say I'm reduced to 10 hit points by a combination of equal amounts of player and NPC damage. Someone then heals me up to half hit points, and I then get killed by a player.
Does the healing remove player damage or NPC damage first? Is it a case of first dealt, first healed?
And, if I'm back to full health at some point after taking damage, does the 'debt counter' reset and start figuring the percentages from scratch again?
"You'll never defeat SetTargetHealth 0. "-Castle
---
"Oh, and we�ll probably nerf Regen again�just for fun."-BaB
---
"so we are looking into the possiblity of maybe someday thinking about maybe implementing something similar to this, in the future" -Positron
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Just added this patch note to PvP section:
Being defeated in a PvP zone will carry debt if any of the damage to you was caused by NPCs. The amount of debt is directly proportional to the amount of damage you took from NPCs vs. how much was done by opposing Player Characters. The more damage dealt to you by NPCs means more debt when you are defeated.
* This means that you can no longer escape debt by being defeated by a PC after taking massive damage from NPCs, nor will you be penalized with a massive amount of debt if you are defeated by an NPC after taking a huge amount of damage from a PC.
[/ QUOTE ]
Thank you.
Together we entered a city of strangers, we made it a city of friends, and we leave it a City of Heroes. - Sweet_Sarah
BOYCOTT NCSoft (on Facebook)
https://www.facebook.com/groups/517513781597443/
Governments have fallen to the power of social media. Gaming companies can too.
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And, if I'm back to full health at some point after taking damage, does the 'debt counter' reset and start figuring the percentages from scratch again?
[/ QUOTE ]
My experience indicates that -all- NPC damage is cumulative, and healing naturally and by powers doesn't remove it.
---------------------------------
Heartbroken
I lurked a lot but I'll miss you allAlpha Team sg, Pinnacle server
Black Citadel vg
It's a good start.
It doesn't fix anything in situations where you are mezed and left to die at the hands of NPCs, or TPd into them intentionally by other players.
I think "no debt in PVP zones" would have been better. If it made scores of players flock to Siren's Call to hunt mobs debt-free, so be it. More PCs to fight.
[ QUOTE ]
Just added this patch note to PvP section:
Being defeated in a PvP zone will carry debt if any of the damage to you was caused by NPCs. The amount of debt is directly proportional to the amount of damage you took from NPCs vs. how much was done by opposing Player Characters. The more damage dealt to you by NPCs means more debt when you are defeated.
* This means that you can no longer escape debt by being defeated by a PC after taking massive damage from NPCs, nor will you be penalized with a massive amount of debt if you are defeated by an NPC after taking a huge amount of damage from a PC.
[/ QUOTE ]
wow....not like there were a bunch of folks running to pvp zones as is. I know for one, that I won't be going back.
Bad idea.
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Just added this patch note to PvP section:
Being defeated in a PvP zone will carry debt if any of the damage to you was caused by NPCs. The amount of debt is directly proportional to the amount of damage you took from NPCs vs. how much was done by opposing Player Characters. The more damage dealt to you by NPCs means more debt when you are defeated.
* This means that you can no longer escape debt by being defeated by a PC after taking massive damage from NPCs, nor will you be penalized with a massive amount of debt if you are defeated by an NPC after taking a huge amount of damage from a PC.
[/ QUOTE ]
Why is there Debt in PvP zones at all?
Sign It : http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
[ QUOTE ]
* This means that you can no longer escape debt by being defeated by a PC after taking massive damage from NPCs, nor will you be penalized with a massive amount of debt if you are defeated by an NPC after taking a huge amount of damage from a PC.
[/ QUOTE ]
Ugh, was that really happening? So if Statesman runs up and knocks me down to 1hp and then a player hits me .367 milliseconds later I get almost full debt? How is healing calculated into this? Regen?
Need more info here...
[ QUOTE ]
Just added this patch note to PvP section:
Being defeated in a PvP zone will carry debt if any of the damage to you was caused by NPCs. The amount of debt is directly proportional to the amount of damage you took from NPCs vs. how much was done by opposing Player Characters. The more damage dealt to you by NPCs means more debt when you are defeated.
* This means that you can no longer “escape debt” by being defeated by a PC after taking massive damage from NPCs, nor will you be penalized with a massive amount of debt if you are defeated by an NPC after taking a huge amount of damage from a PC.
[/ QUOTE ]
This seems like a good idea but it isn't. If you don't correctly take into account heals/etc then you just can't do this correctly. I also can see easy ways for players to get MORE debt than is possible outside of PvP for cases where NPCs did more than my health in damage.
This is just a hack. It is a bad solution to a problem created by putting a large PVE goal in a PvP zone. You broke your own rule. You put signifigant content that everyone will want to do in a PvP zone.
-Teklord
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Just added this patch note to PvP section:
Being defeated in a PvP zone will carry debt if any of the damage to you was caused by NPCs. The amount of debt is directly proportional to the amount of damage you took from NPCs vs. how much was done by opposing Player Characters. The more damage dealt to you by NPCs means more debt when you are defeated.
* This means that you can no longer escape debt by being defeated by a PC after taking massive damage from NPCs, nor will you be penalized with a massive amount of debt if you are defeated by an NPC after taking a huge amount of damage from a PC.
[/ QUOTE ]
I am seeing this as having an effect (and possbily a drastic one) on players trying to wrestle control of a pillbox, etc..., from the hands of opposing players. Or will the damage from the turrets not count toward this?
Dominators don't need mitigation from their secondaries. Even if they did, there's ice (slows), psi (-recharge), and fire and elec (death).
-Talen_Lee commenting on Energy Assault's Utility
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And, if I'm back to full health at some point after taking damage, does the 'debt counter' reset and start figuring the percentages from scratch again?
[/ QUOTE ]
My experience indicates that -all- NPC damage is cumulative, and healing naturally and by powers doesn't remove it.
[/ QUOTE ]
Which would mean that if you fought a sequence of NPCs (while healing yourself continually) and took more than your total hit points over the course of time, and then fought a player who killed you, even with a full health bar and no simultaneous interaction with NPCs you'd get full debt.
If so, that's bloody ridiculous.
If.
I shouldn't have to get debt from fighting NPCs ten minutes ago. NPCs who I DEFEATED.
[ QUOTE ]
Just added this patch note to PvP section:
Being defeated in a PvP zone will carry debt if any of the damage to you was caused by NPCs. The amount of debt is directly proportional to the amount of damage you took from NPCs vs. how much was done by opposing Player Characters. The more damage dealt to you by NPCs means more debt when you are defeated.
* This means that you can no longer escape debt by being defeated by a PC after taking massive damage from NPCs, nor will you be penalized with a massive amount of debt if you are defeated by an NPC after taking a huge amount of damage from a PC.
[/ QUOTE ]
I took only "falling" damage and still got debt. So I think ANY outside damage will produce debt.
There goes Fly is a travel power in PvP.
Given that the Known Issues includes that the RV AVs are going to be debtless deathdealers soon....
Why not make all PvP zones completely debt free for all NPC caused deaths?
Wavicle, Energy/Energy Blaster, dinged 50 in Issue 4, summer of 2005.
@Wavicle, mostly on the Justice server.