Less than impressed...


Aliana Blue

 

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Originally Posted by Ogi View Post
Pretty much every one of my 50s is less fun then my 20s in random groups. Level 20 content locks out Incarnate powers so it is not reduced to Judgement+Destiny+Lore = lol.
That is a relatively recent development. I agree that incarnate powers are a problem, but the same could be said of level 40 as of level 20 - 40 is just better.


 

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Originally Posted by Venture View Post
That dog won't hunt. Events have been added to the game that won't conform to that paradigm.
What Venture said. My first character was level 20 in 2004. Last night she was holding back against the Lost.


The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.

 

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Originally Posted by Lothic View Post
Again if you feel "upset" anytime the game forces you to EX down then I'd just suggest you avoid that content. There is no law that says everything in this game must be accessible to level 50s as a level 50.
I do. I played the sig arcs on a 22 hero and a 24 villain (so as not to lose anything). I will likely not play them on any higher characters. It is still feedback to point out that by requiring such drastic exemplaring, the content they are producing is of limited value to me, a paying customer.


 

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Originally Posted by Lothic View Post
This. I find it more fun to figure out how to make my characters effective at any level than to worry about only having "fun" at level 50. But like I said before to each their own.
Doesn't work for every set. Level 30 maybe, but many sets just don't get key powers until the 20s.

That said, I have broken 8 minutes on this arc already. If the devs see fit to leave the rewards as they are, I'll probably get it under 6 tonight!


The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.

 

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Originally Posted by Lazarillo View Post
When you exemp, your enhancement values are reduced to compensate for the fact that you have more slots in the powers you're using (hypothetically, at least...some builds that may not be the case), and that you have access to more powerful enhancers as well. This can be pretty crippling if, for example, you slotted accuracy to be "sufficient" at your current, high level, you'll find yourself missing a whole lot more often. If you used and were relying Invention sets at a high level to cover certain bases, you may lose those as well. And that's not just when "building for 50". Personally speaking, I tend to start slotting IOs in the late 20s, but exemping down to the level of this month's arc would rob me of any bonuses as well.
While true that you would lose any set bonuses if your running sets, compared to pure DOs or SOs, even when exemplaring lowering the values down to compensate, you would still have higher enhancements values then you would have on just SOs and DOs. This is due to the dual- tri- and quad- aspect enhancements either taking less of a hit, or no hit at all when exemplared down. Plus you can enhance more aspects then you could on pure SOs/DOs.

For example 3 damage, 1 acc, 1 end, 1 rech is a pretty basic 6 slot damage power on +0 SOs. Which gives you about 94.93% damage, 33.3% acc/end/rech. Now, replace those same six slots with a full thunderstrike set, and your looking at 101.47% damage, and 68.9% acc/end/rech.. Thats what i'm really meaning about having higher enhancement values at lower levels, even when considering exemplaring.


 

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Originally Posted by EvilGeko View Post
Doesn't work for every set. Level 30 maybe, but many sets just don't get key powers until the 20s.

That said, I have broken 8 minutes on this arc already. If the devs see fit to leave the rewards as they are, I'll probably get it under 6 tonight!
I never claimed that any of my characters are unstoppable gods at any level. Obviously depending on level and powerset some are better than others. But I will strongly argue that I can probably make just about any character "effective" at any level.

I suppose we'll just leave it up to a differing opinion as to what the word "effective" means in this context.


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Originally Posted by rsclark View Post
I do. I played the sig arcs on a 22 hero and a 24 villain (so as not to lose anything). I will likely not play them on any higher characters. It is still feedback to point out that by requiring such drastic exemplaring, the content they are producing is of limited value to me, a paying customer.
There's no rule that says that every bit of content has to make every "paying" customer happy. Like most things I imagine for every person that doesn't like this there's probably at least another who either does like it or at least doesn't have a strong opinion about it either way.


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My goal with any new character is to have a highly survivable build @ Lvl 20 so that they can begin to solo any and all of the Tip and Alignment missions as soon as they are eligible. With this concept applied, my characters generally have few problems exempting downwards for any other type of mission. As a result, I found the Signature missions to be not much more of a challenge than normal 20ish Tip missions w/Bosses.

Optimizing only for lvl 50 play just seems so short-sighted and limiting with all the cool lower level stuff to do.


 

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Originally Posted by Lothic View Post
There's no rule that says that every bit of content has to make every "paying" customer happy. Like most things I imagine for every person that doesn't like this there's probably at least another who either does like it or at least doesn't have a stong opinion about it either way.
Happily, both types can leave legitimate feedback.

I didn't like the level 20 thing either. The arc was OK, but very short. Certainly nothing I'd recommend anyone spend actual money on. Villain side was better. The maps were fine. Vigilantes and Rogues get much poorer rewards.

It wasn't "eh", but it wasn't much more than "good".


 

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Originally Posted by Lothic View Post
There's no rule that says that every bit of content has to make every "paying" customer happy.
And there is no rule that says people who don't like something have to shut up either. If it's a voting thing, then we all get to have the same vote. Something that benefits more players is better. Remember, we are talking about something that will cost people real money in the future.


 

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Originally Posted by Dromio View Post
Happily, both types can leave legitimate feedback.

I didn't like the level 20 thing either. The arc was OK, but very short. Certainly nothing I'd recommend anyone spend actual money on. Villain side was better. The maps were fine. Vigilantes and Rogues get much poorer rewards.

It wasn't "eh", but it wasn't much more than "good".
I'm not actually going to judge the arc until I see the rest of it. It might turn out that the other 6 parts of this arc are equally less-than-stellar. But it's always possible that this thing, as a whole, might be pretty cool.

Happily I just leave my "feedback" on it to a time when it's more appropriate.


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Originally Posted by Fritzy View Post
Optimizing only for lvl 50 play just seems so short-sighted and limiting with all the cool lower level stuff to do.
Having a scaling feature and not designing content to make use of it seems short-sighted given all the cool things high level characters can do.


 

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Originally Posted by rsclark View Post
And there is no rule that says people who don't like something have to shut up either. If it's a voting thing, then we all get to have the same vote. Something that benefits more players is better. Remember, we are talking about something that will cost people real money in the future.
I never told anyone to "shut up" about this. Vote about it all you want.

I'm just perhaps more willing to judge this thing when we know more information about it. *shrugs*


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Since there are 7 arcs total I was thinking each one would be 5 levels higher. Next arc would be 25 then 30 etc. up to 50. But then again maybe they will keep them lower then that to maximize the amount of characters that can play them.


 

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Fantastic maps, great writing, but the mobs were just phoned in. Why not a new group of pumicite that go up to level 50? Why not a new group of lost that go up to 50? (Beam rifle lost anyone?)

Seems to let the rest of the arc down.


Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by rsclark View Post
Having a scaling feature and not designing content to make use of it seems short-sighted given all the cool things high level characters can do.
And I'll just say again that I ultimately see no reason why ALL game content must be geared towards level 50s.


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Posted

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Originally Posted by Lothic View Post
And I'll just say again that I ultimately see no reason why ALL game content must be geared towards level 50s.

If they introduced new groups of lost and pumicite, it'd not just be for level 50's but level 20-50...


Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Lothic View Post
And I'll just say again that I ultimately see no reason why ALL game content must be geared towards level 50s.
I just mentioned this in the other topic, but it seems to be a hot subject here, too. When you're dealing with premium content, that should indeed be geared towards 50s. AND towards 20s. AND 35s. AND 10s. The arc is fine for what it is, but if it's going to be something the devs think is worth attaching an extra monetary value for, or worth telling me that it's a super special added bonus to our subscriptions, it's something that a much wider variety of characters should be able to do "comfortably".


 

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Originally Posted by Lothic View Post
And I'll just say again that I ultimately see no reason why ALL game content must be geared towards level 50s.
because the first 6 years of this game was bought on low lvls?..hows that?...im sick of being a low lvl.i dont ever wanna be a low lvl again.

good enough?...as much as you dont care to be 50..i dont care to be under 50.


 

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Originally Posted by rsclark View Post
No, but I also didn't gain those last 30 levels in order to not be allowed to use them. I have never had a character that was more fun at 20 than at 50, so any time I'm reduced, the game is intrinsically less fun.

Well I've had several but those got deleted. Exemping is part of the game system and works very well. By your logic we should skip the first 49 levels and go straight in to 50.



"You got to dig it to dig it, you dig?"
Thelonious Monk

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Lazarillo View Post
I just mentioned this in the other topic, but it seems to be a hot subject here, too. When you're dealing with premium content, that should indeed be geared towards 50s. AND towards 20s. AND 35s. AND 10s. The arc is fine for what it is, but if it's going to be something the devs think is worth attaching an extra monetary value for, or worth telling me that it's a super special added bonus to our subscriptions, it's something that a much wider variety of characters should be able to do "comfortably".
In a few months when we have all 7 parts of this arc to look at and judge then I'll be more willing to -actually- agree or disagree with you about this.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Severe View Post
because the first 6 years of this game was bought on low lvls?..hows that?...im sick of being a low lvl.i dont ever wanna be a low lvl again.

good enough?...as much as you dont care to be 50..i dont care to be under 50.
All you have to do is avoid all that "evil" low level content then. Your problem is solved...


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lothic View Post
And I'll just say again that I ultimately see no reason why ALL game content must be geared towards level 50s.
And I said nothing about gearing everything to level 50s. I said that the tech exists to make the same content usable by characters of all levels, so they should make use of it.


 

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As a Dark/Dark Scrapper, being at level 20 sets my available powers to 25, one short of Soul Drain.

Soul Drain helps me combat -To Hit by getting in an accuracy boost first. The damage also helps against negative energy resistant enemies.

The Signature Story Arc is full of CoT Ghosts that do -To Hit and have Negative energy resistance.

I now have to try and make sure I have plenty of yellows on hand to combat this.

I may not have more yellows drop than I use.

Net result: The arc isn't fun on that character, compared to my Fire/Fire Brute, who does have Build Up and can fire that off to deal with the -to hit. Which means I won't run it on that one.


 

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Originally Posted by rsclark View Post
And I said nothing about gearing everything to level 50s. I said that the tech exists to make the same content usable by characters of all levels, so they should make use of it.
And I'll again ask the basic question: Even if the "tech" as you say exists why -must- it be used in this case or any case? Why is it actually "wrong" to have some new content in this game that is not doable as a level 50?


Loth 50 Fire/Rad Controller [1392 Badges] [300 non-AE Souvenirs]
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