All Things Art: NPC Conversions
By
Abraxxus,
Posted on: 2010-10-10 23:56 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
I would love to see those options 
"What counts is not what sounds plausible, not what we would like to believe, not what one or two witnesses claim, but only what is supported by hard evidence rigorously and skeptically examined. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan
I would love to have the Rikti cape as an option, I know several characters would use it.
Likewise, the option to wear waist capes, in fortunata style, for men and women. (BTW, could we please get the buttcapes for male widows? Lack of that costume piece is why I turned my male widow into a female- the costume seemed lacking without it)
I also want the sybil-style robes, even if those have to be a paid-for option, due to the extra capes used.
A (Golden Gate) Bridge Too Far- arc 299315
Crazy NIMBY's, Railroad robber barons, and kickboxing Engineers, Oh My! Go back in time and join the fight to save a San Francisco icon!
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We can't have these.|
Originally Posted by Frozen_Fire
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Sisters Airlia and Solaris have multiple cape systems, which, if allowed to players, would fry folks' graphics cards with how render-intensive it is. It's OK on NPCs because the devs can then control how many double-capes are around, and thus minimize the impact on our poor computers, but if you've ever been in an eight-man mission full of Mu Guardians you may have noticed your game choking a bit. Now, imagine Atlas Park on Freedom or Virtue full of PLAYERS that do that (bigger zone! more players! ALL of them have double, or even quadruple like Airlia, capes!), and tell me how attractive an option that is. Yeah, I'll pass, thanks.
As for the Illusionist, while I do like that dress a lot, long robes and dresses apparently look completely horrid with a large chunk of the player animations we have, so we won't be getting them, ever, at all.
As for Mother Mayhem, Vanessa DeVore, Neuron, and Marauder, I can't speak for every player of this game but speaking for myself, I don't really like the idea of these great big important NPCs not being unique anymore. I dunno, maybe it's just me, but I don't think Marauder should look like just another PC hero or villain, you know? Mender plates and Carnie sashes are one thing, but I wouldn't want to see loads of player characters running around with stuff that only exists on ONE NPC as their signature costume part. It kills things.
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Well, actually a few demo edits have shown Tsoo and CoT long robes/skirts look fine with player animations. The real problem is that the Illusionist skirts lack both feet and actual leg joints at all, it's just one stiff cylinder.|
Originally Posted by flashrains
As for the Illusionist, while I do like that dress a lot, long robes and dresses apparently look completely horrid with a large chunk of the player animations we have, so we won't be getting them, ever, at all.
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Originally Posted by flashrains
As for Mother Mayhem, Vanessa DeVore, Neuron, and Marauder, I can't speak for every player of this game but speaking for myself, I don't really like the idea of these great big important NPCs not being unique anymore. I dunno, maybe it's just me, but I don't think Marauder should look like just another PC hero or villain, you know? Mender plates and Carnie sashes are one thing, but I wouldn't want to see loads of player characters running around with stuff that only exists on ONE NPC as their signature costume part. It kills things.
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For example, the new Bobcat is... weak in appearance, she really does look like just about every other Catgirl PC out there, complete with maxed out boob slider and you really can replicate her easily in the costume editor.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
City of Heroes is a game about freedom of expression and variety of experiences far more so than it is about representing any one theme, topic or genre.
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I don't have the slightest idea why they didn't go with how she looked in the concept art. She HAD a unique tights pattern and hairstyle... why the balls couldn't she keep them?
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Originally Posted by AzureSkyCiel
For example, the new Bobcat is... weak in appearance, she really does look like just about every other Catgirl PC out there, complete with maxed out boob slider and you really can replicate her easily in the costume editor.
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Couldn't care less about Marauder's unique gloves, I just want his hair. We don't have dreadlocks at all. Closest we got are those cornrows. Then he gets dreadlocks. Can we at least get those? I'm sure it wouldn't make him less unique if the people of Paragon City could actually have a normal hairstyle that happens to be similar to his.
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Oh, of course. Similar-but-not-identical is great, it's just identical-to-signature-look stuff that I'm against. Dreads in general ought to be WAY more common than only belonging to one character ever. I'd like some for sure... just maybe not HIS particular dreads. That's not quite what the thread is about, though.
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Originally Posted by Xzero45
Couldn't care less about Marauder's unique gloves, I just want his hair. We don't have dreadlocks at all. Closest we got are those cornrows. Then he gets dreadlocks. Can we at least get those? I'm sure it wouldn't make him less unique if the people of Paragon City could actually have a normal hairstyle that happens to be similar to his.
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It IS a stumper.
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Originally Posted by flashrains
I don't have the slightest idea why they didn't go with how she looked in the concept art. She HAD a unique tights pattern and hairstyle... why the balls couldn't she keep them?
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
City of Heroes is a game about freedom of expression and variety of experiences far more so than it is about representing any one theme, topic or genre.
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18 pages...
I bet we will even hit more than 20 and we will still waiting to see a damn single NPC conversion.
I think they should release one booster montly, with no crappy powers, just the costume pieces, every single month for 4.99 dollas.
First month, Carnie pack, next one, Ouroboros pack... And so on.
Come on the pieces are already created. And we see they allow different colour in AE. Port them to be avalaible to players!
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I'll play devil's advocate and say: A lot more work than either of us realize.|
Originally Posted by Angelxman81
18 pages...
I bet we will even hit more than 20 and we will still waiting to see a damn single NPC conversion. I think they should release one booster montly, with no crappy powers, just the costume pieces, every single month for 4.99 dollas. First month, Carnie pack, next one, Ouroboros pack... And so on. Come on the pieces are already created. And we see they allow different colour in AE. Port them to be avalaible to players! |
Just because the costume pieces 'exist on player-like models' don't mean they exist for player models. The major factor being the ability to make sure a costume piece scales with body size, a feat players can pull but NPCs cannot, their only model variations tend to be in height, and Council/Fifth Column aside, that difference tends to be fairly modest, this goes nothing to say about the NPCs that certainly do NOT use PC-like models.
Finally, releasing one booster on a monthly basis, might be a bit of a task, not to mention the price you're asking it for, and that goes both ways. If it's being released by villain groups... Congrats, you get to pay $4.99 for Ouroboros hips and shoulder strap one month... and that's it. Next month though, the Crey booster will give us enough costume pieces to constitute a regular booster, and Paragon studios will be the ones getting shafted that time.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
City of Heroes is a game about freedom of expression and variety of experiences far more so than it is about representing any one theme, topic or genre.
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I would have to add my two cents here.
Carnival of Shadows peices, some kind of mask some of the ring mistress and minion garb, the corsets, boots and those back things.
Knives of Artemis, the hand mounted crossbows as a possible weapon option for archers, the cool military gears on the thighs, etc.
Malta pouches, a definate plus for all the military among the players.
And options from Praetoria. Unlockable with the proper defeat badges, like some are now. The dual energy pistols, the rifles would all look great.
That is all I can think of for now.
Know what they could do? Update old, low-res enemy groups/NPCs like Hellions, Fifth Column, civilians, etc. As they update these enemy groups, they give us access to these new costume pieces. This would also tie into their "All new NPC costumes will be given to the players" philosophy. Old enemy groups look nice and not dated, we get more costume pieces, and old content will feel fresh, just like all old Rikti content felt funner when they got their make over.
That's three birds with one scone.
7 years on, it's got to the point where characters are recognisably dated compared to newer games:
Champions, which is terrible except for the character editor, which has a LOT less options available than Cityof, but is awesomely well done, especially the body sliders which allow much more variance than Cityof. Also being able to choose 'skins' of outfits is brilliant and should be an option on every Cityof piece ( for example the Metallic skin in Champions looks badass and doubles up for cool looking shiny clothes in the style of http://tinyurl.com/covtexture )
DC Online where the game itself is terrible, and the character editor is an absolute joke in how little options there are, it's just reduced to 'pick your gear and skin colour' - BUT what's there looks good, and the ability to have stuff like jet pack *costume pieces* permanantly on the back to explain powers like Fly is brilliant. Cityof kinda got that with wings, but why did they stop with wings and not go onto stuff suitable for characters with tech/natural origin, hmm. The tech wings look as ridiculously cheesy as the others do, I'd only say the demony characters have it good really (though there does need to be a LARGE bat wing option)
FallenEarth.com, terrible grindy game at heart, very hostile to roleplayers, but, characters look good (though very lacking on options, even less than DC), and they put in one of the most amazing things for RP, a big bunch of realistic face expressions and emotes to control them, so characters don't seem like this, in Cityof:
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Originally Posted by Sworn_Servant
2011-05-03
mannequin faces and stilted poses |
A thriving social/roleplayer community gives for a lot, like a catalyst, for relatively little work compared to all the time it takes to add grindy content (it only needs to be done once, and once it's there it's a big draw). For every social/roleplayer you keep playing the game, they add value to all other players and encourage the other types of players to stay too. I have an internet friend who is an utter genius, now a professor teaching games design at Dundee University, and writes about this kind of stuff all the time: Epitaph Developer Blogs [/fangirl]
My previous post along the same thoughts as you, Xzero!
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Originally Posted by Killerkitty
2011-05-03
Made a www.j.mp Link to pass to people ingame, nice and short so saves on copypasting, is human-rememberable: j.mp/roguemag1 Link to this thread (thinking of when more issues come out): j.mp/roguemag or j.mp/cityoffashion (or cityfashion, or cityofashion) Anyway, proper reply: Is cool! Shame that the blurry texture quality (even on high) when zooming in, and the lack of facial expressions (we need something like FallenEarth.com's face emote system) lets you down though, but you did what you can and still made it look cool mostly. They really need to do a big revamp of character models and skins in the same way that they did ultra mode as mainly affecting the cities - the characters still look 90s/2000ish really compared to Champions (with the horrible cartoon effect turned off in their graphics options, anyway) |
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www.trillian.im Session Start (kkillerkkat:redactredacted): 2011-05-03 <snip> [:39] <redacteddd>: CoX was made in 1840 and looks like it so whatever lol [:46] <redacteddd>: Seriously, if you hadn't been playing CoX before to develop a fondness and whatnot, you'd have a different opinion I'd really bet [:46] Killerkitty: the community is SO much better than champions [:47] <redacteddd>: Its also been around for like 6 years [:47] Killerkitty: as for graphics, the carnie screenshots (ignore the other posts cos most people don't have their stuff at max settings) [:47] Killerkitty: and there's this too: j.mp/roguemag1 [:47] Killerkitty: yeah but it's been patched a few hundred times literally [:48] <redacteddd>: Well, again, 6 years or something. Plus, maybe its got some cool styles, but just the model detail, its aged, very aged [:49] <redacteddd>: Hell I bet you said its graphics were better than dcuo at some point then right after went 'oh oops maybe not' [:49] Killerkitty: hehe, I just went to look at the patch notes page (cityofheroes.com/news/patch_notes) and the 10 pages of patches only go back to issue 9 lol (it's at issue 20 now) [:50] Killerkitty: the city graphics are better than DCUO, not the models tho I agree, but... they do look good, there's a lot more customisation than DC. And I loved the idea of Gotham. But it didn't live up to it, they made it too small, too fake. Just an empty time-filler for going between missions. [:50] <redacteddd>: lol [:51] Killerkitty: you not tried cityof on ultra mode? the cities look amazing now [:51] Killerkitty: Praetoria especially, the new world, that was only made last year [:51] <redacteddd>: Everything. Of course CoX has customization options, more styles, but thats all it has visually [:51] <redacteddd>: I have ennexae with flame tatoos on her thigh and legs and chest...she's walking around bareassed with a cloak and armor skirt [:52] Killerkitty: pff ill be happy with tattoos when we can actually have variety [:52] Killerkitty: I'm looking forward to when they bring back APB I hope that other companies will get ideas from them[:52] Killerkitty: they are re-releasing it soon [:52] <redacteddd>: Hopefully |
The scarred and battered looking skin on the Carnies Strongmen would be awesome to have on your player characters for that violently strong look.
Kheldian sashes.
Pouches and packs on the many Soldier NPCs and even on the Soldier pets.
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I don't know why we have not these already. It's in the game, only needs a few tweaks to fit huge bodies and make it resizeable.|
Originally Posted by Synergy One
Kheldian sashes.
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By the way, I really love the IDF costumes:
Specially:
- The pants: they look like the "Stripe 3" pattern but embossed, something like the Plus Patterns in the Wedding Pack
- The armour chest piece: it looks armoured but not so bulky like the Praetorian Police, maybe because the waist is tight. And it covers the neck, we need more neck pieces, sometimes it feels too exposed and the joint line it's too obvious.
We were meant to be getting the IDF armour in I19/20. We're still meant to be getting it, although when I have no idea. And it's annoying =/
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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I think they're saving it until issue 21, hopefully so we can get the back pieces too, and it'll kind of compliment the the addition of backpacks from the steampunk booster.
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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
We were meant to be getting the IDF armour in I19/20. We're still meant to be getting it, although when I have no idea. And it's annoying =/
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Click here to find all the All Things Art Threads!
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
City of Heroes is a game about freedom of expression and variety of experiences far more so than it is about representing any one theme, topic or genre.
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one thing to point out to clarify though, the "skins" arent as impressive as they sound, they are cloth, leather and metallic(plus oily options+those options). they do not allow such things as using the various tattoo options or the animalistic skins with the tights top patterns. those are still fixed.|
Originally Posted by Killerkitty
7 years on, it's got to the point where characters are recognisably dated compared to newer games:
Champions, which is terrible except for the character editor, which has a LOT less options available than Cityof, but is awesomely well done, especially the body sliders which allow much more variance than Cityof. Also being able to choose 'skins' of outfits is brilliant and should be an option on every Cityof piece ( for example the Metallic skin in Champions looks badass and doubles up for cool looking shiny clothes in the style of http://tinyurl.com/covtexture ) |
for mixing specific unusual skin textures, you are forced to use second layer options, like chest pieces and shirts, just like in coh. so really the main difference is largely a lighting, reflection issue, not a massive qualitative difference.
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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
We were meant to be getting the IDF armour in I19/20. We're still meant to be getting it, although when I have no idea. And it's annoying =/
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Why not do this in reverse, too? Frostfire's looking pretty bad despite showing up all the time these days. He could use an upgrade.
Something like this! Presenting: less-fugly Frostfire!
Much better than normal Frostfire.
Edit: Fine, here's old Frostfire under the same graphics settings as "new" Frostfire. The only improvement that makes is that his particle effects hide some of his hideousness.
Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.
Nice. But, the real one has better boots.
Nice, Vanden!!
Your Frostfire kicks the old one thousands times.
There are lots of old NPCs could use an upgrade.
Specially City representative, Azuria, Frostfire...
We see them all time, and they are UGLY right now!
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Do like. Do like a lot
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Originally Posted by Vanden
Why not do this in reverse, too? Frostfire's looking pretty bad despite showing up all the time these days. He could use an upgrade.
Something like this! Prresenting: less-fugly Frostfire! Much better than normal Frostfire.  |
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Sadly, you can't keep them on while walking/running etc
[..snip..]
Back Detail We should have jet packs should be available as back detail when fly or hover are attained as powers. There again many of these already existing game should be made available. Sky Raiders, Goldbrickers, Longbow, Wyvern, Ritki, Terrence Dobbs (Some sort of tank setup)
JetPacks
Other Back Detail
Want more The Thing/ Species/ Dead Space/ Aliens (xenomorphesque or generally gigeresque)/ Splinter/ Invasion: Earth/ Resident Evil/ Starcraft's Zerg-esque horror stuff!
Not just for characters, but think of the missions we could have
Oh, and a new powerset: patman.org/wod/disciplines/vicissitude.asp
Oh, and let us edit our mastermind pets (this should have been done with power customisation, was promised it would happen, then didn't, years on now, it seems it's completely fallen by the wayside in favour of 'raid' missions. Ugh...) and have character bios (since we can already pick pet names, only makes sense!)
and yes, carnie carnie carnie outfits (how I found this thread on google)
http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Carnival_of_Shadows
http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Giovanna_Scaldi
^ WHY IS THERE NO SHORT HAIR FOR WOMEN ANYWHERE ELSE IN THE GAME?