City of Heroes: Live Forum Archive

Info on Issue 20.5

Ad Astra

By Ad Astra,
Posted on: 2011-05-25 13:03 in CoH and CoV General Discussions

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake View Post
im guessing a a significant amount of perspective is needed to find where rational valid concerns were voiced in a productive fashion from the current crowd that assaults any thread about new incarnate content is posted. perhaps youc an link to a post that preceds the hyperbole and name calling of the developers? because in multiple threads currently running, im seeing the opposite, and that is why the issue is polarized. i initially fought against endgame but kept an open mind and avoided over the top comparisons that do nothing but demonize people who disagree with me. What im seeing from several posters, and yes, this includes you, is not that kind of behavior. and thats why i and many others simply are going to tune you guys out, because you simply go too far. The extents to which you exaggerate make your statements rationally untenable.
No, not really. The fact you've already made up your mind that me and others clearly should be 'zoned out' just goes to prove my point. Lord knows I've tried in the past. When it gets to the point I get lumped in as a 'whinger', I don't think it's unreasonable to stop giving two damns and start being blunt.

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Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by GuyPerfect View Post
The AoE shields could be good or bad, I suppose. If the powers don't cost more Endurance to use, I'll call it good. But if one teammate happens to be standing 31 feet away and you have to expend another 20 Endurance to protect them, I see it getting ugly fast. It's been noted already that Masterminds have gone through this with their Henchman upgrades (and Henchmen are WAY easier to group up than teammates), so let's learn from history rather than repeat it. (-:
Redname confirmed to have no increase in end cost.

 

Posted

Wow! Excellent amount of updates for a half-issue! I'm always a fan of new costume pieces, so I can't wait to try these new ones out. The pics I saw look really neat.

I'm also very happy to hear about the new Incarnate Trial. I like the current ones well enough, but they are sure difficult to want to play over and over and over again.

The new pet options are a welcome update. I play a mystic-type so summoning "soldiers" or "robots" really seemed a little bit of a far fetch - even if you take the off-kilter will of the Well of Furies into consideration.

Definitely liked hearing about the ability to send threads/shards to alts. Some just "earn" the stuff better/faster, so it'll make the process of ramping my alts up just that much less painful.

Thanks, Devs - awesome job!

 

Posted

again you miss the point, the whiners are so derided because thats all they ever did, scream and yell childish insults, which is a bit better description of it than being "blunt", had they EVER been convincing or level headed, they wouldn't have caused zone-outs.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake View Post
again you miss the point, the whiners are so derided because thats all they ever did, scream and yell childish insults, which is a bit better description of it than being "blunt", had they EVER been convincing or level headed, they wouldn't have caused zone-outs.
You clearly haven't read the threads with people trying to point out the various reasons they have refused SB in the past and requested for options to allow that to continue, and other posters not just implying but explicitly saying "Tough, deal with it!"

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Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha View Post
You clearly haven't read the threads with people trying to point out the various reasons they have refused SB in the past and requested for options to allow that to continue, and other posters not just implying but explicitly saying "Tough, deal with it!"
i have seen them, long ago i even popped in to disagree with that mindset. you dont stop jerks by becoming one.

 

Posted

Having read all the newly available info on i20.5 (which I still think deserves to be called i21), I am most highly pleased. WHEEEEE!!!!!

New Lore Pets: I'm happy that we're getting more than the original 4 choices, but I'm ecstatic that we're getting Storm Elementals! W00t! I'd been asking for these ever since we got the info on Lore pets, and now they're coming to us! Huge WTG, Devs!

Buffs becoming AoE: I had actually learned to live with the fast response of setting buffs on teammates, but making some of these AoE will definitely make life easier. Making them AoE without increasing the end cost is a very nice surprise, however. Thanks for that.

New auras: Once again, this is absolutely wonderful. I've been playing a color spectrum themed character for some time, and I've had to use one of the Bonus Sprints to get an acceptably rainbowish movement trail. Not a huge drain on endurance, but it can be an issue at times. Now I can actually use a real rainbow aura! Hooray!

New costume pieces: I'm actually okay with the Ascension Armor pieces being 50-only. I had assumed they were going to be Alpha-unlocked characters only, from the name. I still don't have a huge problem with having special benefits for lvl 50 characters (although account-wide is most definitely better), but I know some players feel very strongly in the opposite direction. Overall, I'm always happy to get new costume and appearance pieces.

Vouchers for auras, capes, threads, shards: Excellent idea! This will definitely improve the strain on those of us with multiple 50s. I had actually just picked one hero and one villain of mine to focus on taking down the Incarnate path, just because my mind can't take grinding any more characters than that. This is a great QoL upgrade.

Cutscene Skipping: Bless you, bless you, bless you. We know the Big Dog's here, we know MM has gone under the knife. Thanks for sparing us.

New Emotes: Hmmm, no details on these. Interesting. New emotes are almost always good, though. Expect this will be nice.

Okay, overall feeling for this update is EXTREMELY POSITIVE!!!. To all the CoX team, thanks for listening to the sometimes torrential feedback and suggestions from all of us. We really do appreciate it. (And thanks again for the Storm Elementals! Yay!)

K

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Kurrent View Post
We know the Big Dog's here, we know MM has gone under the knife. Thanks for sparing us.
Sorry, you'll still have to put up with Marauder's yap. Just not Mother Mame- I mean, Mayhem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha View Post
No, that comes from having valid concerns and many attempts to voice resulting only in other people telling us to 'STFU and GTFO' and stop being 'whiners'.

Heck, do YOU take put downs kindly? I sure don't enjoy it, thanks.
maybe stop taking what people on a video game forum say whom you've never met so personally and just state your buisness/ideas whatever and move on. No need to respond to everyone just cause they either agree or disagree it's only the devs whom need convincing not fellow posters.

tldr: grow some thicker skin your life will be alot less stressful overall.

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by GuyPerfect View Post
Interstitial cutscenes are not skipped, such as the only cutscene in Lambda Sector... So basically the announcement makes an entire point marketing the fact that the BAF intro can be skipped?
The official guide to the Keyes Reactor trial makes it sound like it has an opening cutscene too. Either way, it does mean that the devs have heard many players' dislike of being forced to sit through overly long cutscenes and hopefully will lead to fewer and shorter cutscenes in the future.

Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
Darkfire Avenger DM/SD/Body Scrapper

Arc ID#161629 Freaks, Geeks, and Men in Black
Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World

 

Posted

Mother Mammary's cutscene might be more tolerable
-if- -she- -would- -learn- -to- -speak- -in- -real- -italics-.


K

 

Posted

I think is understable that the Ascend armor is only for lvls 50...
I would rather have it anyway, but it could be weird to have a lvl 4 in Praetoria wearing that armor... So it makes sense to gave it to 50s only.
At least it is account wide, that is a progress.
The armor looks awesome, but we still have to wait for prices...
I hope no more than 5 empyrean merits for each piece.
Helmet, shoulders, cape, chest, belt, gloves and boots... 7 pieces.
I wish cost were 1 empyrean or 5 astral merits=1 costume part.

 

Posted

In case you miss it;
Positron explains the Ascension armor here.

TLDR: Designed, Drawn, and Implemented for Incarnates ONLY.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eva Destruction View Post
The official guide to the Keyes Reactor trial makes it sound like it has an opening cutscene too.
I like the use of "admonishes" - it makes it sound like he's going to stand there and lecture us

Quote:
Either way, it does mean that the devs have heard many players' dislike of being forced to sit through overly long cutscenes and hopefully will lead to fewer and shorter cutscenes in the future.
Or now that they have a skip feature, they might feel they can add more and longer ones

@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos Creator View Post
In case you miss it;
Positron explains the Ascension armor here.

TLDR: Designed, Drawn, and Implemented for Incarnates ONLY.
Yes. Positron says:

"When we first started working on the Incarnate System we knew that it needed a certain amount of awesome attached to it in order to get people interested in actually doing it. If there were not specific rewards tied exclusively to the system, then people will simply continue to do “whatever is easiest” to attain the new rewards created for it."

That kind of thing never works on me. For example, I never used Shivans because I don't want to bother with PVP zones. None of my characters unlocked the Croatoa witch hats or Roman armor. Attaching "awesome" doesn't get me interested in doing it; it just serves to rub some shine off my admiration of the developers.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos Creator View Post
In case you miss it;
Positron explains the Ascension armor here.

TLDR: Designed, Drawn, and Implemented for Incarnates ONLY.
So it basically is a slightly modified version 'tier gear' ala World of Orcs and Humans then (except this unlocks per account, which is better admittedly but it is tier gear none the less), you have to be this awesome to unlock the costume, this shows everyone that you have one or more possibly high ranking incarnate characters.

Who wants to bet that the next 4 slots will have their own tier gear and the Omega slot will have one all its own?

Wow *golfclaps*.

Also I do love the 'if we allowed your low level alts to access it, it would be an insult to the art team' line, really Posi, you honestly think that despite people running the content and actually unlocking it that somewhere, someone using this on a level 1 would make the art team so incredibly insulted.

You probably want MORE people using your costume, showing it off as an incentive for new players to not only reach 50 but also to stick with the game and run the incarnate system so they too can unlock the awesome costume.

Badge Earned: Wing Clipper

A real showstopper!

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirai View Post
None of my characters unlocked the Croatoa witch hats or Roman armor.
But that's like only 2 hours playtime

@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

Straw men aside, I honestly don't see why the Incarnate costume pieces have to be level 50+, especially when that comes with a change to make other level-locked pieces available at character creation. I, personally, have no problem with putting in the WORK to unlock these things, provided they're unlocked for my characters at character creation. But I literally have ZERO use for a costume set that only unlocks at level 50.

And the set isn't even all that good. Yeah, it's new, but again - costumes only have value within the context in which they are used. I have, as of the time of this posting, 9 level 50 characters. They are, point for point:

A Slid Snake-looking dude with a sword
An unkillable girl in shorts and a vest
A dude in a military uniform
Another dude in a military uniform
A girl in in a leotard and metal boots and gloves
A huge green woman in hotpants and medieval armour
A huge black woman in animal furs and chains
A tall Indian woman in a trenchcoat and miniskirt
A man in a white uniform

NONE of these people make sense to have any of the stuff for Incarnates right now. I do have a few characters who could use those earlier in the levels, but they don't have access to the pieces and likely won't within the timeframe that I care to play them. I do have a few good ideas for NEW characters, but it will be a cold day in hell before I play a character for 50 levels with a placeholder costume.

Locking costume pieces behind level 50 is a dick move because by that point, characters are formed, solidified and decided, at least in my head. I make characters with a consistent idea of what I want them to be, and I rarely change my mind on the matter. If I could start them with these costumes, then GREAT. If I can't start them with these costumes, then I don't want them. And that is the WORST thing one can do with costumes, is to put them in that kind of dilemma.

I mean, seriously, what is this hoping to achieve? Give people their "epic loot" look? Because that's what those look like. Like someone just came out of a raid with their brand new giant shoulder pads with fire burning out of them while skulls tied to chains float above. Who does it hurt to make those a global unlock?

Why must EVERY good addition to this game be ruined by an equally big BAD decision?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_MechanoEU View Post
So it basically is 'tier gear' ala World of Orcs and Humans then, you have to be this awesome to unlock the costume, this shows everyone that you have one or more possibly high ranking incarnate characters.
It's cosmetic - no one needs to unlock it

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Who wants to bet that the next 4 slots will have their own tier gear and the Omega slot will have one all its own?
That might depend on if they have their own slavage and merits - which is quite possible

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Also I do love the 'if we allowed your low level alts to access it, it would be an insult to the art team' line, really Posi, you honestly think that despite people running the content and actually unlocking it that somewhere, someone using this on a level 1 would make the art team so incredibly insulted.
David Nakayama might turn savage.

@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
But that's like only 2 hours playtime
Two Hours? Isn't the record for KHTF something like 10 mintues and fo ITF something like 17?

"Men strunt �r strunt och snus �r snus
om ock i gyllne dosor.
Och rosor i ett sprucket krus
�r st�ndigt alltid rosor."

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Positron View Post
The Ascension Armor is NOT some random costume set that we locked into the Incarnate System. Every step of its design was under the assumption of “only available through the Incarnate System, and only to level 50’s.” David Nakayama knew this before he ever started working on the armor, in fact it was a driving motivation in the concept art he delivered. He specifically made something that could be used in pieces to augment your character’s existing costume to give it the “I’m an Incarnate” flair.
Aha, I found the the perfect quote that sums up everything I feel is wrong with the game at present. OK, then. Thanks to Matt Miller's explanation, I now know not to waste my effort on those pieces. I guess when they gave out the Vanguard pieces at character creation, they had to have SOMETHING which was locked behind arbitrary gates, but knowing that makes it easy to ignore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
Aha, I found the the perfect quote that sums up everything I feel is wrong with the game at present. OK, then. Thanks to Matt Miller's explanation, I now know not to waste my effort on those pieces. I guess when they gave out the Vanguard pieces at character creation, they had to have SOMETHING which was locked behind arbitrary gates, but knowing that makes it easy to ignore.
"locked behind arbitrary gates" is kind of the point of MMO's. It's called "character progression".

"Men strunt �r strunt och snus �r snus
om ock i gyllne dosor.
Och rosor i ett sprucket krus
�r st�ndigt alltid rosor."

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arilou View Post
"locked behind arbitrary gates" is kind of the point of MMO's. It's called "character progression".
For powers. Not costume pieces. Not in a game who bills itself as having the best customization around. Boy, it's like I'm looking through a wormhole into Jack Emmert explaining gating Capes at level 20.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Arilou View Post
"locked behind arbitrary gates" is kind of the point of MMO's. It's called "character progression".
As I said, tier gear.

The big gorilla of the fantasy MMO uses the exact same system for character progession admittedly that is SINGLE character progession and this is slightly better in that it is account based.

I'm sitting here in much the same position as Sam going "I have so many new concepts I could make using that armour...but I'll be buggered if I'm going to wait until I get that character to level 50 in order to make use of it."

That is unless one of you people out there saying that the idea behind this is fine is willing to PL that one character to 50 in sharp order for me, then I'd maybe consider it.

So now the costume pieces fail as a 'carrot on a stick' for me at that point, which, for me personally, makes it completely friggen useless. I'll probably get the emotes and the auras but the costume pieces will remain untouched.

Badge Earned: Wing Clipper

A real showstopper!

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
For powers. Not costume pieces. Not in a game who bills itself as having the best customization around. Boy, it's like I'm looking through a wormhole into Jack Emmert explaining gating Capes at level 20.
If people play this game for the character creation they are going to gate custom parts behind content, so that those people *keep* playing and thus earn them money.

That's the MMORPG business model.

EDIT: The alternative is selling it directly, and yes, they do that too. But then people complain about having to pay for costume pieces (although they have to do s anyway, just different payment methods) so the devs alternate the methods to keep everyone... Not happy, but at least give everyone something and keep them paying.

"Men strunt �r strunt och snus �r snus
om ock i gyllne dosor.
Och rosor i ett sprucket krus
�r st�ndigt alltid rosor."