Freedom? Hardly

Note that using the same credit card on three accounts would trigger the anti-fraud measures, far as I know. You might only get to two this time, but it might end up limiting you in the future. I think that the PayPal solution is better when it comes to not angering the NCsoft Store god.


Back to the original subject, but firstly let me apologise for nodding off around page 5 of the topic. Secondly I apologise for potentially repeating anything said on this thread or said by me in the past, and thirdly I apologise for apologising too much.

I feel that Freedom has a completely valid free to play model, and one people would enjoy playing. I played a little free here on the beta, but also considering my experience when I started (issue 4) and recently playing a trial on Live, it looks to me like free players could play this game for a long time without coming against any serious limitation. That's unlike other free games I played, namely DDO and EQ2X, where I felt that free was limiting (DDO due to lack of content, EQ2X mainly due to limited bag space).

I think that $5 is low enough to be an impulse buy, so anyone who feels that tier 2 offers considerably better options will go for that. I didn't feel like it was a problem paying $10 to SOE to get the extras that their Premium equivalent gave in EQ2X, once I decided that I was having enough fun and that this one time unlock would take away some hassles. You get less for your $5 here, but it's easier to spend $5 than $10, and you get 400PP for the store, whereas in EQ2X you only pay for the upgrade.

I also agree that many returning players (those with IO's but not tier 7) will be disappointed. The only reason I won't be too disappointed is that I've learned enough to know what to expect, have come to terms with it, and have decided the solution would be to play new characters. But most returning players will want to play their old characters (that's what initially got me excited about Freedom), and they'll be gimped. The players will have to digest that, learn about their options, and decide if it's worth the time or money required to make their old characters usable. Had Freedom forced returning players to create new characters (like EQ2X did) there would have been no such problem. But being able to go back to old characters only to find that an important aspect of them has been lost would be disappointing.

Still I think that Freedom will be good for the game and will attract new players as well as returning ones. It already has, with me and others getting back into the game for the beta. I never thought I'd pay for CoH again (unless it survived until the point my kids were old enough to be introduced to it), but NCsoft already got some money from me because of Freedom even before it launched. I also think that some players will become VIP's in the long run, and some will become occasional VIP's. I don't think that will happen immediately, though. What I find more probable is that many new players will pay $5 to become Premium.

So long as what Paragon Studios is trying to do is different than what your analysis assumes it is trying to do, your analysis will not be applicable to City of Heroes Freedom. The important thing is not the terms, and I will prove it by eliminating the terms:

City of Heroes is not attempting to convert their business model into a model based on the priority of attempting to get as many players as possible playing the game with the lowest barrier to entry as possible, and then target them with ala carte sales of opportunity. Anyone who thinks this is Paragon Studios goal, or makes the automatic assumption that this is their intent, is simply wrong. All other deductions based on that incorrect assumption will be flawed. City of Heroes is continuing to make a game in which the primary goal is to make a game which has sufficient value proposition to encourage players to pay a regular amount to access most or all of that core gameplay. To increase the amount of players that make the decision to purchase such gameplay, City of Heroes is adding to its existing core regular payment model an additional restricted access path whereby prospective players can play certain limited parts of the game without charge, and can additionally add elements of gameplay for an ala carte fee if they choose. The requirements of these additional avenues are overridden by the requirements of maintaining the maximum value proposition to customers that have chosen to pay regularly for the entire package of core gameplay.

"F2P" and "Hybrid" are just terms, and we can expect human beings with brains to realize that a full and complete explanation for how the business model works would take more space than is normally available to describe it, and that those terms are industry buzz words intended to hint at, but not define the games they are applied to. And to the extent that some people fail to recognize that, that is the price of doing business on a planet of morons.


No, you don't say PS *should* forget their loyal playerbase but you claim they *do*:

Its obvious the primary target for the new model is the VIP subscribers, with the free and premium ala carte options as additions to that core group. You claim, here, to be unaware of that fact. Instead, you first assume something that isn't true:

And then analyze the failures of the model to satisfy that demographic. Now that you know this assumption is in fact false, I hope you revise your analysis accordingly.

It seems pretty up front about telling them "No Incarnate enhancements, and you're limited in how many characters you can unlock up front."

"Much weaker?" How many former players are that hopped up on Incarnate content so far? Have they really been around long enough to treat them as being as critical as you imply?

It seems pretty universally agreed most of the game is based around fully slotted SO's.

The checklist is on the issue overview. It's pretty easy to find and they seem pretty forthcoming with the limitations.

J/ Wilde

What are we baiting them with, and what are we switching it for? This accusation is getting old: we are "baiting" previous subscribers with an offer to return to the game without paying anything at all, and get limited access to the game. And what we switch it with is limited access to the game. You show me where Paragon or NCSoft ANYWHERE so much as HINTS that previous subscribers can return to the game and get their original gameplay experience back unchanged for no cost and I will personally ask Paragon Studios to apologize for that error.

Considdering the average player of a F2P game is 4 days as per IGM and other sources, 30 days....well, thats sort of like me trying to use a movie channel and waiting 45 seconds for it to download. Bye bye channel.

I work in an industry where is a webpage is not up in 15 seconds the back button is hit.

Just say'n

I'm guessing you realize this, but that outlook is extraordinarily rare in CoH in particular, if not other MMOs, especially among long-term subscribers. I don't know anyone who has a lot of long-standing characters, a large SG base, etc, who wouldn't be extremely pissed if the game reset on them.

The ability to accumulate achievements (inf, IOs, levels, SG bases, badges, costumes, etc.) is, in many ways, the point of a persistent world. If there are no achievements to attain (and retain) then there is little value in persistence. Asteroids is not a persistent game, outside perhaps of the short list of High Scores. CoH is persistent, and the expectation of the vast majority of players is that their achievements (in whatever form) will be retained.

Ummm no they won't

Unless I completely misunderstand the process we JUST TESTED when you resub everything is just as when you unsubed.

You would be guessing correctly. My friends often have little meltdowns when I suggest such ideas.

My point, if there was one, is simply that playing the game is what I am here for, not work and not the accumulation of stuff. The fun for me is in the playing and not the 'having'.

Really, this is already a game that encourages making many new characters, which, IMO, is a lot like putting in another quarter anyway.

What? Why are you making this assumption? That's not how it's ever worked here, and there's no indication that they're changing it with CoH:F.

The only thing that ever got eaten if you unsubbed for an extended period was stuff left on the market. I'm not even sure that's still the case, but even if it is, that's the only thing that unsubscribing risks you losing.

Why in the world would you make such an assumption? We've been told over and over that if you go to Premium you don't lose anything, it just may not be accessible to you while you are Premium. We've also been told that everything you have will still be there for you to access if you should return to VIP.

It's really not that hard of a concept to grasp.

They (IOs and restricted ATs) are grayed out, waiting for you to buy the appropriate licenses or to subscribe again. In fact, that's probably the most powerful thing about them, you can look at your gray IOs as they taunt you (especially the Taunt IOs). "I'm still here! Waiting for you to spend a little more money!"

(Similarly, you won't be able to unlock character slots occupied by restricted ATs. But you'll see them there. Waiting.)

Some things will always be available regardless of whether you're Premium or VIP, like costume pieces.

Er... when has the game ever been like that? What does "stripped... ripped and broken" even mean? Especially when you are talking about re-subbing to VIP when your surgery stint is over?

It sucks that you need surgery.

If I had Mod Powers and this were my personal message board, I'd sticky this statement in its original size with a link to Arcanaville's post at the top of every forum. Since it's not my personal message board and I don't have Mod Powers, I'll have to settle for a link in my signature :P

I'm assuming that this is sarcasm, right?

This is incorrect.

If you are a free player in that game, you get access to all the zones - but you only get QUEST ACCESS to the three starter zones - the equivalent of Galaxy, Atlas and Imperial City. In order to progress past level 20 or so, you have to either start going zone-to-zone and just grinding mobs, or you have to buy zone quest packs.

That is a LOT more restrictive than being able to roll all the way to 50 with full access to all contacts who aren't incarnate or Praetorian.

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Yeah, I've been kinda boggled watching everyone respond to Silver Gale's sarcasm like she's serious.

Well, if you don't put a or a at the end of every post, it's hard to tell if it's sarcasm or srs bsns.

Of course, if you do put a or a at the end of every post, it becomes difficult for some people to take you seriously.

And of course, if you are reading one of my posts you can be certain that it contains a healthy dose of sarcasm. Whether you understand the sarcasm or not.

No but Free doesn't also have to mean cheap. Even other free games have more freedom then the new CoH does.

Demonstrably untrue. Other free games have DIFFERENT freedoms than the new CoX does.

We have access to all zones except Praetoria (I believe Praetorian access is gated? Someone correct me if I'm wrong) and all contacts therein. The other free games by the company with the Giant Fan both gate zones AND quest/mission contacts behind paid gates.

That's one comparison. There are others. In some, Freedom will come out ahead - in others, the other games will.