What can you do with a problem like a Blaster?

Not at all, where as you keep insisting that nothing be changed because playing blasters is the only challenge left for you at +4X8. You have mastered chess so you demand that Queens move like Pawns.

Originally Posted by Forbin_Project Then it's time for them to get off the cross, use the wood to build a bridge, and get over it.

* I * am not "demanding" anything. And asking for Blasters to be brought up to par with the other AT's is HARDLY "demanding" that the GAME be made easier. Nor do you have ANY clue as to my ability or lack thereof to master ANYTHING.

I will grant that, if only by virtue of the Dominators damage set being secondary instead primary. At level 50, however, both have fully fleshed out attack chains for melee, ranged, and AoE. What can the Blaster do at this level that the Dom can't?

First off, Immobilize barely counts as crowd control anymore. I can't think of any enemies off the top of my head that don't have any ranged attacks, and a surprisingly high number are primarily ranged. Immobilize is pretty much only useful for keeping enemies in a tight cluster for AoE's. Secondly, compared to Dominators, Blaster mez is a toy. Most Blasters have one to three powers with an actual mez, the vast majority of which are either single target or come with a long cooldown. Dominators can lock down a spawn entirely, often with just one or two powers. The difference is an order of magnitude. And the Dom can still keep pace with the Blaster's damage.

You keep giving bad answers. What can a Blaster do that cannot be accomplished by another AT?

I suppose if you can't come up with legitimate arguments against someone's position you might as well misstate it and hope no one notices or cares you are doing it.


Since when is a list of three things everything ?

I guess you STILL don't get it. You, who by your own words, play blasters because they are the only AT to give you a challenge at +4X8. You are not who the Devs balence the game for. As has already been said, if soloing at +4X8 is not a challenge for you than perhaps this game isn't for your because your skill level is just too high rather than most everyone elses (Apart from a small minority) skill level is too low because they cannot solo anything at +4X8.

You hated that tankers got bruising on their weakest attack, well guess what, people that play and enjoy tanks loved it. You hated the stalker changes, well, those who love stalkers loved it. You not wanting changes because they will take away what you percieve to be your last bastion of challenge in this game is going to hold less sway with the Dev's the the many Average player that the Devs balence for.

Originally Posted by Forbin_Project Then it's time for them to get off the cross, use the wood to build a bridge, and get over it.

Excluding the AOE immobilize from the primary what dominator gets more than one targeted AoE from the primary and one from the secondary ?


If you can keep your enemies at range you limit them to just the ranged attack. If they have 4 melee attacks and 1 ranged attack you have eliminated 80% of the potential methods they have to harm. If they have 1 melee attack and 1 ranged attack you have cut it down to 50%.


By the same token compared to Dominators, Controller mez is a toy.

An AR Blaster can deliver 8500+ points of damage to a spawn of 10 from range in roughly 7 seconds and still keep going.

A Fire/Fire dom is going to have fire breath and then whatever they took as their epic call it 5000-6000 points.

You mean like your statement about doms doing as much damage from range as blasters ?

Well I dont think you have to apply the changed to Corruptors or Dominators at all. Now I am not a developer but I am pretty sure they could change the damage modifier on Snipes for blasters only.. The Nukes might be a different story.. but I am sure something could be worked out..

Now I dont feel that the Blaster Secondaries are garbage.. thats a matter of opinion and they cannot build a game that meets everyones opinion.. Personally I like Energy, Electric and Mental Manipulation.. There are many people that like Ice a lot as a secondary as well.

The Developers are not going to change the secondaries across the board as they are too established and there are too many people with established toons ad build that enjoy them as they are..

And in all honesty I dont care of Corruptors or Dominators improved slightly.. I play everything as do most of the people on this board..

I suppose in your world people who get good at games are the problem.

You describe a situation where the average will be an ever decreasing value.

Either you claimed to know a way, or your tolerance for dying is extraordinarily high.

My analysis of the population numbers released by the devs is still a matter of public record, and linked in my sig.

Because your SR scrapper has trouble with non positional attacks ?

So are your statements.

I have no problem with people that get good at games, I have got very good at quite a few games. So no, my world has no problem at all with people who are good at games.

And how do I describe a situation where the average player looses value.

CoX is an MMO, MMO's make money from having more players. Players that find little challenge in a game are the minority. If the devs balenced a game around only the hard core players that have mastered it and feel everything is 'easy mode' that will drive away the new players because the game will be so inhospitable to new players. players that run out of challenge will leave because the game lacks enjoyment any more so the amount of people giving money to keep the game running goes down. the game then dies because it is now not making money.

simply put, the devs have in the past, and by all indications, will continue to balence the game around the majority of the player base, not those who can solo anything at the highest level of difficulty. To do so would be financial suicide.

Originally Posted by Forbin_Project Then it's time for them to get off the cross, use the wood to build a bridge, and get over it.

Mea culpa again. Let me rephrase a bit and I'll also note that several posters down stream have answered several of these questions.

According to the devs, mez protection is usually provided to those ATs designed to be in melee range. It was given to Tanks, Scrappers, Stalkers, Brutes, and part time to Dominators who were designed to spend at least part of their time in melee.

Look at the blaster secondary.... Mostly melee. Looks to me like the blaster was designed to spend about 1/2 their time in melee range yet they are the ONLY basic AT so designed that was passed over for mez protection. Blasters SHOULD have either half strength or half time mez protection by game design. They do not.

I have 1 blaster built specifically to solo +4/x8. It usually solos at +3/x8. It is a rad/fire/mace that is loaded to the gills with IO defense set bonuses (soft capped S/L, high energy, which also translates by the way to High Melee defense and High Ranged defense which is also important), has all the +HP accolades, level shifts from incarnate powers, and the incarnate powers themselves.

Clarion is the important one here since I allows me to keep Hot Feet toggled on. This has a 4 fold effect.

1) I do not lose the damage that Hot Feet puts out (which is considerable)
2) I do not lost the mitigation from the avoid and the slow in Hot Feet both of which are still important. If I did not have Hot Feet or I left it off I would not be able to survive +4/x8 as even soft capped defenses would not be enough to keep me alive on that setting.
3) It allows me to use my full damage output 100% of the time. I can put out Nova levels of damage in 20 seconds (and every 20 seconds) without a crash.
4) This allows me to Cascade inspirations when facing spawns that are not S/L/E focused. A small purple (or 2 when facing defense debuffers) brings my Melee and Ranged defense upto (or near enough) the soft cap against non-S/L/E foes (I'm still screwed vs stuff that favors AoE and non-S/L/E damage fortunately there are not that many mob types that fall into this category)

Prior to level 50, complete IO sets, and Incarnate Powers the best that I could reasonably do with this toon was about +1/x6. I relied almost exclusively on inspiration cascade. I had to have 1-2 purples per spawn and 1 break free per spawn to maintain the cascade. The purples lasted 60 seconds and would work across 2 spawns the break free lasted 1 spawn.

Freem players get neither IOs nor incarnates, some Preems can have IOs none of them can have Incarnate powers. A good chunk of the Freems are new players that would not have the knowledge of how the game works to even attempt +1/x6. I therefore do not consider +4/x8 any kind of standard simply because "I" have the knowledge to achieve it on a toon specially designed to do so.

You can disagree if you want but the fact is that in the I5 era MOST mob types had no mezzes for minions, lieutenants would have a ranged mez or 2 and Bosses would have short duration melee range mezzes associated with high damage powers.

The revamp to the Rikti gave "chance of mez" ranged attacks to minions, ranged mezzes to the lieutenants, and even ranged mezzes to certain Boss level mobs. Some of the rikti could use their ranged mezzes from ranges that are farther than the base range of Blaster tier 1 and 2 primary and far further than the tier 1 secondary.

I23 as an example has Knives of Vengeance. Virtually ALL of the mobs in this group have a mezzing power that can be used at range. A few of them even out range the blaster.

New Banished Pantheon have multiple ranged debuffs, multiple ranged mezzes, and many more of them out range the blaster. I have been killed several times by new BP while mezzed because they out range me and even though I can trigger my tier 1 and 2 I can't use them because I get that annoy bonk sound and the "Out of Range" message.

Again, Mea Culpa for the assumption. My long time observations contradict your statement. I mention what I have seen but did not note that when I am paying attention on my defender (because that is my role on a team with my defenders) and buffing blasters to the hilt to the best of my ability they are still the ones that die first a large majority of the time, followed by other buffing defenders, and then usually controllers. Accounting of course for builds and experience both of which I usually check for in all my PUG teammates as the team/league is forming.

Freems and Preems can't build for survival. They don't have access to the things needed to do so. I also actually like the thrill of the "glass cannon" play style and have only 1 blaster built that way.

My Main is an Energy/Energy/Force that is built for recharge. I have an "accidental" 10%ish defense from powers like combat jumping and some IO sets that granted both recharge and defense.

I play mainly as a blapper and rely on KB for a good chunk of my mitigation. I usually solo this toon on +1/x8 and die occasionally. My mitigation comes from:

1) Positional awareness.
2) The above mentioned KB and minor defense values.
3) Inspiration cascade.
4) Eye of the Magus followed by Geas of the Kind Ones, once Eye expires.
5) Force of Nature
6) Popping in and out of Personal Force Field to use Aid Self.
7) Phase shift when heavily defense debuffed.
8) Kinetic Dampener and Wedding Band temp powers when none of the above options are available.

Yep on incarnate and a good chunk of standard content the above blaster gets hit with a mez every mob unless I'm fighting enemy types that lacks them. I usually start with a tray full and combine up as many as I can as I go along. I use defiance if I get mezzed and there are only a few mobs from a particular spawn left. I still run out of break frees consistently on the longer missions.

I have other blasters that have other non-defense based focuses. None of them approach the built in abilities of any other ATs and it is mainly the amount and the durations of the incoming mez that is the culprit.

Having Clarion available changes things (hence my focus on some form of mez avoidance for blasters) and lets my blasters function at a level similar to my other toons provided I eat insps like candy on the blaster and pretty much ignore them on the other ATs. If I use the same amount of insps on my other toons as the blaster there is still a performance gap but I can live with that.

If we include PBAoE's and cones, most. Those are more dangerous, but then, Doms actually have tools that let them do close in work without being cut apart. And to be fair, there are Blaster combos that don't have more than two targeted AoE's.

And if they still have enough damage to kill you five times over? Enemies like War Wolves or Steel Strongmen may only have one ranged attack, but it hits like a truck.

No. Controller mez isn't as good as perma-dom, but it's nowhere near as overshadowed as Blasters. Blaster mez is a toy. Controller mez is the same gun, smaller caliber.

I said keep pace, not outperform. You're really bad about that putting words into someones mouth thing. Point is, the Dom will be putting out solid damage, and also has impressive control.

You still haven't actually answered my question. You call it the most flexible AT. What can it do that cannot be done by another AT? It does damage, can it do anything else?

I'd say no. Solo it isn't too bad as no one else is along to break the sleep.

I have a Sonic/Ice/Elec and the issues are the usual ones for the blaster. Alpha response and Mez.

Sonic "could" be better if the widths and ranges on the cones were a bit more synergistic.

One thing I will mention is that the "stun bug" is an advantage here. If you hit a sleeping mob with screech he comes charging at you full steam fully stunned and any melee attacks make short work of him while keeping the rest of the sleeping spawn at range.

Blasters have no close kin. They are the ONLY AT that is Damage/Damage. Any control they have is minor in comparison as are Buffs and Debuffs. Many people compare to scrappers simply because the blaster secondaries resembled at least partial ports of scrapper primaries.

All of the ATs you listed above have infringed on the blaster not the other way around. They have all been given what the blaster had all along and nothing was given to the blaster in compensation. It put ATs that had comparable performance ahead of the blaster and ATs that were all ready ahead even farther ahead. That's why the blaster underperforms all other ATs in the first place.

The devs keep adding mez to the game because they want us to be in jeopardy. Except that mez is not a real threat to any other AT in the game because they either have enough mez protection to ignore it or enough control/debuff to avoid it. ATs that are primarily buffers have no need to eat an alpha, or draw aggro, or have mez protection in their power set. None of that is true for the blaster.

Why do people insist that the blaster give up any thing? Most people don't insist that people in poverty pay anything to get a welfare check. Why do they insist that the most disadvantaged AT in the game give something up to be brought up to average performance levels?

I've long been a proponent of the blaster inherent being a simple *offensive toggle that while toggled on gives a 25% boost to damage and recovery and while toggled off gives mag 4 (or more) mez protection and 25% more regen.

Those players that insist blasters need more damage to be the kings of damage and say that they are never mezzed get what they want since they get enough damage to make them kings of damage again and if mez is not an issue for them as they claim will never have it detoggle and never notice the mez protection.

Those players that insist that mez is the issue can leave it toggled off it would also provide the right kind of benefit to switch between a team when mezzing aggro is spread around an bit more and solo when the blaster eats it all.

An easy fix that addresses all concerns on both sides of the fence without changing the blaster much at all.

*it should be coded as an offensive toggle so that if the blaster is mezzed the toggle drops and the mez protection kicks in immediately.

Fix'd.

And those who like dominators may like the new (i25 or later) blasters! Or something.

I'm not thinking about the Snipe modifier. I'm thinking about the proposed change where snipes are uninterruptable and fast against close targets. Everyone would get that. I don't think the devs would be willing to push the base damage on snipes up even higher, and I'm not sure that would help anyway unless it was enough to one-shot bosses.

They have a few good powers, seemingly distributed at random, but they don't form a coherent whole in the way scrapper, corruptor or dominator secondaries do. When the devs put in all those immobs I think they forgot that the game wouldn't be dominated by melee mobs with weak ranged attacks.

There is potential there. I think if the devs simply worked through each secondary, thinking "how can I make this as good as Corruptor secondaries without fundamentally changing the powers" it would go a long way to solving the problem (e.g. increasing some control mags or making them AoE, adding fear to some immobs, damage buff in TD, and so on). But overhauling all blaster secondaries like this would be very labour intensive.

As for the idea of giving all blasters inherent ranged defense, this would seem to match the original design intent, which failed because such a large proportion of mobs have strong ranged attacks that "range" isn't really an effective defense. However, it would further devalue all those melee attacks in secondaries, since it would make blasters (relatively speaking) gimped in melee range.

It would, if those utility powers required melee range, but most of them don't. Most of the secondary powers that require melee are damage powers, so there really wouldn't be any reason to use them (unless they where fixed to do considerably more damage than ranged powers).

I love people who instead of trying to overcome challenges whine about them instead.

Really I do. They inspire me not to be like them.

The blasters who soloed the ITF back in I12 shined so very brightly. The blasters who got the MoSTF badge without being carried through it shined like stars in the sky. The blasters who soloed giant monsters without incarnate abilities shined beyond belief.

Having someone give you a ladder so you can make a basket isn't shining.