[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It appears that teh power that really unbalances things here is Power Boost. It seems like almost all heroes can have access to it through the Ancillary Pools (I'm far from a CoH expert so don't know exact numbers). Of all the CoV ATs and powerset combos the only ones that have access to it are /ice and /nrg dominators.
[/ QUOTE ]
Def/controllers have access to it, blasters in one secondary, and scrappers/tanks have access to FA which is as unbalanced as PB.
Empathy and Blasters are also "broken" for team pvp, by design. Most of the time, when you use specialists (pvp empath = pure support, blasters = pure damage) in such a fast-paced environment, they'll beat balanced characters.
Even if Cm didn't stack, even if emps didn't have PB, even if blasters didn't get 30% unresistable damage on every attack, emp+blaster would still be very strong. Too strong compared to most villains.
(I'm not advocating for any nerf except CM, but I'd love to see every pvp zone going FFA, or to be able to make any AT on both sides ; of course, it's not going to happen, so I'll have to stick to underpowered villains to find some zone pvp action 
)
[/ QUOTE ]
The last squished tournament was won by duo corrupter combo iirc. Second place was mastermind+corruptor iirc.
My own team (blaster+emp) won one match against another blaster+emp and then lost to the mastermind team.
Don't worry - I9 will bring Inventions Enhancements to make you all tougher against these mighty metal monsters 
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
[ QUOTE ]
My own team (blaster+emp) won one match against another blaster+emp and then lost to the mastermind team.
[/ QUOTE ]
you lost to the people who came second, who have won/placed in other PvP competitions with different ATs and who (unless I'm mistaken) have both chimed in on this thread to say how great blaster + emp combination is.
The nice thing about PvP is that good players can turn conventional wisdom on its head (solo domi scaring the [censored] out of people in Siren's, how does that work since domis are t3h g1mp?).
Nobody is saying blaster + emp is an automatic 'I win' button, in exactly the same way that having a heavy isn't an automatic 'I win' button. It does make it slightly easier and puts the odds firmly in your favour but a good opponent can shred all of that.
Synaesthetix:if your mum wasn't already dead I would go kill her for bringing
you into the world
[ QUOTE ]
you lost to the people who came second, who have won/placed in other PvP competitions with different ATs and who (unless I'm mistaken) have both chimed in on this thread to say how great blaster + emp combination is.
[/ QUOTE ]
And your point is? I wanted to show L that blaster+emp does not equal automatic win.
[ QUOTE ]
The last squished tournament was won by duo corrupter combo iirc.
[/ QUOTE ]
It was won by an Ice/EM Blaster and Energy/Thermal Corruptor. Second placed were a Fire/Rad Controller and an Empath, 'Cel and I came in third with our Ice/Dark Corr and Robots/Dark MM.
It's probably worth noting that I don't think a lot of the top-flight PvP empaths (that I know of) were present that day, or were playing other characters (like 'Cel, for example). It's probably also worth noting that your Empath didn't have Power Mastery - and hence no Power Boost - which made you that much more vulnerable.
@Synaesthetix
"Here, take some more bees with you. You may need them."
Union: FU//LoUD
"that Syn is that that" - Mothers Love
[ QUOTE ]
It's probably also worth noting that your Empath didn't have Power Mastery - and hence no Power Boost - which made you that much more vulnerable.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, but he had telekinesis geared to run the entire length of the match, which allowed an easy victory over Jum's blaster+emp team, on the other hand. TK I think was necessary cause I wasnt certain of white magus' survivability otherwise (he had fly for instance). Ultimately I dont believe that there is only one ultimate team makeup. It all depends.
Enough of this derailing.
ps. its called power build up.
[ QUOTE ]
I wanted to show L that blaster+emp does not equal automatic win.
[/ QUOTE ]
Nothing is. In the context of the thread, what was being said was not that Blaster + Empath is unbeatable, but that it's better than a Heavy. And if Blaster + Empath is better than a Heavy, but still beatable (which is very much my experience), it should tell you something about Heavies.
[ QUOTE ]
Isn't this just Empaths though? Surely you could add this to a Scrapper/Tank or a D3 Defender? or Even a GP?
[/ QUOTE ]
I can tell you firsthand that I'd rather team my Blaster with an Empath than just about anything else. Certain Controller/Empath combos can be very good, but in the zones (given that's what we're discussing here), I'd take a Blaster for the burst damage any day. And when you have that many buffs and heals, a Scrapper's secondary is a bit of a waste. The point is that an Empath and Blaster complement each other particularly well - an Empath helps patch up a lot of the things a Blaster isn't good at, and then adds more damage dealing potential as well.
As for Heavies (calling them GPs is bound to confuse anyone who missed the old thread, by the way), an Empath with a heavy is a nice way for a team only Empath to be able to go into RV alone, but it's not great. I'd always take another player over a Heavy. You're talking about something that's horribly slow, can't jump up to get people, and just doesn't have human intelligence behind it. Yes, you're ordering it around, but you're acting with one brain, instead of two in a human duo. One person to notice things that are going on, one person to do everything. And then you have to deal with the Heavy's dire AI that makes it get stuck on scenery. Plus the Empath buffs aren't nearly as complementary to a Heavy as they are to a Blaster.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
They are also something different that no other zone has and allows anyone to access the MM control system. How can this be a bad thing? 
[/ QUOTE ]
Because there is no decent PvP zones over level 40 where this thing doesn't occur.
[/ QUOTE ]
All of the PvP zones have PvE games within them. They're all different, and some of us like some zones, and certain parts of the PvE, and not others. It's the entire nature of the zones.
It's bound to be the case that not everyone will like everything about any given zone. Some people love Warburg being FFA, for example, while others hate it. We can't have everything - the zones already aren't that populated, and with limited dev time, we can't have 2 38 zones, 2 50 zones, etc. I live with that, in the knowledge that other people like the parts I don't, so there's very little sense in constantly complaining about it.
If it were the case that there was a huge unified outcry and everyone hated the Heavies, then you'd have a point. But we don't. And the only other reason they'd need to be removed would be if they really were instant-win... but they're not, as those of us who actually spend a lot of time in RV - as opposed to just complaining about it from a safe distance - well know.
[ QUOTE ]
which allowed an easy victory over Jum's blaster+emp team,
[/ QUOTE ]
*shakes fist*
May be worth noting it was a Fire/Therm Corr I was teamed with, not an Empath. Not really reading most of your discussion.
[ QUOTE ]
As for Heavies (calling them GPs is bound to confuse anyone who missed the old thread, by the way)
[/ QUOTE ]
Gankpuppies; coz that's what they do/act like.
[ QUOTE ]
as opposed to just complaining about it from a safe distance - well know.
[/ QUOTE ]
Unfair 'Cel, both myself and Hammerfall have spent time in RV; it's harder to keep going back in there though when life dictates otherwise; and there's no fun to be got from it.
If I'm unable to rack up a single kill whilst doing my best; then it's going to leave me far less likely to go back in.
On playing Guild Wars, for instance, my first ever PvP team got 10 team kills in a row. Now that's gonna make me come back. Getting shredded repeatedly in two shots against a character I have stalked and outgunned will make me less likely to come back.
You don't play Poker against someone who always raises on the first round; who then flops a straight every time.
[ QUOTE ]
If it were the case that there was a huge unified outcry and everyone hated the Heavies, then you'd have a point. But we don't. And the only other reason they'd need to be removed would be if they really were instant-win... but they're not, as those of us who actually spend a lot of time in RV - as opposed to just complaining about it from a safe distance - well know.
[/ QUOTE ]
Are you saying that there hasnt been an outcry against RV grinding? I thought there has been couple heated threads..
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
As for Heavies (calling them GPs is bound to confuse anyone who missed the old thread, by the way)
[/ QUOTE ]
Gankpuppies; coz that's what they do/act like.
[/ QUOTE ]
I guessed you meant "Giant Pet" or something. Regen scrappers are invicible against a lot of players, but I dont see people call them "invincibles".
[ QUOTE ]
Getting shredded repeatedly in two shots against a character I have stalked and outgunned will make me less likely to come back.
[/ QUOTE ]
I feel the same about certain AT's i run into. 2 shots... DEAD! By outgunned do you mean simply a higher damage AT? More people?
My MA IDs:
Fiend Space: 211464
If they needed 2 shots to kill me I wouldn't complain. I'm fed up being one shot by a heavy after I get a succesful AS on its owner, that was merely standing
Outgunned. Taking on a Stalker from Stealth from Long distance.
Not seen me. PB/Aim/BU/Snipe;runs at me and hits me;snipe hits, next 2 shots miss him and then he kills me.
MM. Takes the first hit; Hold;Debuff; Miss Miss Miss Dead.
Brute : Shrugs off the first 4 hits; One Dot/Shot.
Corruptor/Dominator: Takes Alpha down to 1/2: Held; Debuffed; Dead.
Tanking : Smash;Smash;Smash; Full Heal; GP appears; Instadeath.
Once it's every time and you've covered every angle you can think of; time to retire.
[ QUOTE ]
Outgunned. Taking on a Stalker from Stealth from Long distance.
Not seen me. PB/Aim/BU/Snipe;runs at me and hits me;snipe hits, next 2 shots miss him and then he kills me.
MM. Takes the first hit; Hold;Debuff; Miss Miss Miss Dead.
Brute : Shrugs off the first 4 hits; One Dot/Shot.
Corruptor/Dominator: Takes Alpha down to 1/2: Held; Debuffed; Dead.
Tanking : Smash;Smash;Smash; Full Heal; GP appears; Instadeath.
Once it's every time and you've covered every angle you can think of; time to retire.
[/ QUOTE ]
There are other things you can try, I even mentioned one on this thread but so far that suggestion has been ignored.
My MA IDs:
Fiend Space: 211464
[ QUOTE ]
Outgunned. Taking on a Stalker from Stealth from Long distance.
Not seen me. PB/Aim/BU/Snipe;runs at me and hits me;snipe hits, next 2 shots miss him and then he kills me.
MM. Takes the first hit; Hold;Debuff; Miss Miss Miss Dead.
Brute : Shrugs off the first 4 hits; One Dot/Shot.
Corruptor/Dominator: Takes Alpha down to 1/2: Held; Debuffed; Dead.
Tanking : Smash;Smash;Smash; Full Heal; GP appears; Instadeath.
Once it's every time and you've covered every angle you can think of; time to retire.
[/ QUOTE ]
How about trying a team?
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
[ QUOTE ]
How about trying a team?
[/ QUOTE ]
That might work if there was someone to team with.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
How about trying a team?
[/ QUOTE ]
That might work if there was someone to team with.
[/ QUOTE ]
Cant rope in any of your super group, coalitions or friends?
Heros
Max Powerz: Lv 50 Tanker
Villains
Max Khaos: Lv 50
Overlord of E.V.I.L.
My Brute - http://maxy-khaos.mybrute.com/
LF SG! Arc ID# 193083
[ QUOTE ]
There are other things you can try, I even mentioned one on this thread but so far that suggestion has been ignored.
[/ QUOTE ]
If you're talking about movement; Blasts root and suppress.
If you're talking Airsup or Disorient; shields/BF/Acrobatics.
If you're talking melee, you're within GP autokill.
If you're talking flyby; SS/autofollow blocks.
If you're talking Inspirations; a full tray of BF's gets me about 5 minutes to get kills; and turns player aggro on you.
If you're talking having a GP; they just SS away.
If you're talking camping around friendlies; they don't react fast enough unless you're slowed.
That's without taking into account the Turret's/GP's equal range; aggro memory, shoot through and your own End loss.
Strategies are not my weakpoint.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
There are other things you can try, I even mentioned one on this thread but so far that suggestion has been ignored.
[/ QUOTE ]
If you're talking about movement; Blasts root and suppress.
If you're talking Airsup or Disorient; shields/BF/Acrobatics.
If you're talking melee, you're within GP autokill.
If you're talking flyby; SS/autofollow blocks.
If you're talking Inspirations; a full tray of BF's gets me about 5 minutes to get kills; and turns player aggro on you.
If you're talking having a GP; they just SS away.
If you're talking camping around friendlies; they don't react fast enough unless you're slowed.
That's without taking into account the Turret's/GP's equal range; aggro memory, shoot through and your own End loss.
Strategies are not my weakpoint.
[/ QUOTE ]
No. I wasnt talking about any of those.
My MA IDs:
Fiend Space: 211464
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
There are other things you can try, I even mentioned one on this thread but so far that suggestion has been ignored.
[/ QUOTE ]
If you're talking about movement; Blasts root and suppress.
If you're talking Airsup or Disorient; shields/BF/Acrobatics.
If you're talking melee, you're within GP autokill.
If you're talking flyby; SS/autofollow blocks.
If you're talking Inspirations; a full tray of BF's gets me about 5 minutes to get kills; and turns player aggro on you.
If you're talking having a GP; they just SS away.
If you're talking camping around friendlies; they don't react fast enough unless you're slowed.
That's without taking into account the Turret's/GP's equal range; aggro memory, shoot through and your own End loss.
Strategies are not my weakpoint.
[/ QUOTE ]
Maybe team-play is?
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
Empath team-mate is just opening up for someone to be a healbot.
TP Foe I find repulsive, and worse than GPs.
[ QUOTE ]
Empath team-mate is just opening up for someone to be a healbot.
TP Foe I find repulsive, and worse than GPs.
[/ QUOTE ]
The problem is, whenever anyone does offer you an option, it's one you apparently don't like, or claim is impossible. (btw, I still have no idea what this "healbot" stuff is, after the last thread where you started on about them. Empaths heal and buff a lot, that's okay and normal.)
It just feels like no matter what anyone says, you'll shoot it down, because you quite simply don't like the Heavies, and want them to be the problem.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Besides one of my original points that Heavies serve no purpose in PVP other than making the reward-grinding in RV easier. For that reason alone I want to get rid of them.
[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Who hates heavies? Id like to have some PVP in RV sometimes like tonight in a team, having a fight with couple brutes, until bzzzt..click hospital. I mean whats the bloody point??!!!
[/ QUOTE ]
Sounds like it.
[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Mate, my problem is not getting ganked, oneshotting or 'other unpleasant things' as long as they are done by players. My problem is with these machines whose sole purpose is to allow grinding for big rewards and foil any real pvp in there.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah.