Please change Penny Yin's costume.


Agent White

 

Posted

My eyes go cross-eyed every time I see Penny in the splash screen. Her anatomy is all wrong. As has been pointed out by others, her cleavage shouldn't start at her throat, and her body positioning would hurt a contortionist.


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Posted

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Originally Posted by Jack_NoMind View Post

And uh... I'm pretty sure the splash art isn't being done by a dev. ;p I'd be happy with jeans, a t-shirt, and biker gloves for her in-game costume.
Actually, I'm pretty sure it IS being done by a Dev. Noble Savage did the art for the redesign of Penny Yin and I'm fairly certain he did the splash page (and the associated forum art) as well.

Here's a link to his Penny Yin piece from his DA page. He also explains a lot of the choices for the costume and coloring.

He also has a few Key Art pieces listed in his DA Gallery including the previous splash screen of Statesman. I using one of the other Key Art pieces as my Test Server splash screen at home.

He also has the "cover art" from each of the SSA Ep.1 chapters, his art from the comic at the beginning of the tutorial and other design work there in his CoH: Freedom Gallery.

He has some of his cover art from the old CoH comic in his Cover Art Gallery and some of the marker sketches he's done for players over the years in a different gallery. Sketches similar to the one you see as my forum avatar (other players often do this using his sketches as well).

Jeans, a T-Shirt and biker gloves don't cut it for the look they had in mind for her.


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Posted

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Unless a dev comes out and says it's deliberate, I'm not buying it.
Didn't some redname confirm it as such? I can swear someone with higher standing did...

EDIT:
Quote:
Here's a link to his Penny Yin piece from his DA page. He also explains a lot of the choices for the costume and coloring.
That works.


 

Posted

She reminds me greatly of Jim Lee's complete redesign of Psylocke because he decided he'd rather draw a hawt Asian chick. "Psychic knife" and all.

So, uh, I guess it's "authentic", but not IMO in a good way.


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Posted

I might as well rerun my old list of what's wrong with Penny's costume:

1. The face clutter. There's just too much going on there. Pick either metal cheeks OR metal eyebrows OR NFL face paint, but not all three. One is a detail, all three makes her look like she dunked her head in a bucket of spare parts. It loses all sense of style and becomes too busy for what it's worth.

2. The colour scheme. It's chaotic and disorderly. She has a top that has a black primary and a red secondary colour with white as a detail colour and a bottom with a red primary and a white secondary with white AND black as detail colours. It's a mess, and it makes it confusing to take in.

3. The business. Penny has so many buckles and straps and zippers and belts and metal ribs following so many body lines that her costume is simply confusing to look at. A good costume uses our mind's ability to parse visual information and gives us a look that says more than the picture itself. Penny's costume is so busy that all I see is a miasma of lines, shapes and colours that I cannot reproduce off memory on pain of death.

4. The thigh-high high-heel boots complete with decorative panties. That's just trashy, and I don't buy the excuse that Penny's just being rebellious. This is the costume of a superhero woman as drawn by a man who's never had to walk around dressed like that. It takes refuge in tights superheroes in order to show us a fetishied look that really doesn't belong on Penelope Yin. I'm sorry, David, but it is. We need more super women wearing sensible shoes, please.

5. The lack of identity. Quick! Describe Penelope Yin's costume in a single sentence! Did you manage to get out more than "It's red white and black?" Because that's the extent of its identity - it has these colours and it kind of has shapes on it. But there's nothing about Penny that stands out by which she can be remembered, aside from "she has a belly button, wish I could have one." There's nothing iconic about it, and there really should be SOMETHING.

Penny needs a new costume, and preferably a much simpler one. Her current look is a victim of its own enthusiasm - it's so over-designed and overly complicated that it fails at being memorable and interesting. It trades visual appeal for bare complexity, and in the process of doing so trades artistry for raw graphics. And that's never a good trade.


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Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
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Posted

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Originally Posted by Athena Six View Post
Personally I adore her costume and wish we could have pieces for ourselves like the jacket!

I read a blog article abut her costume where the author compared it to.. some kind of Dominatrix outfit...I am sorry but I just don't see it.. you say collar I see a buckle you say thigh high boots and we have like four pair off thigh high boots to choose from for our own characters.

The other comments about it mismatching I can at least understand, for you it's aesthetics. I For one feel it matches just fine.

I can see it is not Golden aged.. or standard comic book styled it is modern, techy, sexy and fun and yes with a hint of anime. It also reminds me of a costume from GI Joe.

Was there this much of a fuss over Sister's costume?
I agree - I like the look, especially as depicted in the deviant art page. ( ' :


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
I might as well rerun my old list of what's wrong with Penny's costume:

1. The face clutter. There's just too much going on there. Pick either metal cheeks OR metal eyebrows OR NFL face paint, but not all three. One is a detail, all three makes her look like she dunked her head in a bucket of spare parts. It loses all sense of style and becomes too busy for what it's worth.

2. The colour scheme. It's chaotic and disorderly. She has a top that has a black primary and a red secondary colour with white as a detail colour and a bottom with a red primary and a white secondary with white AND black as detail colours. It's a mess, and it makes it confusing to take in.

3. The business. Penny has so many buckles and straps and zippers and belts and metal ribs following so many body lines that her costume is simply confusing to look at. A good costume uses our mind's ability to parse visual information and gives us a look that says more than the picture itself. Penny's costume is so busy that all I see is a miasma of lines, shapes and colours that I cannot reproduce off memory on pain of death.

4. The thigh-high high-heel boots complete with decorative panties. That's just trashy, and I don't buy the excuse that Penny's just being rebellious. This is the costume of a superhero woman as drawn by a man who's never had to walk around dressed like that. It takes refuge in tights superheroes in order to show us a fetishied look that really doesn't belong on Penelope Yin. I'm sorry, David, but it is. We need more super women wearing sensible shoes, please.

5. The lack of identity. Quick! Describe Penelope Yin's costume in a single sentence! Did you manage to get out more than "It's red white and black?" Because that's the extent of its identity - it has these colours and it kind of has shapes on it. But there's nothing about Penny that stands out by which she can be remembered, aside from "she has a belly button, wish I could have one." There's nothing iconic about it, and there really should be SOMETHING.

Penny needs a new costume, and preferably a much simpler one. Her current look is a victim of its own enthusiasm - it's so over-designed and overly complicated that it fails at being memorable and interesting. It trades visual appeal for bare complexity, and in the process of doing so trades artistry for raw graphics. And that's never a good trade.

Well said!

And so short.


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Posted

Get rid of the faceplate, change the colors a bit and the outfit becomes awesom!

Even better would be a better looking face, but I won't ask for that to be changed.

Over all, I like Penny's outfit and wish it's pieces were available for me to use!


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Posted

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
5. The lack of identity. Quick! Describe Penelope Yin's costume in a single sentence!
I can do it in a single word: NINETIES! (alternatively, XTREEEEEM!)

This is the downside of everything coming back 20 years later. Maybe we should be grateful that she still has feet.


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Posted

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Originally Posted by Agent White View Post
I like her costume. It seems in part what a teen would toss together and call her super hero outfit.

Then again I like Penny and don't really see where all the hate comes from
My stance on it too.

If you grew up looking up to real-life heroes, and then got the chance to actually be a Phalanx member, which would you do?

A) Design your costume yourself, to express yourself and try to make your own style
B) Run a poll on the masses to decide what you should wear
C) Pick Spandex Outfit #98,247 from the Icon premade bin?

I'd go with A.


 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
Penny is just expressing herlself, which is one of the main purposes of clothes
I thought the main purposes of clothes were keeping warm, and allowing me to not have to put up with seeing things I'd rather not have to see.


 

Posted

It's those metal faceplate things that confuse me too. She almost looks like a cyborg, and I'm pretty sure they're not trying to suggest that Penelope got assimilated or did a stint with the Freakshow sometime after Faultline...

Other than, it is the sort of overdone and kinda silly look that she'd IC'ly aim for, so there's that.


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Originally Posted by Lazarillo View Post
I thought the main purposes of clothes were keeping warm, and allowing me to not have to put up with seeing things I'd rather not have to see.
That's probably why Golden Girl said 'one of'.

And since I'm sysadmin for the head office of a 40 store chain that exclusively sells women's clothing, I (and my cost of living) am QUITE glad that her words are true.

edit: On the original topic, I, too, think her costume looks like something Domino would wear from X-Force. I judge that as neither good nor bad, but I do find it noticeable.


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Posted

*shrugs* They weren't exactly required to poll the entire playerbase for costume ideas, and "design by committee" NEVER ends well, anyway. As such, any input here is simply personal opinion regarding what looks good, bad or indifferent on ANY costume in the game. It's fine that people don't like Penny's look. I don't much, myself. But did we really, honestly need a thread about it? Yes, yes... feel free to skip the usual "but I'm entitled to an opinion" excuse. Not every personal opinion requires public expression.


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Originally Posted by Bloodspeaker View Post
But did we really, honestly need a thread about it? Yes, yes... feel free to skip the usual "but I'm entitled to an opinion" excuse. Not every personal opinion requires public expression.
Including your own opinion on this thread? Someone wanted to say something, they made a thread. Happens all the time, it ain't stopping anytime soon.


 

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Originally Posted by Texas Justice View Post
Here's a link to his Penny Yin piece from his DA page. He also explains a lot of the choices for the costume and coloring.
That does help to explain the design. However, I'd say that he's trying to squeeze too many ideas into one costume and that's why it comes across as looking messy. There's simply too much going on because there's too many concepts crammed into one outfit.


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Originally Posted by Xzero45 View Post
I'm sure Serge would've popped in and been like "No, you're not going outside in that. Let me find you something better."
This could be problematic on its own.

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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazz View Post
If you grew up looking up to real-life heroes, and then got the chance to actually be a Phalanx member, which would you do?

A) Design your costume yourself, to express yourself and try to make your own style
B) Run a poll on the masses to decide what you should wear
C) Pick Spandex Outfit #98,247 from the Icon premade bin?

I'd go with A.
Followed by (a), look back at your fashion choices 5-10 years later and wonder, "my God, what was I thinking??"


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrandX View Post
Get rid of the faceplate, change the colors a bit and the outfit becomes awesom!
The face plate can actually work, it just needs to be MUCH simpler, and preferably have some visible means by which it's attached. Blu tack and double-sided tape just don't make for very convincing costumes, plus if this was intended to be some kind of psychic channelling device, it should have been around her brain, not supporting her jaw muscles. As well, it would have stood out much more if it were asymmetrical. My suggestion would be a single device attached at the right ear and extending over the right eye and part of the forehead, suggesting it's being hung on the ear and clamped across the skull, but that's just one option.

As for Penny's costume, I'd say going with a black base and a red secondary colour, with all straps, ribs, belts and details in white would be considerably more memorable, and also look considerably less like two costumes belted together at the waist. Leave the bulk of the boots and the entire arms black, have the chest, upper legs and "panties" stay red then just make all the detailing white so it pops out and you have a costume that's both simpler to perceive at a glance and at the same time more distinct. Again, it's not the only way to go about it, but it's the simplest way to give it some life, I think.


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Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

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Originally Posted by Megajoule View Post
Followed by (a), look back at your fashion choices 5-10 years later and wonder, "my God, what was I thinking??"
Pretty much this. The choices given are too limiting, and they equate "design my own costume" with "create a right mess." I design my own costume all the time, but that doesn't mean I don't run them past people I know and ask "Say, is there anything obviously horrible about what I've done?" Creating your own costume does not preclude getting a second opinion. A creator is his own worst critic.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack_NoMind View Post
There's some serious dissonance going when I see the little girl whose dad I used to rescue in impractically heeled thigh-highs and a collar. I realize that in real life, this happens. In the game, it's just weird.

(I also think parts of her costume are plain ugly -- or well, disproportionate and unmatching. The thing on her head needs to either be bigger and extend out of her hair, or smaller and with less metal eyebrow going on. I like the action-girl-jacket look but it doesn't really connect with the more silver age-y tights and hose on her legs. Dazzler is not the model for a *successful* heroine costume.)
Seen worse dressed heroines.


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Posted

The costume concept art posted (Thanks!) looks better than how it's been done in-game (changing her hair -- the biggest one -- rendering her seamed heeled tights as boots, belts are definitely at least cloth and not metal bands, etc) and in official splash art, but still kinda weak. Where's the blue he's talking about -- her hair? Ehhh. Besides, she has no actual relationship to Statesman (to the best of my knowledge). Why is she even aiming at all for Asian Liberty? Why not just Asian Clockwork-Befriending ***-Kicker?

The top, minus the metal boob support arms and the extremely uncomfortable-looking midriff belts, can stay -- it can even keep the belts if they're put over clothing, for the sporty "I was going climbing but then duty called" look, if that's really what they like.

The legs -- hm. I'd prefer something with a bit more body to it. If they're keeping the sporty look of the top, shorts. Otherwise... I don't know. At least add some white to the top, or change the white panels to match the coloring of the top.

Please break the trend and just give her actual boots. It's all the rage these days. Female crime-fighters are no longer heels-only.

The face thing pretty much has to go. As others have said, it's helmet or under-eye makeup. I kind of like the eye makeup as it's done with the rest of her makeup in the concept picture, but...

Edit : Oh, yeah, the collar. It actually looks cute in the concept picture. In the splash art it looks like a pet collar.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack_NoMind View Post
The costume concept art posted (Thanks!) looks better than how it's been done in-game (changing her hair -- the biggest one -- rendering her seamed heeled tights as boots, belts are definitely at least cloth and not metal bands, etc) and in official splash art, but still kinda weak.
The concept does indeed look considerably better. I'm still not a fan, but here's what it has going for it:

1. The black isn't as black and the white isn't as white. They both look like two shades of grey. This leaves the actually black detail pieces to stand out more.

2. The costume is considerably simpler, marking the first piece of concept art I've ever seen that's simpler than its in-game depiction. Most details are only single-colour and there's considerably less white clutter

3. Her breasts are lower and feel more natural than the effectively "push-up bra" look of her in-game model. I know that's a problem with the female model in general, but it detracts.

4. The face clutter is moved farther back and out-of-the way, so it's not so prominent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack_NoMind View Post
Please break the trend and just give her actual boots. It's all the rage these days. Female crime-fighters are no longer heels-only.
This is one of my biggest problems with her. I'm pretty sick and tired of female super heroes in high heels. I could see it for the ones for whom "fashion" or "sexy" is a big part of their concept, but not all women in comic books are like that. Again, I'd honestly like to see penny wear some more practical shoes. She doesn't even fly that I've seen.

Honestly, fixing the face clutter, giving her practical boots and fixing the colour scheme is probably enough to solve most of the problems.

It doesn't change the fact that seeing Penny in tights, thigh-highs and boob support, considering she was running around in baggy pants and a baseball cap is just weird, though.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

Posted

Some changes she may need are:
Smaller techy pieces in her costume, specially in her face.
Keep it white and red, or black and red. But not black, red and white.
The white part of her current costume doesnt make sense.
Other than that, she looks good.