Resistence: All hail Calvin Scott?
By
Arnabas,
Posted on: 2010-03-18 11:02 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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There's also the little matter of what that empire has been doing |
Originally Posted by Marcian Tobay
Either way... a single creepy relationship vs. a man crumbling a literal empire just to get back the woman who willingly left him!? Yeah, I'd take the former and get the latter on Dr. Phil.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Bah! *dismissive wave* You want your free thinking, go to the Rogue Isles. They're all kinds of free over there.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
There's also the little matter of what that empire has been doing
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So ignorance is strength, and freedom is slavery? |
Originally Posted by Marcian Tobay
Bah! *dismissive wave* You want your free thinking, go to the Rogue Isles. They're all kinds of free over there.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Free as in "Five Fingered Discounts".
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
So ignorance is strength, and freedom is slavery?
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In the Arena of Logic, I fight unarmed.
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You heard it here first; crotch auras in the GR expansion!
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Originally Posted by Warkupo
how is he getting his pants to glow?
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@Mental Maden @Maden Mental
"....you are now tackle free for life."-ShoNuff
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That's just it; Calvin doesn't care what Cole's empire has been doings, and in fact if they gave him his wife back, he'd probably be a Loyalist. He just wants the hot, super-powered tail.|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
There's also the little matter of what that empire has been doing
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
So ignorance is strength, and freedom is slavery?
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http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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And England prevails!
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
So ignorance is strength, and freedom is slavery?
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Not when people act responsibly |
Originally Posted by Fleeting Whisper
No, freedom is anarchy.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
Calvin Scott is the demon of lust that threatens the strength and peace of Praetoria. In the name of Emperor Cole, protect our way of life.
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A minor quibble here, actual anarchy is suppose to be responsible freedom.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Not when people act responsibly
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Not sure that way of life appeals to everyone in Praetoria |
Originally Posted by Marcian Tobay
Calvin Scott is the demon of lust that threatens the strength and peace of Praetoria. In the name of Emperor Cole, protect our way of life. |
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
Dammit to hell.
I've already given up hope that there's ANYTHING remotely resembling a redeemable trait among the Praetors, so my only hope left for genuine ambiguity in this issue was for the Resistance to be manned by a group of dangerous psychotics. People who are bloodthirsty enough that the players are left to wonder if a crushing dictatorship might not be so bad, if only because the only other current option is rampant crime, war, and bloodshed. So now we get the profile of Calvin Scott, the leader, face and symbol of the Resistance...
...who's most evil act on record is that he wants to rescue the woman he loves.
For crud's sakes, the line between good and evil is now officially clearer in Praetoria than it is on Primal Earth. I'm not even kidding, the description I'm reading on this guy couldn't portray him more as a Hero if he had his last initial emblazoned on his chest. On one side, we have "Tear down the Evil Overlord, save the damsel, free the people" and the other is "Rule the world, crush all freedom and slaughter thousands". How is any of this going to appeal to the 'morally gray' nature that is supposed to lead to side switching? This is about as gray as choosing between "frolicking with unicorns" and "selling your soul to Satan".
The Abrams is one of the most effective war machines on the planet. - R. Lee Ermy.
Q: How do you wreck an Abrams?
A: You crash into another one.
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People can't do that with beer, you expect them to do it with the world? |
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Not when people act responsibly
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http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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I'm getting the feeling that the Resistance is going to get the 'heroes' to do things that in Primal earth basically mean terrorism. One mans Freedom Fighter is another mans terrorist after all. |
Originally Posted by M_I_Abrahms
Dammit to hell.
I've already given up hope that there's ANYTHING remotely resembling a redeemable trait among the Praetors, so my only hope left for genuine ambiguity in this issue was for the Resistance to be manned by a group of dangerous psychotics. People who are bloodthirsty enough that the players are left to wonder if a crushing dictatorship might not be so bad, if only because the only other current option is rampant crime, war, and bloodshed. So now we get the profile of Calvin Scott, the leader, face and symbol of the Resistance... ...who's most evil act on record is that he wants to rescue the woman he loves. For crud's sakes, the line between good and evil is now officially clearer in Praetoria than it is on Primal Earth. I'm not even kidding, the description I'm reading on this guy couldn't portray him more as a Hero if he had his last initial emblazoned on his chest. On one side, we have "Tear down the Evil Overlord, save the damsel, free the people" and the other is "Rule the world, crush all freedom and slaughter thousands". How is any of this going to appeal to the 'morally gray' nature that is supposed to lead to side switching? This is about as gray as choosing between "frolicking with unicorns" and "selling your soul to Satan". |
Keep in mind that the Resistance would attract exactly the same sort of people that the Freakshow attracts on Primal Earth, guys and gals angry at the system, tired of being 'put down' and more than willing to just blow stuff up as a stress release. The only difference is that the Resistance has something to aim at which does need to be bought down while the Freakshow just have 'society' to aim at which has usually done them no wrong.
So while the head honcho may be all about saving his woman, I can quite easily picture other Resistance contacts being about blowing up buildings under the pretense that they're trying to free people but actually just enjoy blowing stuff up.
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It's only roflmao 'cause it's true.
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Originally Posted by M_I_Abrahms
.... How is any of this going to appeal to the 'morally gray' nature that is supposed to lead to side switching? This is about as gray as choosing between "frolicking with unicorns" and "selling your soul to Satan".
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I don't suffer from altitis, I enjoy every minute of it.
Thank you Devs & Community people for a great game.
So sad to be ending ):
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Why can't we frolic with Satan or sell our souls to a unicorn?
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Originally Posted by M_I_Abrahms
How is any of this going to appeal to the 'morally gray' nature that is supposed to lead to side switching? This is about as gray as choosing between "frolicking with unicorns" and "selling your soul to Satan".
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It'd be nice if those were options, but I'm not seeing them.
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Originally Posted by NarfMann
Why can't we frolic with Satan or sell our souls to a unicorn?
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The Abrams is one of the most effective war machines on the planet. - R. Lee Ermy.
Q: How do you wreck an Abrams?
A: You crash into another one.
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Well, Tyrant is a lot like Satan, and the vast majority of the people on his side live long, happy lives as free as they care to be. Calvin Scott looks all heroic and nicey-nice, but if you join him you'd better believe your life is going to be miserable and short.
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Originally Posted by M_I_Abrahms
It'd be nice if those were options, but I'm not seeing them.
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So you're saying that Going Rogue will have the Resistance be the side that will turn people evil, and Tyrant turn Villains good. You say this even though (as Golden Girl will tell us...repeatedly) the devs have stated that Resistance=Hero and Praetor=Villain? That would mean that every piece of information we've gotten starting with Hero-Con has been a campaign of misinformation. That they are intentionally playing up Tyrant=Evil, because THAT is the charade?|
Originally Posted by Dr_Mechano
I'm getting the feeling that the Resistance is going to get the 'heroes' to do things that in Primal earth basically mean terrorism. One mans Freedom Fighter is another mans terrorist after all.
Keep in mind that the Resistance would attract exactly the same sort of people that the Freakshow attracts on Primal Earth, guys and gals angry at the system, tired of being 'put down' and more than willing to just blow stuff up as a stress release. The only difference is that the Resistance has something to aim at which does need to be bought down while the Freakshow just have 'society' to aim at which has usually done them no wrong. So while the head honcho may be all about saving his woman, I can quite easily picture other Resistance contacts being about blowing up buildings under the pretense that they're trying to free people but actually just enjoy blowing stuff up. |
It's an interesting ploy, and one that places a lot of faith in the cleverness of the devs. I'll have to think about this a bit.
The Abrams is one of the most effective war machines on the planet. - R. Lee Ermy.
Q: How do you wreck an Abrams?
A: You crash into another one.
By the way, did anyone notice that he's a Mercs/traps MM? So do you think he'll have special pets that are Resistance members, the way Recluse's pets are Arachnos soldiers?
EDIT: He also seems to be wearing a holster.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Chimera has a mission for you - a Praetorian citizen recently spoke out against Tyrant, and was taken to the Asylum - now his wife is asking difficult questions - go to her house and arrest her - she's to join her husband at the Asylum to be mindwiped.|
Originally Posted by M_I_Abrahms
It'd be nice if those were options, but I'm not seeing them.
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Belladonna Vetrano has a mission for you - a Praetorian citizen recently spoke out against Tyrant, and was taken to the Asylum - now his wife is asking difficult questions - go to her house help her escape to the underground before Tyrant's thugs show up.
Calvin Scott has a mission for you - the Nova Praetoria City Library contains only pro-Tyrant propaganda books - go there and destroy his lies, along with the building.
Chimera has a mission for you - intelligence reports suggest the Resistance is planning on blowing up the Nova Praetoria City Library - go there and protect the citizens and staff from harm.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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No. Just no |
Originally Posted by M_I_Abrahms
So you're saying that Going Rogue will have the Resistance be the side that will turn people evil, and Tyrant turn Villains good. You say this even though (as Golden Girl will tell us...repeatedly) the devs have stated that Resistance=Hero and Praetor=Villain? That would mean that every piece of information we've gotten starting with Hero-Con has been a campaign of misinformation. That they are intentionally playing up Tyrant=Evil, because THAT is the charade?
It's an interesting ploy, and one that places a lot of faith in the cleverness of the devs. I'll have to think about this a bit. |
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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A Hero can't even begin to fall, at least when it's not ham handed bad writing, unless he has a reason to join an organization that will turn out to be evil. We don't have a reason to join Tyrant's Army. Not any more. He's been painted with such vast, deep and stark evil that even Westin Phipps would get the heebie jeebies around him. He is the most evil being this side of the gates of Hell themselves. His government is the worst, the absolute WORST parts of 1984, Nazi Germany, and the Rogue Isles themselves.|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
No. Just no
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I've been arguing on the side that Heroes have SOME excuse to join Tyrant and be turned evil. With every bit of info we get, those excuses are stripped away, to the point were even some of my VILLAINS would think he's scum. All I've wanted is a reason for good people to associate themselves with this pile of human filth.
I've said before that you can't paint stark black and white and call it gray. Well, there's one way I could possibly be wrong. Once the paint is laid, the black starts to fade, and the white gets dingy. Utopia is as black and vile as it comes, and the Resistance is everything pure in fiction. The only way for there to be gray is for the extremes to fade away.
The Abrams is one of the most effective war machines on the planet. - R. Lee Ermy.
Q: How do you wreck an Abrams?
A: You crash into another one.
Well yes obviously the Resistance = heroes and Praetorian guard = villains.
But in order to be free the Resistance are going to have to do some drastic things, picture blowing up Cole monuments, institutions such as the hospital mentioned. There is still room for a morally grey area. Yes you can be doing good but some of the stuff you have to do won't go down well.
Also the Resistance are technically 'well intentioned Extremists' and in any group like that you're going to get people who don't really care about 'the cause' and only there because it allows them to do things like shoot a cops or blow up buildings.
So you kind of missed my original point, I wasn't saying that the Resistance was evil just that while the Resistance goal in general is a good thing and most Resistance members are 'fighting for the cause', you're going to get a few people of a certain violent nature taking advantage of the Resistance views in order to just blow crap up.
Either way... a single creepy relationship vs. a man crumbling a literal empire just to get back the woman who willingly left him!? Yeah, I'd take the former and get the latter on Dr. Phil.
She moved on. You need too, as well.
Edit: Seriously? When and why did I start my "Picture in every post" phase!?