Live Feedback: Issue 13 : Merit Reward System
By
1VB_FIST,
Posted on: 2008-12-11 18:56 in Developers' Corner
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I plan on making some tweaks to the system to make Merits, as a whole, more approachable and enjoyable for everyone, though changes take time.
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FWIW, I think you made Merits rather approachable and enjoyable from the start.
My issues have been with the impact on other game aspects as a result of introducing Merits. The two biggest examples being the major shift in market supply, and the constant desire to favor speed over substance.
Yes, there's some room to tweak the Merits themselves, but I think the more important changes have to be done on other systems to adapt to a world with Merits in it.
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Objective Feedback:
IOs from the new sets in the TF Drop Pools are almost non-existant on the market.
Subjective analysis about that:
This indicates a serious lack of TF Drop Pool supply in general. Since merits are the only source of said recipes, it seems the system is not producing enough drops that make it to the Market.
This is probably true over all Pool C recipes, not just the new sets. The new sets are simply a lot easier to notice, and do not have the possibility that market activity may be using pre-existing Pool C's instead of new drops. I expect all Pool C recipes will be harder to find on the market now.
IMHO, TFs need to return to dropping random recipes. Merits should be applied on top of TF reward drops, so that people will over time get additional recipes, such as to offset bad luck on TF drops. (perhaps awarding fewer merits than currently, it doesn't have to directly merge the 2 amounts.) This will retain the pre-I13 supply of Pool Cs, and perhaps even increase the amount of supply of that pool on the market.
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Bingo, this says a lot of what I wanted to say. I've been looking for the low level accurate defence debuff set proc. It's not an uber IO, just a "chance of damage" but it's 200 merits or more. Less than 10 have been sold excluding level 30s, where 5 or more have sold, so don't know how many have dropped.
Suggestion - modify the merit awards to give say a random drop + 40 merits from posi, 7 merits from Katie, 2 drops +60 from Dr Q etc.
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I really like this idea. Big thumbs up. It does two things, continues giving variable rate merits that allows the devs to continue to tweak rewards, and B) *forces* random drops so that the market will continue to be fed.
The bad side, is that it still continues the idea that pool C recipes have to be slown down by 300% or so.
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but I don't think it's so bad to get a lousy drop if you're now getting Merits on top of that lousy drop. You have what you had pre-I13, but ALSO get the bonus stuff long-term.
As was pointed out in Beta, this is an unusual game situation in that Pool Cs are purchasable but NEVER drop normally. That's the heart of the problem.
Besides, they could keep TFs a bit unique if the Merit Store options were not directly replicating the TF pools. Perhaps the Merit drop rolls give options that help you dodge some of the recipes that are not useful to you. Like a way for my Stalker to avoid all the Mez sets he can never slot.
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This has been a very informative thread and a lot of good points have been raised here. I play City of Heroes too and I see a lot of room for growth and improvement in the Merit system. I wanted to let you all know that we are listening even if we're not always posting. I plan on making some tweaks to the system to make Merits, as a whole, more approachable and enjoyable for everyone, though changes take time. Keep the feedback coming; the more constructive, the better. I'd appreciate feedback using the Objective/Subjective format detailed in Ex Libris' original post. We're listening and will take it into consideration in future updates.
Thanks,
Synapse
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Purely Subjective:
The REAL problem here is that none of you seem to realize the problem that City of VILLAINS is facing. It is either that or you just don't care. CoV is in a sad state SF wise compared to CoH's TF's. I hope it is not that you don't care, but since Beta, the discrepancies have been pointed out. I do understand that you all are tired of people complaining about the lack of content when there were boatloads of stuff that people simply weren't doing on the Hero side, but that stuff was omitted from the villain side, so now villains like myself are wondering if we are being heard or listened to.
Please do or say something that will restore my confidence. NO, I do not feel like being a tag along on Hero content on my villains all the time to get merits (Lady Gray, Imperious). No, I do not feel like spending 4 hours organizing a Hami raid on a low pop server to get merits on the red side.
This issue cut me off at the knees. My game used to be grinding through level after level so that once I got to 45, I could get to my favorite part of the game, and test myself against the Freedom Phalanx in the RSF. Now the RSF isn't even worth doing unless I am looking for Hami O's. We used to do multiple runs per night. Since the last issue, I have run more STF's than RSF's. Why? people are playing where the merits are. People want to be able to have the best gear. With the current system, it's just not worth doing much on the red side.
I have done something that I have never done since I got here three years ago. I have let my villain account lapse (my main account). I am seriously considering letting this account expire next month as well.
There seems to be a disconnect between the development team and the red side game.
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This has been a very informative thread and a lot of good points have been raised here. I play City of Heroes too and I see a lot of room for growth and improvement in the Merit system. I wanted to let you all know that we are listening even if we're not always posting. I plan on making some tweaks to the system to make Merits, as a whole, more approachable and enjoyable for everyone, though changes take time. Keep the feedback coming; the more constructive, the better. I'd appreciate feedback using the Objective/Subjective format detailed in Ex Libris' original post. We're listening and will take it into consideration in future updates.
Thanks,
Synapse
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Purely Subjective:
The REAL problem here is that none of you seem to realize the problem that City of VILLAINS is facing. It is either that or you just don't care. CoV is in a sad state SF wise compared to CoH's TF's. I hope it is not that you don't care, but since Beta, the discrepancies have been pointed out. I do understand that you all are tired of people complaining about the lack of content when there were boatloads of stuff that people simply weren't doing on the Hero side, but that stuff was omitted from the villain side, so now villains like myself are wondering if we are being heard or listened to.
Please do or say something that will restore my confidence. NO, I do not feel like being a tag along on Hero content on my villains all the time to get merits (Lady Gray, Imperious). No, I do not feel like spending 4 hours organizing a Hami raid on a low pop server to get merits on the red side.
This issue cut me off at the knees. My game used to be grinding through level after level so that once I got to 45, I could get to my favorite part of the game, and test myself against the Freedom Phalanx in the RSF. Now the RSF isn't even worth doing unless I am looking for Hami O's. We used to do multiple runs per night. Since the last issue, I have run more STF's than RSF's. Why? people are playing where the merits are. People want to be able to have the best gear. With the current system, it's just not worth doing much on the red side.
I have done something that I have never done since I got here three years ago. I have let my villain account lapse (my main account). I am seriously considering letting this account expire next month as well.
There seems to be a disconnect between the development team and the red side game.
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SUBJECTIVE, but necessary:
I would seriously consider making issue 15 and/or 16 content issues with a mix of powerset proliferation. Use these issues to revamp the old heroside stuff that is old and decrepit and add MORE content for redside.
The storyline on both sides needs to move ahead. From the hints dropped it seems like issue 15 might be focused on the fifth column. After spending near a year talking about the COMING STORM, that is seriously disappointing to me. Tired of the Council/5th (I'm sorry but its the SAME DAMN mob group as far as I'm concerned just recolored and re-named, and SORELY UNIMPRESSIVE.)
Also expand the VEAT storyline to be as full as the Kheldian one.
Issue 14 can be MA. I have no issue with that.
I think with merits, pvp, invasions, day jobs, etc you have the systems down, sure they need a bit more tweaking, but it would be a BIG mistake to have another issue like this, that was just systems.
Some may disagree with me, but I think the focus was TOO MUCH on systems on issue 13.
EDIT: Also put co-op on an indefinite back burner for now.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
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EDIT: Also put co-op on an indefinite back burner for now.
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I'd reverse that statement, personally. Unlock some of the existing but disconnected hero-side areas to red-side usage, like the Shadow Shards as a prime example. But beyond that, yes, don't make any more co-op specific zones for now, please! Start adding actual content red-side, finish bringing it up to parity with the blue-side.
To the other players:
SUBJECTIVE: During the winter event, do the following: Get a team of 6-8 people, run around opening presents, kill Winter Lords. 20 merits in an hour, guaranteed. Bonus: Do this in Croatoa so you can respond to a Jack/Eocholai fight and get even more GM merits.
Devs:
SUBJECTIVE: Put me down as a vote for merits for badges... but not all of them. I'm thinking mostly Merits for Eden, Katie, etc so that the first time someone runs them, they can get a Recipe from the vendor... but then after that, since you're not earning the badge any more, you'd only get the normal amount. And any badge not associated with an accolade or gladiator. Also non-merit giving: Exploration, Vet, and Day Job badges. That still leaves plenty of badges that can earn merits, but nothing huge.
-STEELE =)
Allied to all sides so that no matter what, I'll come out on top!
Oh, and Crimson demands you play this arc-> Twisted Knives (MA Arc #397769)
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EDIT: Also put co-op on an indefinite back burner for now.
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I'd reverse that statement, personally. Unlock some of the existing but disconnected hero-side areas to red-side usage, like the Shadow Shards as a prime example. But beyond that, yes, don't make any more co-op specific zones for now, please! Start adding actual content red-side, finish bringing it up to parity with the blue-side.
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They could open up the shard without making it co-op. It's one of the few EXISTING places that would make sense for vills to be able to get to on the blue side.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
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Subjective:
Merits feel like a grind.
Under the old system: Finish Task Force: Oooh, I get a shiny! Maybe it would be something good or useful to that character or that could be shared, or maybe it wouldnt, but there was instant gratification to this.
Under the new system: Finish Task Force: Oh, gee, um, merits. Kind of dry, tastes like cardboard.
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On the other hand, I quite disagree. I really hated random drops. It seemed so arbitrary, and unfair for those of us who didn't want to rerun the same TF/SF over and over again just to try to get that one drop. Now I can run any TFs I want, and then just choose my reward when I want. I love this.
I'm also the kind of person who like to put my money in the bank and get a little interest each month, rather than go to the Vegas slots with it and hope for a big score. That's exactly random drop system felt like to me: a big ol' RNG powered one-armed bandit. The merit system is much better.
Maybe the devs could punch up text on your screen when you get merits. Make it gold colored or a blend of gold and silver. Make a new sound for merits earn. That's as far as I'd go for making merits themselves more interesting.
OTOH, I think merits have illustrated how villains really get the short end of the stick when it comes to TF/SFs. I'm really shocked at the variety and number of TFs suddenly being run. By itself, that's great, but I sure wish villains had the same options.
Suggestion: make new villain SFs. Allow Heroes to "infiltrate" these missions. Let Heroes go find out what those evil villains are up to! Then just change the ending slightly, just the end text, so that Heroes keep whatever was the objective (information, some object) for themselves, thus "winning" against the villains. Or they destroy the objective themselves once it's purpose is revealed. (Could be done with just a click glowie after a "protect" final mish.)
Bonus points if Heroes actually go to Rogues' Isles for this SF. Not for teaming with villains, but not in PvP mode either. (But they should be able to fight street spawn.) Probably can't use the ferries either, gotta stay in the one zone of the SF.
moar co-op pls.
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To the other players:
SUBJECTIVE: During the winter event, do the following: Get a team of 6-8 people, run around opening presents, kill Winter Lords. 20 merits in an hour, guaranteed. Bonus: Do this in Croatoa so you can respond to a Jack/Eocholai fight and get even more GM merits.
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Two things:
The Christmas event lasts what two weeks? What then, still be shortchanged at every turn?
Villains cannot get into Croatoa.
Villains need content. Have needed and asked for it since I-7. All of the pleas have fallen on deaf ears. It is really discouraging. 
Several people have mentioned that they love the feeling of actually getting the drop at the mission complete, instead of heading to Wentworths. Here is a partial solution for the devs to consider that may make some of the people here happy.
Have an option appear on the screen upon mission completion to give a Random recipe drop IF the TF was worth that much. Then deduct the Random Drop from the merits.
Pseudo code follows.
If (MissionMerits => RandomDrop Cost) DisplayRandomDropOption;
If (RandomDropOptionSelection == "yes")
{ give RandomDrop;
MerritReward = MerritReward - RandomDropCost;
} else GiveMerrit Reward;
Over all this will almost surely help increase satisfaction due to a little thing known as "Variable Reinforcement". For those of you not familliar with it, it is one of the psycological reason for gambling is SO popular.
HP Lovecat
Objective:
I run a lot of alts. Recipes, INF, and enhancements are all commodities which can be traded. Merits cannot. Before Issue 13, I could run a TF on any character, and trade the rewards to whoever needs it. This is no longer an option.
Subjective:
The number one change I would like to see is the ability to consolidate merits to a single character. Under the current system, it feels like those who play numerous characters are being punished for not focusing on a single one. This seems to go strongly against previously stated design goals, including the ability to buy additional character slots in bulk, and the very concept of global chat. Everything about the game's design seems to encourage alternate characters.
Except the Merit System.
My first short story (detective fiction) came out in Jan-2012. Other stories and books to follow, I hope. Because of "real writing". COH was a big part of that happening.
(qr)
Objective: Many Task Forces give you enough merits for a random roll. However, because you have to redeem those credits for a random roll, the "immediate gratification" is lost.
Subjective: I love Merits but can understand the arguments against things as is. Could you, if nothing else, provide for a Random Roll + Change option? I realize its a small thing (well, maybe not from an implementation standpoint - I make no assumptions there), but some folks might well respond to that better. Quick, immediate, still got that excitement, etc. Let the player decide right then what they want to do. Finding a vendor, looking at the list, etc., isn't as convenient, and honestly it could be overwhelming looking at that list and seeing what you really want costing x00 credits (it a weird way, some folks might see that and feel almost obligated to try and get it that way).
Subjective: Please don't allow us to collect merits on a global/per account basis unless there's a way to prevent abuses (account hacks, RMT-enablement) or "whoops" moments (accidentally buying more than intended, wrong item, etc), perhaps through a time-limited refund ability (would require tracking what was just bought and all that, though).
Set up the forum account just to reply in this thread.
Objective:
<ul type="square">[*]Many of us don't do strike forces or task forces. So we will not be getting many merit rewards. [*]Many of us play with a lot of alts. For us, merit rewards will be distributed amongst a group of characters. [*]The removal of random drops from TFs, trials, and what-have-yous will lead to a selection of recipes not reaching the markets. [*]Numerically, and with the diminishing returns, the system seems to favore blue side. More TFs to run with higer rewards. [/list] Subjective time:
The invention and black market systems have been one of my favorite things to hit City since I started playing. Now, some of the best IO rewards were TF/SF rewards, but the market made sure that I still had access to these recipes. You see, I don't run TF/SFs. I lack the time and inclination to do so. But with the market that came along with the invention system, I could play City of Commerce and get those rewards. The merit-only reward system is going to remove a chunk of recipes from the market. Things like the "Crap of the Hunter", witch I use, will be vanishing (as well as the snipes, slows, confuses, etc).
My second problem is with the blueside slant. I played Heroes a couple years ago. It didn't do a whole lot for me, at least not enough to make me wanna pay for it every month. When Villains came out, I absolutely loved it and have been playing since. Now there has always been a 2 year established playerbase and content advantage for the heroes, but setting up a reward system that favors one side will have an effect on the population. There has always been more hero players, try not to give people reasons to leave our side.
I like the idea of the merit system. I just don't think it should be an all-out replacement of the old system, nor should it favor heroes or TF/SF-heavy players. I'll end this by saying that I love this game and am only willing to post on the forums because I know you guys (the devs) listen and actually care about the game and those of us playing.
Thanks for listening (reading).
Most people have said what I am going to say, but might as well post it:
I'll try to sum my points up in topics and be objective/subjective about them
Objective:
<ul type="square">[*]Market Supply Has Gone Down
Please data mine the Markets and available recipes before/after i13. Red-side, currently, there is a huge shortage. Besides the recipes that drop from mobs, recipes from the roll pools have dried up.
[*]Random Roll Pool Contents
The random roll pools consist of a huge variety of recipes. Ranging from the very invaluable to the very valuable. This in itself is the root of many problems.
[*]Merits Being Tied to Characters
Merits have rendered playing with alts something do to while waiting for the 24 hour DR counter. This is a big step away from what made this game different.
[*]Red-side SF, or lack of
Red-side has very few SFs. This has become even more apparent with merits.
Villains have 5 SFs without the mini ouro ones to get merits from. 3 trials, all three respec trials. Red-side has NO 30-35 SF. So basically unless you want to run the coop 2 SF/TFs you are stuck with a whopping FIVE SFs to run. Four SFs give 25 merits per run. Only one gives 35 merits per run.
You have to run 10 SFs with level 25 merits to get 250 merits for a highly desirable recipe. This in itself results in repetition of content.
[*]Recipe's Merit Values
Merits per recipe and their past market value have an inconsistent link. Recipes that were not worth that much, now cost many merits. Either the 200-250 merits range is too low for some recipes or too high for others, high/low objectivity depends entirely on how much the devs wants players to grind.
[*]Value of Infamy
Merits have devalued infamy. (notice I said infamy since i have been only running red-side and the same toon since i13 and completely ignoring hero alts so have no idea of influence and WW market). Since there is very little to buy on the BM, influence has lost value. I've been raking up a lot of inf by repeat running the same three SFs over and over and over and over and over and over (did I say over and over yet?), but really, what to spend this on now...
[*]Teaming Impact
Devaluation of influence, and lack of market supply has a negative impact on teaming in general. Merits is really all you want. Why team and do others arcs? If you are really bored of SFs or are crap out of luck and between levels 30-35, you have to run missions. There is no reason to run others missions, you don't get merits for their arcs.
Subjective and Suggestions[*]Market Supply Has Gone Down
This issue, subjectively, means for me, the markets have almost nothing I want to buy, or what is there has gone up in value considerably.
[*]Random Roll Pool Contents
I've always had a problem with this, it is even more apparent now. There are certain recipes that are indeed highly desirable. Most if not every character benefits immensely from them. This was reflected clearly in the recipes market values pre i13. The drop pools contain these recipes and MANY totally invaluable recipes in them. This should not be the case. Sure a random roll at the end of a TF should not mean you will get a recipe you want, but it should NOT give you equal chance of getting a worthless recipe that sells for less inf than a minion defeat yields.
Separate the pool recipes. Sift out the highly undesirables. Keep the highly desirable recipes in one pool, downgrade the worthless recipes in the roll pools to random drop pools. A Random roll should give you a shot at a recipe you can either use or sell for pretty decent cash. This is not the case today.
[*]Merits Being Tied to Characters
I have many alts. I love playing different characters. CoH was unique to me in the sense that it rewarded playing with different characters over the more classical 'me-too' type grind-your-main game play. This is the main reason I've stayed in CoH. Most other MMOs have been about 'your main' and grinding most of the time on him to get him up to par. CoH, offered a way to play different characters, different powers, and different play styles. I could play melee/control/buff and enjoy the game fully. This did not impede in the way of improving one or all characters.
Today I have a merit character, a villain. He's optimized to run the 35 and 25 merit SFs. All he does is 35 merit SF>25 merit SF that is it. That is the most efficient way to accumulate merits red-side for a person with my playtime/hours. There is no reason I should play any other toon today. If I play my other toons I am cutting into time that could be spent accumulating merits on the merit char. This is a big step away from what this game offered in the past. It is taking it towards the me-too pile.
[*]Redside SF, or lack of
I already mentioned I run two SFs over and over now. Please keep in mind that before i13 I did not do a single speed run. Not a single speed run. So I am not a speed runner, I just enjoyed to log in with different chars and run different SF/TFs and play different roles. I did enjoy teaming in PUGs in general or took my better built chars to self challenges. I never felt CoH was repetitive before (I mean we do have a whopping four type of missions that repeat all the time), but now, oh my, I don't think this is any fun anymore.
[*]Recipe's Merit Values
They don't line up. Either bring up the really desirable recipe merit values and make CoH even more of a grind, or lower the merit values for some recipes down.
[*]Value of Infamy
Merits are an alternate infamy now. Period. You can buy anything end everything short of purples with merits. You get infamy up the wazoo whatever you do but you only get merits for specific tasks. This, IMO, is broken. Merits should allow you to buy select recipes and/or things, not everything short of purples. By doing this you have replaced infamy with a much more valuable type of currency. And since the sources of this new currency are limited, this results in the played content to be narrowed.
If merits are supposed to be a parallel currency, then maybe the merit values of items should be reviewed and the tasks that reward them increased. But in this case there needs to be a correlation. Meaning inf/merits should be somewhat balanced.
I think in general, making merits a parallel currency is wrong and counterproductive. Narrowing what can be purchased with them and allowing supply of many recipes back onto the market to be bought with inf should make merits more into 'merits' that you use to buy special items, and less of a parallel elite currency.
[*]Teaming Impact
Many people have gone over this, there needs to be a solution. If Merits are to be awarded at the end of story arcs, then everyone on team should get it.
I haven't done the math, but you could in essence make every non-radio or non-radio-like-contact mission (borea and the borea roman clone guy) give one merit. Sure this means arcs with 12 missions in them give 12 merits. This just means that merit values of items and rewards through SF/TFs need to be increased. But awards playing non-repetitive and highly ignored content, without penalizing teaming.
The values given here are just exemplary and not meant to imbalance the value or merits. I'm simply saying completion of non-repetitive mission content through contacts should give you merits and that the merits awarded through sf/tfs and merits required to purchase items adjusted.[/list]
That mostly sums up my i13 merit thoughts. i13 has deeply changed the way I play the game while most i13 changes were nice additions, I find myself enoying this new way of play a lot less.
Subjective:
It'd be really neat to see a day job that gives a merit at mission completion, and/or the ability to gain a merit for clearing out any mission. You just can't do that fast enough to rival TF gains.
What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?
PPD & Resistance Epic Archetypes
Objective Feedback:
I have numerous characters I play (many more then in my sig). I have a few favorites but I have found myself playing them less and less in order to accumulate enough merits on one character to buy a recipe to give to another character. I made 3 new characters this week, got each one to lvl 5 then quit playing them because I could play one of my mains for the same amount of time and get anywhere from 5-50 merits.
Subjectively
I feel the merit system discourages altism. Something this game has prided itself on. I have a fully IO'd out, 55+ set bonuses, 1.4 billion influence toon (current market value of his sets). And while I love playing him I find myself shying away from anything other then him. He is, sadly, getting a little boring since I have run so many arcs, tf's, monsters, etc on him.
As for Redside. . . I love my brutes but getting anything on them from the market is an exercise in pain. I hate farming redside and playing the characters up to 50 I hardly acquire any of the IO's I want (and yes I know it is a want not a need).
Finally, one more side note, on that lvl 50 scrapper, I used to play him about an hour a day before issue 13. I would average a purple recipe about every 3 hours. Played him over 50 hours since issue 13 went live (in my off season at work) and have yet to have a single purple drop (in the ITF's, 3rd Respecs, missions, scanners, everything I have done).
Subjective: It's nice that the completion of story arcs means something beyond the arc XP bonus plus and the souvenir at the end of the arc. (I'd love to see the souvenirs mean something, though).
Objective: I'm level 13 and have a whole 7 merits to my credit. As a person who doesn't have much time to run task forces, this is a pain in the tail. This brings me to the subjective opinion that the cost of recipes at the merit vendor is prohibitively high.
I concur generally with the feedback here: a marked impact on solo vs. team play, reduced alt mix in my character cycle, etc.
However, with the Winter Event running it is hard to reach definitive conclusions on market impact. Skiers and Cane farming have to be negatively impacting the market and skewing the impact of Merits. Patience remains the watch word.
City of Heroes was my first MMO, & my favorite computer game.
R.I.P.
Chyll - Bydand - Violynce - Enyrgos - Rylle - Nephryte - Solyd - Fettyr - Hyposhock - Styrling - Beryllos - Rosyc
Horryd - Myriam - Dysquiet - Ghyr
Vanysh - Eldrytch
Inflyct - Mysron - Orphyn - Dysmay - Reapyr - - Wyldeman - Hydeous
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To the other players:
SUBJECTIVE: During the winter event, do the following: Get a team of 6-8 people, run around opening presents, kill Winter Lords. 20 merits in an hour, guaranteed. Bonus: Do this in Croatoa so you can respond to a Jack/Eocholai fight and get even more GM merits.
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Two things:
The Christmas event lasts what two weeks? What then, still be shortchanged at every turn?
Villains cannot get into Croatoa.
Villains need content. Have needed and asked for it since I-7. All of the pleas have fallen on deaf ears. It is really discouraging.
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Not completely true. The did add more stuff for villains to do via co-op. The issue NOW, is that we need more villside content and less co-op.
so it's technically not entirely true that we've been waiting since I-7.
If one feels that co-op railroads vills into acting heroic, that is a different argument to make.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
Subjective Feedback: I feel that Newspaper and Radio missions should reward 1 Merit. I understand that ghosting could be a problem, so instead of awarding the merit upon mission completion, award it if all foes are defeated AND mission is completed. My reason for this is that after having played all the story arcs since the game started, my group's routine is to simply get together and do Newspaper/Scanner missions so that we dont have to worry about co-ordinating who is doing which arc, etc.
Subjective Feedback: There should be a way to transfer merits between your own characters on the same server only, on the same account only. The reason for this is that Merits suck for altaholics. I bounce around constantly, so even if I were to focus on merit-worthy content, I will earn Merit results at 1/12th the rate, because I have so many alts and I bounce between all of them evenly. This makes Merit collection tedious. It would be nice if I could combine the ones I earn on my account only.
Lewis
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
I haven't had a lot of time to play Co* recently, so my experience with the Merit system is extremely limited. However, Zaran did make one point that I feel very strongly about, so I'll quote it for emphasis:
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Subjective[*] I've lost most of my ability to do task forces and I miss this alot. Task forces are THE teaming environment. Pick up groups for missions are OK but lack the commitment and comeraderie.
I can't commit more than one continuous hour to the game; I have too many other things I have to do. Doing the the Katie TFs is now passe because of the lack of a good reward, but it was the only TF I could do that I was sure could recruited and completed in a timeframe I could work with.
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This is a serious problem from my point of view. To be clear, I can sometimes arrange longer blocks of time on the weekends, and I certainly enjoy running longer TFs on occasion. So the merit system certainly has some good side. But I really liked the way the KHTF's combination of reward and short time investment made it possible to get in a group and run the whole thing in a very manageable time frame. Sure, I'd almost never got a useful recipe out of it, but it was quick, easy and fun.
I know the devs felt that ~30 minutes was too short a time to be worth a random Pool C recipe, but I respectfully disagree with their decision. Two hours of solid playtime for a Pool C random (for a slightly above average group, in all likelihood) is an impractical model from my point of view. I hope that will be changed.
Unfortunately, I have no objective comments at the moment.
-D
Darkonne: Pinnacle's (unofficially) mighty Dark Miasma/Radiation Blast enthusiast!
Be sure to check out this mighty Arc:
#161865 - Aeon's Nemesis
Subjective:
The label "Merit Vendor" should be changed to something more immersive.
These people could be Ouroboros Mendors providing incentives (recipies) to heroes who fulfill their destinies (completion of trials/tfs/story-arcs).
These people could be Midnighter Club members providing Revelations (recipes) to the Mysteries (merits) collected by heroes.
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Subjective:
Merits feel like a grind.
Let me emphasize that, A GRIND.
Before Issue 13, even before it went live, when the Merit System was revealed for what it was, my interest in playing the game dwindled. I lost heart.
Under the old system: Finish Task Force: Oooh, I get a shiny! Maybe it would be something good or useful to that character or that could be shared, or maybe it wouldnt, but there was instant gratification to this.
Under the new system: Finish Task Force: Oh, gee, um, merits. Kind of dry, tastes like cardboard. Gee, how many more TFs do I have to do to get my shiny? No instant gratification. Even if the task force was long enough to meet the 20 merit goal of being worthy of a random roll, the player still has to make a trip to turn them in. Theres no excitement to this.
I understand the goals, both stated and unstated, behind the Merit System. I like the OPTION to save merits to purchase a desired item, to no longer be reliant on market flippers.
What I dont like is that the zest of doing Task Forces is gone. The excitement of a reward at the end is gone. Comparing and trading rewards with your teammates is gone. I think you have underestimated the importance of this.
My experience:
I just dont feel like doing Task Forces anymore, where I used to do 5 or 6 a week. Why bother? Where I had a chance at the end of each for something great (or maybe useful to my SG or vendor fodder) I now can save up box tops for the eventual day I can buy ONE enhancement. Just ONE. Or I can invest considerably more time than I used to have to in order to obtain a random roll that I have to visit a vendor to get, also not inspiring.
I also dont like that 10 or so of the people I did Task Forces with regularly have quit the game. If I actually wanted to Task Force, most of the people I did so with on my main server Liberty are gone. The only suggestion I have for that is to have another Reactivation Weekend soon and hope some of them come back.
I haven't given up on this game, I still play, I still love my friends and family whom I play with here. I have played COH/V for 4 1/2 years and I very much disagree with the attitude that "people that leave are accounts you would have lost anyway". That is simply not true.
Look at my signature. Its there for a reason. I bought a Lifetime Account on LOTRO a month ago. Issue 13 swept me off to Middle Earth. I play both games now.
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Nailed it.
[/ QUOTE ] Yet Another Nail...
Merits have ruined the game for me to be honest. For the first time in almost 4 years I'm SERIOUSLY thinking of leaving CoH, and I'm not sure where I'll go ...yet. I don't know what makes Devs think grinding is fun, but it's not, the whole situation makes me sad and angry.
I don't know what the answer is... not that you'd listen anyways. Seems to me the outcry was pretty loud in Beta and you ignored it then.
Return CHOICE to the game, return FREEDOM to the game. To hell with trying to funnel me into YOUR vision of how the game SHOULD be played and let me play in peace. To hell with trying to defeat Gold Farmers, who cares? Outside of spamming they bother no one. Never once had a Gold farmer gank me and steal my stuff... ain't gonna happen here.
Of course my theory has always been you'd put out a severely tainted product (a la Microsoft), and then come back with a weak fix and everyone would cheer and praise you. When in fact the "fix" is still less than what is needed, a bait-n-switch. Yes, I've lost faith. If you truly played the game &/or listened, this never would have made it to Live.
Travel Suppression is this game's worst feature, well that and MetaHumans riding mass transit like tourists at DisneyLand.
I'd agree that the merit system currently feels very "artificial" as you termed it. If I remember, I think I brought up something like that in the closed beta; might have referred to just the vendors themselves though.
I believe it went something like switching the merit vendors to Hero Corps contacts (Blueside). I'd also add to that by changing the Merit Reward Salvage to something like Credits for heroes and Cash for Villains.