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there's a good reason why there's no answer. The devs haven't given one.|
Originally Posted by Neptus
I searched and searched for this answer but didn't find it. I'd be very surprised if it wasn't already covered though.
Will VEAT's and or HEAT's ever be able to customized their power colors? Maybe it's just a bug that they can't now? Thanks, Neptus |
The basic problem is that with the Epic Archtypes... the powers are not yours. Your are borrowing somebody else's power-set and abilities. Because of this it is possible that Epic Archtypes may not get color customizations.
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That is only true for patron powers, not ancillary powers.|
Originally Posted by je_saist
there's a good reason why there's no answer. The devs haven't given one.
The basic problem is that with the Epic Archtypes... the powers are not yours. Your are borrowing somebody else's power-set and abilities. Because of this it is possible that Epic Archtypes may not get color customizations. |
The issue with epic archetypes is the powers come from the same fictional source, function in the same ways, and presumably should look the same. This is somewhat true of patron powers as well, where the powers are boons granted by a particular patron and aren't really a power of the player character. We haven't made any firm decisions to do or not do customization for Epic Archetypes or patron powers. Ancillary powers is perfectly reasonable, but we wouldn't be able to do those without doing patron powers at the same time...even though we hate villains.
All of them would happen after Pool power customization, and that isn't likely to happen anytime before Going Rogue gets wrapped up (requires tech and UI work).
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I knew it!
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Originally Posted by BackAlleyBrawler
...even though we hate villains.
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@Phillon
Twitter @FiveIronBrony
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I stand clarified.
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Originally Posted by BackAlleyBrawler
That is only true for patron powers, not ancillary powers.
The issue with epic archetypes is the powers come from the same fictional source, function in the same ways, and presumably should look the same. This is somewhat true of patron powers as well, where the powers are boons granted by a particular patron and aren't really a power of the player character. We haven't made any firm decisions to do or not do customization for Epic Archetypes or patron powers. Ancillary powers is perfectly reasonable, but we wouldn't be able to do those without doing patron powers at the same time...even though we hate villains. All of them would happen after Pool power customization, and that isn't likely to happen anytime before Going Rogue gets wrapped up (requires tech and UI work). |
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I'm having a hard time understanding whether the reason for not having VEAT, patron, (and by association) ancillary power customization is based on tech limitations or RP reasons. If it's for tech reasons, that's completely understandable. If it's for RP reasons, it's kind of like the "dark" theme for <powerset redacted> that got added and then removed during closed beta because of "thematic reasons." I guess there's a difference between what the players can come up with for theme on their characters and what the devs think is okay, and restricting player options because of an arbitrary decision that "you shouldn't be able to color something this way for this reason" isn't usually a good reason in the eyes of players who have concepts they're unable to bring to life.
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Originally Posted by BackAlleyBrawler
That is only true for patron powers, not ancillary powers.
The issue with epic archetypes is the powers come from the same fictional source, function in the same ways, and presumably should look the same. This is somewhat true of patron powers as well, where the powers are boons granted by a particular patron and aren't really a power of the player character. We haven't made any firm decisions to do or not do customization for Epic Archetypes or patron powers. Ancillary powers is perfectly reasonable, but we wouldn't be able to do those without doing patron powers at the same time...even though we hate villains. All of them would happen after Pool power customization, and that isn't likely to happen anytime before Going Rogue gets wrapped up (requires tech and UI work). |
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
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Let me preface this by saying I have the utmost respect for BABs|
Originally Posted by BackAlleyBrawler
The issue with epic archetypes is the powers come from the same fictional source, function in the same ways, and presumably should look the same. This is somewhat true of patron powers as well, where the powers are boons granted by a particular patron and aren't really a power of the player character. We haven't made any firm decisions to do or not do customization for Epic Archetypes or patron powers. Ancillary powers is perfectly reasonable, but we wouldn't be able to do those without doing patron powers at the same time...even though we hate villains.
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Limiting the customization on VEAT powers because they come from the same fictional source is blatant archetypism (new word). It is also contradicted by in-game lore.
During the Westin Phippis mission Check out Longbow attack on Crey Facility the captive Dr. Nova states, "It was only a matter of time until something like this would happen. Recluse was ingenious. He's had Arachnos gathering psychic children for years, and built two great forces, each army part of his strategy to fully control the forces that destroy all conquerors. The Fortunatas are his front line troops in a war against fate itself.."
From that statement seems arachnos was not picky on how the young, soon-to-be fortunata's power manifested. The child could've been a muntant born with their abilities, or something that came about do to experimentation or magical influence.
In contradiction, the Issue 12 preview trailer described Fortunatas as Blood Widows who had natural psychic talent. Now if this is what you were referring to by coming from a fictional source i'll give you that. However, if that is the case, any character who gained their mental powers through discipline and training should be forced to the same restriction. IE.. any natural origin character with psychic powers. There are no such restrictions placed on other psychic powersets. Why are Fortunatas punished in this way?
Might be something to run past Manticore?
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AGH! I hate, hate, HATE the Red Lightning! |
Originally Posted by BackAlleyBrawler
That is only true for patron powers, not ancillary powers.
The issue with epic archetypes is the powers come from the same fictional source, function in the same ways, and presumably should look the same. This is somewhat true of patron powers as well, where the powers are boons granted by a particular patron and aren't really a power of the player character. We haven't made any firm decisions to do or not do customization for Epic Archetypes or patron powers. Ancillary powers is perfectly reasonable, but we wouldn't be able to do those without doing patron powers at the same time...even though we hate villains. All of them would happen after Pool power customization, and that isn't likely to happen anytime before Going Rogue gets wrapped up (requires tech and UI work). |
I've spec'd out Patron powers on my Elec brute because of how bad it looks.
The plastic tips at the end of shoelaces are called aglets. Their true purpose is sinister.
--The Question, JLU
Babs, while I have great respect for you, I think you are off on this one.
If we weren't to be allowed to 'stand out' in Arachnos as our VEATs, then we shouldn't also be allowed to have our own special uniforms.
We should be able to stand out from the Rank and File of Arachnos, proving we are 'better' than they are.
And with HEATs, I feel that there is easily enough feel for 'color tintable' versions of the powers so that we can look *similar* to others, but also stand out as our own heroes.
This is bad forced role play.
Still here, even after all this time!
I think that pool customization and by extension Ancillary/Patron Pools as well as VEATs and HEATs, much like the customization of power sets is probably something that takes a lot of staff hours to accomplish. Currently as much of the staff as possible is working on getting Going Rogue ready for Beta and the scheduled 2nd quarter launch.
That's my 2 inf, of course since it's reasonable and intelligent it will probably get ignored
On Justice
Global @Desi Nova Twitter: @desi_nova Steam: Desi_nova. I don't do Xbox or PS3
I'm sure someone can think of a clever rationale for VEAT/PPP colour customization. Perhaps the abilities manifest differently in certain people, or perhaps the energy used to tap into these powers alters the hue. Who knows! 
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| The basic problem is that with the Epic Archtypes... the powers are not yours. Your are borrowing somebody else's power-set and abilities. Because of this it is possible that Epic Archtypes may not get color customizations. |
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Originally Posted by BackAlleyBrawler
That is only true for patron powers, not ancillary powers.......
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But of course I always had trouble with the idea that slottable powers were granted, and not the character's own. If my character could learn to use them in better/different ways, (that is enhance them) they have some sway and ownership over them. Otherwise, the patron pools should have been "permanent" temp powers, given by the patrons and unchangable.
So, my /Willpower Brute's Indomitable Will can be any color in the rainbow, or indeed invisible, but my Widow's Indomitable Will is profoundly different, and must be represented by a pulsing yellow aura that clashes with the color scheme of her other powers?
While I understand the RP reasoning that PPPs and Epic ATs wouldn't be customizable, to use that as a reason not to eventually do customization of their powers is...well...cheap. Its not like they haven't tried to shoehorn a semi-logical explanation for other aspects of the game before (Dr. Brainstorm and power proliferation). Surely they can find some reason to fit with the RP elements that all the sudden instead of red lightning, there's various colors, or that now the Kheldians come in multiple colors (easy one right there: different races? it works for humans) Or just not even try and come up with it and just do it. If a player really wants to stick to the original RP rules for these characters, they have the option to NOT change THEIR colors.
Note, I'm not accusing the devs of trying to back out of it or anything of that nature, mearly stating my opinion against some of these people trying to cite roleplaying reasons for reasons why they should never be put in place. I completely understand that they (hopefully) are coming eventually when y'all have time. As a developer myself, I COMPLETELY understand the idea that quality development takes time.
Well for the Kheldians, since it's a union of two beings the changes could be reflective of the hosts personality causing a change in how the energy of the Kheldian is manifested. The two eventually become one whole being so it makes sense that aspects of the host would become more apparent.
for PPP's it would simply be the Villain learning the power and working with it to make it their own. Another possibility(which I think many of the Rp'ers already use) is to simply ignore any inconveintly shoe-horned game explanations/mechanics that do not work well with the character they are creating.
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I understand the whole "You work for Arachnos. You use their tech," angle. But... we get to design our costumes and colors. Outside of us, Fortunatas and Bane Spiders are supposed to have a uniform that always looks the same way. We're special. If we can give our costumes their own flair, I don't see why our powers should retain their uniformity. |
Originally Posted by BackAlleyBrawler
That is only true for patron powers, not ancillary powers.
The issue with epic archetypes is the powers come from the same fictional source, function in the same ways, and presumably should look the same. |
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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Am I the only one who read the above and said, "Hmmm, makes enough sense to me" and moved on? The Devs can pretty much do whatever they want to do.|
Originally Posted by BackAlleyBrawler
That is only true for patron powers, not ancillary powers.
The issue with epic archetypes is the powers come from the same fictional source, function in the same ways, and presumably should look the same. This is somewhat true of patron powers as well, where the powers are boons granted by a particular patron and aren't really a power of the player character. We haven't made any firm decisions to do or not do customization for Epic Archetypes or patron powers. Ancillary powers is perfectly reasonable, but we wouldn't be able to do those without doing patron powers at the same time...even though we hate villains. All of them would happen after Pool power customization, and that isn't likely to happen anytime before Going Rogue gets wrapped up (requires tech and UI work). |
Then again, I am also the guy who doesn't think that Dark should be customizable because dark is dark, and not white, etc... or Fire for that matter, because, well, in general it is FIRE colored... or... well, you get the idea.
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Generally it's my belief that more options is better. If you think fire should be fire colored (which, fire can be blue, green, and white for the record), you have every ability to leave it that color. People who have other ideas or concepts (I have a toon who uses green and purple mystic fire from spells) can recolor it.|
Originally Posted by Thirty_Seven
Then again, I am also the guy who doesn't think that Dark should be customizable because dark is dark, and not white, etc... or Fire for that matter, because, well, in general it is FIRE colored... or... well, you get the idea.
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People who want to stick with the Arachnos concept are welcome to retain the color of their powers. People who have other ideas and plans can justify the changes however they want. That's their choice.
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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Good point.|
Originally Posted by Dispari
Generally it's my belief that more options is better. If you think fire should be fire colored (which, fire can be blue, green, and white for the record), you have every ability to leave it that color. People who have other ideas or concepts (I have a toon who uses green and purple mystic fire from spells) can recolor it.
People who want to stick with the Arachnos concept are welcome to retain the color of their powers. People who have other ideas and plans can justify the changes however they want. That's their choice. |
The important thing to note is that you have a REASON to change your fire from "normal" fire. My issue is that lots of folks change it for no good reason at all... and since there is no way to make sure each character has a concept of why their darkness powers are now yellow, I favored just to not give the option at all... but I suppose it is wrong to penalize those of us who WOULD have reasoning and DO have creativity for those lacking one or both.
(And yes I know fire can be more than just redish orange, hence why I said "in general.")
Dark Melee is just a name on a powerset -it doesn't have to represent darkness at all, just a collection of powers you like the effects of. Why limit your imagination because of the names on a few powers?
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Because the powers represent darkness. Dark Melee is the name of the powerset because it describes what the powerset and where the source or effects of the powers come from.
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Originally Posted by Star_Seer
Dark Melee is just a name on a powerset -it doesn't have to represent darkness at all, just a collection of powers you like the effects of. Why limit your imagination because of the names on a few powers?
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On my Egyptian defender her dark colors have been made tan and golds... and represent ancient mystic sands. And it does a great job of it too. Once you hard code yourself into literal translations of everything you really limit your experiences.|
Originally Posted by je_saist
Because the powers represent darkness. Dark Melee is the name of the powerset because it describes what the powerset and where the source or effects of the powers come from.
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Have you never played Calvin Ball?
I tend to agree with most of the crowd here: Saying that PPP and EATS shouldn't be customizable because of their source is kind of disingenuous. Was there given a "canon" reason for why, all of a sudden, regular heroes can fling powers in every color of the rainbow? I must have missed that message from Dr. Brainstorm. As other posters have previously put forth, there are any number of story options to justify the changes to be made. However, I completely understand that you guys are neck-deep in GR and if we have to wait to see the other custom sets then that's okay. Just don't insult our intelligence with explanations like that. We're big boys and girls, we can handle a straightforward "We're really friggin' busy working on this other thing, it's not a priority right now."
BaBs, I want you to know that I have the utmost respect for you and the team and all you do for us. I really do. But this feels like a cop-out.
Hello, my name is @Caligdoiel and I'm an altoholic.
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As much as I love you BaBs, I feel the need to argue my case here.|
Originally Posted by BackAlleyBrawler
That is only true for patron powers, not ancillary powers.
The issue with epic archetypes is the powers come from the same fictional source, function in the same ways, and presumably should look the same. This is somewhat true of patron powers as well, where the powers are boons granted by a particular patron and aren't really a power of the player character. We haven't made any firm decisions to do or not do customization for Epic Archetypes or patron powers. Ancillary powers is perfectly reasonable, but we wouldn't be able to do those without doing patron powers at the same time...even though we hate villains. All of them would happen after Pool power customization, and that isn't likely to happen anytime before Going Rogue gets wrapped up (requires tech and UI work). |
Arachnos WEAPONS perhaps come from the same source, but unless there's something you're not telling us then (especially concerning things Sister Psyche says in the Origin of Power arc) psionics have been around a long time and are super mysterious, and there's no telling if they come from the same source. Everyone else in the world can have a green psionic tornado or a red psionic lance, and I'd love my widow to have white or deep blue psionic powers when she gets to be a fortunata, it seems only fair to me. Patron powers I can understand the need to keep as is since they come from another source though I did see someone mention earlier that it very much seems like someone teaching you how to use them and you making it your own so it could be argued, but out of Mace and Leviathan mastery I can't really see much needing to be customized, Soul just barely but Mu is probably the most desired change, that's not really and issue with me though.
As far as Kheldians go, I can make a similar argument. Kheldians are all individuals as far as I can tell, and they might just happen to have a different energy signature or wavelength or any number of differences. If you're going by the star based look alot of people think they have then think Red Shift and Blue Shift. I personally want a Peacebringer that battles evil with glorious golden light. Would make me much more inclined to play one. Same with Warshade, energy signatures/wavelengths/what-have-you. I'd love to be able to make my Warshade powers red or sickly green. Heck, if you wanna be reeeeeeally nice to us all you could give us a couple of different particle effect types to choose from ala gem and magma sets from Earth powers. Like some Khelds have stronger controll over their abilities so they're more streamlined than tendrily, or some of them have powers that can resemble flame because they're a little unstable. Just that alone would give use an awesome amount of customization.
And as far as ancillary powers, there's no reason to not offer them as custom as they're supposedly new powers awakening in your character, and I seem to recall a dev at some point saying that ancillarys ARE on the list they're just behind power pools and both are waiting on interface issues to be resolved.
tl;dr There's really no reason to deny us EAT customization (or at least for khelds and widow psionics) other than a heavy-handed decision to limit the playerbase to some pre-established notion they they HAVE to be that way. Epics, the same, Patrons, could use it but if not it's understandable.
Okay this RP stuff is getting on my nerves.
Unless BABs was seriously joking, I don't think RP should limit customization in anyway.
Techwise, yeah, I was expecting for us not to see any more color cust until AFTER GR launched.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
I searched and searched for this answer but didn't find it. I'd be very surprised if it wasn't already covered though.
Will VEAT's and or HEAT's ever be able to customized their power colors? Maybe it's just a bug that they can't now?
Thanks,
Neptus