RE: Statesmans Comments on Electric Blasters
By
123456789,
Posted on: 2004-10-07 24:24 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
I've gotten one up to lvl 32 then lost interest partially due to this.
The 2ndary effect is really lacking with only Short Circuit being my worth while end draining power. I hear power sink and shocking grasp are good but I'm not lvl 40 yet.
I have no problems with its damage though. I just wish the 2ndary effect was as useful as all of the others secondaries.
I expect them to rock in PvP though...
If you care.
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I've gotten one up to lvl 32 then lost interest partially due to this.
The 2ndary effect is really lacking with only Short Circuit being my worth while end draining power. I hear power sink and shocking grasp are good but I'm not lvl 40 yet.
I have no problems with its damage though. I just wish the 2ndary effect was as useful as all of the others secondaries.
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Truthfully, I love end drain, I find it very useful... most of the time, I can tank better than some tankers by draining mobs, but the truth is that I can't drain AVs, and I really couldn't even begin to drain decently till level 22, and then, I wasn't as uber as I am now till level 35, and even now, at 44, I'm finding more and more mobs are able to regen so fast and resist my drain so much that I cannot do my uber blapping.
That's probably one of the biggest issues with the electric powerset, everything about it SCREAMS situational, the pet isn't good for much more than that last 40 damage to off that one guy who stunned you, end drain only works if they're fully drained, don't have resistances, and don't regen quickly, the telsa cage only works on lieuts and minions unless stacked.
I don't mind the situationality of it that much, but I kinda wish there were more instances where I could actually be of some help were right now I'm not at all. (Titans, Sappers, AVs)
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I expect them to rock in PvP though...
If you care.
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Nope, fraid I don't.
But wanna know why they AREN'T going to rock in PvP like everyone thinks?
#1: Our only effective drains are all melee, meaning that againest blasters, we're going to have to chase them down and die, getting into melee with tankers and scrappers is death, and controllers will just hold us.
#2: Stamina, EVERYONE has it, and it negates the effects of even the best drains, I mean, that's why some bosses and all AVs give us so much trouble, we cannot even begin to keep them drained, and while this may make it easier to take down scrappers and tankers, everything else will still be able to do their stuff.
#3: Kinetic has better drains, that not only drain, but buff, heal, and recover end too, and then are ranged. THEY'RE going to be the masters of PvP, while electric blasters will twiddle their thumbs as they excell at neither PvP or PvE, and thus are officially declared "Gimp"
Truthfully, I can't wait for PvP though, cause that's when the Devs are gonna realise what [censored] they've made of themselves and start to actually put in some effort to fix electric.
Yeah, I agree with everything you're saying.
I love elec honestly. It's got it all imo; damage, looks, a potentially great 2ndary effect.
What bothers me is that Short Circuit requires me to be in close with mobs which just seems counter-intuitive for a primary blaster power. I'd expect this from an elec secondary pool, not the primary.
The power set as a whole just needs a little push to make it a really great tactical option IMO.
Dude, we're not Electric blasters. We're Energy blasters that don't annoy Tankers by sending mobs flying 
Seriously, I gave up on end drain early on and just slotted damage. I've never felt gimped, hold my own on any team and am a MEAN solo hunter (especially when I'm in debt...I fight better when I'm p*ssed off). But it would be nice if my secondary effect were useable on an everyday basis.
Hi my name is Blue Lightning and I'm gimped.... 
Shhhhh don't tell States to play it we might get hit with the nerf bat for being a blaster. 
In all seriousness I love my elec blaster. I can one shot even lvl Lts(yellow)... I can't do that with any of my other chars(ok if I'm lucky and get in a critical with my scraptastic).
In case you didn't notice I go off topic more often than a drunk falls off the wagon.
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States, I hate to be rude, but if you seriously think that an electric blaster's drain can be helpful againest an AV, you obviously have never played one.
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Shadowhunter = drained
Nemesis Rex = drained
Bobcat = drained
Dr Vahz = drained
Psychic Clockwork King = drained
Theres 5-6 others that ive seen drained, and kept drained, that i cant think of the name of.
Electric blasters are fine, why dont you try leveling past 16 before trying to sound like youve got a clue. Any electric blaster that doesnt drain, needs to delete and reroll an energy blaster.
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States, I hate to be rude, but if you seriously think that an electric blaster's drain can be helpful againest an AV, you obviously have never played one.
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Shadowhunter = drained
Nemesis Rex = drained
Bobcat = drained
Dr Vahz = drained
Psychic Clockwork King = drained
Theres 5-6 others that ive seen drained, and kept drained, that i cant think of the name of.
Electric blasters are fine, why dont you try leveling past 16 before trying to sound like youve got a clue.
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OMG
Are you Serious??? How did you do that?? I'm not kidding, I'm level 44, and I've fought all those guys, but I've NEVER been able to fully drain them. How'd you do that? Wow. 
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States, I hate to be rude, but if you seriously think that an electric blaster's drain can be helpful againest an AV, you obviously have never played one.
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Let's not put words in my mouth here...a SINGLE electric blaster DOES drain endurance from an AV. BUT definitely not enough to make an impact. All secondary effects against AV's are resisted...it takes several electric blasters to make an appreciable dent in an AV (just like it takes many heroes to bring one down).
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#1 End drain only works if they're fully drained, partial, it's a no go.
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Ooops. That's not true. Some AV powers require an amount of Endurance - so that if the AV doesn't have it - he can't use it. So bringing one down to 0 isn't exactly necessary to have an impact.
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States, I hate to be rude, but if you seriously think that an electric blaster's drain can be helpful againest an AV, you obviously have never played one.
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Shadowhunter = drained
Nemesis Rex = drained
Bobcat = drained
Dr Vahz = drained
Psychic Clockwork King = drained
Theres 5-6 others that ive seen drained, and kept drained, that i cant think of the name of.
Electric blasters are fine, why dont you try leveling past 16 before trying to sound like youve got a clue.
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OMG
Are you Serious??? How did you do that?? I'm not kidding, I'm level 44, and I've fought all those guys, but I've NEVER been able to fully drain them. How'd you do that? Wow.
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A single electric blaster seriously could not do that w/o spamming Short Circtuit and Power Sink at least 5 times.
I'd be interested to see some proof (screenshots? *crosses fingers*) or maybe just what level your elec blaster is War ?
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Let's not put words in my mouth here...a SINGLE electric blaster DOES drain endurance from an AV. BUT definitely not enough to make an impact. All secondary effects against AV's are resisted...it takes several electric blasters to make an appreciable dent in an AV (just like it takes many heroes to bring one down).
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In you're chat you said the Quote:
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The endurance draining abilities are outstanding against bosses and Archvillains, but it's on our "watch" list.
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Define outstanding. If Archvillians can resist most secondaries easily, and I have seen multiple electric defenders and blasters with short circut slotted do nothing to almost all Archvillians (yes, in the same group, and he was debuffed with my rad stuff), then I think it needs to be taken a look at. As it stands end drain vs Archvillians is worthless. I can land holds with tesla cage more often then seeing a sliver of end dropping from an AV.
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States, I hate to be rude, but if you seriously think that an electric blaster's drain can be helpful againest an AV, you obviously have never played one.
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Shadowhunter = drained
Nemesis Rex = drained
Bobcat = drained
Dr Vahz = drained
Psychic Clockwork King = drained
Theres 5-6 others that ive seen drained, and kept drained, that i cant think of the name of.
Electric blasters are fine, why dont you try leveling past 16 before trying to sound like youve got a clue.
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OMG
Are you Serious??? How did you do that?? I'm not kidding, I'm level 44, and I've fought all those guys, but I've NEVER been able to fully drain them. How'd you do that? Wow.
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A single electric blaster seriously could not do that w/o spamming Short Circtuit and Power Sink at least 5 times.
I'd be interested to see some proof (screenshots? *crosses fingers*) or maybe just what level your elec blaster is War ?
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Ditto, I just fought shadowhunter 3 times last nite, and not once did my short circut move his end bar.
Remember that Statesman is eating pie. If you were eating pie then you would be able to drain an AV with friends too.
How is it slotted? I have a friend with an electric/energy blaster who drains alot of endurance, and is actually quite an effective blaster.
Spines/ D A lvl 50 Scrap, stone/wm lvl 50 tank, Kat/reg lvl 50 Scrap
Grav/Kin lvl 50 Cont, Fire/Enegry lvl 50 Blast
Warshade lvl 50, PB lvl 39, nightwidow lvl 50, crab lvl 42
plant/thorns lvl 50 dom, ice/fire lvl 40 dom, grav/nrg lvl 41 dom
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#1 End drain only works if they're fully drained, partial, it's a no go.
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Ooops. That's not true. Some AV powers require an amount of Endurance - so that if the AV doesn't have it - he can't use it. So bringing one down to 0 isn't exactly necessary to have an impact.
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I've seen this work on Bosses, never mess with AVs much.
I am not slotted with end drain at all and against a boss, esp if the pet is out. I can have them standing still by the time they are near 1/4 health.
The pet may not do much damage but is excellent for end drain.
For AVs though, I don't think I have ever drained one much before he was taken down. Maybe like Dr. V, when I went to help a lower friend just get through it, but at the mission level then I don't think you can drain them much at all.
Really I don't think cage should hit bosses, at least not often. After all they are usually higher in level and well they are bosses.
As for end drain in PVP, against an even con (same stamina slotting abilty) I figure on draining a target pretty quickly.
Fully slotted may be different, but if I can burn through my end in a regular fight before stamina can replenish it, I don't think a PVP target would be able to endure the attacks long while also attacking.
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...it takes several electric blasters to make an appreciable dent in an AV (just like it takes many heroes to bring one down).
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States, you may want to recheck that last assertion. My regen scrapper soloed Terra without difficulty...yeah, it took twenty minutes, but they were a boring twenty minutes.
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Remember that Statesman is eating pie. If you were eating pie then you would be able to drain an AV with friends too.
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not cool. I've never seen devs interact with players like this dev team does. Disrespecting them is seriously uncool. Save the pie for yourself.
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definitely not enough to make an impact.
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The problem is, seldom does one have a slew of electric blasters in a group.
This is closely analogous to the red bar/blue bar issue in SWG. Most of the group is shooting at a mob's red bar, and then maybe you have 1 guy shooting at the blue bar. The blue bar attacker isn't helping much on a big mob, because the big mob is going to die from damage to the red bar, not the blue bar.
This system did not work well there, and it is unlikely to work well here. Personally, my electric blaster is an alt, so I am not much affected. But if it was my main I would be wishing I was a red bar kind of guy.
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#1 End drain only works if they're fully drained, partial, it's a no go.
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Ooops. That's not true. Some AV powers require an amount of Endurance - so that if the AV doesn't have it - he can't use it. So bringing one down to 0 isn't exactly necessary to have an impact.
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Can I play in your world...... Before i deleted my electric blaster, I had a power tank completely drained of end. next tic before i caould drain him again he hits me with his big blast power..... the next tic he hit me with total focus..... these a powers that my energy blaster can not use with a single tic of endurance. Yep i have stam 6 slotted. yep i tried 6 slotted end reducers.... DOES NOT HAPPEN AT ALL FOR THE HEROES! so i must conclude that the game is programed to cheat for the villains. Just like a boss that can cast both jack frost and fire imps..... hmmmmmmmm
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States, I hate to be rude, but if you seriously think that an electric blaster's drain can be helpful againest an AV, you obviously have never played one.
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Let's not put words in my mouth here...a SINGLE electric blaster DOES drain endurance from an AV. BUT definitely not enough to make an impact. All secondary effects against AV's are resisted...it takes several electric blasters to make an appreciable dent in an AV (just like it takes many heroes to bring one down).
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Well, not to dispute you, but that's not quite accurate either...
I DID solo Dr. Vazhilok with my elec/elec blaster at level 20. So that part is doable, and I certainly am not complaining about the AT overall, but my ability to drain his end was a complete non-issue. So I agree with you on that point...one elec blaster, by themself, has no useful secondary because end drain is minimal at best. I can take them out before the "minimal" end drain even becomes a factor.
For example: At one point, Vazh did go down to 0 end...his doing, not mine...and I ran up to him with Lightning Field up hoping to keep his end down and finish him off toe-to-toe. That may be about the hardest I got hit up to that point (except for when I got one punched by a level 41 Rikti ambush in Steel Canyon). He recovered end enough to really lay a smackdown on me and make me run away to rest (before finishing him off in the second battle) despite my having Lightning Field and Electric Fence on him and hitting him with all my other "endurance draining" attacks. Admittedly, I do not have Short Circuit, but so far I haven't seen the benefits of end drain.
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States, I hate to be rude, but if you seriously think that an electric blaster's drain can be helpful againest an AV, you obviously have never played one.
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Shadowhunter = drained
Nemesis Rex = drained
Bobcat = drained
Dr Vahz = drained
Psychic Clockwork King = drained
Theres 5-6 others that ive seen drained, and kept drained, that i cant think of the name of.
Electric blasters are fine, why dont you try leveling past 16 before trying to sound like youve got a clue. Any electric blaster that doesnt drain, needs to delete and reroll an energy blaster.
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Hmmm.. my level 36 electric/electric blaster says you are full of it. I just asked him.
As for one shotting even LTs at my level. Only with Thunderous blast and only with Aim and buildup. I CAN do it. Just only ever 2.8 minutes.
The secondary effects of electricity are subpar at best. Compared with knockdown, extra damage and slow. It is the worst secondary effect a blaster can have. Period. In PvP we might rock. Might. Since no one has PvPed in this game, no one can be sure what might rock.
As for slotting for Endurance reduction against an AV. I can either do 3x my normal damage (6-slotted for damage) Or I can slot fro Endurance drain. Which MIGHT work agaisnt the archvillan.
The fact of the matter is this. Electric secondary isn't a well thought out power. It needs to be changed. Or made more effective.
Statesman, I play an Empathy/Electric Defender. I lead a large SG on Justice, the likely hood of having multiple electric users in a group is slim to none. Its not like hold and immobilize where there are SEVERAL AT's that have these abilities. The only ones who drain end is electric users, so blasters and defenders. Even my Thunderous Blast against an AV 3 levels below me barely does damage and doesn't end drain enough to move their endurance bar. If it does they regen it so fast you can't notice.
On the Thunderous Blast note, it should be noted I don't have a single End Drain S/O on it, I have 3 Recharge and 3 Damage.
I do have short circuit six slotted with Endurance Drains, I can drain any boss 3 levels above me nearly totally of endurance so long as I don't miss totally. I have NEVER seen this power do anything against an AV OR Monster level Villain at any level. I went through and beat down Adamaster for the badge (I'm currently 48, he was 20something) I could not drain his end at all.
Are you saying its an ALL or Nothing kind of thing against these levels of Villains? You either have enough people to beat past his resistance and drain him completely or you don't do any noticeable damage to that pesky blue bar? That sure seems how it is to me.
w00t Radio
I sent him a tell saying that even fully slotted for end, I have never been able to ever drain an AV, and that the thought that electric could be used to drain an AV is a bit off
(For anyone new to the subject, he said that endurance drain was "Outstanding againest AVs")
He told me this...
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They CAN...some AV's have resistances, others have powers that enhance their Endurance Recovery.
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Alrighty...
States, I hate to be rude, but if you seriously think that an electric blaster's drain can be helpful againest an AV, you obviously have never played one.
So I suggest, you go to the internal server, role an electric blaster up, insta level it to whatever, and PLEASE just try to drain an AV, alrighty, now that you have debt, let's try it with a team, you can grab positron and make him be a tank, make poz a healer, make lord reculse be a bubbler, and let's say the rest can be 4 kinetic/electric defenders. Cool, your teams awesome now, the tank, healer, and bubbler alone should make you invincible, so you can take ALL the time you need.
Start draining, before the AV reaches 0 end, he'll be dead, and guess what, with the way end works, he'll be firing off his best attacks the entire team, each time his tic of end comes, even if you somehow miraculousy reduce him to 0 end.
You'll have learned 2 important lessons every electric blaster knows.
#1 End drain only works if they're fully drained, partial, it's a no go.
#2 You can't fully drain AVs.
I'm really serious about actually playing one. It doesn't seem like you ever have. (sorry if that sounds rude)