Course, the other way to handle it is to follow their instructions to the letter; if it works it's a lesson learned, and if it all goes "bits up" then you can encourage everyone to point and laugh at the leet dude and scream "You lied to me!! I thought knew what you were talking about!! You're rubbish!!" 
QR
I'm glad I'm not alone in my opinion 
I know that every new player is not going to be easy to help. Some people just live to cause trouble but i don't think giving them the benefit of the doubt to begin with is too much to ask. Not everyone bothers to check Vet Rewards, i know i don't simply because i'm not a believer in the more Vet Rewards you have the better you are. I tend to take people on face value and work with them how they are, I run alot of teams and people generally seem to really enjoy them so i must be doing something right.
I remember once we were in a team and someone i invited didn't like the way i was using Hurricane. They were a tank, so they decided to aggro everything on the map, get everyone killed and leave the team. I know it's not a common occurrence but it's exactly that sort of 'i know better than you' attitude that i'm starting to see more of lately.
I've been playing for years, never really joined the forums before and i still have not learnt everything there is too know. I'm not perfect and there are many depths in this game i have yet to plunder e.g. the Shadow Shard tf's. I like to play the game to have fun, to be able to run in and die laughing rather than worrying about what power to use and when. My friend is constantly worrying about this sort of stuff, what power to use, how to slot etc. not because she wants to be, but because she's worried what people will say if she doesn't. I'd like to see new players able to relax and just go with the flow at least to begin with rather than worrying about pleasing everyone else.
I don't think it much to ask for someone new to be able to join a team and not worry if someone will notice if they're not slotted correctly or that they didn't take a certain power because it's 'essential'.
I'm not really meaning to rant, I just genuinely want new people to feel welcome and not have to worry about advanced game systems simply because someone with attitude thinks they should be using them.
The above is only my opinion, please don't hate me for it
SG: Suicidal Maniacs @Aurealis
GhostRaptor: Server populations have been trending upwards since Issue 13 release. There are no current plans for any server mergers and we're looking forward to Issue 14 and the rest of the year.
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However she is scared to death of teaming with some people because if she makes a single mistake or doesn't do something, they treat her like the worlds going to end and that she's a world class idiot, When really she's just new to the game and is learning the ropes.
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my worst case of this was when i decided to try out using a tank for the first time, at some point i got invited to a team, i warned the person that i was new to being a tank and that i hadnt yet mastered the art of taunting away a foe or herding them or whatever its called, anyway they said that was no problem, however once in this mission i was asked to draw away a certain foe, i tried to do this but failed as i ended up managing to draw a whole mob towards us and most of us died, the leader then started ranting at me and said i was obviously a complete idiot and should not bother using a tank and kicked me from team. i hate it when things like that happen as i felt it was unfair, after all i had warned them that id never had a tank b4 and was still practising taunting etc and for them to say it was no problem and then rant at me calling me an idiot is totally uncalled for 
@crazybonkers
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I'm not really meaning to rant, I just genuinely want new people to feel welcome and not have to worry about advanced game systems simply because someone with attitude thinks they should be using them.
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Thing is. CoX is THE most new player friendly MMO on the market, without exception. Try being a newbie in EVE or WoW and see what kind of experience you get.
Personally, I think you're seriously overstating this perceived "problem" of elitism.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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Having explained a point such as Anchoring to a team, then have them repeatedly kill the anchor.
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What do you expect, you marked the anchor for special attention with an aura!
Seriously, some people forget that they were new once as well. Thankfully such people are few and far between and once you've met them there are sufficient tools available for avoiding them in the future...
The OP mentioned about people dismissing topics, this is probably related to the slew of "Merge da Sevrs!" threads we had for 3 months last year.
The main problem wasn't that we had been here longer and discussed it before, the main problem was that one weekend we had FOUR open threads on the subject and it'd been discussed that much that anyone who cared to look could scroll down a little and find a thread on the subject.
Hell, most days you didn't even have to do that and GR ended up putting a formal ban on the topic being raised.
So it was less a "We've been here longer and discussed this before", and more "We've got an open threads on this subject, we've had 8 in the last month and don't want to repost the arguements we've put in those threads."
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I'm not really meaning to rant, I just genuinely want new people to feel welcome and not have to worry about advanced game systems simply because someone with attitude thinks they should be using them.
[/ QUOTE ]
Thing is. CoX is THE most new player friendly MMO on the market, without exception. Try being a newbie in EVE or WoW and see what kind of experience you get.
Personally, I think you're seriously overstating this perceived "problem" of elitism.
[/ QUOTE ]
I would have to agree with the OP FFM.
I don't - and have never played - WoW or EVE but elitism certainly does exist in this game and on these forums.
Personally speaking, the worst possible place I can think of to send a brand new player to would be here.
Proud member of FOXBASE ALPHA and coalition associates.
Hero 50's - 25
Villain 50's - 1
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I'm not really meaning to rant, I just genuinely want new people to feel welcome and not have to worry about advanced game systems simply because someone with attitude thinks they should be using them.
[/ QUOTE ]
Thing is. CoX is THE most new player friendly MMO on the market, without exception. Try being a newbie in EVE or WoW and see what kind of experience you get.
Personally, I think you're seriously overstating this perceived "problem" of elitism.
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Advice from one who has tried it; Don't.
EVE is, as my brother so wonderfully put it; "The MMPO for accountants, run on miliatry grade programs."
And hard as nails to get anywhere in
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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I'm not really meaning to rant, I just genuinely want new people to feel welcome and not have to worry about advanced game systems simply because someone with attitude thinks they should be using them.
[/ QUOTE ]
Thing is. CoX is THE most new player friendly MMO on the market, without exception. Try being a newbie in EVE or WoW and see what kind of experience you get.
Personally, I think you're seriously overstating this perceived "problem" of elitism.
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But that just isn't true. EQI and EQII, GW, TR (RIP), and Warhammer (to an extent) have perfectly friendly, welcoming communities.
WoW and EVE have bad reputations, sure, but they hardly run new players away (due to the community, gameplay can).
CoH/V may have a friendly reputation, but we're not the only one; and when we do have flamewars, by god we go the whole hog.
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I would have to agree with the OP FFM.
I don't - and have never played - WoW or EVE but elitism certainly does exist in this game and on these forums.
Personally speaking, the worst possible place I can think of to send a brand new player to would be here.
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If you think there is an elitism problem HERE, don't EVER try those two games. The "elites" there will chew you up and spit you out in about 5 seconds, and that's on a SLOW day.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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I think the worst form of elitism is if your team fails a TF, for whatever reason, and one player blames another, singularly, for the failure. Having been the target of such an attack myself (as the healer), it's hard not to feel a little wounded.
For that reason, im generally quick to avoid teaming with players who consider themselves above reproach.
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I was on a VEAT and I got the team wiped the other day....
I can't remember the exact conversation but anyways it was something like this:
I said:
<----My fault
They said:
That's okay we don't do blame culture here.
I roughly said:
I underestimated the number of foes in the area and so I started the fight at a bad fight point so my bad.
They said:
It's okay we are not looking for someone to blame.
I said:
<---It's my fault, nothing wrong with accepting responsibility. The key thing is us knowing what went wrong and why it went wrong.
When we regrouped someone said:
What to we do now?
I said:
We should come from the right, we will be able to cull their numbers better without taking on too much too soon.
So we did and we were all right and there was love and iced gems all round at the end of it.
I think there is a difference between name and shame and seeing what went wrong and deciding on what should of been done for all of us to know and learn by. Someone telling me a mistake I made doesn't get to my ego, it helps me become a better player. You can do all that without the whole thing turning into a school playground. It's like in business when things go wrong, you find out who was in control, what went wrong, why it went wrong and what steps you can put in place so it doesn't happen again. I don't care how leet people think they are we all make mistakes and its all part of being human. If we do not cover ground on whats going wrong and how to prevent it next time what we will see and has been known, people spending 6 months trying to even complete one single LRSF and that's not even the Master of.
There are times when people think you might be trying to establish yourself as a know all when your only trying to trade ideas. There is often more than one way of going about things and I like to hear other peoples ideas.
Example of a time when I will get fussed about someone:
Me: Whatever you do guys, don't press the red button..
Someone: Why?
Me: No time to explain the clock is running out. Just don't do it and I'll explain after.
Someone: *Pushes the red button*
Everyone wastes an hour of effort and we would have to go thru all that bleep again.
Now if I forgot to say don't press the red button then its my fault, I expect people to not go right ahead and do things they have no idea of what the consequence will be of, but every so often someone adds to the plan and faffs it all up. Because I have already said but the warning went unheeded at everyones expense its time for a disciplinary hearing..
So ya see not like work at all
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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But that just isn't true. EQI and EQII, GW, TR (RIP), and Warhammer (to an extent) have perfectly friendly, welcoming communities.
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Of those, I've only played GW and TR there's no way would I ever rate them as newbie friendly as CoH. I like how you had to qualify Warhammer. Either a game is friendly, or it isn't. "to an extent" really is just you saying it's not very friendly.
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WoW and EVE have bad reputations, sure, but they hardly run new players away (due to the community, gameplay can).
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Clearly, you've either not read or taken part the WoW forums, or tried to go beyond the tutorial in EVE.
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CoH/V may have a friendly reputation, but we're not the only one; and when we do have flamewars, by god we go the whole hog.
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I wouldn't call the flamewars we've had here flamewars exactly; not in comparison to many other MMO's. Flameskirmishes, maybe.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
While I'm sure there are people who think they know all and have a serious case of elitism I think it's unfair to say that it's that bad on this forum.
I'm a total noob when it comes to how to play stuff in this game.I hit random power buttons and most of the time it works out well enough...(okay...you do learn a thing or two after so many months) and I never felt that people on here treated me as a noob or thought of me different.
So, while I'm not saying there aren't people on here and in the game who are elitist I think some of you are exaggerating the problem.
Imo of course.
The M.A.D. Files - Me talking about games, films, games, life, games, internet and games
I'm not good at giving advice, can I interest you in a sarcastic comment?
@Lyrik
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Now if I forgot to say don't press the red button then its my fault, I expect people to not go right ahead and do things they have no idea of what the consequence will be of, but every so often someone adds to the plan and faffs it all up. Because I have already said but the warning went unheeded at everyones expense its time for a disciplinary hearing..
So ya see not like work at all
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I had an ITF a bit like that the other night... Such fun when you have a tanker which:
1. Doesn't have taunt
2. Doesn't speak to the rest of the team, except to say "AFK" in the middle of a rather large mob of elite bosses on lag hill.
3. Doesn't listen to the rest of the team when we say how we're going to handle a particular mob. (and in fact, decided to go annoy the Minotaur and the Sybil right after being told specifically to keep the hell away from them, and triggering the rather large waves of Nictus that ensue...)
4. Is suffering from a seriously bad case of scrapperlock
I lost count of the number of teamwipes we had before he decided to quit at the start of the final mission...
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
[ QUOTE ]
So it was less a "We've been here longer and discussed this before", and more "We've got an open threads on this subject, we've had 8 in the last month and don't want to repost the arguements we've put in those threads."
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It's like when people want someone to do a build for them, a person could end up doing a build for someone everyday. When do they get to play the game? It's like anything, use the search function. Don't expect things to be "a first" there is normally some info on it somewhere.
There is holier than thou and elitism about. Sometimes its not in the places you think it is, as sometimes its not intentional but sometimes, othertimes, it is and you've got that person dead bang but the one fact you can live with is that you don't have to and IMO shouldn't have to put up with anyone.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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While I'm sure there are people who think they know all and have a serious case of elitism I think it's unfair to say that it's that bad on this forum.
I'm a total noob when it comes to how to play stuff in this game.I hit random power buttons and most of the time it works out well enough...(okay...you do learn a thing or two after so many months) and I never felt that people on here treated me as a noob or thought of me different.
So, while I'm not saying there aren't people on here and in the game who are elitist I think some of you are exaggerating the problem.
Imo of course.
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Exactly what I'm saying. There might be a few individuals who portray such behaviour at times; but it most definitely is NOT a problem here.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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Now if I forgot to say don't press the red button then its my fault, I expect people to not go right ahead and do things they have no idea of what the consequence will be of, but every so often someone adds to the plan and faffs it all up. Because I have already said but the warning went unheeded at everyones expense its time for a disciplinary hearing..
So ya see not like work at all
[/ QUOTE ]
I had an ITF a bit like that the other night... Such fun when you have a tanker which:
1. Doesn't have taunt
2. Doesn't speak to the rest of the team, except to say "AFK" in the middle of a rather large mob of elite bosses on lag hill.
3. Doesn't listen to the rest of the team when we say how we're going to handle a particular mob. (and in fact, decided to go annoy the Minotaur and the Sybil right after being told specifically to keep the hell away from them, and triggering the rather large waves of Nictus that ensue...)
4. Is suffering from a seriously bad case of scrapperlock
I lost count of the number of teamwipes we had before he decided to quit at the start of the final mission...
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I hope you finished it.
Tankers are often over rated and unnecessary. I like diverse teams myself and think that peoples concepts are 99/100 fine and maybe there to challenge me. How we can learn to play together is the most important part and sometimes its quicker ironing out the mistakes to get there. Often you can have one person on their own team and everyone else playing along in their team.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
Alas, no. After the tanker left, the only other (IMO) decent blaster also decided to leave, losing the level 38 scrapper his SK so he'd have been facing +4's, and it had already taken 2 hours by this point. I was on my level 50 fire/ice blaster, exemped down to 42, so couldn't SK him...
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
[ QUOTE ]
WoW and EVE have bad reputations, sure, but they hardly run new players away (due to the community, gameplay can).
[/ QUOTE ]
Case in point, I went onto the WoW forums to get some technicial help, I searched and couldn't find it so I made a new thread.
The first twelve or so replies commented that I was a n00b (exact word used in 10 of them, I'd been playing WoW for 8 months at this point) and no technicial help, the one guy who was nice enough to try and help provided me with no information on what to do.
Since then I've only read the inital posts made in the announcement section when they haven't given us patch notes with the patchers. (once)
Similar posts made here get people responding quickly with either a request for more information or a solution, or at least pointed to threads which contain the solution they're working for.
Also the last time I joined a PUG in WoW, I was blasted for not using my fear power for crowd control on enemies which were immune to it.
And don't even get me started on EVE.
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Alas, no. After the tanker left, the only other (IMO) decent blaster also decided to leave, losing the level 38 scrapper his SK so he'd have been facing +4's, and it had already taken 2 hours by this point. I was on my level 50 fire/ice blaster, exemped down to 42, so couldn't SK him...
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There's one for the old global notes then.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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While I'm sure there are people who think they know all and have a serious case of elitism I think it's unfair to say that it's that bad on this forum.
I'm a total noob when it comes to how to play stuff in this game.I hit random power buttons and most of the time it works out well enough...(okay...you do learn a thing or two after so many months) and I never felt that people on here treated me as a noob or thought of me different.
So, while I'm not saying there aren't people on here and in the game who are elitist I think some of you are exaggerating the problem.
Imo of course.
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Exactly what I'm saying. There might be a few individuals who portray such behaviour at times; but it most definitely is NOT a problem here.
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I'm sorry but i don't agree. I'm not getting into the whole name and shame game but there are a few people on here that facilitate this behaviour quite often. As if their opinion is the only one that matters because of 'experience' and everyone else can go to hell. Heck i've even seen someone post something akin to 'not interested, go away' as if they're the grand master of the forum and have the right to tell people what they can and cannot talk/post about.
If i'm honest i'd expect more respectful comments from people who have been here for a while. What people forget is that when New people join these forums they have their own opinion on things and want to express it. So they make posts about it. It's probably been said before but they've never given their take on it, so they go ahead and do it anyway. People are going to have to accept that new discussions on same subjects are going to happen regardless if they've seen them before or not. If you don't want to participate in a certain discussion due to duplication, you don't post in it and let those otherwise inclined to let the OP know their opinions do so. The search argument is also null in my opinion because people simply get flamed for resurrecting a dead thread, so New people are doomed no matter what they decide to do.
Seriously if a duplicate thread were a problem then GR would remove it, But he doesn't. Going over the same ground with new people is an inevitable part of forums and will always be. There is really no need for people to be arrogant or be a self appointed moderator about other people's posts in my opinion.
The above is only my opinion, please don't hate me for it
SG: Suicidal Maniacs @Aurealis
GhostRaptor: Server populations have been trending upwards since Issue 13 release. There are no current plans for any server mergers and we're looking forward to Issue 14 and the rest of the year.
OK so I've been reading this thread for a bit and I think I slightly disagree.
Every MMO has elitists. It's unavoidable. There is always gonna be someone who thinks they know everything better than everyone else, including newbies.
And considering other MMOs, we have very little elitists.
So, at the end of the day, it's not like elitism is some sort of major problem. Sure, every now and again you'll get someone who's an elitist; but if you just ignore the elitists and move on, then you enjoy the game and community more rather than provoke them.
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I'm sorry but i don't agree. I'm not getting into the whole name and shame game but there are a few people on here that facilitate this behaviour quite often.
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A "few" people do not constitute a problem.
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Seriously if a duplicate thread were a problem then GR would remove it, But he doesn't. Going over the same ground with new people is an inevitable part of forums and will always be. There is really no need for people to be arrogant or be a self appointed moderator about other people's posts in my opinion.
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GR *does* remove them; however by far the greater majority of them occur on Friday evening, after GR has left for the weekend. As for the "elitism" you think exists over some particular subjects, things like the server merge threads for example. Almost everyone on the forums were getting sick of them, and certain people, who themselves could easily be called elitists, completely ignored GR's instruction that these posts stop.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
[ QUOTE ]
at the end of the day, it's not like elitism is some sort of major problem
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I have to agree with that, to be honest in the four years I've been here I have yet to meet an 'elitist' in the game. I've come across some crass idiots who I've promptly ignored but never come across anyone who lorded it over the others in that way.
I don't think playing since the game came out would make someone elite. The game has changed so much that only the stuff that was introduced in the last few issues are relevant. Apart from that it should be upto peers and general opinion on whether you are a good player or not. Self given elitism is delusions of grandeur.