So Solo Friendly Incarnate Path=Team?


Amy_Amp

 

Posted

Also want to point out that the WST converting to 40 threads is a brilliant idea.

This so called solo path that isn't . . . no.

EDIT: Now EvilGeko's idea . . . THAT would be a solo path.


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Posted

*wanders in*






But seriously guys, it sounds like arguing for the same of argument. I personally enjoy both teaming and soloing, sometimes due to my job and stress with life I just want to hop in and smash some guys on my own. Sometimes I have more time and I can hop into a team or group.

I would imagine that this is probably the most common mentality for people, a fairly healthy middle ground where they do certain things based on their mood and available gaming time. (No I have no citation for this I'm just making a guess)

That said, its part of why I haven't been doing incarnate content mostly, lack of time and I can't really do it on my own. So I can understand why people want to be able to solo.

But the marketing spin on the offering a solo path by running trial content is admittedly mind boggling.

Excusing the whole solo vs teaming argument, its like someone divided by zero.


 

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Quote:
For something billed as a challenge, the trials often aren't, or at least they aren't enough of one that everybody actually has to be up to the challenge.
Not to say that the trials are very hard (they really aren't) but they're also pretty easy to screw up by not paying basic attention to what you're doing.


"Men strunt �r strunt och snus �r snus
om ock i gyllne dosor.
Och rosor i ett sprucket krus
�r st�ndigt alltid rosor."

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by EvilGeko View Post
I didn't get that sense. How it read to me was that doing a trial opens access to the Incarnate store. Similar to how finishing Penelope Yin's arc opens Yin's market.

If said store only accepts A and E merits, then when need to change Positron's name to Anti-Matter because that's absolutely EPIC trolling of the playerbase.
Obviously, we won't know until it hits test. But I'm basing my interpretation largely on the fact the voucher vendors are called "Astral Christy and Empyrean Michael." :-/

Still, what else could you use to buy them? The options are (AFAICT) Inf, Reward Merits, Alignment Merits, iShards, iTrial Merits, or actual money. And I'm ready to dismiss real life money out of hand.

Reward Merits and Inf might work (though the costs would probably be a major issue), but it seems like the whole purpose of introducing these new currencies was to avoid relying on the old ones. So I doubt it would be those. Alignment Meirts have a time gate that probably makes them attractive (though it would be a serious lolRogues move), but in that case why bother with the Voucher system? Why not just let the would be soloer convert his/her own aMerits directly?

As I said, I really don't understand what this system is trying to do. If the goal is to have an alternate means to access Incarnate material, why gate the alternate path with the exact same content? And what does any of this have to do with helping soloists? To quote Miss Piggy: "I don't understand any of this."


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I want to be clear about something. I very much want a solo path. I have several characters who I have little desire to run the trials with, but would like to make some progress in the incarnate system. But I don't want some easy-mode system that kills the trials. Because they are fun. And if the devs make the solo path too accessible then yes it will hurt the trials.
I understand your concern, but the whole Incarnate system reminds me of when you couldn't earn XP while Exemplared. It made doing lower level content feel like a waste of time (YMMV, obviously).

I'd really prefer if the devs would allow us to progress our Incarnates in some manner no matter what content we're pursuing (PvE, that is). I'm fine with very slow progress on non-iContent, but I want to progress my character in some way no matter how I play.

-D


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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arilou View Post
Not to say that the trials are very hard (they really aren't) but they're also pretty easy to screw up by not paying basic attention to what you're doing.
Pretty much. Three people not using acids in time = failed Lambda. I've seen it happen.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

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Originally Posted by TonyV View Post
It's hard to find anything meaningful to respond to among the personal attacks and the "woe is me, life sucks, everyone's miserable" attitude, especially when some people play with blinders on that block out all the coolness. I'm a happy CoH player, not a therapist.
Says the boy that can't admit, "yes, there is a lag problem in the BAF. I accept this because the devs have stated so."

Quit projecting blinders on other people, Tony. Yours are the darkest around here.

As for your lovely job description, woopty farkin doo. My branch, for which I am the sole IT employee, pushes out $2 million worth of product every month. You have a server? Wonderful. I've got a few more than that.


Be well, people of CoH.

 

Posted

It's like watching a train wreck...a big, black and red train wreck with spikes on and the Devil sat in the drivers seat with his hooves up, smoking a big fat cigar.

You've been missed, Bill


Quote:
Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Aura_Familia View Post
LOL, TonyV is not helping himself right now.
Heh, need I point out that TonyV isn't in any particular need of help? I'm the one who's , even . It seems to me that the people who are and are the ones who need to be worried about helping themselves.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba View Post
As for your lovely job description, woopty farkin doo. My branch, for which I am the sole IT employee, pushes out $2 million worth of product every month. You have a server? Wonderful. I've got a few more than that.
Oh, snap. Do you really want to compare day job responsibilities? I'm pretty sure I have you beaten. $2 million is maybe one day's production at one of our smaller plants. My team is directly responsible for the vast majority of all of that equipment. I'm not exaggerating when I say that as I sit here typing this, there are literally over 2,700 Windows, AIX, Linux, Sun, Mainframe, and AS/400 servers within 200 feet of me in production service, and that I am watching monitoring tools that watch over literally billions--that's with a b--of software, services, and production activities. I don't particularly want you to know where I work, but if we can agree on a trustworthy objective third party, I'd be thrilled to compare résumés. Personally, I think it's kind of silly, but hey, you're the one who brought it up by taking pot shots at the wiki.


We've been saving Paragon City for eight and a half years. It's time to do it one more time.
(If you love this game as much as I do, please read that post.)

 

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Originally Posted by TonyV View Post
Heh, need I point out that TonyV isn't in any particular need of help? I'm the one who's , even . It seems to me that the people who are and are the ones who need to be worried about helping themselves.
Wasn't talking about happiness but the reality of arguing against something the devs themselves have admitted and have said they are working on.

But keep on digging there buddy. You're doing great.

*munches more popcorn*


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Personally, I think it's kind of silly, but hey, you're the one who brought it up by taking pot shots at the wiki.
More accurately, the shot was at you, not "the wiki."

So are you going to admit that the devs have stated lag issues exist and that you were therefore speaking from a place of ignorance?


Be well, people of CoH.

 

Posted

In answer to the OP, there is no solo Incarnate path, it doesn't exist. Anything else is just an illusion created by marketing. Hence why I'm pretty much avoiding anything outside of the Alpha slot (and I'm not even a soloist).

I will say though, that in my own opinion, the Incarnate system is probably the worst written, thought out and implemented system that has ever been added to the game in the six years I've been playing. And I include i13 PvP in that list.

I'm glad at least some people are enjoying it.


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Posted

I don't mind group content. I genuinely prefer solo, but some parts of the game are just easier or more fun with a group. The conversion process for shards > threads > incarnate stuff is a mostly soloable option, but like others have said, not really a viable one with how long it would take, so yeah I guess I'd rather grind the iTrials with a team than grind other content 100-fold for the same end result solo.

That being said, I think the announcement was just poorly worded. I don't see if as an option for the player who prefers to play alone as much as an option to bypass content with characters you would rather not put through it. Of course, as someone pointed out earlier, even then it seems its (currently) an option to bypass the part of the incarnate path that was truly soloable, so I think maybe they should have thought that through a bit more as far as phrasing.

I'm hoping this is just a step on a path towards something akin to being able to earn incarnate slots/threads etc. with a preferred toon to allow you to just "buy" those slots for toons you'd prefer to avoid the trial-hassle with.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba View Post
So are you going to admit that the devs have stated lag issues exist and that you were therefore speaking from a place of ignorance?
We interrupt this program for important breaking events:

Your evilness, since I know that side conversation is not really engaging a lot of your attention, I thought I'd point this thread out as a public service announcement:

http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showt...hlight=latency

Turning off buff data as Leandro suggests there helped me a BUNCH with the lag of the trials. More than cranking graphics down to butt-ugly, in fact. Worth pointing out, I figure, even though the devs have been patching in some of the same functionality.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled flamewar, already in progress.


Hunter's Forty-Sixth Rule: If your head explodes, you were thinking too much, otherwise you shouldn't worry about the possibility.

 

Posted

Thank you, Bladesnow. That's some nice info. I don't experience any crashing during BAF and can generally get through that one bad spot with nothing more than a "oh goody, three minutes of boredom and ugliness" running through my head, but I did not know that this feature had been added to the game.

I will certainly give nuking the buff data a try should I find myself in a BAF again.


Be well, people of CoH.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba View Post
Thank you, Bladesnow. That's some nice info. I don't experience any crashing during BAF and can generally get through that one bad spot with nothing more than a "oh goody, three minutes of boredom and ugliness" running through my head, but I did not know that this feature had been added to the game.

I will certainly give nuking the buff data a try should I find myself in a BAF again.
Helped with the BAF. DID NOT help with Map o Lag in Lambda in anyway shape or form. The devs have stated they are trying to fix it.


Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha View Post
Pretty much. Three people not using acids in time = failed Lambda. I've seen it happen.
Yes, I will admit the collection phase of Lambda does require your full attention, as does the prisoner phase of BAF. Incidentally, those phases lend themselves to a solo/small team mentality.

Yeah, yeah, I know, the collection phase goes better if you stick together. I'm happy for your uberleague that manages to do that.


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Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World

 

Posted

The Voucher option is less "solo-friendly" and more "alt-friendly."

Although the final details await some Beta Testing, the idea of offering players the opportunity to participate in Incarnate Trials on one character in order to allow their other characters the opportunity to avoid having to run Incarnate Trials is certainly a step in the direction of addressing at least one concern among the player-base: decreasing the considerable time investment required to obtain Incarnate abilities/components on new alts.

Through the account voucher system, a player can designate one character to participate in the trials and gain the abilities that essentially make it even easier to gain more Threads/Components/Astrals/etc. This assumes that hardest part about Incarnating a character is getting over the pitfalls of not having Level-Shifts. Once that hurdle is surpassed, players can have a designated Incarnate character that can earn things easy enough to help their Alts earn Incarnate abilities without having to go through the trials.

This is not an alternative for people who seek to circumvent Incarnate teaming. While I would like Incarnate Arcs that can be done solo, I will wait patiently for those to come and enjoy the teaming options already in the pipeline.
In the meantime, I will also acknowledge this offering from the Devs for what it is (an attempt to address the alt-friendly concerns of the player-base).


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Posted

Yeah, I think somebody in marketing missed a memo or something. This isn't a "solo friendly" option at all, it's a "buy account-bound stuff for your alts" system. I'm not sure how they could get the two confused, but eh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkonne View Post
Obviously, we won't know until it hits test. But I'm basing my interpretation largely on the fact the voucher vendors are called "Astral Christy and Empyrean Michael." :-/
If I were a betting man I would bet very strongly that all the vouchers mentioned are going to be buyable using Astral and/or Empyrean Merits. After all they did kind of hint at it when they mentioned all the 'cool things' we'd be able to eventually use them for.

In fact, I would go as far as to say that there will be rage and disappointment when the exact costs and what you get for them are announced. If you'll excuse me, I have to go make some popcorn.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba View Post
More accurately, the shot was at you, not "the wiki."
More accurately, you referred to the work I do as "copy/pasting information to a website," which is not only a completely inaccurate description of my involvement in the Paragon Wiki, but also a misguided attack on the work that the awesome writers and editors that actually do maintain the Paragon Wiki.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba View Post
So are you going to admit that the devs have stated lag issues exist and that you were therefore speaking from a place of ignorance?
Okay, let's talk ignorance. What I said, and I directly quote, is this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyV View Post
When I run the BAF or Lambda Sector, I do not have these "lag-fest filled mish" problems you are referring to. Have you considered that maybe it's not a problem with the developers but with your own machine? Or (god forbid) that you might need to crank down a graphic setting or two during taxing things?
Please note that I did not say 1) that no one ever experiences lag, or that 2) the devs aren't working on optimizing things on the back end to reduce lag for those who are experiencing it. Nevertheless, then what you said was:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba View Post
Oh, BS, Tony. Everybody lags during the escapee section of the BAF. It's a known issue.
No, Spanky, not everybody lags, but this is just the kind of melodramatic alarmist hyperbole that is typical of a Bill Z post.

Do other people lag? Maybe, hard to say. I haven't been to everyone else's houses to see. What I'm damn sure of is that in my house, on my computer, with my Internet connection, I don't.

Completely aside from that, if people are lagging, it sure as hell isn't stopping them from running those trials, because every night I play, there are at least a dozen or two people standing around the Rikti War Zone looking for trial teams. It also doesn't seem to be a major problem, because while I do sometimes see someone saying, "Wow, lag..." it's not like people are saying, "This is f*****g unplayable, I quit!!!"

Also completely aside from that, it doesn't change what I was responding to, which was a misguided comment referring to "the lack of development/content," when in fact we've been getting a LOT of both. What's happened is that a small contingent of people, people who have been vocal about wanting solo-only content is latching desperately onto anything they can to try to turn really exciting stuff into "woe is me" rants. "Oh, hey! Lag! Everyone hates lag, let's complain about that!" It's kind of funny to me that the user posted the complaint about the lack of development on the day immediately before a massive test of back-end optimizations that, according to Second Measure, one of the smartest engineers he knows has been working on diligently for quite some time. You can't get more gnarly low-level into development than that, and it's pretty much the opposite of the "flashy effects" and "sence [sic] of grandeur" he was complaining about.


We've been saving Paragon City for eight and a half years. It's time to do it one more time.
(If you love this game as much as I do, please read that post.)

 

Posted

Quote:
Do other people lag? Maybe, hard to say. I haven't been to everyone else's houses to see. What I'm damn sure of is that in my house, on my computer, with my Internet connection, I don't.
You lie.

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Originally Posted by Positron View Post
Hey guys,

Thanks to your feedback we believe we have tracked down the cause of this lag (we did something weird with Leagues), we're working to get this resolved on the live servers as soon as possible.

Thank you for your patience, understanding, and most of all your feedback on this situation.
Even Positron says so.


Be well, people of CoH.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyV View Post
No, Spanky, not everybody lags, but this is just the kind of melodramatic alarmist hyperbole that is typical of a Bill Z post.

Do other people lag? Maybe, hard to say. I haven't been to everyone else's houses to see. What I'm damn sure of is that in my house, on my computer, with my Internet connection, I don't.
Ah, I see. The "It doesn't happen to me so it's not a problem" argument. How about they just don't bother fixing any technical issues that don't affect you? Of course when one comes up that does affect you, I'm sure you won't hesitate to scream for a fix.
Quote:
Completely aside from that, if people are lagging, it sure as hell isn't stopping them from running those trials, because every night I play, there are at least a dozen or two people standing around the Rikti War Zone looking for trial teams. It also doesn't seem to be a major problem, because while I do sometimes see someone saying, "Wow, lag..." it's not like people are saying, "This is f*****g unplayable, I quit!!!"
Ok, so fixing lag and crashes is unimportant because some people play despite them. Note that I said "some" people because you aren't seeing the people who do no or fewer trials because they're fed up with lag and crashing in the RWZ looking for trials, do you? So as long as there are enough people willing to put up with it that you can get a league together, it's not a problem, am I correct?

Quote:
What's happened is that a small contingent of people, people who have been vocal about wanting solo-only content is latching desperately onto anything they can to try to turn really exciting stuff into "woe is me" rants. "Oh, hey! Lag! Everyone hates lag, let's complain about that!"
Hmmm, could it be that people who lag a lot on trials mention it as one of the major reasons they don't like grinding trials? And that it's only you and the rest of the "grind moar trials cause I love grinding trials and anybody who doesn't like what I like is stupid" crowd that equates "I want an alternative to trial/large group grinds" with "I'm an antisocial shut-in who never wants to encounter another human being again?"


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba View Post
My branch, for which I am the sole IT employee, pushes out $2 million worth of product every month. You have a server? Wonderful. I've got a few more than that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyV View Post
Do you really want to compare day job responsibilities? I'm pretty sure I have you beaten. $2 million is maybe one day's production at one of our smaller plants. My team is directly responsible for the vast majority of all of that equipment. I'm not exaggerating when I say that as I sit here typing this, there are literally over 2,700 Windows, AIX, Linux, Sun, Mainframe, and AS/400 servers within 200 feet of me in production service, and that I am watching monitoring tools that watch over literally billions--that's with a b--of software, services, and production activities.
Boys and their silly size contests


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mind_Over_Matter View Post
The Voucher option is less "solo-friendly" and more "alt-friendly."
Which is all that needed to be said and this whole mess would have been avoided. If I'd read the patch notes and seen, I'd have stopped to look what this "alt-friendly" option is, discovered what it took and been mildly bemused before moving on to the other things I actually cared about. However, when I read "solo" in there, my reaction was more: "Hold the phone! Solo option? Like, for real? I gotta' see this!" Only it turned out it's like Top Cat's free soda at 10 cents a bottle.

Seriously, if Marketing can avoid saying stupid things, we can avoid arguing about them on the forums, because no matter how stupid a thing shows up in official communication, SOMEONE will make it a point to defend it till the bitter end. Yet Marketing just couldn't resist, could they? Marketing, or whoever wrote that tripe.

It's not even the change I mind, personally. Tradable merits, whatever. It's what it was called that pisses me off, because it's a lie.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
Which is all that needed to be said and this whole mess would have been avoided. If I'd read the patch notes and seen, I'd have stopped to look what this "alt-friendly" option is, discovered what it took and been mildly bemused before moving on to the other things I actually cared about. However, when I read "solo" in there, my reaction was more: "Hold the phone! Solo option? Like, for real? I gotta' see this!" Only it turned out it's like Top Cat's free soda at 10 cents a bottle.

Seriously, if Marketing can avoid saying stupid things, we can avoid arguing about them on the forums, because no matter how stupid a thing shows up in official communication, SOMEONE will make it a point to defend it till the bitter end. Yet Marketing just couldn't resist, could they? Marketing, or whoever wrote that tripe.

It's not even the change I mind, personally. Tradable merits, whatever. It's what it was called that pisses me off, because it's a lie.
Actually, it is a more solo-friendly option - the devs seem to be giving the lowest priroity to players who refuse to team, which is only natural, as not only are they a tiny minority, but the whole Incarnate system is based around team play.


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

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Originally Posted by EvilGeko View Post
What's so hard to understand. They're asking you to do the trial ONCE. Interact in a team ONCE. Then you get a pass for any other character you create.

Wow, the devs sure are mean.
AAAGGGGHHHHHH...you are right. I need to team. Don't faint y'all, but I joined in on the Victory Warwalker fun.

I yelled out LFT in Broadcast, some unsuspecting person invited me, and I had a real good time. The team leader was a sweetheart and did not mind that I put her on follow so I would not get lost

I played my Spines/Elec scrapper, and actually got to beat up on some of the AVs

If teaming were like this, I would be a teaming fiend

Lisa-Wishes I were not so shy or I would go looking for more people like me..and...pales at the thought..team.

But, this does say you need to team at least once to solo.... maybe all us solo types on Victory can meet up and do this

Lisa.


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You've got the power
winners are losers
who got up and gave it just one more try

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