Credit for all the downtime
By
Aett_Thorn,
Posted on: 2011-09-22 09:50 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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If they want to go out of business. Like I said, poor business practice.
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Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
Yes, actually, they can.
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While true, in this case, I think that it would be. If my cable goes out due to an electrical storm, does the cable provider pay me back, despite the fact that I pay for a full month of cable at a time, and I won't be getting that? No, they certainly don't. The reasonable man argument would uphold this end of the EULA.
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Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
Just to point out EULA's have only been held up in one Kangaroo court.
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Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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Still holds, however.|
Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
Just to point out EULA's have only been held up in one Kangaroo court.
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If you sign a document that says "I hereby give permission for Joey Anyman to hit my left hand with a tack hammer one (1) time without any legal, physical or financial repercussions" and sign it (the agreement), Joey can hit your hand with a hammer and if you decide to take him to court he can present the document. The judge would laugh at you.
My guides:Dark Melee/Dark Armor/Soul Mastery, Illusion Control/Kinetics/Primal Forces Mastery, Electric Armor
"Dark Armor is a complete waste as a tanking set."
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And if you got 26, you'd get just as little compensation as you're going to get now. You pay for a service and agree to put up with any downtime that's required to run it. That's all there is to it. If the studio decide to shut down the servers for a month and go on vacation, you will receive just as little compensation.|
Originally Posted by USA America
If they did this in february I'd expect 28 days and not 26.
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Paragon Studios don't owe you anything. There are no refunds and no compensations. That's always been the case. If they choose to compensate people, that's a gesture of good will, not a legal obligation. If we're not happy with it, we're always free to not pay them money.
Snarking at the studio and at random people on the forums is not going to get you compensated.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Hey, I didn't say that they should, just that they can. If they were to do that, I would imagine that they'd be out of business, you're right. However, a few hours is not comparable to a whole month, especially when they've been up at peak hours more often than not.
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Originally Posted by Clouded
If they want to go out of business. Like I said, poor business practice.
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Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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If they had to refund actual money I would think the transaction fees would be through the roof and that wouldn't help anyone who paid by time card.|
Originally Posted by Clouded
Most of those complaining are looking for good customer service. Hiding behind a EULA is a poor business practice in this case.
Don't get it twisted. I don't think any compensation outside of an extra day or two double exp is necessary (due to ALL the extra downtime, not just today). I find the request for any $ or PPs to be a poor idea. |
Paragon Points, or DXP for that matter, doesn't actually cost them any money. If they offered say 200 pts they're not really losing anything.
I think it would:
Restore good faith
Good PR
and possibly increase store sales cause I'm sure there are people who used up all their initial points who still want stuff and while 200 isn't a lot, it's an incentive to buy 400 more to reach 600 which does buy some nifty things in the store.
As always, just my 2inf on the matter
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80-100 PP sounds reasonable.
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Originally Posted by Frostbiter
Lets do some math here. 15/30 = .5. So 2 days is $1. Since 400 paragon points are $5 maybe they could give us all 80 points. Or a cup of coffee or something.
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You heard it here first, people, in compensation for the downtime, SolarSentai will give everyone 2 influence!
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Originally Posted by SolarSentai
As always, just my 2inf on the matter
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Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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Hey if there servers are down for an act of God, i would totally understand. Why because that's a ONE time thing and would not happen every couple of days for hours at a time.|
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
While true, in this case, I think that it would be. If my cable goes out due to an electrical storm, does the cable provider pay me back, despite the fact that I pay for a full month of cable at a time, and I won't be getting that? No, they certainly don't. The reasonable man argument would uphold this end of the EULA.
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And I totally understand downtime in COH, but not on a product that should still be beta tested.
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I'm merely trying to point out that good customer service from companies comes when they don't HAVE to provide any compensation but CHOOSE to repay customers for the excessive interrupts in service. |
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
Hey, I didn't say that they should, just that they can. If they were to do that, I would imagine that they'd be out of business, you're right. However, a few hours is not comparable to a whole month, especially when they've been up at peak hours more often than not.
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Again, I'm not advocating monetary compensation. Something like an extra day or two of double experience would be sufficient in my eyes.
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I personally wouldnt cos then it would mess with my finances for a few weeks...
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Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
I'd like my account credited the lost time, so that if my subscription were to end on the 13th it would now end on the 14th. Other MMO's do it.
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Exactly.|
Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
I'd like my account credited the lost time, so that if my subscription were to end on the 13th it would now end on the 14th. Other MMO's do it.
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This isn't like opening pandoras box.
Re: "Hiding behind a EULA"
It's not poor business practice, it's standard business practice. And not having a EULA is just plain stupid business practice.
We've had some downtime. Ok. It's been a matter of hours. How do you decide who gets what? For some people with limited time that may have been the only times they could have played and that really sucks, sure. For others it's during work, or a trip out of town, so they really haven't lost anything anyway. Then how do you decide who gets what and why is it fair to compensate someone that didn't miss out on anything? The answer? People just have to realize that excrement happens in life.
The devs have always been pretty upfront about stuff like this and when things go longer they at least apologize for the inconvenience and many times will do something ingame. It's not money, but its something. And something is better than nothing. And they don't really have to do anything.
@Mental Maden @Maden Mental
"....you are now tackle free for life."-ShoNuff
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This is pretty reasonable, I think. Not that I expect it by any stretch, and I obviously won't be disappointed if they don't. But it would be a nice gesture.
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Originally Posted by SolarSentai
If they had to refund actual money I would think the transaction fees would be through the roof and that wouldn't help anyone who paid by time card.
Paragon Points, or DXP for that matter, doesn't actually cost them any money. If they offered say 200 pts they're not really losing anything. I think it would: Restore good faith Good PR and possibly increase store sales cause I'm sure there are people who used up all their initial points who still want stuff and while 200 isn't a lot, it's an incentive to buy 400 more to reach 600 which does buy some nifty things in the store. As always, just my 2inf on the matter |
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Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
While true, in this case, I think that it would be. If my cable goes out due to an electrical storm, does the cable provider pay me back, despite the fact that I pay for a full month of cable at a time, and I won't be getting that? No, they certainly don't. The reasonable man argument would uphold this end of the EULA.
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WoW gives players back subscription time, should the game become unplayable for less time than Paragon has been down inthe last two weeks.
You're forgeting this isn't a random hurricane knocking over a powerline, this is schedulded, planend maintance or the results of poorly executed previous maintance.
It's also to prepare to for future customers, refunding the players the lost time, what does it cost them? It means instead of some one paying them on the 20th they pay on the 21st or the 22nd.
To use your IP example, this is them cutting service to you several times over a two week period, so that they can offer service to a new housing estate. If that happened, I'm pretty sure they would give you the extra time before your next bill.
Telling the players to go **** themselves and hiding behind the EULA? What will that cost them? Well players and word of mouth back lash for one.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
100 PP sounds nice.
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Saying "Look, the EULA says we can shut down the servers whenever we want." Is a poor business practice. |
Originally Posted by MentalMaden
It's not poor business practice, it's standard business practice. And not having a EULA is just plain stupid business practice.
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No one is suggesting they should not have a EULA. Just don't use it has a way to not provide better than average customer service.
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Originally Posted by MentalMaden
We've had some downtime. Ok. It's been a matter of hours.
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Originally Posted by MentalMaden
How do you decide who gets what?
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Originally Posted by Clouded
Everyone gets compensated. Offer an additional double experience weekend. |
Offer a double exp weekend when they are selling you exp boosters?
Some how I don't think that will happen.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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I don't believe they have actually done this. Or at least I didn't get the email.
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Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
*SNIP*
Telling the players to go **** themselves and hiding behind the EULA? What will that cost them? Well players and word of mouth back lash for one. |
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I don't care what Australian courts do.
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Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
Just to point out EULA's have only been held up in one Kangaroo court.
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If the game spit out 20 dollar bills people would complain that they weren't sequentially numbered. If they were sequentially numbered people would complain that they weren't random enough.
Black Pebble is my new hero.
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Originally Posted by Frostbiter
I don't believe they have actually done this. Or at least I didn't get the email.
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No they haven't because despite the way they act some times, Paragon aren't staffed entirely by dimwits (other than marketing it seems), however it is what posters have been suggesting Paragon are perfectly within their rights to do so, nay should do so according to some of the shining wits in this thread.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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And while that's great for WoW, I think they've also got a lot more players and a lot more income that allows them to do things like this.|
Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
WoW gives players back subscription time, should the game become unplayable for less time than Paragon has been down inthe last two weeks.
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| You're forgeting this isn't a random hurricane knocking over a powerline, this is schedulded, planend maintance or the results of poorly executed previous maintance. |
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It's also to prepare to for future customers, refunding the players the lost time, what does it cost them? It means instead of some one paying them on the 20th they pay on the 21st or the 22nd. To use your IP example, this is them cutting service to you several times over a two week period, so that they can offer service to a new housing estate. If that happened, I'm pretty sure they would give you the extra time before your next bill. |
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| Telling the players to go **** themselves and hiding behind the EULA? What will that cost them? Well players and word of mouth back lash for one. |
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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What I would like them to do and what they have to do are two completely separate things.|
Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
No they haven't because despite the way they act some times, Paragon aren't staffed entirely by dimwits (other than marketing it seems), however it is what posters have been suggesting Paragon are perfectly within their rights to do so, nay should do so according to some of the shining wits in this thread.
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They are not obligated to pay us anything or to give us anything in-game. They're just not. Would it be a good business move? SURE! I'm not arguing with you there. I'm only saying that they are under no obligation to do so, and it doesn't make them a bad business to not give us anything because something broke while they tried to make the game better for everyone.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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Why compensate someone for something that didn't happen to them? I get we all want to play, but really. This isn't that big of a deal in the scheme of things and only equal to a dollar or so at most. |
Originally Posted by Clouded
Everyone gets compensated. Offer an additional double experience weekend. |
What do you think a EULA is for then? It's things exactly like this, so someone can't get a bee in their bonnet over a few hours of downtime and decide they are going to call Corey B. Trotz Esq. to get their dollar back. And I don't recall them saying "We're shutting them down because we can." It's my understanding they are shutting them down so that the game will actually, you know, work. Not a whim.
@Mental Maden @Maden Mental
"....you are now tackle free for life."-ShoNuff
Just to point out EULA's have only been held up in one Kangaroo court.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.