By
Ad Astra,
Posted on: 2011-09-24 05:58 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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Originally Posted by Gangrel_EU
And even if they wanted the "initial" part of the Incarnate system that came out, they would be limited to the 2nd tier of Alpha
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Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
Can you get that to go back to 2010?
It only seems to do it for 7-feb-2011 |
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Originally Posted by TerraDraconis
Positron talking about features they currently have in an Alpha/Beta build of an expansion does not equal a promise that said feature will be there on release. Until an issue goes gold any feature can be removed, changed beyond expectation, added, or otherwise folded, spindled, or mutilated.
And if all you have is Positron at PAX as your only source then you have no support for your case. None of official marketing or advertising mentioned incarnates. |
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Originally Posted by TerraDraconis
Actually no.
It is the people who are making the extra ordinary claim that Incarnates where part of the Going Rogue expansion that must prove their case. Eveyone who has looked into it and posted their sources has not found any support for that claim. Therefore the burden of proof rests on the side making the claim that Going Rogue was advertised as having the full incarnate system included. A preview is not unlocking a system and a preview can end at anytime. That is the nature of a preview. So it is incumbent upon the people making the claim that purchasing GR also purchased Incarnates to produce the proof of that claim. |
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Originally Posted by Gangrel_EU
Errm, I thought that Going Rogue was released 17th August 2010...
Issue 19: Incarnates was released November 30th 2010.... Issue 19.5: Strike Pack was released 1st February 2011.... Edit: And if you read what i linked to earlier up on the thread (EU going Rogue site, 4th May 2010) you would notice that their overview page doesnt list Incarnates... Infact, it wasnt until July that Positron said that the Sneak Peak was going to be pulled out of Going Rogue... So what do we go on? What the website advertises or what the developers say? Now, if the pre-order site states that Going Rogue had Incarnate stuff, but it was removed from the official Going Rogue website before 4th May... dont you find it strange that there was no developer comment about it until July.... especially if it was going ot be an "Official feature" of Going Rogue... |
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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
And the pre-purchase never advertised anything about Incarnate content. Only the two power sets.
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Originally Posted by Aquila_NA
Link?
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Originally Posted by Aquila_NA
Link?
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The thing is, even if GR had been sold with "New Incarnate System!" splashed all over it, anyone who bought it still got it with the expectation that they would have to pay a subscription to play past the initial thirty days that came with it. When the Freedom system was announced, nowhere did it say that you would be able to continue playing the game exactly as you had before but not pay anything. The lines had to be drawn somewhere, and if what you want is on the VIP side of the line? Then go back to doing exactly what you were doing before, and pay the subscription.
I went through some financial troubles and couldn't pay my subs for months. I would have *loved* to have been able to log on and do... pretty much anything. In my opinion, if you aren't paying a subscription then you should be thrilled that you can do anything at all.
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Originally Posted by Giant2005
Are the game mechanics not enough to prove that claim?
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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
The link was already provided alongside the other links in post #344. The same post also included a screen shot of the old Going Rogue FAQ where it lists the differences between the pre-purchase and the complete edition. The FAQ was also available prior top the launch of GR and doesn't make any mention of Incarnates.
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Originally Posted by Gangrel_EU
Pre-Purchase link from EU Going Rogue site: 2nd April 2010
http://web.archive.org/web/201004020...b/prepurchase/ And on the "pre purchase" part of the website, it has *no* mention of Incarnates, infact it only talks about Demon Summoning and Dual Pistols ((Funnily enough it also says that Going Rogue would be released in July 2010...)) |
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Originally Posted by Aquila_NA
If one of those isn't the page where people plopped their money down, then they add nothing except more fallacious non-proof.
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Originally Posted by Aquila_NA
If one of those isn't the page where people plopped their money down, then they add nothing except more fallacious non-proof.
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I'm all for a subscription base for the Alpha Slot with the ability to form it Only from shards. In other words no access to iTrials.
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Originally Posted by Aquila_NA
If one of those isn't the page where people plopped their money down, then they add nothing except more fallacious non-proof.
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I don't want them to give incarnates to non vips I just want them to admit they lied. LOL like that will ever happen 
people on the internet actually admitting their wrong ya right.
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Originally Posted by TerraDraconis
But the page you actually paid on never ever ever made any claim about incarnates. Not ever.
At best there may have been ad copy or something from May or June that mentioned it once and then was pulled. Though I'm thinking all those references apparently go back to comments by Positron at PAX which don't constitute an accurate claim of what will be in the final release, but just what is being worked on. Anyone making a claim that they bought it from a page stating that it included incarnates is the one needing to prove it at this point. There is plenty of evidence that such a claim was not made on the actual order page. |
What I don't understand is why anyone would think you could buy Incarnates when Incarnate content isn't even done. There are still slots to unlock, more powers being added, more trials being made and more story being written. Where's the logic in getting access to that without paying, even if you bought GR, when the company *still* has to shovel money into its development?
IMO, Incarnates is like how CoX was previously; to play, you have to support its 'in progress' development. Yeah, the rest of the game is 'free' but stuff they add, you'll most likely have to buy.
The only way it'd even make sense is if you had to *buy* each individual slot and each individual power and access to each individual trial. Grow up kids! The world isn't *free*! It runs on MONEY...
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Originally Posted by Snow Globe
Look at this video, (time index 5:55).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NT9O0HM2-QM Here, I'll show it:  What does the pretty picture say? Issue 19: Incarnates. Got that? Good At 6:40, Positron said we'd get a "taste" of the Incarnate System with Going Rogue. Not the full system, but a taste. His post here ( http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?p=3024907 ) said that it was going to be removed from Issue 18 / Going Rogue. Like I said, you are trying to prove something without anything to back it up. You claim that you are calling for proof. That was given. If that isn't good enough, then you have to show any proof to the contrary. The burden of proof rests on your shoulders because you seem intent on denying the claim it wasn't included. So back up that claim. |
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Originally Posted by Lucky666
I don't want them to give incarnates to non vips I just want them to admit they lied. LOL like that will ever happen
people on the internet actually admitting their wrong ya right. |
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Originally Posted by Aura_Familia
Except with everything shown what you just stated is absolute nonsense.
They didn't lie. I think enough evidence has been given to show that. But you can keep your tin foil on tighter if you like. |
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Originally Posted by Lucky666
It's already been linked to in this very thread "keep everything you paid for" try to keep up Samual Tow linked it.
If that aint lying well then I don't know what is. ps I am staying vip doesnt affect me dozen or so times I say it I just hate lies and wish nothing but the truth. |
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Originally Posted by Aura_Familia
Except for the word NEARLY.
Not at all a lie. Not clear enough sure. I'll give you that. |
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Originally Posted by Lucky666
I don't want them to give incarnates to non vips I just want them to admit they lied. LOL like that will ever happen
people on the internet actually admitting their wrong ya right. |