Looks like "Earth Assault" is coming for Dominator
By
BigBrotherMidas,
Posted on: 2009-07-16 10:43 in Dominators
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I should mention though, I personally feel that with the recent changes, Power Boost for Doms should be changed to Power Build Up. Leave it at the 120s recharge it's at currently, give it a Damage/To Hit boost, and maybe lower the amount of +Duration it has. Icy and Energy won't be able to do as many "bursts" of damage that Elec can, but at least it will have an option for those that feel the +Duration is superfluous.
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ABSOLUTELY NO.
If you wanted a secondary with +Damage, you should have rolled one. No need to totally change the behavior of every one else's character just for you.
Earth Assault, I can understand arguing for changes, because it doesnt exist on live yet. In that case, arguing about preference is ok.
Lewis
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
-.-;
Wow, no need to be so rude. I only said what I personally feel, I did not say that I was even lobbying for the changes, yeesh. I took Icy Assault for concept. At the time, I did enjoy Power Boost, but I have since found it completely superfluous compared to having Domination on all of the time. That's all I was saying. Damn.
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In answer to myself here.. I found that attack chain visualizer I had found before. ^.^
http://www.snakebytes.net-a.googlepages.com/test2.html
For anyone interested.
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Wow, no need to be so rude.
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I was adamant, and horrified, but not rude. I didn't call you any names. 
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I took Icy Assault for concept.
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Well then, tweaky mechanics changes shouldn't matter to you, unless you now care about something other than concept.
Lewis
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
Ok, Frosticus, in 12.66s I am able to get a total of 1925.77 damage, for a DPS of 152.11 without using Build Up for an Electricity Assault Dominator. This is using your specified 150% Recharge build, and a 95% Damage Enhancement.
Linky
Though this particular attack chain seems to actually like Zapp, that kind of surprised me.. But still, it avoided using Thunderstrike, and surpassed your BU chain in total damage.
EDIT:
And.. I just noticed, that particular shot doesn't include the values that I set in it.
Range Mod of 0.95
Charged Bolts 1s Anim, 0.95 DS 4s Recharge
Lightning Bolt 1.67s Anim, 1.558 DS 8s Recharge
Zapp 4.33s Anim, 3.382 DS 20s Recharge
Static Discharge 2.07s Anim 1.1685 DS 16s Recharge
Melee Mod of 1.05
Charged Brawl 0.83s Anim 1.386 DS 6s Recharge
Havoc Punch 1.5s Anim 2.058 DS 10s Recharge
Thunderstrike 3.3s Anim 2.142 DS 16s Recharge
Basically, I looked through City of Data, and the Patch notes. Then multiple ranged values of DS by the doms Range mod of 0.95, then did the same for Melee attacks DS by the Doms melee mod of 1.05.
The attack chain visualizer then automatically generates the actual damage. I believe, if you take one of the pre-built sets with Build Up that you can even get Build Up to factor into the total damage. going to fudge around with that next.
EDIT2:
Yup! BU will work in it too.
Total Damage: 2509.57
Time: 12.16 sec
DPS: 206.38
This is a BU chain with Elec, that does NOT use Zapp.
Linky
So, Frosticus, play around with it, and see what you can come up with Energy. I somehow doubt it will really rival Elec's ST DPS though. ^.^;
EDIT3:
Hmm, just realized.. there is ONE problem with that BU chain listing.. it would actually be a bit, well, off as I believe the BU values are hard coded into it..
Quick little test, and the BU Value is hardcoded at 100% damage value, so, let's see.
*LAUGHS* Wow, that's um, weird.. it also seems to only increase part of the damage on the last C-Bolts that gets hit with it.. Ok ok.. lemme see..
Ok, fudging around with it a little, I was able to make the chain WITHOUT BU adding the damage to it, and gives these values.
Total Damage: 1716.18
Time: 12.16 sec
DPS: 141.13
From there I can make the actual damage list for the Dom BU values.
So, the last C-Bolts will get the BU buff, but the C-Brawl does not.
C-Brawl is 169.08 damage under these circumstances, so 1716.18 - 169.08 = 1547.1 is boosted by BU. However, some of that is from 95% enhancement, so 1547.1/1.95 = 793.385~ (had to round). If we then take this value and multiply by ( 1 + 0.95 + 0.68 ) * 793.385 = 2086.60255 + 169.08 from the last C-Brawl for a Dom BU Value total of 2255.68255 damage over 12.16s for a DPS of 185.5.
Well, that shows me for forgetting that the BU is hardcoded!
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So what was your actual numbers there? Sorry it is just a lot of edits
In the end it looked like you pulled 2256 is that with our without VS? Did you also adjust for server time?
I know Thunderstrike is garbage and should be skipped under ideal dps and dpa simulations. I just wonder how many doms realize that in game?
I just did a burst representation because you suggested /nrg would be fine with pbu. I think it would stomp all over /elec.
Anyway here is the relevant DPA's across the sets.
<font class="small">Code:[/color]<hr /><pre> DPA DPA
Pbolt 44.47 Cbolt 44.47
BS 66.70 Cbrawl 72.99
PP 65.60 Lbolt 46.83
Pblast 55.97 Havoc 66.70
TF 63.57 TS 38.57
Pburst 61.20
</pre><hr />
Bare in mind Starsmans charts have /elec as 0.05 above /nrg for sustained st. It is clear looking at the dpa values that /elec leans heavily on charged brawl whereas /nrg is comfortable with every power it has.
I haven't looked at the attack chain generator yet. But I'll have a look shortly to see what can be seen.
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I should mention though, I personally feel that with the recent changes, Power Boost for Doms should be changed to Power Build Up. Leave it at the 120s recharge it's at currently, give it a Damage/To Hit boost, and maybe lower the amount of +Duration it has. Icy and Energy won't be able to do as many "bursts" of damage that Elec can, but at least it will have an option for those that feel the +Duration is superfluous.
[/ QUOTE ]I just want to remind you, we do have an option. We skip powerboost. It'd be nice if it did something, but it doesn't, so... ah well, eh. It's not a big deal.
That's WITHOUT Voltaic Sentinel factored in at all.
Whether or not a Dom uses their abilities to the best of their potential is irrelevant personally. It comes down to what the maximum potential of the set can do, and yes the 2256 is the "BU" chain without Volt Sentinel factored in. Just raw burst damage that Elec can come up with using the best abilities it can.
The 2256 BU value is higher than the PBU value that you have listed, and the thing to keep in mind is that PBU is not up as often as BU. Even assuming they gave it at the 120s recharge.
The first value I gave is for a good burst chain which netted 1925 damage in 12.66s which is higher than the Energy burst chain without PBU that you listed. Elec does not need BU to be competitive with Energy. Again, this is without any Volt Sentinel factored into it. Though, this chain was one that used Zapp in it. I did get one that got to 1903 or something without Zapp at all, it was under the 1925 but over 1900 that much I remember for sure, and the chain is usable indefinitely.
And yes, you are completely right that the set leans on C-Brawl to get it's high DPS. C-Brawl was just that over the top previously to the Dom buffs though, same anim time but way higher base scalar. I can see why they cut the damage on it. Either way, my main thing that I wanted to point out is there are very much real reasons to take Elec Assault over Energy Assault. Elec is still the top ST DPS performer for Doms, Energy is just a really good contender now than it was before.
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I should mention though, I personally feel that with the recent changes, Power Boost for Doms should be changed to Power Build Up. Leave it at the 120s recharge it's at currently, give it a Damage/To Hit boost, and maybe lower the amount of +Duration it has. Icy and Energy won't be able to do as many "bursts" of damage that Elec can, but at least it will have an option for those that feel the +Duration is superfluous.
[/ QUOTE ]I just want to remind you, we do have an option. We skip powerboost. It'd be nice if it did something, but it doesn't, so... ah well, eh. It's not a big deal.
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Yup, I know ^.^
I actually already posted in this very same thread that that is exactly what I did with my Mind/Icy Dom.
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I should mention though, I personally feel that with the recent changes, Power Boost for Doms should be changed to Power Build Up. Leave it at the 120s recharge it's at currently, give it a Damage/To Hit boost, and maybe lower the amount of +Duration it has. Icy and Energy won't be able to do as many "bursts" of damage that Elec can, but at least it will have an option for those that feel the +Duration is superfluous.
[/ QUOTE ]I just want to remind you, we do have an option. We skip powerboost. It'd be nice if it did something, but it doesn't, so... ah well, eh. It's not a big deal.
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Yup, I know ^.^
I actually already posted in this very same thread that that is exactly what I did with my Mind/Icy Dom.
[/ QUOTE ]Durn kids, writing more than I read.
Woo! I'm really pumped now
mind/earth shall be fantastic!
Also, I'd rather something different from pb as well - aim/bu would make me smile!
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Really wish that Starsman would update his website that he has, as those charts would have much more detail about which powers get used for which settings, and such.
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I updated them a while back but "forgot" to update my site to link to them.
However, in the sake of simplicity I didnt add the list of selected powers on this version. I can revisit this and make them visible in the power Data tab... will see what I can pull off there without having to re-design the entire page.
There are a few vids up from Comic Con, one of which shows some of (all of?) the powers from Earth Assault. Mud Pots!? Really?
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"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
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There are a few vids up from Comic Con, one of which shows some of (all of?) the powers from Earth Assault. Mud Pots!? Really?
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From earlier in the thread, and confirmed by other CC attendees:
1. Stone Spears (4 sec rech, 2.1 sec animation)
2. Stone Mallet
3. Tremor
4. Hurl Boulder (8 or 10 sec rech, 2.5 sec animation)
5. Power Boost
6. Heavy Mallet
7. Seismic Smash
8. Mud Port
9. Fissure
What a fun tool, save a lot of Excel time. Definitely bookmarked
Ok for /nrg
(adjusted for Arcanatime)
BS>PP>TF>BS>PP>PBurst>Pblast> repeat
13.73 sec, 138.94dps
1907.71 damage
For /elec
(adjusted for Arcanatime)
CBrawl>Havoc>Lbolt>Cbrawl>Cbolt>rep eat x2
12.68 sec, 127.9dps
1621.27 dam
w/ BU
BU>Cbrawl>Havoc>Lbolt>Cbrawl>Cbolt& gt;Havoc>(bu expires) Cbrawl>Lbolt>Cbolt
14sec, 144.35
1545.9 (bu)+475.04 (bu expired) = 2020.9 dam
*I figure VS adds about 23.5 dps to /elec, but that is overly optimistic as pets usually have a delay longer than activation+rech would indicate.
Like I said, /elec needs BU just to compete. And you need to use VS to actually best the /nrg by any meaningful amount.
/nrg gets powerboost for free, /elec pays for BU. I noted that when the changes were first announced.
More data points:
@ 30% recharge
nrg: BS>PP>TF>PBurst>PBlast>BS>PP> Pbolt>Snipe>Pblast>repeat
=125.3 dps
elec:
Cbrawl>Hav>Lbolt>Cbolt>Cbrawl>Snipe >Havoc>Cbrawl>Lbolt>Cbolt>TS>rep eat
=112.66 dps
@ 70% recharge
nrg:
BS>PP>TF>Pburst>BS>PP>Pblast> Pbolt>Snipe>repeat
=125.54 dps
elec:
Cbrawl>Hav>Lbolt>Cbrawl>Cbolt>Snipe >Cbwl>Hav>Lbolt>Cbrl>Cblt>TS
=114.96 dps
@100% recharge
nrg: (same as 70%)
elec: (same as 70%)
@ 150% recharge
(see above breakdown)
@225% recharge
nrg:
BS>PP>TF>BS>PP>Pburst>repeat
=141.46 dps
elec:
Cbrawl>Hav>Lbolt>Cbrawl>Cbolt>Hav&g t;Cbrawl>Lbolt>repeat
=131.04
Edit: if /nrg had pbu put in place of powerboost and remained on the same recharge timer with the defender duration (12.5 sec), then /nrg would be better than /elec in every single way (if it isn't already)
Yes it would have a longer recharge than buildup.
120+1.32 =121.32 with 12.5 dur= 10.3% uptime
90+1.32 = 91.32 with 10 dur= 10.9% uptime.
I'd say that is a pretty insignificant difference.
However, I still support /earth getting pbu
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Really wish that Starsman would update his website that he has, as those charts would have much more detail about which powers get used for which settings, and such.
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I updated them a while back but "forgot" to update my site to link to them.
However, in the sake of simplicity I didnt add the list of selected powers on this version. I can revisit this and make them visible in the power Data tab... will see what I can pull off there without having to re-design the entire page.
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Thanks for updating them!
So, it looks like.. at the lower end of the Recharge spectrum that Energy is ahead of Elec, but at higher Recharge Elec is ahead of Energy. Very nice to see ^.^
Though, I am a bit sad to see that on the high recharge Icy is so low on the charts.. Not that I am surprised by it particularly since they left it completely unchanged outside of the Dom modifier boosts. Though, of course, the devs don't balance around such a high recharge rate since it takes IO's, and such to achieve. ^.^; Oh well.
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Isn't it though?
It doesn't get BU right since it's hardcoded for Scrappers, but it's still a fun tool.
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Isn't it though?
It doesn't get BU right since it's hardcoded for Scrappers, but it's still a fun tool.
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Ya, I just hand edited in bu by setting dam enhance to 0 and then noting the last attack in w/e chain would benefit from it. Still saves me a lot of time from punching it in excel.
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There are a few vids up from Comic Con, one of which shows some of (all of?) the powers from Earth Assault. Mud Pots!? Really?
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From earlier in the thread, and confirmed by other CC attendees:
1. Stone Spears (4 sec rech, 2.1 sec animation)
2. Stone Mallet
3. Tremor
4. Hurl Boulder (8 or 10 sec rech, 2.5 sec animation)
5. Power Boost
6. Heavy Mallet
7. Seismic Smash
8. Mud Port
9. Fissure
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Im already thinking of concepts for a fire/earth/dark
Active 50's
Darklocked (dm/sd Brute)
Wardman (Fire/sd Scrapper)
Congealer (ice/cold Corruptor)
Peroxisome (mind/psi Dominator)
Evil Thing (Fire/Kin Corruptor)
Proud Member of Repeat-Offenders
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Isn't it though?
It doesn't get BU right since it's hardcoded for Scrappers, but it's still a fun tool.
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Ya, I just hand edited in bu by setting dam enhance to 0 and then noting the last attack in w/e chain would benefit from it. Still saves me a lot of time from punching it in excel.
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Oh, you mean like creating an attack with the values of BU, but have a DS of 0 rather than using one of the existing with BU sets?
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Isn't it though?
It doesn't get BU right since it's hardcoded for Scrappers, but it's still a fun tool.
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Ya, I just hand edited in bu by setting dam enhance to 0 and then noting the last attack in w/e chain would benefit from it. Still saves me a lot of time from punching it in excel.
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Oh, you mean like creating an attack with the values of BU, but have a DS of 0 rather than using one of the existing with BU sets?
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No, I just took w/e chain it generated and looked at where I'd like to stick BU in (ie the beginning for simplicity sake).
I know BU takes 1.32 sec to cast so leaves 8.68 seconds of buff. I'd then look for where it would expire in the chain. If there was any benefit to be gained by swapping an attack or two I'd do that.
The reason I set dam enhances to 0 is because while bu is active it was just easier to take the number it spit out and multiply it by 2.63 and then by 1.95 for w/e was left.
That doesn't give a good representation of BU over time though, more just in a short burst scenario that is longer than BU by a bit.
If I wanted to do it over time at varying recharges I'd just look at the uptime ratio against the damage buff it provides and jam that in as a flat percentage onto of whatever damage buff I'm looking at. Not pretty, but I doubt it would throw the numbers off much until extreme recharge is attained.
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There are a few vids up from Comic Con, one of which shows some of (all of?) the powers from Earth Assault. Mud Pots!? Really?
[/ QUOTE ]
From earlier in the thread, and confirmed by other CC attendees:
1. Stone Spears (4 sec rech, 2.1 sec animation)
2. Stone Mallet
3. Tremor
4. Hurl Boulder (8 or 10 sec rech, 2.5 sec animation)
5. Power Boost
6. Heavy Mallet
7. Seismic Smash
8. Mud Port
9. Fissure
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Im already thinking of concepts for a fire/earth/dark
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I'm already planning a Plant/Earth due to my love for my Fire/Fire keeping me from trying the x2 DoT auras. Doubling up sounds amazing (And I said omg save your Magma Mower names now in another post) but oy the end costs.
Power Boost for Flashfire would be the cherry on top though... with Tremor... and Fissure and... wait... do I really love my fire/fire (checks second build completely done in PvP IOs already...)...
Rats.
Thank you, City of Heroes, for giving me a superhero social network combined with amazingly smooth game play. Petitions signed with realistic expectations.
I hope that they eventually do an alternate animation for Hurl Boulder that's a speeded-up Propel Boulder instead. I want my Earth/Earth Dom to be Terra, not the Hulk.
Global name: @k26dp
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I know BU takes 1.32 sec to cast so leaves 8.68 seconds of buff
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Power effects generally don't occur until the activation time is finished. So BU has a 1.32s cast, and a 10s buff time.
What you are showing is a burst representation, and not a DPS representation.
This is the most recent chart that Starsman had during the Dominator changes that went test. Linky
Really wish that Starsman would update his website that he has, as those charts would have much more detail about which powers get used for which settings, and such.
Looking over what his chart does have listed, the usage of Thunder Strike in the Electric's chain that you list is what makes it very much subpar. I myself am not one that would use Thunderstrike unless my other attacks were not ready yet, as TS' damage for it's animation time is particularly low relative to the other attacks Elec gets.
EDIT:
*Ponders* I remember seeing an "attack chain" builder some place that allowed custom attacks, and would give a visual representation of the animation times, and recharges along with pointing out the 'best' attack to use at a given time..
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