Is COH: Freedom Putting the Cart Before the Horse?
By
8-J,
Posted on: 2011-08-04 24:56 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
I'm all for giving them more Freedom (without giving them the option to send me a tell, I want VIPs and Premiums to be able to do such without resorting to an option that only allows my friends/SG mates to send me commentary), just give the players that do Pay the ability to continue playing unhindered. I'm sorry, my experience in this very game before said limitations were put in was half my time was spent reporting RMT abuse. I even unsubbed for a short period and left because of it and I will do so again if I have no control over it.
Oh, and this won't be the death knell of RMTers. I can see the advertisements for character accounts with Vet Points or Premium adds now. Yes, this means they paid a little, but they will use a free account to solicit.
If premiums can send tells, and you can become a premium by buying something from the market, wouldn't it be easy for the gold farmers to buy like a 25 cent item just to get access to tells?
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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No because the smallest package of Paragon Points that will be sold is $5 dollars. Which is why the devs have said it only takes a $5 dollar purchase to upgrade to a premium account.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
If premiums can send tells, and you can become a premium by buying something from the market, wouldn't it be easy for the gold farmers to buy like a 25 cent item just to get access to tells?
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Originally Posted by UberRod
I'm not understanding this attitude that all free to play players are RMTers or gold farmers, or ne'er-do-wells whose only goal is to make VIP players (the one, true kind of players!) life a living hell.
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No one believes all free players are RMTers and Gold Farmers.
But that doesn't change the simple fact that all RMTers and Gold Farmers use free accounts because it doesn't cost them anything. They have to use free accounts because it's too damn expensive to constantly pay to open accounts that just get banned.
I would like a mission that allow hero to bake cupcakes, then have a villain steal the cupcakes, and then hero take back the cupcakes and then turns rogue and refuse to sharing cupcakes and eats them by self.
Cup cakes are delicious.
^_^;
Soon�
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Every seasoned player I talk with redside says the story content is far superior to blue side. It's not even a contest. However, that is only true once you get past Mercy. |
Originally Posted by reiella
More broadly, I'd say it actually showcases the reason why pretty well. That the 'bad side' tends to be better written. Because it has to be better written.
With CoX, I'd suggest the quality is pretty comparable. The problem is, with few exceptions from the player perspective, the writing doesn't pass the higher minimum quality component for a villain story. |
I've always felt the main problem for Red side is just that the content in the opening area is such a train wreck only a few players ever make to the good parts and get hooked. Hopefully the facelift in i-21 will be a step toward fixing that.
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I take it you haven't talked to them about the VEAT content.
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Originally Posted by 8-J
Every seasoned player I talk with redside says the story content is far superior to blue side. It's not even a contest. However, that is only true once you get past Mercy.
I've always felt the main problem for Red side is just that the content in the opening area is such a train wreck only a few players ever make to the good parts and get hooked. Hopefully the facelift in i-21 will be a step toward fixing that. |
I am far more concerned about the servers handling the load. I have an older PC. I cannot afford a new one yet. ( have a plan for that ). However before issue 18 my older PC ran CoH bust fine. I was able to do Mothership raids and even the OLD Hami raid that had hundreds of people in them..
However since issue 18 this game has gotten worse and worse to play. I used to be able to play on Recommended very well. Now I have to play on the lowest setting. I had occasion mapserver and disconnect issues. Now they are FREQUENT.. Often to the point that I need to restart my entire PC. Trials are the worst.. Ive never seen it so bad..
I PRAY there is a SERIOUS server upgrade when we go to Freedom. Virtue and Freedom already have serious server load. I was hoping one thing they would do with Freedom is limit the servers people could join.
The hard things I can do--- The impossible just take a little bit longer.
If numbers are so much more important than a teammate who is fun to play with, forget about the game altogether and go play with a calculator instead. -Claws and Effect-
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Zwillinger was previously with EA.|
Originally Posted by Kyriani
Lemme guess... the game you're speaking of was Aion?
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Currently EA fields two MMO developers.
Only one of those developers put out a new MMO while Zwill was at EA.
Shouldn't be too hard to figure out which MMO Zwill is talking about.
here's a hint.
It involved a lot of Battle, and really big Hammers.
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I can't hear you over your avatar. WTH is that?
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Originally Posted by Garielle
Before I get into this, let me state something very clearly.
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The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
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This seems to treat Freedom as a trial account, but that's only partially true. F2P players might also buy costumes and other geegaws and doodads without becoming Premium or VIP players. So alienating *any* players means the difference between some money and no money. So what if they only spend ten bucks? That $10 more than NCSoft had before that player showed up.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
I'm not going to lose sleep over that. That isn't a make-or-break thing. If they allowed free players to send blind invites, I wouldn't complain too much either, but to lose at most 25% of players who would not be paying to play in any capacity for at least a significant amount of time if ever seems rather insignificant. |
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
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Interestingly that game actually suffered the REVERSE of what CoH sees. |
Originally Posted by je_saist
Zwillinger was previously with EA.
Currently EA fields two MMO developers. Only one of those developers put out a new MMO while Zwill was at EA. Shouldn't be too hard to figure out which MMO Zwill is talking about. here's a hint. It involved a lot of Battle, and really big Hammers. |
The 'evil' factions were far more popular than the 'Good' ones.
I did like that game though, nothing quite like a 100 person WAAAAGGGH! flowing across the RvR open battlefields.
Plus even non-RPers seemed to slip into Orc mannerizms.
"Oi shut it ya gitz, we iz bein' Sneaky!"
"Whut Sneaky, ya sum kinda oomie luva?!"
"I ain't no stinky oomie luva...now remembaz ta yell surpriz just before ya hitz em."
*The one Dark Elf in hearing range just gives off a sigh and a facepalm*.
Badge Earned: Wing Clipper
A real showstopper!
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Except as soon as they spend those 10 bucks they are no longer free players but are instead premium players. Remember premium players = players who have spent money.
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Originally Posted by Ironik
This seems to treat Freedom as a trial account, but that's only partially true. F2P players might also buy costumes and other geegaws and doodads without becoming Premium or VIP players. So alienating *any* players means the difference between some money and no money. So what if they only spend ten bucks? That $10 more than NCSoft had before that player showed up.
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Just a note: if they spend $10, they become Premium players. Free players are ones who have never spent any money on the game.
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Originally Posted by Ironik
This seems to treat Freedom as a trial account, but that's only partially true. F2P players might also buy costumes and other geegaws and doodads without becoming Premium or VIP players. So alienating *any* players means the difference between some money and no money. So what if they only spend ten bucks? That $10 more than NCSoft had before that player showed up.
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Whack a mole?
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Originally Posted by je_saist
Zwillinger was previously with EA.
Currently EA fields two MMO developers. Only one of those developers put out a new MMO while Zwill was at EA. Shouldn't be too hard to figure out which MMO Zwill is talking about. here's a hint. It involved a lot of Battle, and really big Hammers. |
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
Except as soon as they spend those 10 bucks they are no longer free players but are instead premium players. Remember premium players = players who have spent money.
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Originally Posted by Thunder Knight
Just a note: if they spend $10, they become Premium players. Free players are ones who have never spent any money on the game.
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Originally Posted by je_saist
Zwillinger was previously with EA.
Currently EA fields two MMO developers. Only one of those developers put out a new MMO while Zwill was at EA. Shouldn't be too hard to figure out which MMO Zwill is talking about. here's a hint. It involved a lot of Battle, and really big Hammers. |
Mallet Conflict Online?
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
It's a normal human reaction - the vast majority of people like to see the good side win, and the evil side lose - heroes are winners, and villains are losers.
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Actually the heroes are almost always cast as the underdogs- usually less of them and more obstacles in their way and more difficulties to overcome. And human reaction is to route for the one(s) with the hardest journey/ path to overcome. Ala sport team underdogs who were never expected to be able to compete but thru hard work and good luck, made it to the finals. Even those people who like the favorites find it hard to not at least route in their hearts for the underdog team.
(Actually I started to type a whole spiel about that Galaxy far far away but got too off tangent but cannot stop myself from saying something anyways as it parallels Praetoria. Vader is on the side of legal, lawful government, so hero normally right? Luke and the Rebellion are against the moral corruption in the legal, lawful government. So, Vader isnt evil or a villain but flawed as he cannot see the corruption. While Luke should be viewed as a villain, he actually is a 'folk hero.')
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<THREADJACK>Given how the Force is depicted, Vader is more of a willing avatar of the corruption. "Turning" seems to be the subjugation of your own will by your own volition, in exchange for raw power. Vader is the personification of the corruption, and the evidence that he sees it clearly is that he offers Luke the opportunity to "join me and we will bring an end to this senseless conflict and rule the galaxy together as Father and Son". His "solution" is only to replace the Emperor's brand of corruption with his own; but that's a Sith for you.</THREADJACK>|
Originally Posted by Mr_Body
So, Vader isnt evil or a villain but flawed as he cannot see the corruption. While Luke should be viewed as a villain, he actually is a 'folk hero.')
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Maybe the "problem" with the Rogue Isles is that we don't ever see outside of Recluce's twisted little social darwinist melting pot. Comparing it to Haiti or any similar small Caribbean nation, those countries are "third world" primarily because they have limited economies, limited infrastructure, and frequent natural disaster in the form of hurricanes and such.
Recluse is a super villain with the resources to build a personal empire. Maybe he doesn't care about running the country but he cares about HAVING a country to run so someone is running it. Presumably that person or group of people would be responsible for meeting some measures of performance. There has to be some caste of working stiffs to produce the Scrapyarders and the Luddites and the rest. Maybe the Isles are more like Cuba than Haiti, but in that case, where's the world outside the melting pot that provides the economy to support it?
The game is so busy depicting Recluse as this evil amoral mastermind that it doesn't bother to realistically depict how he can also be a third world despot. Where does he get his resources from? Who are his global trading partners? How does his representative at he U.N. vote on global security issues?
Then again, maybe I should just apply the Bellisario Principle and not examine it too closely. *shrug*
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Not a good attitude for the devs to embrace. One of the 'Extra Credits' videos on The Escapist site is about microtransactions. The narrator makes the point:|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
People who do not pay to play the game are not customers.
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| Somebody at EA once asked James, "How many players who are not paying me do you expect me to buy bandwidth for?" James's answer was, "As many as you can get." Here's why: In a multi-player game, players ARE content. We all know that no matter how good the mechanics of a game are, it's no fun to play if it's a ghost town. |
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
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Any amount of money? I thought there was higher limit than $10.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
Except as soon as they spend those 10 bucks they are no longer free players but are instead premium players. Remember premium players = players who have spent money.
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The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
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According to the info released about the different tiers: New free players can become Premium Players by buying any amount of Paragon Points. I think the minimum PP purchase is supposed to be $5?
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Originally Posted by Ironik
Any amount of money? I thought there was higher limit than $10.
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Arc#314490: Zombie Ninja Pirates!
Defiant @Grouchybeast
Death is part of my attack chain.
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And this is why this game is still fiction. And you shouldnt mix fiction with reality like you did a few times before.|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
There's also the problem that villains want to change the world into something bad, but heroes want to keep the world as it is - which makes the more static game world of an MMO way more suitable for heroes than villains - Paragon City is always being threatened by Villains, but it's still always there - so the default setting is that the Heroes have succeeded and the Villains have lost.
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My villain wouldnt go for something bad. More for something the same with freedom to act for her. A bit more realistic. Villainy in the real world often wins. As the thugs loose they get used by the real world villainous masterminds who tend to win always. The coropt bankers... the corupt governments... the general that takes over the power...
And the normal civies like you believe them all! So you are a gullable pawn in the big plot that makes only a selected few profit. That is the real world... a world where the big masterminds rule. And heroes wouldnt be appreciated unless they are beying used for commercial benefits.
- The Italian Job: The Godfather Returns #1151
Beginner - Encounter a renewed age for the Mook and the Family when Emile Marcone escapes from the Zig!
- Along Came a... Bug!? #528482
Average - A new race of aliens arrives on Earth. And Vanguard has you investigate them!
- The Court of the Blood Countess: The Rise of the Blood Countess #3805
Advanced - Go back in time and witness the birth of a vampire. Follow her to key moments in her life in order to stop her! A story of intrigue, drama and horror! Blood & Violence... not recommend to solo!
Apologies for cutting your post down, but:
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This is what it comes down to, really, and what needs to be understood before we can have a FUN villainous experience. In real-life, no-one wants "evil" people to win. We don't root for murderers, robbers and kidnappers, we don't want to be shot dead while shopping at the mall, we don't want to feel threatened just walking down the street. In the real world, we're concerned with comfort and survival, and not necessarily in that order.|
Originally Posted by Liz Bathory
You shouldn't mix fiction with reality.
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Video games are not the real world. I can't speak for literally everyone, but quite a few people play games both to escape from the real world and to have fun. As such, rubbing the real-world horrors of villainy in my face as I play is not going to give me an enjoyable experience. This is really what it's all about - I pay to play this game so that I can have fun, and villain-side is specifically designed so that it's NOT fun. Take my word for it - I'm not going to be very excited about subscribing to a game that seeks to torture me.
I don't care about the morality or ethics of villainy. I play a villain for the same reason I play any game - to have fun. It's the developers' job to figure out how to make a villain-centric game fun to play, and there is no excuse for their failure to do so. Not real life, not morality, not life lessons. If you can't make your game fun to play, you shouldn't make a game in the first place. If you chose to make a game about perpetrating evil acts, then you god damn better figure out how to make those evil acts fun and entertaining to a broad audience.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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This advents were put into place to give us peace from the RMTers and I do not want to give them Freedom to begin all over again. Yes, I can report them, and report them, and report them... See where I'm going. I don't want to spend half my time reporting RMTers. I'm all for giving Free players a measure, but give the VIP and Premium members a way to lock it off if it gets horrid.
And before some other things are brought up for Free Players. No, they should not be able to send me mail unless they are on my friends or SG lists. No, they should not be able to send me tells. I'm sorry, I log in to play not avoid the telemarketers (RMTers) like I do in my day to day routine. Am I being hypercritical and blanketing blame before it happens, yes. Why? Because I have left other games because of lack of contol over RMTers. Here, I finally have control and I will not surrender it.
F2P players already can't start teams have limited chat options. I can't remember if they have limited mail or tell options, but I think they do? What is the purpose for this rant? Granted you've had bad experiences, that I have never had myself, but Free to Play players are already seriously limited.
I agree with Sam that if you treat the free to play and premium players like crap, they will go away and spread tales of woe. If the game is kind, then they will invest in the game. I have a friend who will look into the game when it goes free to play. I don't want him treated like crap just because he's free to play.
Uber Talgrim - level 50 emp/dark defender
Uber Rod - level 50 dark melee/regen scrapper
Rod Valdr - level 50 invuln/SS tanker
Talgrim - level 50 ninja/dark mastermind
OMG!! Please add these costume designs now!