Walking Dead on AMC
Eventually, you (the general you. Or, in other words, we) are going to need somebody's help. Currently, we are living in luxury, compared to what it would be like in any sort of apocalypse: zombie, nuclear, or robot ninja. We have our basic needs taken care of already: food (just go to the grocery store), electricity (provided), medical care (past basic first aid). There are survivalist out there and they may play MMOs, so they may actual post on these boards. But is there are loners, they aren't suited to take on any incoming threat. Not enough ammo, and one loner against a horde of attackers will eventually die. Can't be on guard 24/7, ome mistake and that's it.
There is a reason why humans formed groups, even back in the nomadic days. It is somewhat possible to find group of people all cutthroat, willing to send each other up the river to save their own skin, but in the longterm, a person survives by finding a mutually beneficial group so that a division of labor and responsibility can be meted out to keep everyone safe and sheltered.
People like Bear Gryllis can survive in the wild. But can they survive in the wild where there is a constant unknown threat lurking? Zombies aren't like bears. You can't spot their lairs, you can't scare them off or play dead and you have to constantly be on the look out for them. More importantly, can survivalists like Survivorman stay in those conditions for a variable amount of time? They may have to keep moving, which in of itself, is a tiring experience.
In the end, an apocalypse survivor is going to need other people. For that extra meal, extra level of defense, for that shelter. And needing other people dictates following some sort of basic level of deceny. That may not mean saying your Ps and Qs, but it does mean not turning on each other (which I believe is a major reoccuring theme in The Walking Dead and most zombie films. As soon as one in the group thinks their methodology or their own hide is better than everyone else's, things go to hell in a handbasket)
"Ben is short for Frank."
-Baffling Beer-Man, The Tenacious 3: The Movie
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ROFLMFAO!!!!! I'm sorry, didnt know we had such a survival expert on the forums. maybe you should call up discovery tv and try n get your own show. After you wake up from that dream of yours that is.
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unequivocally, the difference between suggested styles will be lumi's continued life, with accompanying troupe, and your world war z, last man in the universe fantasy, that ends when you trip your own booby trap.
a lot of friends would have been far less kind in that statement.
Kittens give Morbo gas.
"Ben is short for Frank."
-Baffling Beer-Man, The Tenacious 3: The Movie
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This is the last frame of the Doctors gloves, the gloves within the gloves, right before he gets in the decontamination chamber. There's no evidence he received a wound that I can see.
This is the last frame of the Doctors gloves, the gloves within the gloves, right before he gets in the decontamination chamber. There's no evidence he received a wound that I can see.
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Not really sure yet how contagious this virus is, but that was certainly not the smartest thing he could have done all things considered.
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Then he used Sampe T-38 to make a zombie burger. I don't think using the djion mustard was the brightest choice.
"Ben is short for Frank."
-Baffling Beer-Man, The Tenacious 3: The Movie
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Of course a second or two after your pic he pulled that glove off in a clearly contaminated area.
Not really sure yet how contagious this virus is, but that was certainly not the smartest thing he could have done all things considered. |
He's still wearing the glove before he steps into the chamber.
he's still wearing the glove when he steps into the chamber. I'm not seeing where he was in danger of being contimanated.
Why are people using the word Virus? The doctor never even used the word virus.
Editted to add.
The Doctor says its been 194 days since Wildfire was declared and 63 since the disease has gone global. Does this help us figure out how long Rick was in the hospital.
Eventually, you (the general you. Or, in other words, we) are going to need somebody's help. Currently, we are living in luxury, compared to what it would be like in any sort of apocalypse: zombie, nuclear, or robot ninja. We have our basic needs taken care of already: food (just go to the grocery store), electricity (provided), medical care (past basic first aid). There are survivalist out there and they may play MMOs, so they may actual post on these boards. But is there are loners, they aren't suited to take on any incoming threat. Not enough ammo, and one loner against a horde of attackers will eventually die. Can't be on guard 24/7, ome mistake and that's it.
There is a reason why humans formed groups, even back in the nomadic days. It is somewhat possible to find group of people all cutthroat, willing to send each other up the river to save their own skin, but in the longterm, a person survives by finding a mutually beneficial group so that a division of labor and responsibility can be meted out to keep everyone safe and sheltered. People like Bear Gryllis can survive in the wild. But can they survive in the wild where there is a constant unknown threat lurking? Zombies aren't like bears. You can't spot their lairs, you can't scare them off or play dead and you have to constantly be on the look out for them. More importantly, can survivalists like Survivorman stay in those conditions for a variable amount of time? They may have to keep moving, which in of itself, is a tiring experience. In the end, an apocalypse survivor is going to need other people. For that extra meal, extra level of defense, for that shelter. And needing other people dictates following some sort of basic level of deceny. That may not mean saying your Ps and Qs, but it does mean not turning on each other (which I believe is a major reoccuring theme in The Walking Dead and most zombie films. As soon as one in the group thinks their methodology or their own hide is better than everyone else's, things go to hell in a handbasket) |
I know I would never make it alone but if I had to choose between being alone or being with some idiot pretending to know everything when chances are they never even leave their mom's basement I'd choose to die alone and spare myself the tourture.
Frankly both you and Luminara could be lying about your survivalist theories/credentials as far as I'm concerned. But based purely on what you've both written just in this thread alone I'm more inclined to give Luminara the benefit of the doubt before you. Until you figure out why I'll just hope for your sake a civilization-ending apocalypse (zombie or otherwise) never happens to you.
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Its almost sad infact cuz I know nothing of what it would take to survive in a situation like that and never wanted to post beyound my first reply on this thread. I would stop wasting my time with this nonsence but now it is to amusing to ignore.
he's still wearing the glove when he steps into the chamber. I'm not seeing where he was in danger of being contimanated.
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Why are people using the word Virus? The doctor never even used the word virus.
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It seems like a safe assumption, given the disease role of the CDC and the microscope images.
Yeah, I there is a post above that touches on that.
You make the best argument yet. I respect your reply cuz its not a bunch of BS claiming you know it all or pretending your some kind of survival expert.
I know I would never make it alone but if I had to choose between being alone or being with some idiot pretending to know everything when chances are they never even leave their mom's basement I'd choose to die alone and spare myself the tourture. |
Take the example of Andrea and Amy last night. Andrea should have put a bullet in Amy's head ASAP and everyone knew it. But they let her have her moment (or idiocy, if you are thinking it that way). Why? In part because she had a gun. Can you imagine what would have happened if Daryl had crossbowed Amy from a distance? I am sure Andrea would have turned around a fired wildly at him, endangering the rest of the group. I also think that between Laurie's conversation with Rick and Andrea's use of a gun, she is a valuable "commodity" in that she is another body that can defend the group at large.
Or, in the case of Jim, waiting to make a decision was somewhat idiotic, but was also in part to insure the safety of the group in the future. How so, you might ask. While Jim was obviously bitten, they waited to see what his condition was. Could you imagine what it would imply if he was shot as soon as the bite was discovered? It would mean that anytime someone was injured by what may have been a zombie attack they would have to be killed. If Rick went into the woods and got scratched by a tree limb and fired his gun at a bunny, but missed and he came back, what would happen? Would people notice the scratch, remember hearing the gunshot, and think Rick was attacked by a zombie and kill him? Even if he insisted he wasn't? I think that's what Rick (and the show) was trying to say with the Jim situation: the line can constantly change especially in a situation where fear is the primary motivator.
Zombie tales, and apocalyptic stories in general, tend to show that all idiocy leads to danger and death for dramatic reasons, but I am not sure that is the case in real life. We have the Darwin Awards, sure, but I think the real dangerous idiocy comes from complacency. When we are too used to living in times when nothing can possibly harm us. In an apocalpyse-scenario, we will have lapses of judgement that could lead to danger, but, alas, that could happen to anyone. From the suicidal guy who just can't take it anymore and runs into a horde or strong-willed leader who hasn't gotten a lot of sleep lately and won't allow for a moment of rest, lest something bad happens (which, according to fiction, insures something will happen). You are as likely to have that lapse as is Person X. That's why there needs to be some leeway, I think.
You also have to remember, if an apocalyptic event happens suddenly or irrationally, like a zombie outbreak, a lot, a lot of people are going to be in shock. It is easy for all of us to watch TDW and say "Oh, we'd do this or prevent that" because we are witnessing events from afar, emotionally removed from that universe. Add in the shock of actually living these sorts of events and we go back to letting raw emotion guide us and leading to those lapse of judgements.
Actually, I think that would make a good zombie flick: a nerd (like us) being the natural leader due to his or her immersion into zombie pop culture and immediately recognizing that head shots work, what tropes to avoid, etc. Could be done in the style of Shaun of the Dead, tongue-in-cheek.
"Ben is short for Frank."
-Baffling Beer-Man, The Tenacious 3: The Movie
[IMG]http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa10/BafflingBeerman/teamjackface1.jpg[/IMG]
Being given a timeframe for the outbreak makes me hope for a flashback episode that visits important events in that timeline.
"Ben is short for Frank."
-Baffling Beer-Man, The Tenacious 3: The Movie
[IMG]http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa10/BafflingBeerman/teamjackface1.jpg[/IMG]
I am sure there will be idiots in any group. But I think just like now, people need and will tolerate some idiocy as long as the overall safety and well-being isn't threatened. These people who do idiotic stuff often provide other benefits that their (hopefully temporary) idiocy can excuse
Take the example of Andrea and Amy last night. Andrea should have put a bullet in Amy's head ASAP and everyone knew it. But they let her have her moment (or idiocy, if you are thinking it that way). Why? In part because she had a gun. Can you imagine what would have happened if Daryl had crossbowed Amy from a distance? I am sure Andrea would have turned around a fired wildly at him, endangering the rest of the group. I also think that between Laurie's conversation with Rick and Andrea's use of a gun, she is a valuable "commodity" in that she is another body that can defend the group at large. Or, in the case of Jim, waiting to make a decision was somewhat idiotic, but was also in part to insure the safety of the group in the future. How so, you might ask. While Jim was obviously bitten, they waited to see what his condition was. Could you imagine what it would imply if he was shot as soon as the bite was discovered? It would mean that anytime someone was injured by what may have been a zombie attack they would have to be killed. If Rick went into the woods and got scratched by a tree limb and fired his gun at a bunny, but missed and he came back, what would happen? Would people notice the scratch, remember hearing the gunshot, and think Rick was attacked by a zombie and kill him? Even if he insisted he wasn't? I think that's what Rick (and the show) was trying to say with the Jim situation: the line can constantly change especially in a situation where fear is the primary motivator. Zombie tales, and apocalyptic stories in general, tend to show that all idiocy leads to danger and death for dramatic reasons, but I am not sure that is the case in real life. We have the Darwin Awards, sure, but I think the real dangerous idiocy comes from complacency. When we are too used to living in times when nothing can possibly harm us. In an apocalpyse-scenario, we will have lapses of judgement that could lead to danger, but, alas, that could happen to anyone. From the suicidal guy who just can't take it anymore and runs into a horde or strong-willed leader who hasn't gotten a lot of sleep lately and won't allow for a moment of rest, lest something bad happens (which, according to fiction, insures something will happen). You are as likely to have that lapse as is Person X. That's why there needs to be some leeway, I think. You also have to remember, if an apocalyptic event happens suddenly or irrationally, like a zombie outbreak, a lot, a lot of people are going to be in shock. It is easy for all of us to watch TDW and say "Oh, we'd do this or prevent that" because we are witnessing events from afar, emotionally removed from that universe. Add in the shock of actually living these sorts of events and we go back to letting raw emotion guide us and leading to those lapse of judgements. Actually, I think that would make a good zombie flick: a nerd (like us) being the natural leader due to his or her immersion into zombie pop culture and immediately recognizing that head shots work, what tropes to avoid, etc. Could be done in the style of Shaun of the Dead, tongue-in-cheek. |
ROFLMFAO!!!!! I'm sorry, didnt know we had such a survival expert on the forums. maybe you should call up discovery tv and try n get your own show. After you wake up from that dream of yours that is.
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You make the best argument yet. I respect your reply cuz its not a bunch of BS claiming you know it all or pretending your some kind of survival expert.
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I'm not an expert. I would never refer to myself as an expert. I'm functionally incapable of thinking of myself as an expert, in any aspect of my life. I certainly didn't give any indication that I would call myself an expert, or want anyone to address me as such. Nor have I implied that I know everything. More than you? Yes, based on your own admissions and unintentional revelations when you were posturing, but everything? Quite the opposite, in fact, I stated that no-one, not even experts, know everything or can prepare for everything, thus the need for companions.
But I am capable. I had to learn survival skills to take care of myself, and if I weren't at least moderately competent, I'd already be dead several times over, from exposure, starvation, injuries.
I know I would never make it alone but if I had to choose between being alone or being with some idiot pretending to know everything when chances are they never even leave their mom's basement I'd choose to die alone and spare myself the tourture. |
But can they survive in the wild where there is a constant unknown threat lurking? Zombies aren't like bears. You can't spot their lairs, you can't scare them off or play dead and you have to constantly be on the look out for them. More importantly, can survivalists like Survivorman stay in those conditions for a variable amount of time? They may have to keep moving, which in of itself, is a tiring experience. |
In the short term, either type of survivalist will suffice to keep a small group of people alive, regardless of enemy presence. Survivalists with military training will be more suitable for bunkering down and creating a defensible base, or getting that group out of a hot zone with minimal risk of detection and capture. Survivalists like Stroud and Lundin would better serve in safer areas or long-term habitation of a relatively safe location (even if it's in occupied territory, depending on the intelligence of the enemy. in the case of zombies, Stroud or Lundin would be fine, as they have sufficient skill to build small traps, warning devices and other security measures to warn, deter and kill when necessary).
In the end, though, continued survival is going to come down to the group's ability to replenish their supplies regularly, and the most reliable and certain way to accomplish that is through farming. Even a solitary survivor, regardless of expertise, will eventually deplete the resources in a region, forcing him/her to pack up and move on or start growing crops and husbanding livestock. That's when the survivalists like Stroud or Mears will be most beneficial, because they know what plants grow where, when they're in season, etc. You'll have no assurance of being able to get corn, wheat or other typical crop seed, so you'd be taking what's already growing and transplanting it to a managed location. They could also help secure wild game without killing it, allowing you to try to domesticate it, or at least keep it alive and relatively healthy for use later.
Long-term survival depends primarily on your location. In the show, the group is scavenging supplies from Atlanta. This gives them approximately 18 months of available food, minus however long they were there before Rick joined them. That's the average shelf life of canned food, 18 months. Some is only good for a year, some is good for 3-5, and there have been examples of canned food still being edible and bacteria-free for as long as 46 years, but a good average is 18 months. After that, they'll start to run out of readily available food and have to resort to what the land provides, even if they've been supplementing their canned food with fish, game and edible plants.
Ideally, under similar circumstances, you'd want to move on to a location near a river or a river-fed lake, where you would be least likely to exhaust the supply of fish and have access to fertile soil and fresh water. You'll have to start growing crops and domesticating animals (deer and wild fowl) or recapturing domesticated animals (cattle and chickens) sooner or later, though, because fishing, hunting and gathering is much more difficult during winter months, especially if you're feeding several people. Fresh fish, plants and whatever game you could catch should sustain the group through the first year, and hopefully the winter, but after that, you'd better have your fields sown and livestock reproducing, or you're going to risk depleting the local game and flora before you reach a point of self-sustainability. Could always move on, of course, but if you've managed to make an area safe, it's more efficient to finish what you started with the farm than to keep relocating.
In the end, an apocalypse survivor is going to need other people. For that extra meal, extra level of defense, for that shelter. |
That's weird I remember him pulling off the glove, and the secondary glove under it, both bubbling from acid. My initial thought was that the acid may have made it through the second glove to skin faster then he got them off, but as mentioned, no wound in evidence later when his bare hands were seen, so it is pretty moot.
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Why are people using the word Virus? The doctor never even used the word virus.
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The Doctor says its been 194 days since Wildfire was declared and 63 since the disease has gone global. Does this help us figure out how long Rick was in the hospital.
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In this age of instant Internet-based news it's likely that something that's turning people into zombies would've become world-wide news pretty early on. Combine that with the idea that Rick apparently knew absolutely nothing about Wildfire when he got shot I would conclude that he got shot at least 180-190 days ago, if not longer. This means he was in a coma for at least 5-6 months before the hospital got overrun and maybe 2 weeks on his own lying in the bed after all the other people there left/died.
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I'm confused. I'm not the one that said I was a survival expert. Infact I said that I have never been in a situation where I had to fight for survival. So are you saying you beleive I'm lying about that and really am a survival expert? or that I've nailed a one in a thousand chance of being in an online fued with a survival expert that sits on the forums arguing with me?
Its almost sad infact cuz I know nothing of what it would take to survive in a situation like that and never wanted to post beyound my first reply on this thread. I would stop wasting my time with this nonsence but now it is to amusing to ignore. |
I'm certainly no expert here, but on the other hand I'm not making any ridiclous boasts about what I would do to survive either. Thanks for adding some silly humor to this thread.
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I know I'm an a hole but I'm not ashamed of it one bit. Infact I'm kind of proud to be one
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It's actually a good thing that you are so lacking in subtlety. It makes it much easier to identify you as a threat to the group and take you out.
I've been shy to post in this thread, because... I'm finding the show very boring, and it makes me sad because I wish I liked it more. I'm not interested in the characters, except for the Sheriff, and the plot is... really plodding.
I've been fast forwarding through about 20% of the each show thinking, oh, here is where they talk about this obvious thing... fast forward... fast forward... man these people talk a lot fast forward, fast forward, and they aren't talking about anything very unpredictable.
Like the episode where they go back for Merle, there is a good quarter of the show that is them discussing the trip, that they shouldn't go, that they should, that they shouldn't, and no character says anything that you don't expect them to. Its obvious, and we all know they will go back for him... and they do... but they kept talking about it, and talking about it, and talking about it. After a while I got the feeling I was watching a Survivor episode or something instead of a zombie show. Then after all the talking, what happens? Nothing. You end up on an empty roof showing the severed hand, that the show telegraphed from the opening scene, so no big surprise.
The show if full of this. Talking... talking... talking... obvious moment, telegraphed moment, talking... talking... then a few zombies.
The reason I've been shy is because I think I'm the only one who feels this way. I just hope that the pace picks up. Right now its plodding along like a zombie.
The only episode I was really interested in was the first one, but that was a very standard Zombie introduction show. Felt like 28 days later.
Anyway... I can tell its a good show, I just wish I liked it more.
I think the trick is I need to be interested in the characters, and I'm just not. They are too obvious for me. I hope this doctor guy is more interesting. So far he seems to be.
Okay I must be going crazy and of course I deleted the show from my DVR, BUT I distinctly remember them showing the CDC guy pulling the glove off and we see a split second of his finger bubbling. THEN he rushes into the decontamination room. THEN later when he is drinking wine I could have SWORN I saw a bandaid on his finger. I'll have to record one of the repeats and look again! I usually never notice these little things so it's odd to me that I'd imagine them all.
Also "my bad" for calling it a virus, they just haven't given us anything else to call it yet. Contagion, disease, plague, what have you....
Okay I must be going crazy and of course I deleted the show from my DVR, BUT I distinctly remember them showing the CDC guy pulling the glove off and we see a split second of his finger bubbling. THEN he rushes into the decontamination room. THEN later when he is drinking wine I could have SWORN I saw a bandaid on his finger. I'll have to record one of the repeats and look again! I usually never notice these little things so it's odd to me that I'd imagine them all.
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I don't remember a band-aid with the wine glass, but perhaps I missed that.
Okay I must be going crazy and of course I deleted the show from my DVR, BUT I distinctly remember them showing the CDC guy pulling the glove off and we see a split second of his finger bubbling. THEN he rushes into the decontamination room. THEN later when he is drinking wine I could have SWORN I saw a bandaid on his finger. I'll have to record one of the repeats and look again! I usually never notice these little things so it's odd to me that I'd imagine them all.
Also "my bad" for calling it a virus, they just haven't given us anything else to call it yet. Contagion, disease, plague, what have you.... |
No, I just went back and rewatched it....
He rips off a glove to reveal a bubbling glove underneath it. Then runs to the decon shower and you can see both of his hands still with gloves on. The water/solution would have diluted the compound pretty quickly, likely without the stuff being a problem.
I didnt see a band aid on his hand when he was drinking.
Okay I must be going crazy and of course I deleted the show from my DVR, BUT I distinctly remember them showing the CDC guy pulling the glove off and we see a split second of his finger bubbling. THEN he rushes into the decontamination room. THEN later when he is drinking wine I could have SWORN I saw a bandaid on his finger. I'll have to record one of the repeats and look again! I usually never notice these little things so it's odd to me that I'd imagine them all.
Also "my bad" for calling it a virus, they just haven't given us anything else to call it yet. Contagion, disease, plague, what have you.... |
Now I wish I had DVRed it...
I don't remember a band-aid with the wine glass, but perhaps I missed that. |
I obviously don't dispute the pics warden_de_dios provided earlier. I just think we may be dealing with a fairly critical continuity error because I too distinctly remember him pulling BOTH gloves off and seeing his exposed hand. The fact that the very next thing we see is him rushing towards the door with both hands gloved would seem to be a case of bad editing at the very least.
Basically I figured the whole point behind him becoming suicidal and saying "No, go away!" to the campers on his monitor is -precisely- because he knew he might have infected himself. The whole thing comes off as fairly confused if we the audience can't be sure which way to interpret what happened in the lab.
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