Don't go Free to Play(F2P), COH
By
33253,
Posted on: 2010-10-27 07:26 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Quote:
i can think of one or two that are significantly less restrictive, but i obviously can't say more than that.
|
Originally Posted by Chase_Arcanum
I can think of several forums that have very similar policies, if not more restrictive. Unfortunately, I can't list em. They belong to... um... other games.
|
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
Quote:
I think it is a silly and pointless rule. I think it will generate more needless work for you, as you have to carefully prune out otherwise perfectly civil discussion, and more frustration for us as we try to rephrase our discussion to stay within the bounds.|
Originally Posted by Moderator 08
Sure we're pretty ok with that. Please do be careful not to let it go into personal attacks though.
|
You already have rules against posts that are inflammatory and posts that make personal attacks. You do not *need* additional rules against posts that *might potentially* become inflammatory. May I draw your attention to the fact that posts about PvP in CoH almost inevitably descend into PvP vs. PvE flames, and yet you've made no rules against talking about the PvP in this game?
I know this is probably not your fault and you're just the guy stuck with enforcing this, but I hope you're at least passing on our comments to someone above.
Character index
Quote:
Really, those of us upset with the moderation rules should take our complaints to a more proper place, namely express them to NCSoft (maybe via customer support) not the mods who have to enforce what they get told to enforce. |
Originally Posted by Zyphoid
I like this one.
I have to agree these rules are a bit overbearing. You need to decide if you still want this to be a community or not. As they stand, the rules are tearing down the community, for the sake of what I am unsure. There are other games that I have tried, but the community always pales in comparison to the CoX community. I fear that the tyrannical policies being pushed will damage that aspect for many people. I also find it odd that the names of other games are more heavily monitored than some curse words, or personal attacks on these boards. I find that to be an odd priority to have. |
Complaining in this thread would be meaningless, no matter how many. Enough complaints to NCSoft about the moderation rules might have an effect.
I don't suffer from altitis, I enjoy every minute of it.
Thank you Devs & Community people for a great game.
So sad to be ending ):
Quote:
Used to have a batch script that'd bombard a server with finger requests. Appropriately called "pull".
|
Originally Posted by Chase_Arcanum
Gopher! Man, that brings back memories!
And if you think that'd confuse the new kids, mention FINGER. ( For the young-uns. It was a protocol that would tell you if someone was logged on to a system (and show a message sig if they'd added one) that caused many an awkward moment. This was back in a time where, if you were lucky, maybe 20% of a university population made use of the Internet (often via Gopher) and less than 5% of the local population did... so the jargon was even less known than we see today. Imagine the looks from this scenario: sitting at a crowded all-night college diner (before they started calling em "coffee houses") and listening to your friend rant that his girlfriend at another University had an online addiction, "... I mean, I fingered her CONSTANTLY for over four hours last night and she never logged off." |
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
Quote:
Mod8 was largely responsible for the writing of the current rules. He obviously had to get approvals from various unknown people(s) but any further changes in the rule or enforcement start by talking to him.|
Originally Posted by tanstaafl
Really, those of us upset with the moderation rules should take our complaints to a more proper place, namely express them to NCSoft (maybe via customer support) not the mods who have to enforce what they get told to enforce.
Complaining in this thread would be meaningless, no matter how many. Enough complaints to NCSoft about the moderation rules might have an effect. |
This coming from someone who used to be a player representative on the secret committee to talk with the mods about this sort of thing (now defunct).
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
Quote:
Many pictures of Jimmy Page show him playing a Gibson Les Paul or Gibson EDS 1275, but what many people don't know is that for the solo on 'Stairway to Heaven', Page played a...|
Originally Posted by Moderator 08
You can't say "the f2p game I'm currently playing" but you can say "I hope they don't do X which I dislike". Not as extreme as it seems to appear.
|
Well...
Um...
Whatever it was it sure sounded great, and if it was an electric guitar - not saying it actually was an electric guitar, let alone any specific make or model, just speculating here - it would probably have had .008 gauge Ernie Ball strings on it.
Oh, and when they performed 'Kashmir' live he often played a...
Um...
Thing. Or whatever. Tuned to DADGAD. Probably. If it, you know, had strings. Which maybe it didn't.
Quote:
Perfect.
|
Originally Posted by Flarstux
Many pictures of Jimmy Page show him playing a Gibson Les Paul or Gibson EDS 1275, but what many people don't know is that for the solo on 'Stairway to Heaven', Page played a...
Well... Um... Whatever it was it sure sounded great, and if it was an electric guitar - not saying it actually was an electric guitar, let alone any specific make or model, just speculating here - it would probably have had .008 gauge Ernie Ball strings on it. Oh, and when they performed 'Kashmir' live he often played a... Um... Thing. Or whatever. Tuned to DADGAD. Probably. If it, you know, had strings. Which maybe it didn't. |
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
Quote:
Fixed.
|
Originally Posted by Flarstux
Many pictures of Jimmy Page show him playing a [instrument] or [slightly different instrument], but what many people don't know is that for the solo on [popular musical composition], Page played a...
Well... Um... Whatever it was it sure sounded great, and if it was an electric guitar - not saying it actually was an electric guitar, let alone any specific make or model, just speculating here - it would probably have had .008 gauge [name brand] strings on it. Oh, and when they performed [another popular musical composition] live he often played a... Um... Thing. Or whatever. Tuned to DADGAD. Probably. If it, you know, had strings. Which maybe it didn't. |
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
Quote:
With the whole "CoH 2" was registered/trademarked talk going on, I wouldn't be surprised if this version went F2P when CoH 2 is released with a $15 sub.
|
Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
It is a very viable business model, the number of people who are willing to pay $15 every once in awhile for something (Be it a new character slot/race/costume/etc) are far larger than those willing to pay $15 a month for game access.
|
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
Remember there is also Paragon Unleashed.
I don't use it that much but it does allow for discussion.
I think everyone has pretty much agreed the 'no videogames' rule is about as stupid as it gets 'no competing MMOs' that's fine and perfectably understandable.
It's even weirder that you can't mention NCsofts own MMOs, they own City of Heroes for gods sake and we can't mention, by name, a product released by the same company, that is just completely idiotic.
To take from the awesome example above, it would be like a Guitar forum for the fans of Gibson guitars only being able to talk about one model of guitar that Gibson released and not being allowed to talk about any other model.
Mod08 you are responsible for these rulings as in we were told you drafted them up, perhaps you can see that this particular rule is kind of foolish?
I must say, the gradual shift in this thread from "Arrogant, ignorant-of-many-facts OP gets told" to "Genuine F2P discussion" to "Dissection of somewhat draconian forum rule policy" has been most entertaining.
Thanks, y'all! 
Positron: "There are no bugs [in City of Heroes], just varying degrees of features."
Draconian and a step backwards in basic free speech. What an absolute absurd rule. Whoever came up with it should be fired. Can't name anything else other than the game. Yeah. Good one.
I also find this comical since we don't know much about what is coming down the pipe for this game. Essentially we can all discuss and ask for things that never come out. We rarely get any replies regarding requests (Noble Savage is the rare exception - he is great at talking to the customer). We don't have any idea of what features we can expect down the road or where this game is heading in the next year or so.
Quote:
Hrrrmmmm. I still think complaints about moderation rules be better served directed towards NCSoft than in thread complaining.|
Originally Posted by Lemur Lad
Mod8 was largely responsible for the writing of the current rules. He obviously had to get approvals from various unknown people(s) but any further changes in the rule or enforcement start by talking to him.
This coming from someone who used to be a player representative on the secret committee to talk with the mods about this sort of thing (now defunct). |
Very interesting its mod8 that's created the extra workload and draconian rles.
I don't suffer from altitis, I enjoy every minute of it.
Thank you Devs & Community people for a great game.
So sad to be ending ):
Quote:
There, was that so hard?
|
Originally Posted by Flarstux
I hope they don't play "Stairway to Heaven" which I dislike.
|
Character index
For what it's worth, and I realise discussing moderator action is itself against the rules, I disagree with this enforcement of the letter of the law even when it clashes with the spirit of the law. The reason we have forum rules, as I understand it, is to keep the forums a nice and friendly place that people can enjoy. This, as I have seen in the past, is best achieved by targeting specific problems as they occur and only wide-scale barring certain topics in extreme situations. This means removing "other game" mentions only in situations where they become problematic, rather than via search-and-replace.
I've often said that the forums need more moderation, but somehow this always gets turned on its head and draconian rules applied such that LESS moderation is actually needed and applied, which strikes me as the wrong way to solve problems. This, in effect, is a re-run of what Ex Libris did when she moved S&I into For Fun because of precisely one guy who kept getting offended and precisely one guy who kept saying "No."
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Lemur Lad
I don't come here to "win" and when I'm wrong I admit it. However explaining to someone why things would or wouldn't work takes facts, and facts require examples and citation.
Effective debate is about a back and forth discussion and the exchange of accurate information, so the thoughts and ideas are improved or discarded. If you knock information and examples out of the tripod, it becomes feelings and opinions, which can't be gainsaid, or even discussed effectively because you've made them sacred. Under those rules pretty much any disagreement can be taken as a personal attack, which just means you'd have more threads devolving into chaos not less. I come here to inform and be informed. Having to guess where someone is getting their information or idea or what event they're referring to hinders that. Under these rules, I can't even say "I've tried this idea before in another game, it doesn't work." There's no frame of reference and my objection inspires no one to think because it's just an open ended opinion that can be dismissed. If this is the hardline interpretation you guys are going to stick to, you might as well just make everything a Forum Poll or allow people to use /jranger as a response again, because "Yes" and "No" are going to be the only meaningful response anyone can give. A forum is a place of discussion, this kind of thing turns this from a forum into a Comment Thread. |
This.
Whatever the executors of the policy feel, the policy itself is broken.
It makes me question just what Paragon Studios are afraid of. Do they lack faith in their offering to stand toe to toe in the marketplace against the competition?
This policy in itself doesn't engender confidence in the product nor does it assist the community spirit.
Thelonious Monk
Quote:
Given the noticable decrease in OCR activity on the boards as well as overall Redname participation here it seems someone in NCSoft decided that the forums needed to be taking up less resources.|
Originally Posted by Schismatrix
i'm guessing a staff switchup of some sort at NCsoft changed who creates the policies a couple months ago. Perhaps a Chinese government minister was hired to set forum policy.
|
Personally I'll keep doing what I'm doing and let the mods decide what does and doesn't break their rules.
Quote:
There is no free speech here. It's their house, their rules.
|
Originally Posted by TheJazMan
Draconian and a step backwards in basic free speech. What an absolute absurd rule. Whoever came up with it should be fired. Can't name anything else other than the game. Yeah. Good one.
I also find this comical since we don't know much about what is coming down the pipe for this game. Essentially we can all discuss and ask for things that never come out. We rarely get any replies regarding requests (Noble Savage is the rare exception - he is great at talking to the customer). We don't have any idea of what features we can expect down the road or where this game is heading in the next year or so. |
Quote:
http://unsubject.files.wordpress.com...hvussubnum.png
|
Originally Posted by Scarlet Shocker
Currently the model that Paragon have seems to be working fine: Monthly subs and a booster pack every few months seems to generate some healthy revenue for them, and the lowish sub fee, regular free issues and vet rewards keeps people subscribed. They'd have to be very very sure that changing that model would benefit the game.
As things stand, most players seem to subscribe for a good while, most buy most boosters (we'll ignore Party pack for the purpose of this argument) and most bought GR. It seems despite the doom-sayers that this old game has some life left in it and change for its own sake is rarely wise. |
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by 33253
|
With no context that is meaningless
Thelonious Monk
Quote:
It's not in thread complaining, it's a reply to something the moderator himself posted here. If it were random griping, you'd have a point. However this is an attempt at a discussion with the person who made the statements in the place he made them.
|
Originally Posted by tanstaafl
Hrrrmmmm. I still think complaints about moderation rules be better served directed towards NCSoft than in thread complaining.
|
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
This, in effect, is a re-run of what Ex Libris did when she moved S&I into For Fun because of precisely one guy who kept getting offended and precisely one guy who kept saying "No."
|
There was a lot more to the decision to move than that. Those were the most egregious public events and thus the ones people remember, but there were plenty of other reasons and a lot more discussion than just a shoot from the hip decision on Ex's part.
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
Quote:
It's not the rule that's foolish, at least it didn't use to be. It's the decision to change enforcement of that rule into a literal hardline interpretation instead of a pragmatic one.|
Originally Posted by Dr_Mechano
Mod08 you are responsible for these rulings as in we were told you drafted them up, perhaps you can see that this particular rule is kind of foolish?
|
There's always been a rule about comparing contrasting with other games. Even before Mod8 handled the updates to the forum rules. However it was never strictly interpreted to mean that any mention of any other game was taboo until now.
It allowed for mentions and discussion in context as long as it didn't turn into a "versus" style shouting match.
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
Quote:
You're absolutely correct. However there's nothing wrong with questioning changes in the way those rules get applied.
|
Originally Posted by BlackArachnia
There is no free speech here. It's their house, their rules.
|
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
So did something happen when I was away that deemed this necessary?
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...