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While this is accurate (except in the case of companies that put out regular paid expansions), Back Alley Brawler was not part of the Going Rogue hires. He had been with the company since around the time Issue 7 launched.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
But like with all games, they don't need everyone who works on an expansion after the expansion is released.
As I mentioned earlier, GR neeed a lot of zone work, because it was giving us 4-6 new zones - but as we won't be getting 4-6 new zones in the upcoming Issues, the people who worked on the GR zones aren't all needed now - and the same with all the people who worked on Ultra Mode - now that it's done and added to the game, not all of them are needed anymore either. The upcoming Issues are not GR-sized, so there's no need for a GR-sized team to work on them. |
I really, really hope it's not true, but evidence seems to add up that it is.
*salute* We'll really, really miss you, BaBs. You've been a fantastic member of this community for a long time. Good luck in whatever you pursue.
--Virtue--
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Heh heh, Oil Slick.
I miss that guy. Now even more so. 
Playstation 3 - XBox 360 - Wii - PSP
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Samuel_Tow: Your avatar is... I think I like it
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Lighthouse, is that you?|
Originally Posted by OPTICAL_ILLUSION
mod 8 if they ever got rid of you i would quit the game and break all sorts of rules on the boards before i left.
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"I do so love taking a nice, well thought out character and putting them through hell. It's like tossing a Faberge Egg onto the stage during a Gallagher concert." - me
@Palador / @Rabid Unicorn
So,what really happenned?
BABs gone really?
Check out all of Noble Savage's Art threads! All things art, Super Boosters, 'Lost' Costume Pieces, Buildings, Animations, and NPC Costume Piece Conversion
My understanding was that new people hired to complete a big project were the ones to be let go when the project was done; not keep the new people, and let those who have been with the project forever go in their place.
It would be good for someone in the know to let us know exactly what is going on here, because from where I sit, letting a developer of this standing go is actually quite an ominous development.
If he left voluntarily, now is the time to let us know. Because if it was not a voluntary leaving, if I worked there I would be really, really nervous. They let BaB go....? Crap, then nobody's job is safe.
Our economy in microcosm. Good luck BaB, no matter what ended up going down.
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It's amazing how far that story has spread over the years. If we could do forum polls, I'd have one to see how many people claimed to be there on the day.|
Originally Posted by Marcian Tobay
Heh heh, Oil Slick.
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I know I was one of less than a hundred to be present for it.
I will say though, that those runs of testing (and breaking) the new Hami with him and Castle and Ghost Widow there at different times will always be some of my best memories of the game.
We were giving feedback there and in the forums and it really felt like what we were saying mattered.
I still kinda wish they'd listened to us when we talked about cutting the 4 waves of mitos to 3, or replacing one of them with Mito buds, but so be it.
/em salute Godspeed Mr. Bruce
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
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Yes.
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Originally Posted by Pedro Schwartz
So,what really happenned?
BABs gone really? |
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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I refer you to this:|
Originally Posted by Bad_Influence
My understanding was that new people hired to complete a big project were the ones to be let go when the project was done; not keep the new people, and let those who have been with the project forever go in their place.
It would be good for someone in the know to let us know exactly what is going on here, because from where I sit, letting a developer of this standing go is actually quite an ominous development. If he left voluntarily, now is the time to let us know. Because if it was not a voluntary leaving, if I worked there I would be really, really nervous. They let BaB go....? Crap, then nobody's job is safe. Our economy in microcosm. Good luck BaB, no matter what ended up going down. |
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Originally Posted by SilverAgeFan
Folks need to slow down a moment. IF BABs is indeed gone, a few things to keep in mind:
In other words, if he was laid off, there is a whole lot of none-of-our-business (good or bad) behind the situation. BABs has done some great work over the years during his tenure with CoX. And even if he wasn't laid off, think about it, 5 or so years is a Looooooong time to hold a position in as dynamic an industry as his. In time, I'm sure we'll learn the truth of this rumor regarding his status. But for now folks, slow down a little on this one. |
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Though it should be noted, that sometimes, it means exactly that. It's not like a lot of companies like to give their employees notice of lay offs, as that tends to drive work down.|
Originally Posted by Goliath Bird Eater
Quite a few people in this thread that don't understand business structure and assume that "laid off" equates to "suddenly handed your pink slip by your evil boss".
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At least, my experience in the job market has said, no employer has ever given a two weeks notice.
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
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You've no idea of internal dynamics. Any developer's rapport (or lack there of) with us the player base is no clear indication of their rapport within the working environment. And the conversations leading UP TO the decision of the lay off are--I GUARANTEE YOU--being kept private from his coworkers. If it was voluntary, for whatever reason (loyalty to subordinate employees, personal conflicts with coworkers, health issues, family issues needing to move to another state, etc etc etc) it WILL STAY BEHIND CLOSED DOORS.|
Originally Posted by Bad_Influence
If he left voluntarily, now is the time to let us know. Because if it was not a voluntary leaving, if I worked there I would be really, really nervous. They let BaB go....? Crap, then nobody's job is safe.
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Why? Because if he (or anyone else) was laid off and given a severance package (be it weeks or months and months of pay and benefits), they were LAID OFF. You don't get packages for resigning. You don't get packages for being fired.
So no point in pressing the issue here publicly because we will never be told the details of what is a wholly private and potentially very difficult decision.
I have the feeling that perhaps this was more a 'amicable parting' than a 'you're laid off, clear your desk' kind of vibe.
BaB is a talented individual and I'm sure there are many job offers waiting in the wings, it seems like he might have just got tired working on CoH, he did shut himself off from the community long before this happened.
Arcanaville, since you usually have better access to them than we do, could you pass on our messages of 'Good bye and Good luck, we'll miss you' to him, I'm hopeful that you would have kept in contact with him.
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I'm up for this.
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Originally Posted by Marcian Tobay
Quick Question: Would anyone be up for meeting on a server tonight, going to Galaxy City, and hanging out as a way of paying homage to Back Alley Brawler?
The fun part is, it'd be Galaxy City. That's how you know that everyone there is there for the ceremony. My recommended details: Justice server, 7:15 PM (Pacific Time) |
Formerly "Back Alley Brawler"
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I've had more then a few jobs where I had months notice of layoffs. |
Originally Posted by BrandX
Though it should be noted, that sometimes, it means exactly that. It's not like a lot of companies like to give their employees notice of lay offs, as that tends to drive work down.
At least, my experience in the job market has said, no employer has ever given a two weeks notice. |
It depends on the industry and market your in honestly and what exactly you do. It also depends on who the person being laid off is, if they're an integral part of operations you don't do that quickly necessarily, sometimes you want an overlap period to adjust with them gone.
And as SilverAgeFan said, sometimes they're mutual, company needs to make a budget fix, someone is already looking elsewhere, so they make a plan.
But we'll never know those details because its private.
My bet however is that he's already set up elsewhere, someone mentioned Carbine and thats a very likely possibility. He's a seasoned animator, its not a far stretch to think that NCSoft may have wanted him on another, non-Paragon, project.
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Of course it could also mean that. My point (SilverAgeFan's point, actually) is that being laid off actually encompasses more than just one set of circumstances, and that - although it's human nature to do so - we shouldn't automatically speculate that the worst case scenario is what happened when we have no first-hand knowledge. That's all.
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Originally Posted by BrandX
Though it should be noted, that sometimes, it means exactly that. It's not like a lot of companies like to give their employees notice of lay offs, as that tends to drive work down.
At least, my experience in the job market has said, no employer has ever given a two weeks notice. |
Positron: "There are no bugs [in City of Heroes], just varying degrees of features."
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Yeah, no one here has any idea what went down. I am very cognizant of that. | You've no idea of internal dynamics |
That's why it looks ominous. Saying "it might have been this way or that way" is true... but we don't know which version actually went down. Meanwhile letting a lead developer go is not going to look too hot to any community, this one included.
Just sayin'.
OK this doesnt make any sense what so ever. Just what the hell happened to all that money yall made from GR? Yall must have some crazy budget issues going on to let one of the best animators go like that. I know how bad from personal experience how bad a lay off is, till this day I am still struggling to find a new job in the IT field. My prayers go out to BaBs and his family.
Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
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Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
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Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!
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I too think you're being extreme in how you interpreted his comment about Colin Brown's work. His exact phrasing was "our crack animator Colin Brown...". What is offensive about that? Should he have said "our decent-but-in-no-way-comparable-to-BaBs animator Colin Brown"? How about "Colin Brown did an acceptable job on these animations. Let me just add that Back Alley Brawler is still the superior animator, even though he had nothing to do with these and my mentioning him is somewhat absurd, given the context." |
Originally Posted by Perfidus
He's also a shill and a ham, and if you feel its ridiculously hostile for me to point that out, or to interpret his comment earlier as brushing Babs under the rug a bit, then that's fine.
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Freedom: Blazing Larb, Fiery Fulcrum, Sardan Reborn, Arctic-Frenzy, Wasabi Sam, Mr Smashtastic.
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It's been documented that only about 2,000 people quit over ED, one of the devs (I think Posi) said as much in a post once. Not that significant out of a playerbase of (at the time) around 150,000+.
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Originally Posted by Severe
hmmm thats funny...i think statesman wrote something like that right before e.d. came out and we lost half the population of this game...im just saying..soemtimes say something besides what has been said already
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Quote:
Not every company is like that. I know when I got laid off I was in complete shock about, especially since they were going to be building a new building at the time. It wasnt all rainbows and roses either. I am still bitter about it because I know they could have easily made this transition easier and not have a lay off to happen in the first place. But again we dont know how things work at NcSoft for all we know he could be laid off temporarily till CoH 2.
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Originally Posted by SilverAgeFan
Folks need to slow down a moment. IF BABs is indeed gone, a few things to keep in mind:
In other words, if he was laid off, there is a whole lot of none-of-our-business (good or bad) behind the situation. BABs has done some great work over the years during his tenure with CoX. And even if he wasn't laid off, think about it, 5 or so years is a Looooooong time to hold a position in as dynamic an industry as his. In time, I'm sure we'll learn the truth of this rumor regarding his status. But for now folks, slow down a little on this one. |
Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator
Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!
Quote:
My personal feeling is, when word came down they'd have to cut people he decided on his own to leave. Maybe he was tired of the work here and wanted a new project. His work here would make it relatively easier to get another position, and his leaving could mean keeping 2 junior staffers.|
Originally Posted by Bad_Influence
Yeah, no one here has any idea what went down. I am very cognizant of that.
That's why it looks ominous. Saying "it might have been this way or that way" is true... but we don't know which version actually went down. Meanwhile letting a lead developer go is not going to look too hot to any community, this one included. Just sayin'. |
We don't know, and nothing that has been said makes things more ominous than less.
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
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Fair enough. And the knowledge is rarely uniform. Some of these things I describe are how they looked from a middle level. Some entry level employees and even some seasoned but not as highly thought of employees who kept their jobs because a senior employee was privy to the changes coming decided to leave and let them keep salaries--they had no idea how close they had all come to getting laid off. And during this time there was in fact also talk of building a very large new building.|
Originally Posted by EvilRyu
Not every company is like that. I know when I got laid off I was in complete shock about, especially since they were going to be building a new building at the time. It wasnt all rainbows and roses either. I am still bitter about it because I know they could have easily made this transition easier and not have a lay off to happen in the first place. But again we dont know how things work at NcSoft for all we know he could be laid off temporarily till CoH 2.
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So you're right. With layoffs, not everyone always knows. And there are sometimes contradictory rumors flying around an office space.
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Agreed. I was just stating it could be all terrible and not as nice as others have said. Or how others have speculated in the postive rather than the negative.
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Originally Posted by Goliath Bird Eater
Of course it could also mean that. My point (SilverAgeFan's point, actually) is that being laid off actually encompasses more than just one set of circumstances, and that - although it's human nature to do so - we shouldn't automatically speculate that the worst case scenario is what happened when we have no first-hand knowledge. That's all.
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BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
In other words, if he was laid off, there is a whole lot of none-of-our-business (good or bad) behind the situation. BABs has done some great work over the years during his tenure with CoX. And even if he wasn't laid off, think about it, 5 or so years is a Looooooong time to hold a position in as dynamic an industry as his.
In time, I'm sure we'll learn the truth of this rumor regarding his status. But for now folks, slow down a little on this one.
A thousand time, this.
Quite a few people in this thread that don't understand business structure and assume that "laid off" equates to "suddenly handed your pink slip by your evil boss".
Positron: "There are no bugs [in City of Heroes], just varying degrees of features."