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Arcanaville wins.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
 "PARAGON HEAR ME! WE ARE STILL HERE! Let us send a message to NCSoft! Let us shake this game! Let us tremble the warwalls of earth, steel and forcefield! Let us be heard from weatherless sky to weird moon! Tonight let us make them remember THIS IS PARAGON AND WE ARE NOT AFRAAAAID! |
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I read through it. Did I miss the part when it talked about the wells? What are the damn wells?
Quote:
The Well of the Furies for humans, we dunno what the other Wells are call. They're basically the physical embodiment of a race's potential. When you have one, your race can grow all awesome and become Incarnates. When you don't, you're kind of hollowed out and listless. |
Originally Posted by thgebull0425
I read through it. Did I miss the part when it talked about the wells? What are the damn wells?
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The Battalion, the big threat that was coming, were dangerous because they -consumed- other races' wells.
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Okay, I'll give you that.
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Originally Posted by Dollhouse
Venge bait...
 |
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Arc 503982 "Dimension Xi Epsilon 22-10" Part one of a multi-part arc.
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To be fair, there's often been a certain layer to QA missing in this game, for some reason.|
Originally Posted by Agent White
It depends on how broken it is. Grandville causing more lag is less broken than say, a bug in the SSA which stops the mission from being completed.
It comes down to a matter of resources and profit. Paragon was A) a small studio and B) needed to continually produce items that garnered profit. That's why new content took precedence. Fixing stuff can be a quality of life improvement but more often, stuff like Grandville is more cosmetic than function so it's not high on the list of priorities. Or worse it's something that was broken by previous developers and left in an unfixed state and the best people to be able to fix it have left. Look at bases and mayhem/safeguard missions. Both things that really needed fixing but just the sheer amount of time to A) Reverse engineer to simply have an understanding of its workings and B) work out how to implement changes/fixes/upgrades without breaking the system (if it was even possible) is pretty high compared to what it would require to just build new things from scratch or that already work within the existing engine and are well documented and understood (costume sets, powers, zones, etc). And it isn't like they didn't get around to fixing stuff when they could spare five minutes. I mean look at everything that was getting fixed or changed around in Issue 24. The schedule is always tight but you never know when they get to squeak in something. |
There's a lot of bugs that can(and likely should) get delegated to the backburner, but
there've been quite a number of serious, sometimes game-crashing bugs which are known
for some time, and then pushed live anyway(and in some cases kept live longer than
really should be.) That's more on the unacceptable side. I don't know if that was from
lack of resources, or some broken layer of communication, but it's been a real thorn from
time to time.
Steel_Golem pretty much had it right though, and it's what always bothers me about MMOs
in general. With other software, the feature development is usually going hand in hand
along with the bugs, so more gets fixed. But for games like this, there's the constant
pressure to keep new content coming, keep the flash, keep the WOW, and keep people
paying cash. That sucks a ton of time away from the product quality as it is, but it also
buries older problems under a mountain of new hotness, so it all just gets lost.
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Actually, the document suggested that were the game to continue, that might have been eventually retconned a bit, since Tim (Black Scorpion) seems to be saying the intent was never for the Wells to represent *all* potential. At least as he saw it, the Well(s) is more of an accumulation of energy that derives from all life: "exceptional" individuals can become conduits for that accumulated energy, like static electricity can build up from motion, that then discharges from a metal object. That the story led in the direction of the Well being the *source* of power rather than just a focal point of power is something at least he claims to have been an error. That error might have been eventually retconned if we had lasted long enough to reach past the Batallion to Ascension.|
Originally Posted by Agent White
The Well of the Furies for humans, we dunno what the other Wells are call. They're basically the physical embodiment of a race's potential. When you have one, your race can grow all awesome and become Incarnates. When you don't, you're kind of hollowed out and listless.
The Battalion, the big threat that was coming, were dangerous because they -consumed- other races' wells. |
And as I mentioned above, Tim's version of the Well of the Furies strongly contradicts the notion that Wells can be "consumed" at least permanently. Temporarily perhaps, but not permanently. Not without killing all life that generates it at the same time.
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That was some awesome insight but did I miss the resolution of the Pandora's Box sig arc? Besides the mention that Manticore is your silent partner red-side I didn't see anything about it. How does that turn out? Or is that in some other thread I've missed?
I think part 4 and possibly part 5 are on the beta server right now.
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David Nakayama confirmed that the set would be ported to players via his deviantART account. Even though I never had it, I'll probably miss that costume set the most |
Originally Posted by Zyphoid
I have more questions, but all of them are costume related. I really want to know if we were ver going to get that awesome Black Knight armor.
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Hey guys,
It was fun to work on the answers with Positron and everyone. Posi put a lot of work into gathering all the answers and using all the lore knowledge from years gone by to answer them.
Regarding the Scirocco arc - it was something I was very excited about (which is why I wrote such a long winded response). The idea started when Baryonx and I were talking about Scirocco and I mentioned that it would be interesting to see how a personal story "campaign" would go over that would end with Scirocco becoming a hero. The missions were mixed between a few encounters ending in a unique boss fight w/ mechanics or pure dialog missions, etc.
It's definitely really interesting to see everyone's reactions, as the entire thing was going to be pretty different in a lot of instances from our how normal content worked. It was either going to be great, or a spectacular failure, as Tim Schafer would say.
Regarding Battalion, we were all very well aware about the issues we had with Praetoria and wanted to fix that with the next storyline. The plan that Positron and War Witch agreed upon was to have the Battalion storyline be shorter than the Praetorian War and to also develop other storylines in these issues so it wasn't BATTALION BATTALION BATTALION every issue. The Scirocco story arc is one of the examples, as well as Ultimatum.
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Wow. Good stuff. Thanks for doing this. And thanks for all the awesome content you created over the years. I LOVE THIS GAME!
"This is the last song I will ever sing, no I changed my mind again, Good Night and Thank You!"
Entertaining read, but something just floated to the top:
"Why is so much in Cimerora about restoring a monarchy, and not about building a democratic society based on merit?
MM: Because the only democracy to ever work for a significant period of time was the United States, and even there it’s a Democratic Republic hybrid government.
"
This is... Not a very nice thing to say, for several billion people, dead and alive.
I will miss this all so bad =(
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It definitely would have been very different... But that's not a bad thing. Sometimes different can be the best way to go.|
Originally Posted by Dr. Aeon
It's definitely really interesting to see everyone's reactions, as the entire thing was going to be pretty different in a lot of instances from our how normal content worked. It was either going to be great, or a spectacular failure, as Tim Schafer would say.
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Granted, I'm biased in this particular instance because we're talking about a story centered on a specific NPC that I'm very fond of, but I still think the general principle holds true. There's nothing wrong with trying a different appraoch.
@Brightfires - @Talisander
That chick what plays the bird-things...
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As they say, sometimes the truth hurts.
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Originally Posted by Nihilii
This is... Not a very nice thing to say, for several billion people, dead and alive.
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Main Hero: Chad Gulzow-Man (Victory) 50, 1396 Badges
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Mission Architect arcs: Doctor Brainstorm's An Experiment Gone Awry, Arc ID 2093
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Originally Posted by Nethergoat
it's NEVER too late to pad your /ignore list!
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So when can we expect Part II? 
Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
Dark_Respite's Farewell Video: "One Last Day"
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
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378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
Quote:
The explanation in the Lore AMA doesn't really explain the sentient bit of the Well (which speaks to us a couple of times), which I think is an important missing piece of the puzzle. The Well can grant great power to individuals, whether it be a normal power up (the "easy way" we were told about, though we never actually got to explore). Or as we saw in Tyrant, an attempt to create a champion. So obviously the Well can control WHERE the power goes, to an extent.|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Actually, the document suggested that were the game to continue, that might have been eventually retconned a bit, since Tim (Black Scorpion) seems to be saying the intent was never for the Wells to represent *all* potential. At least as he saw it, the Well(s) is more of an accumulation of energy that derives from all life: "exceptional" individuals can become conduits for that accumulated energy, like static electricity can build up from motion, that then discharges from a metal object. That the story led in the direction of the Well being the *source* of power rather than just a focal point of power is something at least he claims to have been an error. That error might have been eventually retconned if we had lasted long enough to reach past the Batallion to Ascension.
And as I mentioned above, Tim's version of the Well of the Furies strongly contradicts the notion that Wells can be "consumed" at least permanently. Temporarily perhaps, but not permanently. Not without killing all life that generates it at the same time. |
So, with that in mind, the process of absorbing a Well could be the Battalion taking over or replacing the sentient part of the Well and making it serve them. The excess energy is no longer re-invested in humanity. So while there may still be the base potential of humanity, even if there might still be "simple" metahumans, there would be no more incarnates. No more gods, spirits or titans. No more great leaders of civilization, generals, or tyrants. All the excess power created by humanity that they drew from now goes to the Battalion.
And in that way, the race could become a hollow shell of it's former self. They would be just normal people, maybe with a few truly exceptional individuals here and there. But the true greatness of the species would be gone.
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Are you sure the Well is truly sentient? The Well never actually speaks to us, the Well speaks to us through others. But so does LSD.|
Originally Posted by Xaphan
The explanation in the Lore AMA doesn't really explain the sentient bit of the Well (which speaks to us a couple of times), which I think is an important missing piece of the puzzle. The Well can grant great power to individuals, whether it be a normal power up (the "easy way" we were told about, though we never actually got to explore). Or as we saw in Tyrant, an attempt to create a champion. So obviously the Well can control WHERE the power goes, to an extent.
So, with that in mind, the process of absorbing a Well could be the Battalion taking over or replacing the sentient part of the Well and making it serve them. The excess energy is no longer re-invested in humanity. So while there may still be the base potential of humanity, even if there might still be "simple" metahumans, there would be no more incarnates. No more gods, spirits or titans. No more great leaders of civilization, generals, or tyrants. All the excess power created by humanity that they drew from now goes to the Battalion. And in that way, the race could become a hollow shell of it's former self. They would be just normal people, maybe with a few truly exceptional individuals here and there. But the true greatness of the species would be gone. |
In any case, you're talking about co-opting the Well as opposed to destroying it, which makes more sense in this context but is not what I believe the in-game fiction suggests the Battalion does. Then again, I've always believed Prometheus to be an unreliable narrator, and the loregasm also suggests that this would likely be confirmed down the road as well.
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Got to agree on wanting more Kheld lore... I know I asked more questions, and have much the same reaction as FFM
Still, thank you very much for doing this.
.... and for making Techbot Alpha's head explode. Not that I wanted it to, but once I read the answer, I hurried to find some popcorn (and a tarp.)
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Fair enough. Gloves off, then. |
Originally Posted by Chad Gulzow-Man
As they say, sometimes the truth hurts.
|
USA did not invent democracy, and can hardly be called one before 1965, compared to other actual democratic countries of the time. Even after that, it's very arguable whether it is one or not, as its political system is deeply flawed, relying on indirect voting even for presidential elections. Lobbying is omnipresent. Corporations have more power than people. Being able to lay off an entire developer team from one day to another isn't an example of a "successful democracy" to anyone who hasn't lived isolated from the rest of the world.
You're right in saying the truth hurts. It is painful to see yet another demonstration of american arrogance and ignorance, so widespread even someone at a relatively high ranking job like Matt Miller can make statements any sixth grader in educated countries would know to be wrong on a fundamental level. Particulary ironic to see that statement being made in the context of a fictional place set in the Antiquity setting, considering democracy originates from Ancient Greece.
So:
Genesis: Patch powers and the like
Mind: ???
Vitae: ???
Omega: Acended "Well unto ourselves"
More detail: what more where you thinking? Did we ever get infinite radial freem or what!? Make something up, dang it :angry: 
Miss Arc #147491: Rise of Bedlam
AKA Iron Smoke @Champion Server
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You were doing well up to this point:|
Originally Posted by Nihilii
Fair enough. Gloves off, then.
USA did not invent democracy, and can hardly be called one before 1965, compared to other actual democratic countries of the time. Even after that, it's very arguable whether it is one or not, as its political system is deeply flawed, relying on indirect voting even for presidential elections. Lobbying is omnipresent. Corporations have more power than people. Being able to lay off an entire developer team from one day to another isn't an example of a "successful democracy" to anyone who hasn't lived isolated from the rest of the world. You're right in saying the truth hurts. It is painful to see yet another demonstration of american arrogance and ignorance, so widespread even someone at a relatively high ranking job like Matt Miller can make statements any sixth grader in educated countries would know to be wrong on a fundamental level. Particulary ironic to see that statement being made in the context of a fictional place set in the Antiquity setting, considering democracy originates from Ancient Greece. |
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| being able to lay off an entire developer team from one day to another isn't an example of a 'successful democracy' to anyone who hasn't lived isolated from the rest of the world |
It is nevertheless true that long-term stable democracies of any kind are historically rare, and ones that are used as role models for emulation even rarer. In fact, if you scratch all the current stable democracies that derive from British colonies or are explicit emulations of British parliamentary rule, you're left with a very sparce remainder, none of which are used as models for other democracies that I'm aware of (at least, not yet). Matt's statement is highly parochial, but there is a kernel of truth to it.
True stable democracies are mostly an 18th and 19th century invention for all but certain limited cases, and successful ones that maintain their integrity outside of isolation are almost entirely a 19th and 20th century invention. Even Athens was not an entirely stable democracy historically. Its more precise to call it an experimental democracy, and one that was not considered an especially good role model for other countries to follow precisely because of its experimental and shifting nature (among other reasons).
I would say there has only been one actual stable really successful long-term democratic system, and that's the British Parliamentary system. Its been long-lived, it has served as the model for a large number of other democratic systems, and its most radical inspirational departure is probably the United States itself which is also a successful long term democracy. You'd be hard-pressed to name another system that is reasonably democratic, stable, long-lived, and successful in terms of both maintaining its integrity outside of isolation and replicating any significant part of itself outside its own origin.
Switzerland is certainly both stable and approaching the two century mark in longevity; maybe in another century or two it might become the model for other democracies, although I'm skeptical at the moment. Switzerland seems to be one of those exceptional exceptions throughout history.
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Quote:
It might come as a shock, but there are other democracies in the world, and nations that are actually more democratic than the US. |
Originally Posted by Chad Gulzow-Man
As they say, sometimes the truth hurts.
|
For example, every Commonwealth nation that has more than two political parties with enough influence to contend for office.
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I really like this idea and the one described in the document that the Well is just life energy itself, suggesting that the way it interacts with people is more a manifestation of how that energy interacts with their consciousness than a real personality of its own. It clashes a little bit with how the Well seemed to work, but not irreparably so: did the Well abandon Cole as its champion, for instance, or did Cole's own expectations about the Well create a self-fulfilling prophecy? The second answer's so much more interesting, and the idea of heroes tapping into the planet's life force just seems more appropriate, than the Well as a temperamental and morally shady gatekeeper of power. |
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Are you sure the Well is truly sentient? The Well never actually speaks to us, the Well speaks to us through others. But so does LSD.
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"Now, I'm not saying this guy at Microsoft sees gamers as a bunch of rats in a Skinner box. I'm just saying that he illustrates his theory of game design using pictures of rats in a Skinner box."
I hope I have inspired some, and amused all.
We are heroes, this is what we do.
Now take it easy, breath, and get out there!
Bravo.
Writer of In-Game fiction: Just Completed: My Summer Vacation. My older things are now being archived at Fanfiction.net http://www.fanfiction.net/~jwbullfrog until I come up with a better solution.