If you're not having fun, then leave. No point in wasting your time and money on something you don't like.
And FYI, you can still face the same challenges in AE, as well as face even more challenges outside AE.
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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If your goal is to say "I did that" then why do you need xp/inf/drops along with that? If your true goal is a sense of accomplishment, why do the shinies (or lack thereof) matter? If you're pressing buttons to beat even level foes, and pressing buttons to beat high level/rank foes, how is beating the latter by any stretch of the imagination "hard work"?|
I build superior toons in CoX by careful examination of every tiny minute set bonus possible. My toons are able to solo 300 of any single type of boss in a single room. What I enjoy is facing the hordes of enemies and laying waste to them all. I use no exploit what so ever. I expect to be rewarded for all my hard work, but the developers of this game insist on nerfing every high end challenge I can face. |
You speak out of both sides of your mouth. Make up your mind what your motivations are, and let them motivate you, or not. Your choice.
PS If you were facing 300 bosses in a room without breaking a sweat, you were using an exploit. You're using the specialized spawning rules of AE, in conjunction with the aggro limits to gain an unfair advantage in terms of rewards as opposed to people who cannot. Just because you don't feel it was one, doesn't mean it wasn't.
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
If you can still take on 300 bosses that are tough enough to provide you with a challenge, then you should get experience for those bosses. But, taking on those 300 bosses is really designed around taking on Lts and Minions too. If that wasn't the case, there would be more missions that have only Bosses in the non-AE content, and in fact there are some that people farm.
If you CAN'T take on 300 bosses in the non-AE content, then maybe it was the AE all along, and those bosses aren't really as tough as "real" bosses. Risk versus reward, easier foes should give less XP.
If it was the challenge, and you liked that, that's fine, but risk versus reward. Many players can't possibly defeat foes like that. So if you were at the same risk as those players, you wouldn't be able to defeat them either. You are able to defeat them, ergo your risk is less. Your "hard work" is no harder than someone else defeating a challenge they find equally difficult.
The question is, should you get extra XP, for slotting IOs, and creating custom critters, and finding, well, "tactical advantages"? My question is, if you work so hard to create these incredible builds, farm for huge amounts of influence, and only end up making yourself bored because the game becomes too easy, why don't you just start over and not use any IOs? Why don't you play something gimped, like a petless Mastermind? A challenge is a challenge, whether you're facing 300 bosses, or 3 minions. Is it knowing that there's nothing in the game that can compete with you, unless you make it yourself?
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This.|
Originally Posted by Jade_Dragon
If you can still take on 300 bosses that are tough enough to provide you with a challenge, then you should get experience for those bosses. But, taking on those 300 bosses is really designed around taking on Lts and Minions too. If that wasn't the case, there would be more missions that have only Bosses in the non-AE content, and in fact there are some that people farm.
If you CAN'T take on 300 bosses in the non-AE content, then maybe it was the AE all along, and those bosses aren't really as tough as "real" bosses. Risk versus reward, easier foes should give less XP. If it was the challenge, and you liked that, that's fine, but risk versus reward. Many players can't possibly defeat foes like that. So if you were at the same risk as those players, you wouldn't be able to defeat them either. You are able to defeat them, ergo your risk is less. Your "hard work" is no harder than someone else defeating a challenge they find equally difficult. The question is, should you get extra XP, for slotting IOs, and creating custom critters, and finding, well, "tactical advantages"? My question is, if you work so hard to create these incredible builds, farm for huge amounts of influence, and only end up making yourself bored because the game becomes too easy, why don't you just start over and not use any IOs? Why don't you play something gimped, like a petless Mastermind? A challenge is a challenge, whether you're facing 300 bosses, or 3 minions. Is it knowing that there's nothing in the game that can compete with you, unless you make it yourself? |
A challenge is what you make it to be. It doesn't always have to be everything min/maxed.
Another example for a challenge? Create a MAN build. Take normal powers until you can take power pool powers, then just take power pool powers. You can use up to 4 separate power pools to take powers from.
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If you want a challenge, try joing a ship raid... and then soloing the center of the ship... why don't you solo Ukon Grai, while you are at it.|
Originally Posted by ThugsRus
Okay, my attempt to make humorous metaphores to the current situation with Issue 16 failed miserably. Let's try a direct approach.
I build superior toons in CoX by careful examination of every tiny minute set bonus possible. My toons are able to solo 300 of any single type of boss in a single room. What I enjoy is facing the hordes of enemies and laying waste to them all. I use no exploit what so ever. I expect to be rewarded for all my hard work, but the developers of this game insist on nerfing every high end challenge I can face. My friends' who enjoy the same aspect of this game are all on the verge of quitting. I too am on the verge of quitting. My question ... Is it time to quit? I can't seem to find any enjoyment left in this game and I don't want to abandon a game that I've invested so much in, but I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel. |
If that doesn't seem hard enough (heck, it might not be)... then maybe you are just too awesome for this game and should move on to greener pastures. I hear Progress Quest is fantastic!
Solo AVs. Do the RWZ Challenge. See how far you get venture into the Shadow Shard.
If you want to challenge yourself, don't come crying about how they took away your 'challenge'. There's plenty of ridiculously hard self-imposed challenges in this game.
300 bosses? Not even Stone tankers can pull that off without significant, and I mean significant trouble. The way the AE worked was just wrong.
My suggestions:
Go to the difficulty contact.
Set level to +4.
Set team equivalent to 8.
Set preference to Face Bosses when Solo.
Set preference to Face Heroes/Archvillains at full power.
If this still isn't a challenge enough for you, fire up a LRSF and then have the remainder of your team bail. Solo it. If THAT isn't enough, you're using some sort of game-breaker.
Your post baffles me. Not only does it not make sense, it makes me feel like you're either A) trolling, or B) too used to AE boss farming to actually make heads or tails of the game. But you sound too sincere to be a troll, so...
My guides:Dark Melee/Dark Armor/Soul Mastery, Illusion Control/Kinetics/Primal Forces Mastery, Electric Armor
"Dark Armor is a complete waste as a tanking set."
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Well, not really. The aggro limits mean you can't have more than 17 attacking you at once. Certainly 17 is impressive, but your first claim was more than an order of magnitude worth of exaggeration.|
Originally Posted by ThugsRus
I build superior toons in CoX by careful examination of every tiny minute set bonus possible. My toons are able to solo 300 of any single type of boss in a single room.
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What I enjoy is facing the hordes of enemies and laying waste to them all. I use no exploit what so ever. I expect to be rewarded for all my hard work, but the developers of this game insist on nerfing every high end challenge I can face. My friends' who enjoy the same aspect of this game are all on the verge of quitting. I too am on the verge of quitting. My question ... Is it time to quit? I can't seem to find any enjoyment left in this game and I don't want to abandon a game that I've invested so much in, but I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel. |
Let me ask you something, though. Have you spent much time OUTSIDE of the AE building? Do you actually KNOW what the rest of the game is like, from personal experience? If you've tried every other part of the game, and the only thing you like is imbalanced AE missions, then it probably is time to move on.
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
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Hey, Progress Quest IS fantastic! It's the only game I can play on the computer when I'm not at the computer.
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Originally Posted by Thirty_Seven
If you want a challenge, try joing a ship raid... and then soloing the center of the ship... why don't you solo Ukon Grai, while you are at it.
If that doesn't seem hard enough (heck, it might not be)... then maybe you are just too awesome for this game and should move on to greener pastures. I hear Progress Quest is fantastic! |
I sit in my zen of not being able to do anything right while simultaniously not being able to do anything wrong. Om. -CuppaJo
It is by caffeine alone that I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shaking, the shaking becomes a warning. It is by caffeine alone that I set my mind in motion.
Keep in mind the so called 300 "bosses" he was decimating were of the Dual Blades/Pain Domination variety.
Joke thread of the year.
lolMinMaxing
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If you consider your PLAYTIME to be HARD WORK, then yes, you should probably go.
| I expect to be rewarded for all my hard work, |
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If you do it for the challenge, and enjoy it, then isn't that the whole point? Like if you're having fun doing it, isn't that the main reward?
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Originally Posted by ThugsRus
What I enjoy is facing the hordes of enemies and laying waste to them all. I use no exploit what so ever. I expect to be rewarded for all my hard work, but the developers of this game insist on nerfing every high end challenge I can face.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Maybe the posters definition of exploits and yours are not the same.....makes me laugh that the only posts on this board on farming and AE are those that are againist it. Find me a role playing game that is not exploited in some way... find me a game that someone does not find the baddie that drops a rare item.. drops great exp or money and farms that baddie till they see them in their dreams.... ANYONE ever hear of a Metal Slime.... found all kinds of ways to exploit that sucker..|
Originally Posted by Lemur Lad
If your goal is to say "I did that" then why do you need xp/inf/drops along with that? If your true goal is a sense of accomplishment, why do the shinies (or lack thereof) matter? If you're pressing buttons to beat even level foes, and pressing buttons to beat high level/rank foes, how is beating the latter by any stretch of the imagination "hard work"?
I am going to make comments to this thread and then add my own at the end...... How can you even compare "pressing" a button for an even level baddie and comparing to a challenged purple level baddies as just "pressing" buttons. To be able to "press" the button.. requires loads of game play to afford the character building process that this game has set up. Purple recipes costing over a half a billion and now the PVP costing half a trillion it is HARD work to progress thru this game to get a toon that can take the challenges. Wanting to complete challenging archs and bossings is rather thrilling... BUT/AND I am sure many want also to receive GOOD infamey, rare recipes and whatever other nice prize is available. This entire game is set up on risk and reward... it drives you from Level 1 thru 10 so fast, that your whamped with debt. Okay I rambled there....but from Level 1 we are driven to reach the next level.. driven to create recipes from drops... and since Issue 16 the drops just suck... if I get one more kinetic weapon on a 2 plus 8 mish I will scream. You speak out of both sides of your mouth. Make up your mind what your motivations are, and let them motivate you, or not. Your choice. The person who wrote this thread made a choice... it said.. I want a challenge AND I want the rewards for it... how is that talking out of 2 sides of a mouth... why does ANYONE think that a board gives anyone free reign to be just rude. PS If you were facing 300 bosses in a room without breaking a sweat, you were using an exploit. You're using the specialized spawning rules of AE, in conjunction with the aggro limits to gain an unfair advantage in terms of rewards as opposed to people who cannot. Just because you don't feel it was one, doesn't mean it wasn't. |
I was not an avid fan of the AE farm, never gonna say I didnt use it... it killed real game play for a while.. but anyone that finds any way to make the game WORK FOR THEM.... and what THEY want... BRAVO to you.
It seems all the answers to this thread are negative.. noone agrees? Everyone wants to just challenge the 300 comment.. challenge the unfair use of AE or whatever the poster did to spawn 300 plus baddies. I do believe the reason for the new level system was to "Provide more challenge"... the point missed in all the ******** over his/hers assumed tactics is that he would like to be rewarded based on the challenge level.....I got a boron exposure for beating Sthenos.. took 4 deaths.. 2 trips to the market and AE for large inspirs and finally calling some team mates in to finish it.... YES I WANT A BIG reward.
"Pats self on back for winning the challenge"... laughs at getting maybe 50K for finishing.... and a boron worth maybe 100K.....
My rambling will quit for now.. since I will go off on the numerous disappointments I have right now in the game that has driven my bored *** to the foreums in the first place.
But an answer to the question.. Thugs... 2 months and we can go to closed beta... that will be my final test if I want to invest anymore of my 4 years of Vet on this game... waiting for the promises of new content every 3 months. Costumes are great... colored powers even greater... but I want a story and a game to play after I hit 50 and have spent 4 billion on enhancments..... LOL just slotting them... so funny... I guess you have no clue how much game play is required to by ONE Hecatomb damage....
Again I am rambling... and BE NICE on your replays...
Sorry all... I wrote within the quote assumed it would be colored or italiced... hope you can follow
Ray
Need a challenge, The Hamidon called you a wuss and said to come get some! lol
Raymaiha:
The Devs set up a system where there is a certain amount of work that goes into getting a level 50. Either in time that it takes to get there, or actual work.
People were exploiting a new system to get to 50 with much less time and effort. That is an exploit. Yes, games have exploits. Guess what? Game developers don't like people using them, and tend to try to shut them down as soon as they can. People who get to 50 in no time at all, and can afford everything they want with a minimum of effort are going to leave sooner. It's a business decision. People who get everything they want get bored, and then they leave.
Name me one game that didn't try to shut down massive exploits when they become aware of them.
There is a big difference between farming, PLing, and exploiting the game. The Devs don't really care about farming (although they did say, multiple times, that the AE systems was NOT to be used for it, and that people who did so were at risk of being punished), and PLing to a certain extent is fine. What is wrong is that people could get to level 50 in a matter of a couple of hours, AND that it was becoming the norm, instead of the exception. That does become a problem for both the game and the players. If you don't accept that, it's fine, but it is a problem.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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So...... 5 years worth of content updates isn't good enough for you? Have you ever heard of Ouroboros?| but I want a story and a game to play after I hit 50 |
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| so funny... I guess you have no clue how much game play is required to by ONE Hecatomb damage.... |
Also, the definition of an exploit isn't what I say it is, or you, or Lemur, or Westley, or anyone else in this thread says it is. It's what the Devs say it is. If something is considered an exploit by them, that is all that matters, and they don't like them, so be prepared for them to shut them down.
I guess I just don't get how people are surprised when the Devs specifically say, several times, that the AE system is not for PLing or Farming, and then actually take steps to make sure that people can't PL or farm it, and punish them when they do. That like people being surprised for getting a speeding ticket for going 20 over the limit after the cops publically announce that they're going to be cracking down on speeders.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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Are you able to defeat a variety of bosses? Part of the difficulty of facing serious enemies is they don't all do the same thing. |
Originally Posted by ThugsRus
Okay, my attempt to make humorous metaphores to the current situation with Issue 16 failed miserably. Let's try a direct approach.
My toons are able to solo 300 of any single type of boss in a single room. |
How about a custom critter group based on a successfull high-end task force? Rather than all having the same power sets, they have buffing, debuffing, DPS, slows, end drains, kins, rads, etc? Make them all EBs, with maximum power sets.
How about building a mission that is designed to defeat you?
Can you solo a Carnie/Malta/Rikti mission based on +4/x8/Bosses/AV? This means either standard content, or a mission designed to be challenging, not a farm run.
Also, Statesman called. He says Lord Recluse is planning something nasty, and would be interested if you could take care of it. By yourself. You can find him in Independence Port.
If you really want his respect, you can do the +4/x8, and set for the Masters Badge, which means no deaths, no temp powers allowed.
I'd be interested if you could do this.
Should you quit? If the time and money you spend aren't paying off in fun, then yes.
www.paragonwiki.com is a great source of information for this game.
New or returning to the game? Want advice from experienced players who want to help YOU?
The Mentor Project: Part of the New Player Council.
Oh really? Any type of boss? I'd like to see you take on a room full of Rularuu Overseers.
Why limit yourself to just a single type of boss though? More variety makes for a bigger challenge. Make a custom enemy group with Dark Ring Mistresses, Malta Gunslingers, Master Illusionists, and Fake Nems.
Heck, add in the PPD Lieutenants that run Tactics, the Midnight Squad Lts. with Dispersion Bubble, and Knives of Artemis minions. Then you get full XP!
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I think your question is one that only you can answer. Based on your outlook I would assume that is to leave the game and find something else.
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Originally Posted by ThugsRus
Okay, my attempt to make humorous metaphores to the current situation with Issue 16 failed miserably. Let's try a direct approach.
I build superior toons in CoX by careful examination of every tiny minute set bonus possible. My toons are able to solo 300 of any single type of boss in a single room. What I enjoy is facing the hordes of enemies and laying waste to them all. I use no exploit what so ever. I expect to be rewarded for all my hard work, but the developers of this game insist on nerfing every high end challenge I can face. My friends' who enjoy the same aspect of this game are all on the verge of quitting. I too am on the verge of quitting. My question ... Is it time to quit? I can't seem to find any enjoyment left in this game and I don't want to abandon a game that I've invested so much in, but I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel. |
My Global Chat Handle: @The Dreaming Shadow
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Definitely do this.|
Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim
My suggestions:
Go to the difficulty contact. Set level to +4. Set team equivalent to 8. Set preference to Face Bosses when Solo. Set preference to Face Heroes/Archvillains at full power. |
The new difficulty settings should allow nearly everyone to find a challenge. And if you can successfully solo +4 level/+8 team size missions with bosses and archvillains, you will indeed reap rewards far in excess of those offered by the default difficulty settings.
If you find the game is still too easy even on max difficulty, then yes, I'd say you are just too good for this game and you should probably move on to something else. It happens. Sometimes a player just "masters" a game and needs to find challenges elsewhere.
If you find yourself overwhelmed using the new difficulty settings despite having previously taken on 300 bosses in AE, that might be a clue that you were in fact taking advantage of an exploit (possibly without realizing it) and that you really weren't facing as much of a challenge as you thought you were.
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I think you'd also get full death as well |
Originally Posted by MTS__
Oh really? Any type of boss? I'd like to see you take on a room full of Rularuu Overseers.
Why limit yourself to just a single type of boss though? More variety makes for a bigger challenge. Make a custom enemy group with Dark Ring Mistresses, Malta Gunslingers, Master Illusionists, and Fake Nems. Heck, add in the PPD Lieutenants that run Tactics, the Midnight Squad Lts. with Dispersion Bubble, and Knives of Artemis minions. Then you get full XP! |
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
I feel the same way as the OP sometimes. I play with folks who steamroll through SFs on relentless and make near record times.
The game hasn't been adjusted for the benefits of IO's, I guess.
I am building a serious challenge AE.
I will post the number here when I finish.
Okay, my attempt to make humorous metaphores to the current situation with Issue 16 failed miserably. Let's try a direct approach.
I build superior toons in CoX by careful examination of every tiny minute set bonus possible. My toons are able to solo 300 of any single type of boss in a single room.
What I enjoy is facing the hordes of enemies and laying waste to them all. I use no exploit what so ever. I expect to be rewarded for all my hard work, but the developers of this game insist on nerfing every high end challenge I can face.
My friends' who enjoy the same aspect of this game are all on the verge of quitting. I too am on the verge of quitting.
My question ... Is it time to quit? I can't seem to find any enjoyment left in this game and I don't want to abandon a game that I've invested so much in, but I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel.