City of Heroes: Live Forum Archive

Discussion: Hollows Zone Gameplay Makeover

Aidalyn

By Aidalyn,
Posted on: 2008-03-19 09:38 in News, Events and Announcement Discussion

 

Posted

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I still think these revamps should be for both sides, some how though.



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Like the Rikti War Zone? They have only so many people and so many hours in a day to work with. It's not like we've seen uninterrupted strings of zone changes made only to one game. CoH has many unused zones, while the CoV zones are more streamlined. I'm not saying CoV shouldn't get any attention. But CoV did benefit from the war zone, is getting a new secondary for MMs, and will probably get more in the future.

~Missi

http://tinyurl.com/yhy333s

Miss Informed in 2016! She can't be worse than all those other guys!

 

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LH, would you please relay my compliments to War Witch?

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I wanted to make the transition from City zone to Hazard zone less painful, especially since new players are 'forced' to go there by a Contact. I made this neighborhood a standard 'city' spawn zone.

[/ QUOTE ] Huzzah! Wonderful decision!


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I added Skulls, Hellions, and Lost to the mix. Also, you may run into Paragon Police or Longbow, but since they're allies, they'll help you out.

[/ QUOTE ] Yay! I like seeing them fight. It always struck me odd that the PPD were so "weak".

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Now there are Hydra, Coralax, and some Trolls wandering around.

[/ QUOTE ]Yay! New stuff ... and badges?

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Vahzilok have moved into the neighborhood, but usually only at night and in a very specific location. The Legacy Chain have a presence there too, a heroic group of mystical heroes who are there to help, not hurt the heroes of Paragon City.

[/ QUOTE ] Yay ... umm ... wait, I can't attack the Legacy Chain?

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In the guts of the Gulch, the spawn levels are 13 - 15. However, around the perimeter (to accommodate the Talshak mission), there are a set of spawns that are 11 - 12 only. These guys are clearly defined as they are the only spawns in the entire Gulch that are face down in the ground taking a dirt nap. If players want to drop down and go deeper into the Gulch, they do so at their own risk.

[/ QUOTE ] Nice! I like how you are consciously adjusting the difficulty from perimeter-to-deep.

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There are also some Tsoo but they're sneaky, and you never know when they're going to drop in.

[/ QUOTE ] Wow! You've really made the Hollows more diverse! I wonder if there are any flying enemies ...

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I pulled every single mission door from the zone and reassigned it to a specific contact AND that contact's neighborhood. What this means is; no longer will players have to fly across the deadly Grendel's Gulch at Level 5 for their Frostfire mission at the other end of the zone, dodging spawns that can make mincemeat of them in a few short hits.

[/ QUOTE ] To be precise, it's Flux's arc that really makes people travel around (to the opposite corner (skyway side) of the zone, usually).

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Meg Mason is located in Cherry Hills by the abandoned water tower on the hill where the Supergroup Teleport exit point is.

[/ QUOTE ] Huzzah! Makes her easy to find.


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I’ve always felt that the zone had promise. It just wasn’t being realized!

[/ QUOTE ] Agreed. Thanks for all your hard work!

 

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Hm.

Upon further reflection, I'm not sure I'm that happy about the Coralax and Legacy Chain moving into Paragon City. As cool as they are, they're some of the things that give City of Villains a distinctive sense of purpose. By making them cross-factional, you marginally improve City of Heroes while diminishing part of the cool factor of playing Redside. And honestly, diminishing the cool factor's kind of the last thing City of Villains needs.

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Or blue side only people may see them and be interested in learning more about them and go and check out red side

While not the news that we were hoping for, the new make over sounds very nice.

 

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I really hope this is not all the info we are getting today.

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Some people are never happy.

 

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I really hope this is not all the info we are getting today.

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As I stated in an earlier thread, we are still weeks out from closed beta and more weeks out from open beta and then launch. So, expect to get something on a weekly basis from now till then. If we just dumped it all out now, well we'd be sitting around going "that's nice, but when can I play it?" So, thanks for your patience and understanding that it won't all come at once.

[/ QUOTE ]We are going to be like when can we play it anyways so I fail to see your point in this Lighthouse. At least if you did put the sets out there we could at least work on live servers to get the enhancements ready for future alts if we knew what every AT was getting.

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Yeah, even though knowing how WW changed the mob spawns and mission doors is nice, it's not really much in terms of actual new information.

Oh, well. Posi and Castle have already talked about some Powerset Proliferation-related stuff in posts, so maybe we'll get lucky with some more "tidbits" than will appear in these weekly official info releases...

 

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I really hope this is not all the info we are getting today.

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As I stated in an earlier thread, we are still weeks out from closed beta and more weeks out from open beta and then launch. So, expect to get something on a weekly basis from now till then. If we just dumped it all out now, well we'd be sitting around going "that's nice, but when can I play it?" So, thanks for your patience and understanding that it won't all come at once.

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I think we all understand that LH. But check out the Dev Corner. There are thousands of view and almost 900 posts each for the VEAT and Powerset Proliferation.

Each of those features has more posts just in the dev corner than the rest of the other features COMBINED. And if we counted all the various threads out in the other forums, it's clear that interest in those two features dwarfs anything else.

I don't think the community is being unreasonable in wanting information about those features first. Those are what people are talking about and spending another week having to guess is a major letdown.

The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.

 

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I'm with Eis for the most part. The Hollows was the place to go unload on a spawn and see how much you could take. That was really the boiler plate for my early characters, to see how much I could handle. Plus I bloody hate the Vahzilok.


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Actually, I treated the Hollows hazard spawns (which used to be conveniently near the contacts) as powerleveling-up opportunities. Power-munch some defense and damage inspirations, and go off and unload AoEs. It wasn't really a place for me to test my early builds because of the convenience of the contacts. (For that, I go to Perez Park and do my "hardcore" tests there).

 

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I really hope this is not all the info we are getting today.

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As I stated in an earlier thread, we are still weeks out from closed beta and more weeks out from open beta and then launch. So, expect to get something on a weekly basis from now till then. If we just dumped it all out now, well we'd be sitting around going "that's nice, but when can I play it?" So, thanks for your patience and understanding that it won't all come at once.

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I actually prefer having the information come out a little at a time. It gives me something to look forward to and, as stated, doesn't create a huge "dead air" space while we wait for the content to actually show up. Besides, the sooner it comes out, the sooner people will started escalating the " Why is X so Y and how come they didn't make Z more K? " posts. I'm good without those. I don't need months of people complaining about things they haven't even seen yet.

~Missi

http://tinyurl.com/yhy333s

Miss Informed in 2016! She can't be worse than all those other guys!

 

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Those all sound like really great changes to the Hollows. Now how about setting War Witch loose on the Shadow Shard? The huge villain population in the Shard is entirely too static, too rooted in place. The Shard has such enormous unrealized potential.

How about:

- a few wandering space "dragons"

- a few wandering rikti spacecraft

- a 50-hero Hamidon-raid-level arch-villain

- hollow out some asteroids for us to explore

- more complicated "one-off" missions

- an accolade power earned by completing the four Shard TFs

- access to the Shard for CoV (co-op mode like the RWZ?)

- actually place the Ski Chalet and Pocket D somewhere in the Shard

- black holes, small meteors, vision-obscuring nebulae

- a wisp city

- random rare rularuu raid on FBZ

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I'd settle with "a reason to BE there" personally, but otherwise QFT.

 

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Each of those features has more posts just in the dev corner than the rest of the other features COMBINED. And if we counted all the various threads out in the other forums, it's clear that interest in those two features dwarfs anything else.

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You're absolutely, 100% right, EvilGeko.

So, those will almost certainly be the last topics to get more detail. Because they want us speculating and discussing and frothing about it, building buzz in the process.

 

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I really hope this is not all the info we are getting today.

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Some people are never happy.

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/signed

 

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I really hope this is not all the info we are getting today.

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As I stated in an earlier thread, we are still weeks out from closed beta and more weeks out from open beta and then launch. So, expect to get something on a weekly basis from now till then. If we just dumped it all out now, well we'd be sitting around going "that's nice, but when can I play it?" So, thanks for your patience and understanding that it won't all come at once.

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And I mean this as no offense to WW, but if you did rank what bits of info we wanted to hear about, the Hollows rework would be near last if not last. Giving us info at the rate of one per week I'm perfectly fine with. Just give us the stuff we want to know about the most first.

Again, this is no slant towards WW. My first weekend playing this game was solidified via teaming in the Hollows. Being SKed up and visiting certain spots on the map just made everything seem so much more intense. I wasn't in Atlas anymore and I knew it. Here things like CoT, Igneous, and other far more deadly things lived. I will forever remember that experience along with things like soloing Frostfire on my Rad/rad, soloing the "Hunt 10 Igneous" mish on my Sonic/en blaster, having people trash talk Igneous during their fabled mish on my Storm/dark after the team decided to try it without a "healer" and I was the only support toon, leveling 5 times on an Atta mish, that freaking CoT hell mish to unlock the Hollows Trail, and the trial itself, getting instantly owned while going through the Glutch and eventually being able to walk though it with a level 5 character with nothing more than Sprint as my travel power. I really do like that zone and I'm partly saddened it was made easier, but I'll gladly go the zone once I can access i12 and see the changes. I just wanted some of the other i12 info first.

<--- who might make a token level 5 Glutch run just for old times sake before it's changed into being easier.

 

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Nice changes, WW. Thanks for the news! I'm just happy to be getting any tidbits about i12.

 

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I'd settle with "a reason to BE there" personally, but otherwise QFT.

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Heh. I was doing the "kidnap Akarist from the Shadow Shard" mission just two days ago. My reaction to getting the mission was "wait -- you've got an incredibly rare turncoat from the Circle of Thorns, providing information to all the heroes. It is vital he be kept safe. So... you've elected to hide him out in an incredibly hostile dimension populated by giant eyeballs with thorns and raybeams?

Look, Reed. Just because you like the Negative Zone is not an excuse for going to the negative zone.

 

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Hm.

Upon further reflection, I'm not sure I'm that happy about the Coralax and Legacy Chain moving into Paragon City. As cool as they are, they're some of the things that give City of Villains a distinctive sense of purpose. By making them cross-factional, you marginally improve City of Heroes while diminishing part of the cool factor of playing Redside. And honestly, diminishing the cool factor's kind of the last thing City of Villains needs.

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Well it makes sense for Legacy Chain to show up in Paragon City, and just like Longbow they aren't attackable by heroes since thy're 'the good guys'. It sounds like the presence of both them and coralax will be small. It sonds lke the heroes will now get to farm coralax for the gladiator but with only one neighborhood getting any it will be a slow proccess. Coralax have a much higher presence redside, and Legacy Chain is attackable there and give a gladiator as well. Since heroes can't attack Legacy Chain they still don't have access to that gladiator.

By some of what WW said I also think we may have possible new content (badges/missions) tied to the Vaz presence in a couple of neighborhoods, and maybe with the Tsoo as well.

 

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Each of those features has more posts just in the dev corner than the rest of the other features COMBINED. And if we counted all the various threads out in the other forums, it's clear that interest in those two features dwarfs anything else.

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You're absolutely, 100% right, EvilGeko.

So, those will almost certainly be the last topics to get more detail. Because they want us speculating and discussing and frothing about it, building buzz in the process.

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Buzz wouldn't be exactly what I would have called the flamewars about Psi Blast, but I know what you're saying. But you know, you could still have that. You could have said. This week we're going to tell you that Tankers get.....and Dominators get..... Have fun chewing on that.

They could have said, Bane's get crits from hide. (They actually did say that yesterday).

The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.

 

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Each of those features has more posts just in the dev corner than the rest of the other features COMBINED. And if we counted all the various threads out in the other forums, it's clear that interest in those two features dwarfs anything else.

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You're absolutely, 100% right, EvilGeko.

So, those will almost certainly be the last topics to get more detail. Because they want us speculating and discussing and frothing about it, building buzz in the process.

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I think it's a wise choice and I wouldn't be surprised if we heard something on Villain EATs next with Powersets being last.

 

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While I understand the changes, and the thinking behind making them, I'm not sure they are entirely a good thing. While I did loathe the Hollows for a while, they made me a better player. I learned how to navigate without drawing aggro (this is well before the days of temp travel powers). I learned to be on the constant lookout for other (and new) spawns while fighting, so as not to aggro a 2nd group. I learned a lot of little nuances of pulling. I had to learn, or I died.

There is a part of me that thinks everyone needs to learn the lessons of the Hollows. But with temp-travel powers some of those lessons are probably going unlearned anyways. And that other part of me understands trying to make the Hollows more enjoyable.

Both parts of me love the new hospital in the zone. Running back from Atlas sucked.

 

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Woot! This is gonna rock... One question- How the heck did Coralax get into the Red River, and why? I hope we get background-missions.

 

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Woot! This is gonna rock... One question- How the heck did Coralax get into the Red River, and why? I hope we get background-missions.

[/ QUOTE ]swam of course.

Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator

Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!

 

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And I mean this as no offense to WW, but if you did rank what bits of info we wanted to hear about, the Hollows rework would be near last if not last. Giving us info at the rate of one per week I'm perfectly fine with. Just give us the stuff we want to know about the most first.

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You guys really need to put yourselves in the Dev's/Rep's shoes here.

How does what you're asking for make any sense at all except that it fulfills our desire for instant gratification?

No one with any sense ever doles out information meant to excite people with the best, most interesting news first. You give out the little things and work your way up to the best, most interesting stuff last, closest to the main event.

I want to know about the cool, nitty-gritty gameplay stuff too, but if I was in charge of giving out this info I would do exactly what they did here.

Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA

 

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The changes I see sound pretty good with one exception. I did not see anything about Igneous. Unless I missed that in the article. Will Igneous (since they are hard to come by other than Hollows) still be in Hollows? I ask this for badge reasons.

 

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I've always enjoyed the look of the Hollows, but the spawn placements were just infuriating. Jetpacks at 5 helped with that. Still, now maybe I won't need the jetpack to enjoy the zone

 

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Woot! Shiny!