I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this because I'm new to forums but I have a simple request for the developers. Can they expand the Supergroup Icons library to include the icons currently available in character creation? The Supergroup details are an import part of the creation process and it would be nice to be able to use icons like say the mapleleaf as a Supergrop Icons. If this is not the correct place to post something like this could someone please tell me where I can post it. Thank you.
you people thinking fire or illusion are over-powered need to visit the tanker or scrapper boards once in a while.
there is a thread on the scrapper boards right now where regen's chuckle at how easy av's are for them, and how they can solo the impossible and so on.
then you have tankers being able to stand with unlimited numbers of mobs beating on them and not care, for instance the other night trying to fight bobcat i got one-shotted for over 1k dmg 3 times in a row on my fire/rad, i asked a tank to come in and bobcat couldnt even hurt the tank.
so please get a broader point of view than your mind controller before you go saying lines are nerf fodder because they are only on par with other lines in the game.
noone wants nerfs except griefers.
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Yeah, Gravity.
That's the one that really needs lookin at.
It's pretty crazy some of the things I've seen MindControl do. ...It's nothing that's in real demmand, but it makes the crowd control that my Illusion controller and Storm defender have look pathetic. If they had some real damage too they'd probably be able to handle a few too many situations a little too well. So I wouldn't worry about Mind again quite yet.
But Gravity, I don't think it's even capeable of that level of control and the activation times don't help either. But changing them could take too long like it took for Martial Arts and Katana. Do something quicker like changing some of their minor DoT's to moderate DoT's and make some of those immobilizing powers debuff resistance to smashing damage and call it good.
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Because you don't play one.
You are alos laboring under the delusion that only one of them can be fixed.
I run with my friends grav, and his crowd control is easily as good as mine, and he does more damage with his pets. Now, his damage is nothing compared to what fire imps can do. Now, let me be clear, I do NOT want to gimp fire or anyone else. I think grav needs a boost. But I KNOW my mind controller needs a boost.
Yeah, that's your opinion and I'll defend it.
But in my defense I said "...It's nothing that's in real demmand". ...Maybe Damage won't matter all that much if other things are changed. And if it is still damage that matters most, then I know there's just as many Mind Controllers who've already said they don't want to trade their control for some untested damage.
No I may not play a Mind Controller, but that doesn't mean you've got the market cornered on them either.
given where this thread is gonig i suppose you have to define what is overpowered?
ill and fire are very powerful more so than any of the other controllers. But we're not the ultimate soloists that everyone gives us credit for. I've seen a spines/regen scrapper run through the dock of PI aggroing groups of +3 nemesis, when He's collected a couple of dozen he turns around and wipes the floor with them... I can't do that... at best I might do slightly less than half of that... if I'm carefull.
another occasion on a mission a large group of those nemesis spider things (jaegers right?) met us a the elevators and in one salvo wiped out the entire team, except the invuln tank who wasn't at all effected. He then beat up every last of them so we could rez.
the controller AT starts out as the 5th best soloist out of 5 AT's. post 32 we become 3rd best soloists. some controller builds are better than others but overall we're not the top soloists even under prime conditions. Unless it's written in stone somewhere that controllers must be the worst soloists I see no real reason to nerf.
Bottom line is the last 12 levels have been the best fun I've had in this game so far.
Honestly I don't think adding damage is the solution at all.
Then again.. Playing gravity is like being given a million dollars on the condition you let someone stab you. On one hand being a controller is so fun to play at times. It gives me a real sense of stratigy. The very idea of control over gravity is awesome in itself as well. On the other the "control gap", stacked with the natrual problems controllers have, is unbearable when faced with large groups. I haven't seen a small group yet that actualy gains any use out of me other than the punching bag syndrome. I would take my XP leeching [censored] out solo, and unburden the groups I stay with, if I could do it at more than a snail's pace.
Even more depressing is the fact that controllers are still a "long term goal". At this rate I am tempted to remake Space as a Kinetics defender. Though at the same time I would feel terrible for abandoning the AT. Her concept fits gravity better too. I could probably resist the urge to stab myself in the head as a defender, but I would be betraying both the controller AT and my character's concept.
Ugh.. I wish I could just create two characters with the same name. Otherwise I have no clue what I should do.
States, nothing to see here, controllers are fine..Hey look over there!
<hides my favorite controller in the closet>
Man, everytime I'm having fun with an AT, they get "looked at"
Sigh. 
Actually, for Grav, Adding Damage IS the solution even if States and Geko themselves don't think so. Illusion Controllers have the worst control... They're practically a Storm Defender with 1 lockdown and too many pets. But very few people complain because they crank out the damage which means faster EXP. Gravity is usually going to cause Slower EXP in the majority of situations compared to every other AT, so just change that and Grav will get a Carrot that leads people to like it and wanna stay with it a lot more.
There's already Earth and Mind and Ice as well for the varieties of Pureist Controller builds. Last thing that's needed is one more that plays just like the others but is still weaker on control. Make it play more like Illusion, but instead of the pets doing most of the Damage, the Controller himself would do most of it through DoT's, and you'll have one more completely Unique and flavorful Controller primary that Synergizes more directly with the less taken Secondaries and does some very exciting things. 
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Actually, for Grav, Adding Damage IS the solution even if States and Geko themselves don't think so. Illusion Controllers have the worst control... They're practically a Storm Defender with 1 lockdown and too many pets. But very few people complain because they crank out the damage which means faster EXP. Gravity is usually going to cause Slower EXP in the majority of situations compared to every other AT, so just change that and Grav will get a Carrot that leads people to like it and wanna stay with it a lot more.
There's already Earth and Mind and Ice as well for the varieties of Pureist Controller builds. Last thing that's needed is one more that plays just like the others but is still weaker on control. Make it play more like Illusion, but instead of the pets doing most of the Damage, the Controller himself would do most of it through DoT's, and you'll have one more completely Unique and flavorful Controller primary that Synergizes more directly with the less taken Secondaries and does some very exciting things.
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Agreed. And not just because I have a Grav controller.... 
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Well, I hope they do NOT nerf you. I'm a mind contrller. A poor schlep mind controller. My first toon. I'm frsutrated as hell, and really in awe at what fire controllers can do. I wish I could do half te damage you do. I just don't want to get there by the devs reducing your damage!!!!!!!!
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Unfortunately, I read the tanker threads and have friends who are tankers so I'm thinking we are gonna get the bat along with illus. 
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Most of the suggestions for mind controllers (conspicuously given by ppl that don't have on) amounted to "improve this, but weaken that", which of course, is a net ZERO. I don't know why the world wants us to suck.
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I don't want you to suck, I have played with a few MC, and as far as I am concerned its not a bad thing, just when I team with MC, I adjust my playing differently to go along with theirs, but I adjust to whoever I'm playing with, different friends, different styles. I do not want them to nerf my imps, just make the other types stronger, bring them up to speed. Why nerf when you can improve?
Thanks, NC Soft, for closing my favorite game ever without warning and with plenty of life still left in it, and thus relieving me of the burden of EVER wanting to buy, try or even hear about another game from your company. Will my decision make a dent, or persuade them in anyway, shape or form? Nope, obviously not. Don't care. NC Soft is dead to me. ~ PsyFox
You know you shouldn't look at this like a negative. Because the previous "nerfs" was changes they felt needed to be made without OUR suggestion. In this situation, the devs opened up their ears how the AT should be improved instead of them thinking of ideas which would make us [censored] and moan and cause them to roll the changes back. They're getting an idea of what changes we'd be able to deal with and enjoy so we can be more happier with our AT.
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Well, I hope they do NOT nerf you. I'm a mind contrller. A poor schlep mind controller. My first toon. I'm frsutrated as hell, and really in awe at what fire controllers can do. I wish I could do half te damage you do. I just don't want to get there by the devs reducing your damage!!!!!!!!
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Unfortunately, I read the tanker threads and have friends who are tankers so I'm thinking we are gonna get the bat along with illus.
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Most of the suggestions for mind controllers (conspicuously given by ppl that don't have on) amounted to "improve this, but weaken that", which of course, is a net ZERO. I don't know why the world wants us to suck.
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I don't want you to suck, I have played with a few MC, and as far as I am concerned its not a bad thing, just when I team with MC, I adjust my playing differently to go along with theirs, but I adjust to whoever I'm playing with, different friends, different styles. I do not want them to nerf my imps, just make the other types stronger, bring them up to speed. Why nerf when you can improve?
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Unfortunately, history does not point to strengthening the others. Every time the devs look at an AT, its striking down the good ones to suck like the others.
Lvl your controllers now, fellow illusion and fire, cause soon the hand of dev will be slapping us down. I seriously doubt the lesser sets (MC comes to mind), will probley see some small improvment, but fire and illusion are getting the nerf. Of course I don't know this for fact, but based on the devs previous actions, its always nerf the good sets to "be in line" with the rest.
The nerf bat cometh 
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Well, I hope they do NOT nerf you. I'm a mind contrller. A poor schlep mind controller. My first toon. I'm frsutrated as hell, and really in awe at what fire controllers can do. I wish I could do half te damage you do. I just don't want to get there by the devs reducing your damage!!!!!!!!
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Unfortunately, I read the tanker threads and have friends who are tankers so I'm thinking we are gonna get the bat along with illus.
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Most of the suggestions for mind controllers (conspicuously given by ppl that don't have on) amounted to "improve this, but weaken that", which of course, is a net ZERO. I don't know why the world wants us to suck.
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I don't want you to suck, I have played with a few MC, and as far as I am concerned its not a bad thing, just when I team with MC, I adjust my playing differently to go along with theirs, but I adjust to whoever I'm playing with, different friends, different styles. I do not want them to nerf my imps, just make the other types stronger, bring them up to speed. Why nerf when you can improve?
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Unfortunately, history does not point to strengthening the others. Every time the devs look at an AT, its striking down the good ones to suck like the others.
Lvl your controllers now, fellow illusion and fire, cause soon the hand of dev will be slapping us down. I seriously doubt the lesser sets (MC comes to mind), will probley see some small improvment, but fire and illusion are getting the nerf. Of course I don't know this for fact, but based on the devs previous actions, its always nerf the good sets to "be in line" with the rest.
The nerf bat cometh
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Yes as all the dam nerfing that happened to tankers, like that punchvoke, changing taunt into a better provoce, aura-voke, alowing ice and stone to stake there armours, stopping stone from be to ugly to play... dam poor tankers they where nerfed to hell. I sure hope they dont do that to controlers.
replace terrify with full auto.. that would balance mind controll... yeah...
Well, maybe not. But some endurance efficient damage source might be nice. Like a pet, or voltaic sentinel. But I am not sure losing an existing power would be worth it.
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Because the previous "nerfs" was changes they felt needed to be made without OUR suggestion.
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That's because we didn't suggest the Nerfs themselves. They asked us last time what were the biggest issues. A list pretty much verbatim to what was on this recent one was built up and apparently what stood out most to the Devs then was how Mind control faced more danger for some holds but mosly for sleeps that were completely worthless when debuffs and AoE's woke everything up. Also Fear powers, Confuse, and Mass Confuse got some credit for EXP which also helped Illusion a bit. ...But the Nerfs to the pets came from Obvious-Ville since the builds using them were obviously "out of character" for controllers which are suposed to be Low-Damage according to the Starting descriptions and was making the other sets look like a waste of time. ...And Fire still does that to a degree. And while it's not doing Blaster Damage, it can do Scrapper DPS. But no matter of discussion is really going to change the course of what's planned for it because they don't need us to decide that, the Datamining tells them all they need to know about whether a power's overpowered, especially when players Get PL'd just to reach it which is also very easy information to obtain through datamining.
So we ARE at the very same crossroads as before and it's just very very unlikely that only buffs will follow and the latest changes we saw to Tankers and Scrappers makes that pretty clear as Invuln was just "too good" and so was Instant Healing but they tried to make up for those nerfs by doing as much as they could to fullfill some of our requests on bringing up the underpowered sets such as Ice, Dark, Pre28-Regen, and Stone.
It's always Give and Take. Unfortunately I think this might again be like the last time we were in this position and we have not convinced eachother that we MUST have much more Give than what gets Taken from us and if we haven't convinced ourselves then we definitely haven't convinced the Devs and they will only Give us slightly more than they Take and we will still not be as desired for Teaming like an Empathy Defender or Invuln Tanker is.
I have one suggestion....
That Epic Power a controller can get from t he Psychic Epic Power pool that is described as giving you 90 seconds of resistance to holds and knock downs and imobolization and psionic defence.
How about make it last as long as the scrapper super reflexes power that does the same thing and make it so it recharges about as fast.
Right now i think it lasts 40 seconds not 90 and it recharge is slower then tar...even with recharge enhancements you cant keep it up very well.
I personally dont think increasing its duration or making it recharge faster would over balance the game.
Right now its not that great..since it wont be there when you need it very much.
Anywise thats just a suggestion i have.
I didn't have the chance to contribute in the controller issues thread, so I thought I might as well post my thoughts here, garnered after playing my mind and grav trollers, reading the manual, playing with other controllers and doing a lot of thinking. This is what I've come up with. The main thing is what makes a controller. For me, the main powers for a controller are the AoE hold and the pet. These are the really uber powers in the sets that really allow controllers to be good. So, if we take every controller and give them 1 'point' for every aoe hold and pet they have, we can see why gravity needs something.
Fire
Cinders=aoe hold=1 point
Flashfire+fire cages=aoe hold=1 point
Fire Imps=pet=1 point
total=3
Earth
Stalagmites+thermal vents+volcanic gases+earthquake+stone cages all put together roughly translates in 2 aoe holds=2 points
animate stone=pet=1 point
total=3
Ice
Glacier=aoe hold=1 point
Ice Slick+Flash Freeze+Shiver, arctic air, frostbite, etc roughly=aoe hold=1 point
Jack Frost=1 point
total=3
Illusion
Flash=aoe hold=1 point
Phantom Army=pet=1 point
Phantasm=pet=1 point
total=3
Mind
Total domination=aoe hold=1 point
Telekinesis+terrify+mass confusion+mass hypnosis=about 1.5 aoe holds and 1/2 a pet, so=2 points
total=3
Gravity (now here's the problem)
Gravity Distortion Field=aoe hold=1 point
Singularity=pet=1 point
total=2
So as you can see, most sets have a total of 3. Most have 2 aoe holds or various powers that equate to that, and one pet. illusion has only 1 hold but 2 pets, and mind has no pets but tons of holds. However, gravity has one aoe hold, one pet, and nothing else. It has its 3 starting single-target moves and an aoe immobilise, but where other sets have such useful powers as ice slick, phantom army, earthquake and the like, Ice gets measly old propel, dimension shift and that wierd teleporty thing. Sure dimension shift stops foes taking any action, but the whole point of a hold is to allow your mates to wail on the foe in peace. With DS, you can't do that. Therefore what I'd like to see would be a change to these 3 abilites, which I think most people consider pretty damn shabby anyhow. Cutting down on the animation time of propel, changing DS, and maybe making the wormhole thing an aoe could really turn this set around.
I do accept that the points system, aoe hold=1 point and pet=1 point is not perfect. Some pets are better than others, some holds are not really holds, but I still think it illustrates my point well enough, especially with the upcoming pet changes.
And yes, I know this is a tired old topic, and that States has made his comments and all that,but I'm just trying to help, to look at the problem in a different way and try and figure out what's wrong.
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nothing at the moment is set in stone.
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Not set in Stone? Why are Earth Controllers getting preferential treatment?
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You can't please everyone, so lets concentrate on me.
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Right now i think it lasts 40 seconds not 90 and it recharge is slower then tar...even with recharge enhancements you cant keep it up very well.
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It's just you. It does last 90 seconds. Just keep in mind that getting hit with multiple mezzes could overcome your resistance. Six-slotted, the downtime is minimized. Plus with Hasten, and you could have it up almost all the time.
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Yes as all the dam nerfing that happened to tankers, like that punchvoke, changing taunt into a better provoce, aura-voke, alowing ice and stone to stake there armours, stopping stone from be to ugly to play... dam poor tankers they where nerfed to hell. I sure hope they dont do that to controlers.
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I have to agree with you, Rev_Pinecone. I'm a little confused by the couple of folks who are complaining about the changes done to the tank AT. I think, for the most part, people are very happy with the tank updates. If anything, you can see there are quite a few more people checking out the tanker forums, and I feel that there's been a general increase in the tanker population.
The two biggest issues I can think of are the changes to unstoppable and rage. You can no longer do perma-unstoppable, but that problem is that unstoppable made most of the lower tank powers unnecessary. I'm not really familiar with rage, but I think they've made quite a few really good improvements to the tank AT. I guess we'll see what they do for controllers, but I'm cautiously optimistic.
thanks Statesman. Now could you post something like this in the blaster forum? I don't think I've ever seen a dev post there.
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Yes as all the dam nerfing that happened to tankers, like that punchvoke, changing taunt into a better provoce, aura-voke, alowing ice and stone to stake there armours, stopping stone from be to ugly to play... dam poor tankers they where nerfed to hell. I sure hope they dont do that to controlers.
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You forgot adding mobility to unyielding for invuln and moving the status resistances to the shields for fire.
And I too see more tankers (of every type) than ever before since the "nerfs." Funny how that is.
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Yes as all the dam nerfing that happened to tankers, like that punchvoke, changing taunt into a better provoce, aura-voke, alowing ice and stone to stake there armours, stopping stone from be to ugly to play... dam poor tankers they where nerfed to hell. I sure hope they dont do that to controlers.
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You forgot adding mobility to unyielding for invuln and moving the status resistances to the shields for fire.
And I too see more tankers (of every type) than ever before since the "nerfs." Funny how that is.
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I also did not mention a few other things (like movement, slow but still movement, in rooted for stone) I really just got tired of listing all the impovements. Tanks got a lot of imporvments, invunriblity is as strong if not stronger than ever. There may be a problem with rage but I dont know how the latest change effected things. All that is clear is tanks got lots and lots or plusses with 1 or 2 down sides, my tank for one is very happy, with sleep res in ice I can fight the tsoo rather than sleep as my team fights them.
The truth is that fire and illusion controllers can become a 1 person army after 32. I'm not pointing fingers, saying nerf that, but if the devs need to balance things, that's just the way it goes.
As for mind control, some of their powers are pretty nifty, but in my opinion, not overly desirable to have in a team.
-First complaint is the experience penalty with confuse powers. Teams will shun that.
-Second is that sleep powers are useless in many teams, since you typically have a tank holding aggro when blasters or kheldians use AOE blasts.
-Third, mind controlling tends to slow down the progress of a team more than be useful. "Hey team wait here for a few minutes while I mind control those guys and reduce the exp reward for us."
As for gravity, the other control set that needs help.
-Perhaps reduce the base recharge of many of their powers might help. Sure Distortion Field is a nice hold, but you really need lots of accuracy and recharges to make it useful.
-I suppose boosting the pet a bit might be good too.
-Also, Dimension Shift would be much more useful if the affected foes were untargetable or something. Having every one of your team mates continuously swinging at intangible foes severely cripples this power. Maybe if it was single target, so you could choose which foes to remove from the battle (ie the ones your team isn't fighting).
-With Crush and Crushing Field how about a slow effect similar to warshades immobilize power? After all, warshade powers are gravity based also.
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When I create my characters, I do the research and find out what other people find effective so I don't find myself in a situation where I chose stupid powers and can't even beat up on an even con minion or two.
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When has ANY powers change rendered any character (which wasn't completely dependent on a sole power) incapable of beating up a couple of even-con minions? Or maybe you meant to say "large spawns of +4s".
DS