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Its not as if inf buys you any significant advantage in PvP any more.
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That's a valid point and why I don't farm any more. I used to, just to purple out my pvp toons.
I still PL some characters to 22, just because I've done the early arcs sooooo many times I can't be bothered to clear trolls out of the hollows any more :P
Fahie
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*sigh* Like I said...they want to improve their character for whatever reason it is. They will farm for x million inf to get that rare recipe, to maybe get the edge on Rommy in a ITF or just become more powerful in PvE.
They will give up funplay because they are doing it to improve another part of the game, character development, which they will actually use for funplay. See?
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Actually, not really. Does it actually improve the game having a more powerful character?. Cant see it myself. All cotent can be done on an average one. Character development? I cant see anything behind that.
Is a more powerful character more fun? Funnily enough, I find it marginally more dull.
Im not knocking farming here, im just trying to understand something I cannot empathise with.
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Actually, not really. Does it actually improve the game having a more powerful character?. Cant see it myself. All cotent can be done on an average one. Character development? I cant see anything behind that.
Is a more powerful character more fun? Funnily enough, I find it marginally more dull.
Im not knocking farming here, im just trying to understand something I cannot empathise with.
[/ QUOTE ]Enhancing your character with expensive stuff gives you something to -do- with your 50 after you're done leveling him, I guess.
In some cases, the increases to character performance can have extremely obvious effects too, as is the case with Permadoms; or, permaing various buffs in general, such as Eclipse or Sunless Mire.
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Agreed with Calam. I suppose the OP is new to the game, but if he wants to be PLed, well, that's his choice. At the end of the day, we don't have to PL him, but we need to give him the right to ask if he can be PLed instead of saying "hey, I don't think you should do this".
It all comes down to the way he wants to play.
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Of course it is, that's why I made a point of saying "I would advise against it if as a new player he wants to get the most fun out of the game".
Emphasis mine. Advising against something is not the same as saying you're an idiot if you do it.
Additionally, I've never had much truck with "player rights" when this kind of thing is mentioned. Sure he has the right to ask to be PL'd and other people have the right to PL him if that's what they want to do. Remember too, I have the right to disagree with the reasons behind it, I have the right to decline his request and suggest other ways of playing that have been fun for me that he also might enjoy. Rights don't only work one way, and as such should really be considered irrelevant.
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Enhancing your character with expensive stuff gives you something to -do- with your 50 after you're done leveling him, I guess.
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Indeed. The only real purpose for IOs.
I really should do something about this signature.
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Does it actually improve the game having a more powerful character?. Cant see it myself. All cotent can be done on an average one. Character development? I cant see anything behind that.
Is a more powerful character more fun? Funnily enough, I find it marginally more dull.
Im not knocking farming here, im just trying to understand something I cannot empathise with.
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In part, it's certainly that it's something to do with a level 50 after it hits 50.
It's not just that, though - I do actually have more fun on my characters where I've played around with IO sets than my characters who have SOs or standard IOs. Why? I guess they feel that much more personalised and individual, I've tweaked them to fit my style of play, and suddenly my Fire/Rad Corr isn't just one of thousands of Fire/Rad Corrs.
It all depends how you use them, too. Some people are obsessed with fitting in purples and LoTG recharges because uber sets are their goal. Me? I like playing around with procs and trying to make my characters more self-sufficient, or perhaps I aim to make them work well with a toons I tend to team with. However it's done, there's a real difference between an SO'd toon and one with a good IO build - and by good, I mean one that achieves its aims, whatever those are.
I guess it also helps that I'm a difficulty junkie, and I love huge groups of mobs - having builds I can do silly things on that it feels like I shouldn't be able to do really does improve my enjoyment of the game.
Like any given part of any game though, I'm sure it doesn't appeal to everyone. And we're a little off-topic, because it's entirely possible to make a good IO build or two without any real farming. 
I can perfectly understand people who want to farm so they can equip more characters with good builds, though. I'd love to have more of my toons fitted up.
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*sigh* Like I said...they want to improve their character for whatever reason it is. They will farm for x million inf to get that rare recipe, to maybe get the edge on Rommy in a ITF or just become more powerful in PvE.
They will give up funplay because they are doing it to improve another part of the game, character development, which they will actually use for funplay. See?
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Actually, not really. Does it actually improve the game having a more powerful character?. Cant see it myself. All cotent can be done on an average one. Character development? I cant see anything behind that.
Is a more powerful character more fun? Funnily enough, I find it marginally more dull.
Im not knocking farming here, im just trying to understand something I cannot empathise with.
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For PvP, it can make a difference - any little boost to your stats is important if you're fighting another experienced PvPer - so it's kinda like an arms race - if one regular PvPer fills up with purples, their regular opponents will feel they need to do the same to keep on an even level with them.
@Golden Girl
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Agreed with Calam. I suppose the OP is new to the game, but if he wants to be PLed, well, that's his choice. At the end of the day, we don't have to PL him, but we need to give him the right to ask if he can be PLed instead of saying "hey, I don't think you should do this".
It all comes down to the way he wants to play.
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Of course it is, that's why I made a point of saying "I would advise against it if as a new player he wants to get the most fun out of the game".
Emphasis mine. Advising against something is not the same as saying you're an idiot if you do it.
Additionally, I've never had much truck with "player rights" when this kind of thing is mentioned. Sure he has the right to ask to be PL'd and other people have the right to PL him if that's what they want to do. Remember too, I have the right to disagree with the reasons behind it, I have the right to decline his request and suggest other ways of playing that have been fun for me that he also might enjoy. Rights don't only work one way, and as such should really be considered irrelevant.
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Well, I guess your post did come out like that. Maybe instead of:
"I would advise against it for a new player, there are funner ways to play." (I know that's not the exact wording, but it's similar to that)
You could say:
"I've found in my experenice that PLing is quite dull, and as a new player you probably won't learn much from it. I recommend you try levelling normally for a while before considering PLing."
...which would come out much less negative and hatred towards PLing.
Guys lets just stop this now. At the end of the day, it's the way they want to play, although as a new player PLing is not recommended. We have gone over why people PL/farm, now it's just a matter of fieryman making a final decision if he/she wants to be PLed and if so find someone to PL them.
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Just out of interest, where is the OP getting 200mill inf from if he's a lowly lvl 2?
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Probably an external source eg a friend.
Just out of interest, where is the OP getting 200mill inf from if he's a lowly lvl 2?
Maybe off those lil wee people that you see buzzing about the portals in PI mid week only for them to run to the safety of their farms everytime you try to chat to them? :P
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They will give up funplay because they are doing it to improve another part of the game, character development, which they will actually use for funplay. See?
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Actually, not really. Does it actually improve the game having a more powerful character?. Cant see it myself. All cotent can be done on an average one. Character development? I cant see anything behind that.
Is a more powerful character more fun? Funnily enough, I find it marginally more dull.
Im not knocking farming here, im just trying to understand something I cannot empathise with.
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i do not agree here, having played SO/IO'd Characters(lvl 50's), and playing those characters fully slotted with Set IO's, there is a major difference( atleast on my builds), it also depends what you investing in, are you going for +Defense stats, +Recharge, +Regen or whatever +.., it makes a big difference, i would for no gold go back to playing my Characters with just normal IO's after i saw what a fully slotted with sets can do.
i have much more fun with me SHields/ice tanker, WM/Shields ,FIre/Wp brute , the difference is imense
Greetz Sha 
49 level 50's(CoH/V), cant be arsed to list em all :P
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playing those characters fully slotted with Set IO's, there is a major difference( atleast on my builds), it also depends what you investing in, are you going for +Defense stats, +Recharge, +Regen or whatever +.., it makes a big difference, i would for no gold go back to playing my Characters with just normal IO's after i saw what a fully slotted with sets can do.
i have much more fun with me SHields/ice tanker, WM/Shields ,FIre/Wp brute , the difference is imense
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Defo I agree with MasTa_X - With sets I have a Inv/SS tank that is 90% res to S/L so he is like a granite on ITF's. With normal SO's I prob wouldnt be able to take as much damage as I do and prob end up dying more. 
I was going to post another thread about farming, my question being:
Is farming looked down upon now, or is it just the state of the game?
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I was going to post another thread about farming, my question being:
Is farming looked down upon now, or is it just the state of the game?
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That's not really an "or" question; depending on who you ask you can get a "yes" to either (or maybe even both) options.
It's not so much looked down upon, it's just that some of us find it difficult to see the point.
I really should do something about this signature.
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It's not so much looked down upon, it's just that some of us find it difficult to see the point.
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It varies; I'm in the "can't see the point" camp, but have no problems at all with farmers off doing their thang on some map or the other, so long as they don't bother me. (Hint to farmers: repeated "join my team for 5 minutes?" tells count as bothering...)
Others, though, regard farming as the source of many of the evils in the world (n00bs in Peregrine, inflated AH prices, merit nerfs, global warming) and they do look down (or worse) on farmers.
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They will give up funplay because they are doing it to improve another part of the game, character development, which they will actually use for funplay. See?
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Actually, not really. Does it actually improve the game having a more powerful character?. Cant see it myself. All cotent can be done on an average one. Character development? I cant see anything behind that.
Is a more powerful character more fun? Funnily enough, I find it marginally more dull.
Im not knocking farming here, im just trying to understand something I cannot empathise with.
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i do not agree here, having played SO/IO'd Characters(lvl 50's), and playing those characters fully slotted with Set IO's, there is a major difference( atleast on my builds), it also depends what you investing in, are you going for +Defense stats, +Recharge, +Regen or whatever +.., it makes a big difference, i would for no gold go back to playing my Characters with just normal IO's after i saw what a fully slotted with sets can do.
i have much more fun with me SHields/ice tanker, WM/Shields ,FIre/Wp brute , the difference is imense
Greetz Sha
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What I dont understand here: Personally the only significant challenge left in the game is the LRSF/STF, at least for reasonably built toons (cheapish IOs, sensible picks and slots). There are a few exeptions, like the vanguard, but overall, its pretty hard to find a significant challenge at high level even on highest difficulty.
Now, I like a reasonable challenge. Not ridiculously hard, but something where im not on autopilot.
Given the difficulty in finding a reasonable challenge as it stands... does ubering out with Purples actually increase your enjoyment of the game? Do you want it even easier???
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Given the difficulty in finding a reasonable challenge as it stands... does ubering out with Purples actually increase your enjoyment of the game? Do you want it even easier???
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Yes and no.
Purpling out a blaster seems irrelevant to me. Sure, it's better but it's not more fun.
However, purpling out the ill/rad (to get perma PA for example) means that I now have the challenge of soloing GM's.
I couldn't do that with SO's, so yes, purples and uber rares ( eg Lotg ) increase my enjoyment of creating a character and increase my enjoyment of playing it.
Fahie
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Given the difficulty in finding a reasonable challenge as it stands... does ubering out with Purples actually increase your enjoyment of the game? Do you want it even easier???
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It doesn't necessarily make it easier. As I said above, not everyone goes for the same goals with their builds - I'm sure there are people who go for the sterotypical uber build, carry on just marching through missions the same old way, and then get very bored. But there are plenty of people making builds that just amuse them, or make a character play in an unusual way, or perhaps make it able to do things that specific character "shouldn't" be able to do.
Fahie's example of turning a toon into an AV soloer is a good one. Some people like trying to take on large-team spawns themselves or in a small team, some people get a real kick out of speed-running TFs and optimise for that. Some people kit out squishies with a lot of res or def so they can solo things they couldn't otherwise, or even tank. Or sometimes it might simply come down to wanting to round out a character - like giving a very end-heavy toon a load of recovery, because it's bloody frustrating to run out of the stuff.
There are a lot of self-invented challenges to be found - I'm sure they're not all to everyone's tastes (like the infamous petless MM), but a lot of people do find building for these things really fun, and IO sets really do take it a lot further.
you know people have been soloing GMs on Ill/Rad long before there were IOs in the game right? Perma PA is not required, I bet it would take down the time it takes mine to do it sure, but its not required
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They were appropriately appalled
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Didn't Ill / Rad use to be fotm for "Stupidly over powered for a support toon" before fire kins ?
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It's not so much looked down upon, it's just that some of us find it difficult to see the point.
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It varies; I'm in the "can't see the point" camp, but have no problems at all with farmers off doing their thang on some map or the other, so long as they don't bother me. (Hint to farmers: repeated "join my team for 5 minutes?" tells count as bothering...)
Others, though, regard farming as the source of many of the evils in the world (n00bs in Peregrine, inflated AH prices, merit nerfs, global warming) and they do look down (or worse) on farmers.
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Id agree with this .. its not the farming that is the problem it is the annoyance of some farmers methods of team building that gets on ppls nerves. If they didnt need fillers you would hardly know they are there.
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you know people have been soloing GMs on Ill/Rad long before there were IOs in the game right? Perma PA is not required, I bet it would take down the time it takes mine to do it sure, but its not required
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Yes, but I was making a general point about specialising characters for specific (and perhaps non "standard") jobs, not specially talking about Ill/Rads. And specialising was always possible to some extent, of course - you can bet there were Ill/Rad builds in I4 specifically meant as AV killers, or soloers, or teamers. IOs just take that specialisation to a new level. It's probably largely the same sort of people who enjoyed playing around with specialised builds pre IOs who still enjoy it now... we just have a lot more options post Inventions.
Much as some people apparently can't understand the enjoyment in this, I can't understand not wanting to do it - Inventions really revitalised the game for me, and I think there's a good chance I'd have wandered off by now without their addition.
So to get this back closer to on-topic, I can completely understand people farming inf in order to try to complete their builds - but I hate unsolicited, repeat "wanna farm?" tells as much as the next person. Perhaps the best message to send to the OP is that it's fine to play however you like, but everyone will appreciate it if you do so in a way that doesn't irritate other people. I do think the best bet would be finding an SG that does a lot of farming and PLing - much more steady, they'll be like-minded and therefore not irritated by your playstyle, and the quality of teaming will probably be better than just asking around.
As an added bonus, you don't get a forum full of people discussing the merit (or lack thereof) of various ways to play the game.
depends on build and level. Soloing GM´s at level 50 youll need to output a bare minimum of 360 dps.
Hummm. If you had read the last few posts they are mostly talking about PLing, not farming. So they did follow what you were asking.