How do you keep a copyrighted name?
By
Anti_Proton,
Posted on: 2012-05-22 21:50 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
I believe that the names of Greek Gods are public domain and cannot be considered intellectual-property/copyrighted/trademarked.
I've never had any personal experience with character or naming issues in this game though.
From what I understand, while it is somewhat of a case-by-case basis by the individual GM, sometimes a name with a completely different look and backstory may win an appeal (if generic'd). If all things match up (name, appearance, overall theme/background) to a copyrighted character, then there's no chance... but just having a common-word name without any other similarities can be allowed (however, I don't know that the biggest and most popular common-word names could be kept this way, such as Wolverine or Spider-Man). 
Best of luck!
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You can't copyright centuries old mythology.
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That's true, but only if you make your character look like the mythology, not the copyrighted version (For example, Thor in Marvel comics is blonde, whereas in the mythos Thor is generally seen as brown-haired).|
Originally Posted by Scythus
You can't copyright centuries old mythology.
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It's the same reason why using Ruby Slippers in your Wizard of Oz interpretation is NOT covered by Public domain (in the original book, they were glass and there were other differences in Alice's appearance).
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Originally Posted by Shubbie
Im very good at taking a problem and making it worse.
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Alice? |
Originally Posted by DarkSideLeague
It's the same reason why using Ruby Slippers in your Wizard of Oz interpretation is NOT covered by Public domain (in the original book, they were glass and there were other differences in Alice's appearance).
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RED-haired.
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Originally Posted by DarkSideLeague
That's true, but only if you make your character look like the mythology, not the copyrighted version (For example, Thor in Marvel comics is blonde, whereas in the mythos Thor is generally seen as brown-haired).
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You can keep a copyrighted name until you are caught by a GM or reported by a jerk (er i mean fellow player). Sorry to hear about all your nerfed names - I really do hate that - but maybe try adding some flavour to them. Instead of just "Sentinel" - maybe "Dark Sentinel" or "Red Sentinel" or "Happy Lucky Sentinel 97"
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Originally Posted by TheJazMan
I've had a number of toon names genericed. The names included Sentinel, Wildcat, Apocalypse and a number of others. I was told it was NC Soft policy this would happen. Then I just learn a guy has been running around with a 'copyrighted' name and it was OK by the powers that be? How does this make sense?!?! I am really wondering why there's such a double standard going on here. Can anyone help me out? I sent in a ticket about this and was told they cannot reveal such info.
The name the guy was allowed to retain is that of a well known Greek God. |
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There is also the case of Dresden getting to keep his Copyrighted characters, seeing as he owns the copyright and all.
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True, but Jim has had to deal with the GM's on more than one occasion to confirm that he does indeed have permission from himself to use the name in order to keep from being genericed.
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Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
There is also the case of Dresden getting to keep his Copyrighted characters, seeing as he owns the copyright and all.
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That's her middle name. She stopped going by Dorothy after she grew up and became an exotic dancer. |
Originally Posted by FloatingFatMan
Alice?
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Originally Posted by TheJazMan
I've had a number of toon names genericed. The names included Sentinel, Wildcat, Apocalypse and a number of others. I was told it was NC Soft policy this would happen. Then I just learn a guy has been running around with a 'copyrighted' name and it was OK by the powers that be? How does this make sense?!?! I am really wondering why there's such a double standard going on here. Can anyone help me out? I sent in a ticket about this and was told they cannot reveal such info.
The name the guy was allowed to retain is that of a well known Greek God. |
While this:
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Originally Posted by Scythus
You can't copyright centuries old mythology.
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In your case, the names you had genericed were in use as specific characters by a comic company. Marvel in at least 2 cases. Since those are common words, they cannot actually be copyrighted. What they are is trademarked as the names of characters with a specific appearance and backstory. A company that makes alarm systems can name their product Sentinel and be fine, because their use of the word does not infringe on Marvel's use of it as a character name. Paragon Studios can call their enhancement set Apocalypse and be fine, because they are using the word as a reference to a highly destructive event, not as a specific character name.
The centuries old mythology part is absolutely true. You can't trademark anything that falls into public domain, such as mythological characters. They were not the intellectual property of any person or organization and those names existed before the idea of trademarks did.
Marvel does not own the rights to the name Thor. They can't own them for the reason that the name existed as the name of a deity long before the idea of owning a word existed. What Marvel DOES have is a trademark on a character named Thor with a specific appearance: blond hair, bluish/black armor, red cape, winged helmet. NCSoft only blocked the name because they know that if they did not someone would immediately create a character that infringes on that trademark, even though the name itself cannot be owned.
The character you mention that is named after a well-known Greek God? Well, if no one has ever trademarked a specific version of that particular deity, then the name is fair game and cannot be genericed. Even if someone had, if your version of the character were different than the trademarked version you would be able to argue your case with the GM. Thor is only blocked because Marvel's trademarked version of him is so well known.
Hope that helps clear it up. I'm running on 2 hours of sleep, so it may not have been explained very clearly.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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Well, no, not when they are bloomin obvious direct copies. Get an imagination already.|
Originally Posted by Torment And Agony
You can keep a copyrighted name until you are caught by a GM or reported by a jerk (er i mean fellow player). Sorry to hear about all your nerfed names - I really do hate that
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| - but maybe try adding some flavour to them. Instead of just "Sentinel" - maybe "Dark Sentinel" or "Red Sentinel" or "Happy Lucky Sentinel 97" |
The developers talked about this. Your character is most likely to be genericed if:
1) They are a well known superhero.
2) Their costume and powers are also copied.
3) A well known RL person.
And less likely to get genericed if:
1) They are very obscure;
2) Not from superhero media;
3) Have completely different costume and powers.
As already pointed out, a name from mythology is not copywrited. The only reason WoW can have orcs is because it was a very obscure alternative name for an ogre before Tolkien revived it.
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WoW? Pfft. They've been using it for the entire series. Warcraft (the original)'s full name was "Warcract: Orcs and Humans." (Still have that CD around somewhere, too.) If there were a problem with it, it'd have been stomped on *way* back then, well before they became a major player. |
Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
As already pointed out, a name from mythology is not copywrited. The only reason WoW can have orcs is because it was a very obscure alternative name for an ogre before Tolkien revived it.
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Then again, the name is fairly generic - it'd be like complaining a game about armored warfare has something called "tanks."
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
The only reason WoW can have orcs is because it was a very obscure alternative name for an ogre before Tolkien revived it.
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Before Tolkien revived it?
Before?
Are you serious?
You do realize Tolkien published his books back in 1954 right? And Dungeons and Dragon was using orcs since 1974.
Blizzard Entertainment didn't exist as a company until the 1990's, and it's Warcraft series was released in 1994.
Forbin has plenty of good points about Orcs. Just going to add a bit more.
It was Tolkien that invented or created Orcs as we know them. (Also the idea of human sized elves with stories and mythology as humans have. Prior to him elves where akin to fairies.)
Later the ones responsible for the game Warhammer changed the orcs color to green, from Tolkiens more brown version (Fortunatly). Thus starting I think the green hoard. And as Forbin said Orcs have been used/modified in Dungeon & Dragons.
Thus giving us the basis for Orcs as we know them today.
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Any Dc and Marvel Trade Mark names can't not be use, Anything base on Mythology and base on Fables or Fairly Tails, can be use.
Make sure you don't use copy righted names, try to come up with Unique names for your toon like Atomic Heat, Super Rabbit or War God.
Try adding too the copy righted name might work, if you are Smart with it, like Super Fire Man, Kid Atomic Flash or Captain United America.
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I mentioned WoW because it's the most well known current use of Orcs. The ACTUAL legal battle was over the inclusion of orcs in Dungeons and Dragons, in the late 70's. They where made to remove "Hobbit" because that was an original creation, but could keep orc, because Tolkien had dug up an actual but disused name for a similar creature. But the outcome was, orcs could be used by anyone.|
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
Before Tolkien revived it?
Before? Are you serious? You do realize Tolkien published his books back in 1954 right? And Dungeons and Dragon was using orcs since 1974. Blizzard Entertainment didn't exist as a company until the 1990's, and it's Warcraft series was released in 1994. |
An example might be if you called your character [something] Goblin. So long as the costume wasn't too similar to a comic book character (or movie version), you should be fine.
But remember, it's the GMs decision, not a legal one. If the GM decides Green Orc isn't permissible, then it isn't permissible, even though it's legally fine.
I have an alt called Chiroptera Lass, who might get genericed if I played her more, but more because of the costume than the name.
I really should do something about this signature.
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truthfully with those names, I'd think you should beable to use them. But then, Im sure there would be plenty of people using those names and making exact duplicates.|
Originally Posted by TheJazMan
I've had a number of toon names genericed. The names included Sentinel, Wildcat, Apocalypse and a number of others. I was told it was NC Soft policy this would happen. Then I just learn a guy has been running around with a 'copyrighted' name and it was OK by the powers that be? How does this make sense?!?! I am really wondering why there's such a double standard going on here. Can anyone help me out? I sent in a ticket about this and was told they cannot reveal such info.
The name the guy was allowed to retain is that of a well known Greek God. |
But what was the copyrighted name of this person?
Of course, the devs go overboard on this, as I recall people getting genericed just for using the name Sakura.
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Heh strangely Games Workshop also had a legal battle with the Tolkien estate a long time ago due to the very same reason, they were using the term Hobbit, they ended up changing the name to Halfling, which I think is a generic catchall term that anybody can use.
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
I mentioned WoW because it's the most well known current use of Orcs. The ACTUAL legal battle was over the inclusion of orcs in Dungeons and Dragons, in the late 70's. They where made to remove "Hobbit" because that was an original creation, but could keep orc, because Tolkien had dug up an actual but disused name for a similar creature. But the outcome was, orcs could be used by anyone.
An example might be if you called your character [something] Goblin. So long as the costume wasn't too similar to a comic book character (or movie version), you should be fine. But remember, it's the GMs decision, not a legal one. If the GM decides Green Orc isn't permissible, then it isn't permissible, even though it's legally fine. I have an alt called Chiroptera Lass, who might get genericed if I played her more, but more because of the costume than the name. |
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Well after reading that sentence I immediately thought of 3 Sakuras that are copyrighted. One for Magic,one for Natural and one that's a mix of Natural/Magic of course the three I'm thinking off are specific but the natural one is somewhat generic as well.
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Originally Posted by BrandX
truthfully with those names, I'd think you should beable to use them. But then, Im sure there would be plenty of people using those names and making exact duplicates.
But what was the copyrighted name of this person? Of course, the devs go overboard on this, as I recall people getting genericed just for using the name Sakura. |
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Originally Posted by DMystic
Well after reading that sentence I immediately thought of 3 Sakuras that are copyrighted. One for Magic,one for Natural and one that's a mix of Natural/Magic of course the three I'm thinking off are specific but the natural one is somewhat generic as well.
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Ahh but they need the second part of the name to be copyrighted.
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<digression>Dorothy's slippers were silver in the book, but changed to ruby red for the film to show off the Technicolor process.</digression>
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Originally Posted by DarkSideLeague
That's true, but only if you make your character look like the mythology, not the copyrighted version (For example, Thor in Marvel comics is blonde, whereas in the mythos Thor is generally seen as brown-haired).
It's the same reason why using Ruby Slippers in your Wizard of Oz interpretation is NOT covered by Public domain (in the original book, they were glass and there were other differences in Alice's appearance). |
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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
That's her middle name. She stopped going by Dorothy after she grew up and became an exotic dancer.
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Okay, I'm done digressing for now.
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True, but sometimes the first name and the look is all that are needed.|
Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
Ahh but they need the second part of the name to be copyrighted.
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Or the name and background.
My question is why would you want to keep a copywritten name? The EULA isn't there just to screw you over, it's there to protect the company from the crap that Marvel tried to pull.
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I've had a number of toon names genericed. The names included Sentinel, Wildcat, Apocalypse and a number of others. I was told it was NC Soft policy this would happen. Then I just learn a guy has been running around with a 'copyrighted' name and it was OK by the powers that be? How does this make sense?!?! I am really wondering why there's such a double standard going on here. Can anyone help me out? I sent in a ticket about this and was told they cannot reveal such info.
The name the guy was allowed to retain is that of a well known Greek God.