Statesman some of us do not care about PvP
By
Aaron123,
Posted on: 2005-04-27 19:28 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
I agree with the op
-AZ
Now that I think about it, I remember all the ranting and screaming that went on when they originally REMOVED the ACC debuff from SS.
It lost -acc (good) and +def (bad), but it gained -aggro (good). The end result was positive. In this case, it's a net loss.
I just love these posts about something that is going on Test server and may even not make it to the live server.
Even if it makes it to the live server, I'd give it a month to try. This development team has shown in the past that they will listen to the community. They will change something that goes against the spirit of the powers yet makes it onto the live servers.
So go with your doom and gloom and I'm-taking-my-business-elswhere-without-actually-seeing-if-changes-stay-in-live-servers attitude. In the long run, you lose out.
As for the statement by Statesman about PVP not effecting PVE; I've always seen that as a pipe dream. The best that can be done is to try to minimize how much PVP will effect PVE.
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I've said it before, I'll say it again:
Just as in evolution, those that can adapt will thrive. Those that cannot will whine, cancel accounts and die.
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Dood, you are officially my new hero!
Super Jump is definitely important to me. I need to be able to hit hover-sniping sappers the first time, or be defeated. Putting an accuracy debuff in it means big trouble the first time a Malta ambush comes after me, not just for me but for anyone else in the area once the sapper kills me or I run to the zone gate to get away from him.
No SJ combat = bad for melee
One person asked why anyone would use SJ or SS in combat.
Well, if you've played a scrapper, or tank, it's a must.
For scrappers it's how you get from mob to mob fast. Sure, I can slot up Swift or sprint, but then I have to put slots in it, that detract from my regen alilities(I'm a Regen scrapper, non-Mog).
For my Tank, I use Blazeing Aura as a taunt, and use SJ to jump from group to group. You land, wait for BA to hit, toss of a single taunt while you're doing that and move on.
Now I'll have to land, turn off SJ, taunt, turn SJ back on, and SJ away. Where I used to have 2 key strokes, I now have 4.
This means instead of looking at the next group of mobs, at what mobs are trailing behind me, at my team mates, their health, I'll be looking at the mobs around me to see if I hit them with my taunts.
It's like this.
The devs seem to have this idea that for the game to be "Fun" I have to be smashing buttons all the time. They want me to be constantly hammering away at over 20 buttons in combat.
I don't want that. I want movement, maybe 6 buttons for attacks/buff/debuffs/holds..ect and a few buttons for insp's and heals.
I came to this game for the simplicity of the combat.
Seems they want to make it more complex.
Having SS or SJ is by no means "a must" in combat, only for specific tactics that you've outlined.
I use SS only to get out of Caltrops faster, and SS only to hit flying mobs (usually and ambush or kill x mission) that I couldn't otherwise reach....that's it. No other use for either power (other than travel) in any of my other tactics, they are by no means a must for any of my Scrappers or Tankers.
I am not pleased with the nerf on the basis that it doesn't really "balance" anything. Ok, -ACC, um how does this make DA scrappers any better? how does this help Storm defenders. I think there are many other areas where balance was needed, this isn't one of them. I am also disturbed that "balance" issues potentially found via PvP and Arena testing might be influencing PvE...there's no proof to this, as someone point out, but I am a little leery of the fact that all this just happened to become an issue at the same time PvP is introduced. It just gives me a bit of pause, hopefully I'm wrong, an there is nothing to that notion.
My only experience in using SJ in battle was some sky skiffs were part of my Raider ambush. without SJ, my scrapper wouldn't have been able to get in range.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
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but what the hell is the point of nerfing it in the first place then?
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Actually, I would like to know that myself.
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but what the hell is the point of nerfing it in the first place then?
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Actually, I would like to know that myself.
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To bring them into line with Flight?
*waits for people to scream about just making Flight better*
The problem with doing that is that if you keep making everything *better*, eventually stuff becomes too easy. Being able to Fly and shoot with perfect accuracy would almost be too easy, as you could just dart in and out of enemy range faster than it could chase you. Kinda like you do with Super Speed...
And I'm going to point out that *no* Blaster needs Super Speed to set up an Alpha Strike..Stealth is plenty of, well, Stealth that's needed to even get in the middle of a bunch of baddies and, say, set off a Nova. Trust me. I did that for 18 levels. Without *ever* using Super Speed. Just Stealth (no, not even Invisiblity). Try adapting your tactics instead of screaming like children.
Yep, I got this game to be heroic, not engage in PvP. Yes, I understand that change happens, and yes, I also understand that I PAY for this GAME.
I won't be paying much longer if my enjoyment is curtailed.
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The problem with doing that is that if you keep making everything *better*, eventually stuff becomes too easy. Being able to Fly and shoot with perfect accuracy would almost be too easy,
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Well, Kheldians do that... and it's really not *THAT* bad. Moreso that Fly has a nasty endurance drain, which really makes it hard to fight with...
Ah, hell, whatever. You know what this is? This is THE END OF CoH! I COMMAND YOU ALL TO CANCEL YOUR ACCOUNTS USING A SECRET UNDERHANDED MIND-MELD! AND THEN YOU WILL ALL EMAIL ME INFLUENCE. NO I DO NOT KNOW HOW THAT WOULD WORK BUT I WILL LEAVE IT UP TO YOU TO FIGURE IT OUT!
Heh.
Dawnslayer on Virtue.
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but what the hell is the point of nerfing it in the first place then?
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Actually, I would like to know that myself.
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To bring them into line with Flight?
*waits for people to scream about just making Flight better*
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I wont scream...but all they had to do to flight was either reduce the end tick cost or make it faster and that would have also brought it in line with the other travel powers.
If you hate PVP, I'd recommend second guessing Guild Wars.
Sure the PVE is fun but its really good a big PVP focus, and all that entails ("Nerfs"/"Adjustments")
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I won't be paying much longer if my enjoyment is curtailed.
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Nor is anyone asking you to.
Well, Mattman might. He's a jerk like that. 
Removing the acc penalty on flight may seem like a direct comparison, but flight has other penalties too. I'd love to see the end cost reduced and the flight speed increased, but if I had to choose one, endurance cost would be the way to go.
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Sure the PVE is fun but its really good a big PVP focus, and all that entails ("Nerfs"/"Adjustments")
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True, but your:
A) Not paying 15 bucks a month for it.
B) Can switch skills in and out in towns and outposts, allowing you to customize to meet the demands.
C) Limited to only eight skills while in a mission/adventure area, thus making it alot harder to hit upon that "magic bullet" of skills and L00t that will make you Uber.
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I won't be paying much longer if my enjoyment is curtailed.
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Nor is anyone asking you to.
Well, Mattman might. He's a jerk like that.
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Muahaha, I've begun to cast a long shadow over these boards!
And yeah, the fact that your skills aren't bound to your character like powers are to your hero mean that nerfs hit you less. Of course, I still think you're going to here people complaining about generic "Mesmer nerfs" or what have you.
I hate you, Mattman. BRING BACK STUPIDHEAD!
Dawnslayer on Virtue.
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I hate you, Mattman. BRING BACK STUPIDHEAD!
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He's my evil (And dumb) alter-ego that Sister Psyche is keeping in check. Or maybe this is the sinister one...I'm confused...
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True, but your:
A) Not paying 15 bucks a month for it.
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True, but you're also definitely never getting any new content for it. Their model is to release new expansions every quarter of the year to keep earning money. So, depending on how much these expansions cost, you might actually end up paying more than a MMOG if you try to keep up with all the expansions.
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but what the hell is the point of nerfing it in the first place then?
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Actually, I would like to know that myself.
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That's definitely something that would be helpful for us to know. There are a lot of assumptions flying around about why the changes were made, and a lot of people are probably entirely off base, but we have no way of knowing that. And once we do know that, we can begin to give feedback that's actually useful.
I don't keep up with all the nerfs a whole lot but I will make one observation. The other day, provoke didn't seem to work at all in PVP. I'm not expecting them to run right into my aura, but they didn't even stop to take some long-range shots. Fear seems to work spectacularly well, however, which I don't have until I create my first or 2nd big baddie on COV.
I'm guessing it's gonna be a full-moon tonight because there is some big-time ranting going on today. So this is just one civil observation. A second would be you're ugly and your mom dresses you funny.
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My kinetics defender is in even bigger trouble. The buffs and debuffs are centered around the target, and 90% of the time, I have to be in melee range myself. I don't want to be there for a second longer than I have to be, and SS helps in that regard because I can zip in and out to reduce my exposure time.
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See, for me, that's the beauty of Kinetics. You can actually wade into the middle of combat and stay there and come out relatively unscathed. It's actually the best part of that powerset, IMO. I can stand in the middle of a group of mobs and not get as easily squished. It's brilliant. 
And when you have a solid Tanker or Scrapper who knows how to control aggro, it's even better. Heh. 
After 50 levels of standing in the back, out of melee range, and healing as an Empath, the ability of Kinetics to mix it up a bit in combat, and to survive was a nice change.
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Eventually I'll learn new tactics, or I'll have to spend more slots on Swift, but why should I have to when there's nothing wrong with the way I'm playing now?
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There may not be anything wrong with the way you're playing, but instead of looking at this as a nerf, why not look at is as a challenge? So you'd have to think on your feet a little bit more instead of going through the same attack pattern over and over and over. I can't see the issue in that, personally.
SJ probably not much, but SS is important as hell for me. Not for my scrapper, and especially not my stone tanker who can't run it anyway.
The problem is my squishies. Flamethrower and Full Auto are cones which need to be setup nearly every time I use them to hit the maximum amount of people. They also have relatively short ranges which puts me in more danger since I can't move while the animations are going on. Once I adjust my position and finish my attacks, I gotta be out of there ASAP, since I'm going to be within 20 feet of the action while this is all happening. The last thing I need to worry about is forgetting to turn off SS and not hitting anything, or forgetting to turn it on and faceplant--or even mistiming the attack and firing a round before I turned it off.
Also, I've avoided getting smacked by wandering mobs while stuck in the FA animation because of the -aggro it gives. Of course I'll eventually remember to turn it on and off, but what the hell is the point of nerfing it in the first place then?
My kinetics defender is in even bigger trouble. The buffs and debuffs are centered around the target, and 90% of the time, I have to be in melee range myself. I don't want to be there for a second longer than I have to be, and SS helps in that regard because I can zip in and out to reduce my exposure time.
Oh, I guess I did forget to mention how I used to joust Sappers with Touch of Fear, but that's obviously illegal.
Eventually I'll learn new tactics, or I'll have to spend more slots on Swift, but why should I have to when there's nothing wrong with the way I'm playing now?