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Originally Posted by St0ner
Ok, What is wrong with these people? They do not deserve to live through the episode.
Your sister got bit and died, so sad but dont sit by her side greaving while she has time to turn. God I was hoping that she would just lean up and tear a piece of that dumb girls face off. Dude got bit on his stomach. Should we try n get him help? Are they really this stupid? Nothing to think about! Dont even wait till he turns, put the shotgun to his head and pull the trigger already!!! |
Okay....the sister thing Im trying to justify. They wanted a goodbye scene between the sisters and I get it. Maybe the older sister just knew they reanimate slowly....if thats the case Im okay with that.
As for the guy that was bitten...with no solid evidence that the virus is transferred that way are you going to off him in such a cold manner. For example the wife was bitten then died, then reanimated....it would seem to me that theres a certain amount of time in there....maybe the virus only reanimates dead flesh? Maybe the bite kills through natural infection then the virus works its magic...maybe 1% of the population is immune or somesuch. All zombie tropes that have been done before.
They just dont know....as was evidenced by the deer from a couple episodes back. Anecdotal evidence is not enough to just off someone the minute theyre bitten. I think you take precautions, I think you tie the guy to a chair or tree and watch him. But thats just me.
--Frog
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If indeed it does ever come to a zombie apacolipse it will be a dog eat dog world out there. The ones to be more concerned about humanity than surviving will be the first to go while the ones who can leave their emotions behind and do what needs to be done will be the last ones standing.
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Originally Posted by Luminara
Andrea clearly knew what she was doing. She knew how long it would take for Amy to turn, she knew how to finish it, she had the gun cocked and ready. She was in control of the situation, and she needed the time to grieve.
That would be inhumane, and clearly, these survivors (excluding Daryl) are as concerned about retaining their humanity and compassion as they are about their survival. Jim wasn't suffering initially, he wasn't an immediate threat, so shooting him then and there would be a cold, heartless action. One which would lead to more extreme behaviors later, like shooting everyone who stubbed their toes or came back from the woods with a scratch, "just to be safe". It's noteworthy that Daryl, after so vehemently stating that he'd expect someone to pull the trigger on him if he were bitten, couldn't do it when he had the opportunity to put Jim out of his misery. He looked at Jim, with that crossbow drawn, loaded and ready, and no-one to stop him... and he just lowered his eyes and walked away, sorrow for Jim showing on his face. Humanity. Treating your fellow man/woman with dignity, even if they're dead or dying. If you sacrifice that, you're really no better than the zombies, you're just a different kind of walking dead. That message should be obvious by now. They've all but flat out said it at least once in every episode. |
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I would not even think twice about doing such extreme things in an extreme situation like that but no I wouldnt just tie him to a tree. That would give him a chance to get loose and eat me later specialy if he knows where I am heading. No I would blow his brains out all over that tree instead just to be safe. |
Originally Posted by Frogfather
Okay....the sister thing Im trying to justify. They wanted a goodbye scene between the sisters and I get it. Maybe the older sister just knew they reanimate slowly....if thats the case Im okay with that.
As for the guy that was bitten...with no solid evidence that the virus is transferred that way are you going to off him in such a cold manner. For example the wife was bitten then died, then reanimated....it would seem to me that theres a certain amount of time in there....maybe the virus only reanimates dead flesh? Maybe the bite kills through natural infection then the virus works its magic...maybe 1% of the population is immune or somesuch. All zombie tropes that have been done before. They just dont know....as was evidenced by the deer from a couple episodes back. Anecdotal evidence is not enough to just off someone the minute theyre bitten. I think you take precautions, I think you tie the guy to a chair or tree and watch him. But thats just me. --Frog |
I know that most prolly dont agree with me so just hope not to be stuck with me if it ever does happen.
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Originally Posted by St0ner
If indeed it does ever come to a zombie apacolipse it will be a dog eat dog world out there. The ones to be more concerned about humanity than surviving will be the first to go while the ones who can leave their emotions behind and do what needs to be done will be the last ones standing.
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Originally Posted by St0ner
I would not even think twice about doing such extreme things in an extreme situation like that but no I wouldnt just tie him to a tree. That would give him a chance to get loose and eat me later specialy if he knows where I am heading. No I would blow his brains out all over that tree instead just to be safe.
I know that most prolly dont agree with me so just hope not to be stuck with me if it ever does happen. |
Yeah there's something to be said about being "safer than sorry" during a Zombie Apocalypse. On the other hand it's easy enough to (for instance) tie up potential new zombies and watch them to see whether they turn into zombies or not isn't it?
They've left the details of how the zombie virus in this show works a bit vague but it's pretty clear that not 100% of the people who get infected start walking around. We've seen plenty of bodies lying around of people who are just plain dead - not zombies.
So as far as how they handled Amy and Jim I don't really have a problem with it. With Amy there was apparently no guarantee she was going to become a zombie so why waste a bullet (or brutally smash her head) if they didn't need to? I agree they probably should have at least tied her up but Andrea handled it well enough. And with Jim they quickly knew he had the fever but they gave him a reasonable chance to get better before they agreed to let him go.
As Innovator said it was cool to have Daryl expressing that "get them before they get us" point of view, but he expressed those things just to help develop the other characters as being "better" and more humane than that.
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Also, the show isn't "Zombie Apocalypse Survival Guide", and the characters aren't being presented as experts. It's just a group of average people dealing with a really crappy situation. They way they're acting/reacting seems to be fairly representative of how I would expect any group of average people to behave.
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IIRC, all of the dead bodies we've seen just lying around were in places where there was a military presence. That is, all of them were shot in the head. |
Originally Posted by Lothic
We've seen plenty of bodies lying around of people who are just plain dead - not zombies.
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* * * *
::::::::COMIC SPOILERS AHOY!!!::::::::
In the comic Andrea shot Amy in the head immediately to keep her from reanimating.
In the comic, if you die for ANY reason other than a head-shot, you come back as a zombie. Oh, and in the comic the reanimation happens MUCH faster, like just a minute or two (or less) after death.
::::::::AVAST COMIC SPOILERS!!!::::::::
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Were all those bodies lined up in that make-shift morgue out behind the hospital in the first episode shot in the head by the military? It's possible but we weren't shown that specifically. There have been a few other times where we've seen bodies simply lying in the street at random. Yes I suppose we can assume that all these random people were put down with head shots as well but that would just have to be a guess on our part.|
Originally Posted by sleestack
IIRC, all of the dead bodies we've seen just lying around were in places where there was a military presence. That is, all of them were shot in the head.
* * * * In the comic Andrea shot Amy in the head immediately to keep her from reanimating. In the comic, if you die for ANY reason other than a head-shot, you come back as a zombie. Oh, and in the comic the reanimation happens MUCH faster, like just a minute or two (or less) after death. |
Clearly this show is not following the comic book 100%. As this thread mentioned earlier it'd really be impossible for it to match it exactly anyway. But because Robert Kirkman is directly involved I have no misgivings whatsoever if he wanted to change how HIS zombies worked for this TV show. They have established that these zombies are caused by a virus and as such it's totally believable to me that the virus involved would not affect EVERYONE. Some people could be immune to it.
Besides when you think about it's actually more creepy if the idea of becoming a zombie was not totally certain. It'd mean that if you practiced Daryl's approach of burning/smashing every body you find you might be doing it to people who you didn't need to do it for. Uncertainty is always more frightening and unnerving than a "always happens" situation.
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Originally Posted by St0ner
I would not even think twice about doing such extreme things in an extreme situation like that but no I wouldnt just tie him to a tree. That would give him a chance to get loose and eat me later specialy if he knows where I am heading. No I would blow his brains out all over that tree instead just to be safe.
I know that most prolly dont agree with me so just hope not to be stuck with me if it ever does happen. |
First....until you can look a loved one in the eye and pull a trigger, its not even worth saying "this is what I would do". I had to put down my dog once and that was hard enough, and Im nowhere near soft-hearted.
Second, by tie him to a tree...I meant the fevered non-zombie Jim....tie him up while he cant do anything about it. Post a guard just in case. Then watch him. If he turns, kill him. Until he does or does not you really dont know anything about his situation
In your situation I hope you dont mind dying somewhere in the woods alone and frightened (and likely talking to yourself) because thats whats going to happen
--frog
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Okay so did EVERYONE miss the fact that the CDC doctor now has an open wound that was exposed to the "virus"?? Plus in the preview for next week it looked like Andrea was either freaking out or turning. So I can totally see the doctor turning and infecting others. This would be a good reason for Rick and crew to leave the CDC.
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I figure the CDC guy probably knows he's potentially contaminated. That's likely why he was ready to shoot himself and why he kept saying "No, please go away!" to the monitors when Rick was beating on the door. Yeah he's upset that he lost the TS-19 sample, but that by itself wouldn't be enough to kill himself over. The only reason he opened the door at the last second is that he was overcome by a moment of guilt for potentially allowing them all to die.|
Originally Posted by PowerStream
Okay so did EVERYONE miss the fact that the CDC doctor now has an open wound that was exposed to the "virus"?? Plus in the preview for next week it looked like Andrea was either freaking out or turning. So I can totally see the doctor turning and infecting others. This would be a good reason for Rick and crew to leave the CDC.
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I have no doubt that the CDC guy will die in the next episode, either by his contamination or by zombies directly. The method of his death will serve the story by making the whole situation that much more suck-tastic.
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We also got somewhat of a timeframe from this episode: something lie 120 days since the vrius was discovered ("Wildfire"), 63 days since it went global. So, safe to say that Rick was in a coma for about a month, month and a half at least?
Also, I got the first two volumes of TWD in the mail today from friends as a late b-day present. Also, the "emo" Superman story (I think, I haven't cracked that one open yet and only recognize it by the cover art).
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I didn't even notice the "Lost" analogy until it was pointed out elsewhere.|
Originally Posted by _NiVra
That was a great piece of imagery at the last scene there, and before BBM says it: yes, the lone man trying to save the world in a bunker, discovering there are survivors and ending an episode with bright lights coming out of a portal did give me the "Lost" effect. :-)
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Also, Rick losing his mind at the door is like Locke losing his mind at the Hatch
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Well, frankly, it's clear that you won't be one of those last ones standing, unless you're being kept alive by someone with far more knowledge and less hostility toward his fellow men/women.|
Originally Posted by St0ner
If indeed it does ever come to a zombie apacolipse it will be a dog eat dog world out there. The ones to be more concerned about humanity than surviving will be the first to go while the ones who can leave their emotions behind and do what needs to be done will be the last ones standing.
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You aren't a practicing survivalist, that's obvious. You wouldn't be posting in a nerd fight, about a television show, on a game forum if you were, and you damn sure wouldn't be so quick to discount how useful other people are to have around, if for no reason other than to alleviate the stress of being alone. Survivalism is using every tool to lean the odds in your favor, no matter how worthless it may appear to be, because the least thing may prove to be the most important and useful, and that includes other people. You don't throw things away until they're beyond hope of repair and there's nothing else you can salvage from them, if you're trying to survive. That includes companions.
You also clearly don't have any military training, or at least none above scrubbing toilets and hating your drill sergeant for "picking on you". If you were properly trained, and any of it had penetrated, you'd recognize the value of troop morale, something which is definitely not best served by arbitrary executions or testosterone-fueled attitude. Or sheer stupidity, like wanting to murder other people simply rather than try to help them because they aren't offering any immediate benefit, despite the fact that they also aren't an immediate danger.
If you had any experience of any kind from either source, you'd also be aware that no-one, not even the most proficient survivalist or most perfectly trained soldier, has every skill necessary for survival alone, a point which the writers deliberately drove home by showing Andrea and Amy fishing, Daryl hunting, Dale and Jim repairing vehicles, Rick and Shane leading and Glenn bringing tactical skill to the group.
Bottom line, you can sit there and bluster into your keyboard until the cows come home, but it's not fooling anyone and if there were an "apacolipse", throwing adolescent bravado at the zombies won't save your ***. You don't have the experience, raw knowledge or skill to keep yourself alive, much less make decisions on who else lives or dies, so you'd best hope that anyone you do find yourself tagging along with are more humane than you want to portray yourself as being.
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I thought he made it into the decon room in time. Did I miss something? I didn't see any shots of wounds on his hand or fingers. Gloves contaminated and dissolving, but no scratches, cuts or burns on the skin. The automated system also appeared to be capable of detecting contamination almost immediately, so if he were infected, it should have warned him or killed him before he left the shower.|
Originally Posted by PowerStream
Okay so did EVERYONE miss the fact that the CDC doctor now has an open wound that was exposed to the "virus"??
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I don't think it really matters, in the long run. He was alive and lucid when he needed to be, to open the doors for the survivors, so if he turns now, it's one zombie. Rick and company are still safer in there with him than they ever were outside, and they've got access to what has to be a decent stockpile of supplies (CDC Man was drinking wine, he's probably not starving either). They can handle one zombie easily.
Of course, him being infected could lead to the scene where he has driven the others off and him hacking off his own limbs and tissue (to mirror Merle) to test for a cure. In a crazed frenzy.
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There was at least the hint that the acid through the gloves made it to his skin, and hence a wound. But what was unclear is why the compound was acidic and if had anything directly to do with the zombie flesh with which he was working. |
Originally Posted by Luminara
I thought he made it into the decon room in time. Did I miss something? I didn't see any shots of wounds on his hand or fingers. Gloves contaminated and dissolving, but no scratches, cuts or burns on the skin. The automated system also appeared to be capable of detecting contamination almost immediately, so if he were infected, it should have warned him or killed him before he left the shower.
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More significantly - no bandage visible on his hand in later shots with the wine glass. So I doubt he was 'wounded'.
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Lol I'm not the one writing 5 paragraphs about crap I dont even know about. All I'm saying is maybe I will survive doing things my way. Maybe I wont I donno I've never actually been in a situation where I am fighting for survival but neither have you. I can say if I were anywhere around someone like you when it happend I'd survive longer just for the fact I'd take out their knee caps and use em as bait when I'm running from the zombies. Now a person with *humanity* could never do this so by default I still win |
Originally Posted by Luminara
Well, frankly, it's clear that you won't be one of those last ones standing, unless you're being kept alive by someone with far more knowledge and less hostility toward his fellow men/women.
You aren't a practicing survivalist, that's obvious. You wouldn't be posting in a nerd fight, about a television show, on a game forum if you were, and you damn sure wouldn't be so quick to discount how useful other people are to have around, if for no reason other than to alleviate the stress of being alone. Survivalism is using every tool to lean the odds in your favor, no matter how worthless it may appear to be, because the least thing may prove to be the most important and useful, and that includes other people. You don't throw things away until they're beyond hope of repair and there's nothing else you can salvage from them, if you're trying to survive. That includes companions. You also clearly don't have any military training, or at least none above scrubbing toilets and hating your drill sergeant for "picking on you". If you were properly trained, and any of it had penetrated, you'd recognize the value of troop morale, something which is definitely not best served by arbitrary executions or testosterone-fueled attitude. Or sheer stupidity, like wanting to murder other people simply rather than try to help them because they aren't offering any immediate benefit, despite the fact that they also aren't an immediate danger. If you had any experience of any kind from either source, you'd also be aware that no-one, not even the most proficient survivalist or most perfectly trained soldier, has every skill necessary for survival alone, a point which the writers deliberately drove home by showing Andrea and Amy fishing, Daryl hunting, Dale and Jim repairing vehicles, Rick and Shane leading and Glenn bringing tactical skill to the group. Bottom line, you can sit there and bluster into your keyboard until the cows come home, but it's not fooling anyone and if there were an "apacolipse", throwing adolescent bravado at the zombies won't save your ***. You don't have the experience, raw knowledge or skill to keep yourself alive, much less make decisions on who else lives or dies, so you'd best hope that anyone you do find yourself tagging along with are more humane than you want to portray yourself as being. |
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Not a chance.| All I'm saying is maybe I will survive doing things my way. Maybe I wont |
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| I donno I've never actually been in a situation where I am fighting for survival but neither have you. |
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I can say if I were anywhere around someone like you when it happend I'd survive longer just for the fact I'd take out their knee caps and use em as bait when I'm running from the zombies. Now a person with *humanity* could never do this so by default I still win
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Survival is a matter of using your brain, not your balls. Shooting random strangers to distract zombies will accomplish nothing useful or positive. You drive away anyone who might be willing to help you, you attract zombies and people who are like you, who will just as readily shoot you as you would them, and you "win" nothing except a greater chance of dying sooner.
Daryl's smart, or at least smart enough to survive. He knows when to shut his mouth, put it back in his pants and follow the leader. He chooses to stick with the group and take orders, because he knows his own limitations. You're no Daryl. You're Ed. And you'll end up like Ed.
Talking of Ed, it was bitter (and delicious) irony that he got attacked and eatened by a female zombie.
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slee man, you gotta watch them spoilers there. That's a pretty hefty thing. |
Originally Posted by sleestack
IIRC, all of the dead bodies we've seen just lying around were in places where there was a military presence. That is, all of them were shot in the head.
* * * * In the comic Andrea shot Amy in the head immediately to keep her from reanimating. *SPOILER REMOVED* |
So yeah, just read the first volume of The Walking Dead (named Days Gone Bye, just like the pilot ) and so far, the show does the dramatic moments a lot better. Everything seems to be in a rush on the comic.
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ROFLMFAO!!!!! I'm sorry, didnt know we had such a survival expert on the forums. maybe you should call up discovery tv and try n get your own show. After you wake up from that dream of yours that is.
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Originally Posted by Luminara
And I'm not the illiterate macho man spewing hot air and BS.
You know the only other thing hot air and BS comes from? An *******. Might want to reconsider your role model. Not a chance. Twenty five years practicing survivalism. I've walked miles with a collapsed lung, spent weeks nursing third degree burns, stitched my own leg after opening it up with a machete, gone without food for ten days, camped out in a foot of snow, started a fire in a thunderstorm... I'll forget more about how to survive than you'll ever learn. You aren't charming enough to get me to stop on my way out of the hot zone, you aren't bright enough to con me into stopping and you certainly aren't going to convince me to turn around and rescue you when you're waving a weapon. And if you're just shooting anyone you happen to see, you'll be dead before the zombies find you. You keep yammering on with this idiotic "I'm the toughest mothertougher that ever toughed" foolishness, but it's not proving anything except your own inability to think more than a few seconds ahead of your actions. Survival is a matter of using your brain, not your balls. Shooting random strangers to distract zombies will accomplish nothing useful or positive. You drive away anyone who might be willing to help you, you attract zombies and people who are like you, who will just as readily shoot you as you would them, and you "win" nothing except a greater chance of dying sooner. Daryl's smart, or at least smart enough to survive. He knows when to shut his mouth, put it back in his pants and follow the leader. He chooses to stick with the group and take orders, because he knows his own limitations. You're no Daryl. You're Ed. And you'll end up like Ed. |
Yeah I wouldn't really call this episode the best one so far either, but it was a "necessary" one because it finally focused on the campers a bit more and added some depth to their characters so that we as the audience can care enough about what happens to them. One of the general weaknesses of this series so far has been the general lack of "connection" with these campers. Unlike other shows it's just been simply hard to actually care whether most of these people besides Rick end up living or dying. I'd call this a much-needed character building episode.
This episode also restored some of my faith in this series as far as giving us a little bit context as to what happened to the rest of the world. I don't mind that this is mainly a story of a handful of survivors just struggling to stay alive but it's been bugging me that they hadn't (up until now) given us even a vague hint as to what happened to set the Apocalypse in motion. Of course we still don't know the exact source of the virus, but at least we now know a general timeframe of how long it took to spread around the world.
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