Going Rogue and Supergroups...

This is one of those logic questions that's been kind of bugging me...

Currently, the game is 90% Segregated. Each side has their own classes, their own content, and overlap only exists in a few places.

When Going Rogue comes out, people are going to be hopping sides like mad, partially for new content, partially for badges, partially because they really like brutes and want to take them to Paragon for a change.

But... here's the thing... Currently, supergroups are side segregated. When GR comes out, people are going to want to switch sides, but their is kind of... tied...

I mean, from an immersion point of view, it makes sense to force people to quit their SGs when switching sides... But depending on how often you need to switch sides, this could just be impractical.

And what if you lead a SG? Does everyone switch sides? Do you lose all of your prestige?

Will all SG's become neutral?

This is one of those questions that just sort of awkwardly nags at you... especially with Hero Con coming up...

I'm guessing you'll have to leave - I mean, you could hardly expect to remain a member in good standing of the Legion of Doom if you were suddenly buddies with Superman, right? - but that is, of necessity, only a guess. It's a good question, though, to which nobody (other than the people working on the software right now) can yet know the answer.

Going Rogue means you leave all current ties associated with you and start a "new life" either in crime or heroics. Thus i'ld be VERY suprised if you did get to keep your supergroup rank/membership.

This is one of those things people have been asking for forever... but when people wanted it and wanted it... I doubt many of them thought about the consequences to their actions...

It wont bother someone like me thoe, because I have an SG or VG on both sides of the server... that all *my/our* characters are in... but for people who dont have that luxury at this time with fully pimped out bases... I can see this little afterthought of SGs and prestige earned as being an issue.

I'd hope that if you're going to switch sides back and forth all the time, you'll just have to rejoin the SG/VG.

Wouldn't make since any other way.

i'm hoping tbh, you cant join a sg or vg when rogue.

Vanguard is an existing organization that accepts both heroes and villains into its membership in order to repel Rikti invasion.

Just create a new Vanguard Reserve Unit. Bases accessible through all existing base portals but when you leave you can only enter alignment-appropriate areas. It's the perfect in-game answer to the problem since it already has all the necessary history and structure in place.

Then give the base builders Vanguard-style decorations and base items to play with.

Well, if I did have to venture a guess at what might be coming up for SGs, I might have to venture this:

I could easily see the devs borrowing another page from DAoC and having three factions after GR: Heroes, "Neutrals" (for lack of a better term), and Villains. In regards to base raids, Hero bases could be raided by Neutrals and Villains; Villain bases could be raided by Neutrals and Heroes; and Neutral bases could be raided by Heroes and Villains.

There might be some lateral movement with memberships. From Ten Ton Hammer:

And that still doesn't answer what happens if the leader decides to switch sides.

I mean, the easiest thing to do would be to make all SGs Neutral, and have the owners enforce H/V/N faction ties. It does **** for immersion, but it's easiest way I can think of...

I mean, otherwise the entire system would be upended.

There are several groups out there who have both a supergroup and a villain group. I'd see that as a great and easy solution to most of the problem. Just transition from your unit's SG to its VG, or vice versa. If they don't have the other, they probably soon will.

Personally I've talked these things out in depth with some of the members of Dream Team (my current SG on Guardian Server - perhaps you've heard of us :P) and we've basically come out with a number of things we'd like to see, as well as what is likely to happen.

Obvious conflicts: 1. influence/infamy, 2. super group membership and how often you can switch sides, 3. auction house/black market, (more detail below)

1. as far as influence and infamy goes, it's a pretty complicated issue. How will characters "transfer" their currency? Will they be able to do so at all? If not, do they have to give it away or transfer it to another one of their toons?
* the likely course will be something along the lines of what WoW has with the aliance/hoarde gold system transfer. just like with the goblins in WoW, there will likely be some shady mafia/bookie types in the game that will transfer your in-game currency for a fee or percentage. While the fee may be steep, it's better than nothing.

2. super group membership is the main topic of this thread, and can go one of 2 ways, and it all depends on how often you can switch back and forth.
* If they truly are aiming for that "riding the grey line" thing, they would have to come up with a way to litterally be a double agent and be able to maintain a hero SG and a villain SG. Now it's unlikely that it will be as simple as the click of a button, but something along the lines of a taskforce would be acceptable/logical. It's rather unreasonable to make the decision absolute and final, as it would get rid of that grey area all together and would upset many if they regretted their decision to switch sides. the other unlikely option is to make the switch final, where the need to disolve all ties to one's old SG is a necessity.

3. finally there's the auction house/black market issue.
* There is undoubtedly going to be a flux of recipes and salvage going from one side to the other with the intent to make a killing on the market (for example, heros loading up on celerity +stealth procs and going to villains where it's value is much, much higher). The only way we can see this being fixed is for the markets to be merged somehow. Granted that the prices will eventually balance out somewhere inbetween the lower prices of one side and the higher prices of the other, but the end result will allow both sides to have equal access to what is for sale without allowing anyone to take advantage of the current going prices.

any and all criticism on the above mentioned is welcome, and your opinions on what may come to pass is encouraged

I'd like to finish by saying that it's rather annoying to have received absolutely no official news on Going Rogue beyond the initial posting sometime in May. The website has had no changes or updates since it's creation, and the character profile of Tyrant has said "coming soon" for 5 months now. To throw us a bone every once in a while wouldn't be so bad, right?

I don't think it's too "out-there" to assume the devs are going to add an SG option to determine your tolerance level.

Vanguard takes all supers, for the greater survival of Earth.

What if I want my SG to act the same? If we all decide we have a common enemy, I see no need to be exclusive. Like the assumed "slider" of your alignment, I imagine super groups having much the same. Fall outside SG tolerances...fall outside the SG.

ChaosExMachina brings up a few other good points of concern that have been questioned by the members of my SG, I had forgotten to mention them. Those being the "restarting at level 1", which AT's will/will not be able to switch (namely the epic ATs), and only "new characters" will be able to enter GR.

IMO, all of these are unlikely, as the whole lure to GR is being able to take a character you've already built up (ex, a decked out stalker) and take it to the other side (to give the villains a taste of their own medicine in RV). Am I wrong in assuming this?

So making a new character and making say a mastermind on blue side from level 1 when you already have the one you want at 50 would mean playing the same character over again. I don't think anyone wants to do that.

And if they limit the epic ATs to their current respective sides, it would really limit the story aspect of the game. What's to say that a SoA wouldn't get tired of following Lord Recluse's orders and the "Destined One" plot line, and of robbing banks? Maybe he would like to take his services(and his spider pack) to paragon city for a change of pace/heart to help people or even to get back at Arachnos?