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Hey BAB, has there been any news lately on the development of that Psionic Weaponry set? I'd love to know if my hopes for it are at least remotely founded.
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Any idea when the rodents mm is coming out?
(Waves finger using Jedi mind power to trick devs into planning mm rodents within the next year)
You know, Hamsters, Capybaras, & Mutated Lab rat. One that was experimented on with superadine. (the brute rat) has a special melee power called "cage-buster." Knock-down and flying cage pieces do shrapnel damage (dot).
[I don't hate kb toons. I just don't let my kids ever go to a school with a kb toon, or talk to them - Anonymous.]
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I have addressed the problem with polls in my OP. Frankly, 90% "the people" are morons.
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A statement like this begs the question "And you're not because?" Accusing people who disagree with you of being morons is arrogant, self-righteous and not a little egocentric. With a premise like "Other people are stupid, I'm not, so things should be like I say they should be." you may as well not even bother. That just don't fly.
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Again you are missing the point, and making a personal attack. I think it was P.T. Barnum who said "no one ever lost a buck by under estimating the intelligence of the American public." Just because some thing is popular doesn't mean it's good. The Back Street Boys sell a whole lot of CDs, and yet the Ramones never got to do a world wide arena tour. Go figure.
"There's a sucker born every minute"
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And just because YOU don't like something doesn't make it bad ethier. Who appointed you god of what's good and what is not? Obviously a self-appointed title. I happen to like the idea of Dual Blades very much. It sounds fun to me and if that's what people wanted deal with it. That's what happens in democracies. Unless you maybe would perfer we not be one? Of course there is no gaurantee whatosever that your idea would be the prevailing one in a non democracy.
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I have addressed the problem with polls in my OP. Frankly, 90% "the people" are morons.
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A statement like this begs the question "And you're not because?" Accusing people who disagree with you of being morons is arrogant, self-righteous and not a little egocentric. With a premise like "Other people are stupid, I'm not, so things should be like I say they should be." you may as well not even bother. That just don't fly.
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Again you are missing the point, and making a personal attack. I think it was P.T. Barnum who said "no one ever lost a buck by under estimating the intelligence of the American public." Just because some thing is popular doesn't mean it's good. The Back Street Boys sell a whole lot of CDs, and yet the Ramones never got to do a world wide arena tour. Go figure.
"There's a sucker born every minute"
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And just because YOU don't like something doesn't make it bad ethier. Who appointed you god of what's good and what is not? Obviously a self-appointed title. I happen to like the idea of Dual Blades very much. It sounds fun to me and if that's what people wanted deal with it. That's what happens in democracies. Unless you maybe would perfer we not be one? Of course there is no gaurantee whatosever that your idea would be the prevailing one in a non democracy.
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All your posts fail.
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I have addressed the problem with polls in my OP. Frankly, 90% "the people" are morons.
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A statement like this begs the question "And you're not because?" Accusing people who disagree with you of being morons is arrogant, self-righteous and not a little egocentric. With a premise like "Other people are stupid, I'm not, so things should be like I say they should be." you may as well not even bother. That just don't fly.
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Again you are missing the point, and making a personal attack. I think it was P.T. Barnum who said "no one ever lost a buck by under estimating the intelligence of the American public." Just because some thing is popular doesn't mean it's good. The Back Street Boys sell a whole lot of CDs, and yet the Ramones never got to do a world wide arena tour. Go figure.
"There's a sucker born every minute"
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And just because YOU don't like something doesn't make it bad ethier. Who appointed you god of what's good and what is not? Obviously a self-appointed title. I happen to like the idea of Dual Blades very much. It sounds fun to me and if that's what people wanted deal with it. That's what happens in democracies. Unless you maybe would perfer we not be one? Of course there is no gaurantee whatosever that your idea would be the prevailing one in a non democracy.
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All your posts fail.
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Your life fails. End it now. Admit your love for the OP and go marry him already.
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I have addressed the problem with polls in my OP. Frankly, 90% "the people" are morons.
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A statement like this begs the question "And you're not because?" Accusing people who disagree with you of being morons is arrogant, self-righteous and not a little egocentric. With a premise like "Other people are stupid, I'm not, so things should be like I say they should be." you may as well not even bother. That just don't fly.
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Again you are missing the point, and making a personal attack. I think it was P.T. Barnum who said "no one ever lost a buck by under estimating the intelligence of the American public." Just because some thing is popular doesn't mean it's good. The Back Street Boys sell a whole lot of CDs, and yet the Ramones never got to do a world wide arena tour. Go figure.
"There's a sucker born every minute"
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And just because YOU don't like something doesn't make it bad ethier. Who appointed you god of what's good and what is not? Obviously a self-appointed title. I happen to like the idea of Dual Blades very much. It sounds fun to me and if that's what people wanted deal with it. That's what happens in democracies. Unless you maybe would perfer we not be one? Of course there is no gaurantee whatosever that your idea would be the prevailing one in a non democracy.
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All your posts fail.
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Your life fails. End it now. Admit your love for the OP and go marry him already.
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You have been banned in the real world.
What's that? Oh that's right I can't hear you cause I ignored you for stalking me from topic to topic.
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What's that? Oh that's right I can't hear you cause I ignored you for stalking me from topic to topic.
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Yet you still reply, and read my posts. Your failing worse than before, we need El_Nino in here STAT, or else this thread will die off like the Flagellents of medival europe!
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... like I need a hole in the head.\
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I utterly agree with you.
Are there blade wielding heroes in comics?
Certainly.
Are there blade wielding heroes in comics to any extent present in ratio to the whole as to be reflected in the manner they are in CoX?
Nah.
I think they're moving further and further from comics and more to a generalized "powerful people from many genres" MMO.
I mean, using the logic of "but some heroes use blades!" or "just look at manga", I could also say that this game lacks actual vampires as heroes (present in comics), powerless heroes who still kick [censored] (See Rex Havoc), furry animals as heroes (and no, RPing a catgirl just don't cut it - I'm talking about a zoo crew. Actual human sized animals. See Pig Iron, et al), all of these things are present in comics, but hardly enough to justify their presence in-game.
I totally understood having a blade in scrapper sets.
However, having 3 out of 8 scrapper sets be blades seems slightly askew as far as representing the "comics".
That said, hey, if they make players happy... whatever. More money, more content, better game as far as I'm concerned. Let the Drizzts go forth and multiply, let the Stabby Stabberson WoW rogue recreations fill the map, let the homages to Sturm Brightblade shine on. More money.
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I have addressed the problem with polls in my OP. Frankly, 90% "the people" are morons.
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A statement like this begs the question "And you're not because?" Accusing people who disagree with you of being morons is arrogant, self-righteous and not a little egocentric. With a premise like "Other people are stupid, I'm not, so things should be like I say they should be." you may as well not even bother. That just don't fly.
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Again you are missing the point, and making a personal attack. I think it was P.T. Barnum who said "no one ever lost a buck by under estimating the intelligence of the American public." Just because some thing is popular doesn't mean it's good. The Back Street Boys sell a whole lot of CDs, and yet the Ramones never got to do a world wide arena tour. Go figure.
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We all enjoy the quiet perception that our is the truly "good" taste.
Your is actually a good example: Back Street Boys was marketted, in its demographic, towards teens.
Guess what a large part of the MMO demographic is? 
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I have addressed the problem with polls in my OP. Frankly, 90% "the people" are morons.
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A statement like this begs the question "And you're not because?" Accusing people who disagree with you of being morons is arrogant, self-righteous and not a little egocentric. With a premise like "Other people are stupid, I'm not, so things should be like I say they should be." you may as well not even bother. That just don't fly.
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Again you are missing the point, and making a personal attack. I think it was P.T. Barnum who said "no one ever lost a buck by under estimating the intelligence of the American public." Just because some thing is popular doesn't mean it's good. The Back Street Boys sell a whole lot of CDs, and yet the Ramones never got to do a world wide arena tour. Go figure.
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We all enjoy the quiet perception that our is the truly "good" taste.
Your is actually a good example: Back Street Boys was marketted, in its demographic, towards teens.
Guess what a large part of the MMO demographic is?
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Stoners?
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I think they're moving further and further from comics and more to a generalized "powerful people from many genres" MMO.
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I've said it before and I'll say it again: GOOD. I know this may not be a popular opinion, seen as how the game's said to have been based on traditional American comic books, but... Well, to me, this is City of Heroes. And there's a lot more stuff out there that can be a hero than just what DC or Marvel have written about. So, yes, heroes from movies, anime, science fiction and other video games should, I firmly believe, be just as well included and represented in the game as Super Man or Wolverine or the Hulk or Batman or whatever.
Which brings us to...
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I mean, using the logic of "but some heroes use blades!" or "just look at manga", I could also say that this game lacks actual vampires as heroes (present in comics), powerless heroes who still kick [censored] (See Rex Havoc), furry animals as heroes (and no, RPing a catgirl just don't cut it - I'm talking about a zoo crew. Actual human sized animals. See Pig Iron, et al), all of these things are present in comics, but hardly enough to justify their presence in-game.
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I agree. These things are missing and I'd like to see the ability to remake them in here. You are correct that anything even remotely like a Gothic vampire is nigh-on impossible to make unless you go for some specific type of vampire, like D (who's only half such). Unpowered people who kick as... Would require a game system that has more than just 1. Walk up to bad guy; 2. Punch until you lose target; 3. Walk up to next bad guy; 4. Repeat. So it's not so much a "they don't fit the genre so we'll exclude them" as much as "they don't work within the system."
Beyond that, I'd like to see animal characters, as long as they can be workable within the system, though they'd need to be humanoid or the answer is "Sorry, would need new animations." Same goes for human-sized animals. Those are all good ideas in my opinion, and things that I'd like to see in the game, even if I won't necessarily use them all.
As far as I'm concerned, the more stuff we have and the less we worry about comic books, the better.
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Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I have addressed the problem with polls in my OP. Frankly, 90% "the people" are morons.
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A statement like this begs the question "And you're not because?" Accusing people who disagree with you of being morons is arrogant, self-righteous
and not a little egocentric. With a premise like "Other people are stupid, I'm not, so things should be like I say they should be." you may as well not even bother. That just don't fly.
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Again you are missing the point, and making a personal attack. I think it was P.T. Barnum who said "no one ever lost a buck by under estimating the intelligence of the American public." Just because some thing is popular doesn't mean it's good. The Back Street Boys sell a whole lot of CDs, and yet the Ramones never got to do a world wide arena tour. Go figure.
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We all enjoy the quiet perception that our is the truly "good" taste.
Your is actually a good example: Back Street Boys was marketted, in its demographic, towards teens.
Guess what a large part of the MMO demographic is?
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Stoners?
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And we appreciate the attention.
YAR!....no ordinary housefly.
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... like I need a hole in the head.\
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I utterly agree with you.
Are there blade wielding heroes in comics?
Certainly.
Are there blade wielding heroes in comics to any extent present in ratio to the whole as to be reflected in the manner they are in CoX?
Nah.
I think they're moving further and further from comics and more to a generalized "powerful people from many genres" MMO.
I mean, using the logic of "but some heroes use blades!" or "just look at manga", I could also say that this game lacks actual vampires as heroes (present in comics), powerless heroes who still kick [censored] (See Rex Havoc), furry animals as heroes (and no, RPing a catgirl just don't cut it - I'm talking about a zoo crew. Actual human sized animals. See Pig Iron, et al), all of these things are present in comics, but hardly enough to justify their presence in-game.
I totally understood having a blade in scrapper sets.
However, having 3 out of 8 scrapper sets be blades seems slightly askew as far as representing the "comics".
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I think this is rather Marvel- and DC-centric. Those are certainly not the only comics extant, even if we're just talking about Western comics.
There's a whole thread in the Comics forum about this, and the list is pretty long, and includes some heavy hitters such as Wonder Woman, Wolverine and Nightcrawler. Then there are the cross-media comics such as Buffy, Angel and Star Wars, which have a plethora of blade-wielding characters.
I wouldn't mind a nod or two to more anthropomorphic costume pieces, as I have a couple characters who are either animals or animal-human hybrids. I'm not a catgirl fan per se, but if putting up with more catgirls allows me to play my raccoon and samurai dog toons, then I'm all for it.
I think you can easily do a vampire character, too. The costume pieces are there, as are the powersets, Dark Defenders or Scrappers.
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
I still want a "Form morpher", like Grunge from Gen 13.
Everyone forgets the form shifters, not shape shifters, but those who can change their entire chemical makeup to imitate a particular element, or power.
Like grabbing an Invincibility/SS enemy and mimicing his powers, only to uppercut him through the roof.
We still need talon claw like attacks, the whole 'wolvie' like claws thing is cool, sometimes, othertimes it's quite dated.
Or like Mimic from X-men? Or more current, like one of the character's from Hero's? I can't remember his name right now. Not Sylar, he steals powers. The senator guy's brother.
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I agree. These things are missing and I'd like to see the ability to remake them in here.
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Meh, while I can support other gamer's wants, I've no interest in a formless game that lacks any creative cohesion or identity. I subscribed because it was a western comic themed MMO, and while the introduction of manga elements (the "other big comic market") was inevitable, this casting off the general comic flavor in favor of a "super people" mish-mash is more along the lines of a 1970s "Illustrated Pulp Magazine" than any comic. Which in itself wouldn't be bad save for the enter initial design of the game remains very evidently designed around a different theme.
It would be similiar to trying to incorporate every fantasy theme into one fantasy MMO: elfquest and Pratchett alonside each other. Achievable, but messy and a unnecessary.
And certainly a genre mish-mash isn't necessary. Much could be done with this game without casting off its original flavor. I must point out that every single element of the fantasy genre is also present in comic format: we may as well go ahead and introduce those, too.
We could just call it "SuperMMO!"
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Meh, while I can support other gamer's wants, I've no interest in a formless game that lacks any creative cohesion or identity. I subscribed because it was a western comic themed MMO, and while the introduction of manga elements (the "other big comic market") was inevitable, this casting off the general comic flavor in favor of a "super people" mish-mash is more along the lines of a 1970s "Illustrated Pulp Magazine" than any comic. Which in itself wouldn't be bad save for the enter initial design of the game remains very evidently designed around a different theme.
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Your mileage may vary. I want a mishmash of different genres and concepts for no other reason that that I find other people's subjective definition of what a genre should be and the things that should fit in there limiting as a general concept. Seen as how the game has, but not necessarily displays all those concepts at the same time, I find that this is quite easily achievable in a tasteful way. Sure, we have a mishmash of like a gazillion things, but that in no way requires us to have stories that are a mishmash of different designs. It's pretty easy to pick one aspect of the game's universe, one or several, in fact, and run with them while more or less ignoring the rest for another story. After all, do we NEED to involve the Sky Raiders when we're dealing with the Circle of Thorns trying to summon yet another demon? Not unless the story calls for it as far as I see it.
Personally, I know I bought CoH not because of anything to do with comic books, but exactly because it was a SuperMMO. It defined a genre all of its own - people with powers in a modern-day setting. That's it. I was deathly afraid I'd get into the game and be face with slogan-spouting, tights-wearing super heroes of corn. I was quite prepared to simply not play past the first few months that came paid with the game when I bought it (the game plus a time card). However I found a world not built on someone else's intellectual property, not constraint to someone else's idea of what should fit and what shouldn't. I found a world that was, for all intents and purposes, perfectly free and unlimited. Any concept you want to put in there will work, just as long as you give it a bit of thought. Any idea you have can be implemented. Any genre you draw from will fit in immediately and quite snugly, to boot.
To end on a few points:
People keep telling me that this game was meant to be about American comic book super heroes. I'd like to see that in writing from an official source, because my understanding has always been that this was a starting point and a rough guideline, but never a stringent rule or even much of a concern when it dictated bad decisions.
People keep telling me that we don't need to skip genre to have everything in the game because the comic book universe already has everything. I'd be inclined to agree with this, if what fit into the comic book universe were not brought up so often as a reason to NOT do things. I'd appreciate how those seemingly contradictory notions can coincide.
People keep telling me that what I, personally, like doesn't matter, because the game is built one way and what I like is quite another and that I should go play something else. The problem with that is that the game is, in everything other than forums, a perfect representation of what I want. It has the things I want, it covers all the genres I can think of and accepts all the (often esoteric) concepts I've put into it without much of any shoehorning. All that is to say, I don't see a problem anywhere other than here on the forums, where people keep telling me there is one and that the game as it is and as I like it really shouldn't be like this but should be something else. And that somehow keeps putting me in the wrong, even though "I was here first." I'd appreciate an explanation on that one, as well.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Your mileage may vary. I want a mishmash of different genres and concepts ...
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Say no more. We couldn't be farther apart. As I said, following this train of thought leads to *no* element being exluded from the MMO. While I could get behind a nod to various genres within the comics themselves, just casting off "comics" in favor of "pulp illustrations in general" is a formless miasma. I find it easier to immerse my self in being a super hero when the universe is built around the genre that supports it.
And it seems to me it would be preferable to build a game around your wants for a formless "everything in one" game rather than change the one obviously centered on the comic genre into it, not that I blame you for asking. There is a large difference between illustrated novels, illustrated pulp, and "comics" and the initial design flavor of this game (which was speicifically western comics but moved into manga pretty quickly).
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Personally, I know I bought CoH not because of anything to do with comic books, but exactly because it was a SuperMMO.
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Well, it's still sort of western comics yet, mate. The change isn't complete. Getting there, though. We're still built around "Super Groups", the concept of arch villains with a host of themed goons behind them, all very western comic-MMO, and, even with the plethora of new blades and a lot of nod to manga, it still remains very much more X-Men-esque than anything else. (Thank goodness, to me..)
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It defined a genre all of its own - people with powers in a modern-day setting.
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O.o .. Sam... every single web site that covers it puts it in the "comics" genre. It's still very western comic. The term "super hero" is a western themed comic term. "Archvillain" the same. The concept of an SG base, etc.
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Any idea you have can be implemented. Any genre you draw from will fit in immediately and quite snugly, to boot.
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If that were true we wouldn't have threads questioning the presence of too many blades in the game. Obviously it's an awkward eye sore to some or it wouldn't be noted.
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People keep telling me that this game was meant to be about American comic book super heroes.
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Well, I told you that was the original premise, because that's how it was marketed. And, since we've seen no press releases stating otherwise, I've always assumed that would remain a consistent theme with the inclusion of the other major comic market, manga, as an option.
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I'd like to see that in writing from an official source, because my understanding has always been that this was a starting point and a rough guideline, but never a stringent rule or even much of a concern when it dictated bad decisions.
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I never recall reading anything that said "We're starting as a comic MMO, but moving into pulp illustrated at a later date", I just saw "City of Heroes, the first comic book based MMO, goes gold..." on websites.
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People keep telling me that we don't need to skip genre to have everything in the game because the comic book universe already has everything. I'd be inclined to agree with this, if what fit into the comic book universe were not brought up so often as a reason to NOT do things. I'd appreciate how those seemingly contradictory notions can coincide.
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I'd say some folks equate "comics" to any form of illustrated mag or illustrated pulp series, as is shown by requests for a plethora of comic elements only found in fringe publications, or are pushing for their particular illustrated mag faves becuase this is the only game wherein there is a chance to see it happen at this time, slim as that chance may be.
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People keep telling me that what I, personally, like doesn't matter, because the game is built one way and what I like is quite another and that I should go play something else.
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....?
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All that is to say, I don't see a problem anywhere other than here on the forums, where people keep telling me there is one and that the game as it is and as I like it really shouldn't be like this but should be something else.
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Sounds like game discussion to me... the same on every game forum, really.
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And that somehow keeps putting me in the wrong, even though "I was here first." I'd appreciate an explanation on that one, as well.
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?!?!? "You were here first"? I have no idea where you're going with that. I'm going to promote my game opinions based on my subscription fee and presence in the player base rather than seniority of some sort.
In any case, there's nothing wrong with the direction you are pushing the game into going...
But it leaves the original demographic high and dry (which may well be a good thing, MUO will be coming out eventually and maye they'll cover the comic themed MMO and CoX can move to "amoeba" form, absorbing every style and none) - I imagine the folks who gravitated to the game to play a comic themed MMO might be put out by a mid-life shift in demos.
I don't hold much fears of this happening, mind. I think they're tossing out bits and pieces to keep subscribers happy. But i don't think a shift to a generalized "Mish Mash MMO" is going to get any new customers. Fantasy and future-tech fans already have their bases covered and, as fun as CoX's cute little combat system is, the game doesn't really have the depth to attract a life-changing crowd just based on a theme-shift. It would really have to break some new ground in the design department for that. Doubtful at this late stage.
Well said Emnity
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Say no more. We couldn't be farther apart.
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Fair enough.
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And it seems to me it would be preferable to build a game around your wants for a formless "everything in one" game rather than change the one obviously centered on the comic genre into it, not that I blame you for asking.
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My only problem here is that I can hear what you're saying. Yet when I look at the game itself, a rather formless, free-for-all game is what I see. So, really, I can't see all that much that would actually need to change. From where I'm looking, the game is pretty much as I want it to be right now. Getting even closer, in fact. Archvillains and Super Groups, to me, are comic book concepts in name only. Sure, they hail from comic books, but are hardly unique to the genre, and are rather unassuming about what you want them to be, to boot.
For instance, I have a couple of SGs all to myself. That means all filled up with my alts, just for the record. They're there for concept reasons. One is a loosely-defined criminal organisation under the thumb of a rather ruthless and capable leader and the other is your standard issue mega corporation. The framework fits as well as any, to be honest, and while it doesn't exactly facilitate my ideas to the last detail, it doesn't really stand in their way whatsoever.
Funnily, a friend of mine complains about how CoH's Super Groups aren't really true to comics, where groups of super heroes tend to be at or below 10 people and groups of 75 don't really exist outside of special cases or special events. I could be interpreting his words wrong, of course, and I'm probably the least knowledgeable person here when it comes to comic books, so I'm only throwing that out as a noteworthy detail.
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If that were true we wouldn't have threads questioning the presence of too many blades in the game. Obviously it's an awkward eye sore to some or it wouldn't be noted.
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You've probably seen my take on that about every time I've come across it. The game itself accepts these concepts. It's some people that don't like them. This is really where the forums are telling me I can't do something while the game and the settings blatantly contradict this. To be honest, I'm not really all that worried about what concepts other people feel I should or should not be making. All I'm worried about is making concepts that make sense to exist in paragon city, weather any of the other players like it or not.
And, really, looking at my characters, I have a robot, a cyborg, a couple of mutants, a couple of generic experiments, a demon, a necromancer, an angelic ghost, a couple of aliens and a school girl. I don't have ninja, pirates or catgirls. Yet. There's always time for more ideas. I don't lose much of any sleep worrying if someone saw me running around and didn't like it. I see people that I can't even begin to fathom the corn of on a daily basis, but it's their dime, really. Can't really tell if it fits without a backstory, but those who do have any usually fit at least somewhat.
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O.o .. Sam... every single web site that covers it puts it in the "comics" genre. It's still very western comic.
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Like individual players, how different sites bill the game does not really hold much weight for me. Most sites I've seen tend to list games based on their own reviews and interpretations, so for the "written statement" part that doesn't quite cut it. It tells me a great many people believe it, and that was never something I wanted to deny. I'm just looking for the official version.
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Well,I told you that was the original premise, becuase that's how it was marketed. And, since we've seen no press releases stating otherwise, I've always assumed that would remain a consistent theme.
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I never recall reading anything that said "We're starting as a comic MMO, but moving into pulp illustrated at a later date", I just saw "City of Heroes, the first comic based MMO, goes gold..." on websites.
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I remember a quote from the Statesman quite vividly. It was in response to one of those "It's like that in comic books, so it should be like that in game." I think it was about secret identities. The quote in question went along the lines of saying the game was inspired by comic books, but by no means an attempt to BE a comic book. So while they drew inspiration from comic books and did what they could to stick to them, they would not take that so far that it would cause them to make a bad decision.
I don't have the quote and my memory is fuzzy enough that I may well be making all of that up. The point is that I'm pretty confident the developers have stated that they will keep to the genre as much as they could, but would not let that drive push them into adding things that were bad for the game or keep them from adding things that were good for the game. The way I interpret that is that the game started off as inspired by comic books and this remains the major source of inspiration for new content, but that this does not mean the game has to stay true to the genre as any stringent rule.
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?!?!? "You were here first"? I have no idea where you're going with that. I'm going to promote my game opinions based on my subscription fee and presence in the player base rather than seniority of some sort.
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There's a reason that was posted in quotes. All that is to say that I like the game as it is and as I see it. Lots of people really seem to like telling me I'm wrong and that the game should be changed into something they like and I probably won't. Hence, "I was here first" because the game is what I like and it seems a little awkward to break it for me and fix it for someone else. Not that it's somehow wrong, just that a change that takes work to implement shouldn't simply take from one person and give to another, but should aim to improve the game overall. Improve the game, in fact by developer admission, while degrading it for the least amount of people possible. So I just don't take well to the "Your opinion doesn't matter because I am Legion for we are many." You know?
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I don't hold much fears of this happening, mind. I thin they're tossing out bits and pieces to keep subscribers happy. But i don't think a shift to a generlized "Mish Mash MMO" is going to get any new customers. Fantasy and future-tech fans already have their bases covered and, as fun as CoX's cute little combat system is, the game doesn't really have the depth to attract a life-changing crowd just based on a theme-shift. It would really have to break soem new ground in the design department for that. Doubtful at this late stage.
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That's just the thing, though, I don't think a theme shift is necessary. The game's already pretty much as I want it. Again. There's nothing I'd like to see changed, save for minor technical stuff (like soloable TFs, but that's neither here nor there). The game is pretty much perfect right now. What I want to see is exactly what I'm seeing - more progress on all fronts. What I do NOT want to see is a sudden change of heart that sees a drive to make the game "more comic-booky" that sees bad decisions made for the wrong reasons.
Case in point: I want to see shield defence. Badly. I do NOT want to see shield melee. A bonk with the shield or two I can see, but a whole melee set with a shield is in the realm of handguns for Scrappers - pushing it a LOT.
Frankly, as long as the game keeps going as it has, I'll be happy. Do we need more blades? Let me see... Do we need more powersets altogether? It goes along the same lines. There's other stuff I would have like to see, too. Fistfighting, lightsabre, light melee (as a counterpoint to Dark Melee), gadget melee and a bunch of other sets with weapons, many of which we're getting as weapon customization. Dual Blades wasn't even the first on my list when I voted on that poll - Energy Blade was.
But that's what we got. Frankly, I don't care what we DIDN'T get. Dual Blades is a cool set even if I voted for something I wanted more besides. It adds an interesting twist to old concepts and opens the door to new ones. To me, that's good enough for the game.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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My only problem here is that I can hear what you're saying. Yet when I look at the game itself, a rather formless, free-for-all game is what I see.
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Meh, a perception issue, I guess. I do recall being very much drawn to this game because it was set in a western comic setting, and the 5 new players I've recently brought over from Eve and WoW are finding it to be very specifically "comic book" in style. (One of them complains about it continuously... loves the combat, hates the setting and look in general.)
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This is really where the forums are telling me I can't do something while the game and the settings blatantly contradict this.
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You keep saying that and I cannot identify with it. Even in the most vehement forum disagreements, I've never seen anyone "told" what they can and cannot do - you sound a bit like BI, here. (No offense, BI. )
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There's a reason that was posted in quotes. All that is to say that I like the game as it is and as I see it. Lots of people really seem to like telling me I'm wrong and that the game should be changed into something they like and I probably won't. Hence, "I was here first" because the game is what I like and it seems a little awkward to break it for me and fix it for someone else.
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Well, to open, I simply can't identify with that mindset. Guess that covers that.
Secondly - this thread is about calling for CoX *not* to move away from its comic format to a general and formless "mish mash" - I understand you are saying that "you don't see it as a comic game" - and I don't know what to say to that, it's marketed that way, pretty much the entire playerbase knows it's that way, it uses all the terminology and, at least at this point, still fits firmly within the western comic setting, despite all the manga and sharpety sharp swords. So, at least in the case of "this" thread, no one is aking to move the game away from what you want, they are asking to keep it as it is (or some of them are, at least, such as the OP).
CoX is a "comic book" game, it's why so many of us came here - there was nothing else to serve us. If it doesn't stay a "comic" game then why stay? Such a shame to abandon your primary demographic. (It'll never happen, but hey...)
I am disinterested in a mish mash game in which one can "ignore the non-comic content and play as if one were in comics" - that's why I like immersion, so I don't have to pick and choose pieces of a game in order to enjoy it - that's why I like genres, so I know what flavor I will encounter when I enter into an imaginary surrounding.
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Like individual players, how different sites bill the game does not really hold much weight for me.
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We're talking about web sites sthat published the "going gold" press releases: releases composed by NC. I'd say NC has a pretty good handle on what type of game it is. :P
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I remember a quote from the Statesman quite vividly. It was in response to one of those "It's like that in comic books, so it should be like that in game." I think it was about secret identities.
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Sam, you're working here towards building a case for this game not having been design as a comic book game. It's not going to get off the ground with me. I've no doubt in my mind how it was marketed - the phrasing it still all over every gaming news release website as well as CoX's own, and it easily searchable. It's cool if *you* want to think wasn't designed that way, but I have to say, from an outside perspective, I think you're *really* stretching when your ignoring the developer's own press releases and phraseology.
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That's just the thing, though, I don't think a theme shift is necessary.
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Well that's good, then, if you and I are both of the mind that CoX should remain entrenched where it currently resides in its incarnation, then we're on the same page.
I'd like further updates to contain content true to comic book form, not "General MMO". Design status quo.
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You keep saying that and I cannot identify with it. Even in the most vehement forum disagreements, I've never seen anyone "told" what they can and cannot do - you sound a bit like BI, here.
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I've been told a few times that what I like is "more WoW and EQ stuff and has no place in the game. Even thought it's already in the game a lot of the time. Catgirls have no place in the game (which puts Mynx/Bobcat in a difficult postion). Medieval knights have no place in the game. Elves have no place in the game. Orcs have no place in the game. Fairies have no place in the game. Witches have no place in the game. Just about every time I or someone else has complained that we can't make this or that costume, or that the pieces for this or that concept are somehow restricted while the pieces for other concepts are not, there's inevitably someone who feels we should shut up or go play WoW. Or the real kicker - go make our own MMO. I've seen that enough to know to expect it.
I may sound like I'm self-victimizing here, but the truth is that these things happen. There are a lot of concepts that some people feel shouldn't be made in this game and that if I want to make them, I should go play WoW/EQ/Whatever. I'm of the opinion that, pieces permitting, any concept and any costume can fit into the game, be it Neo, Wolverine, Legolas or Drizzle. Long as it's not a rule violation, I don't take well to people claiming certain concepts just don't fit.
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Secondly - this thread is about calling for CoX *not* to move away from its comic format to a general and formless "mish mash" - I understand you are saying that "you don't see it as a comic game" - and I don't know what to say to that, it's marketed that way, pretty much the entire playerbase knows it's that way, it uses all the terminology and, at least at this point, still fits firmly within the western comic setting, despite all the manga and sharpety sharp swords. So, at least in the case of "this" thread, no one is aking to move the game away from what you want, they are asking to keep it as it is (or some of them are, at least, such as the OP).
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The problem with that, though, is that Dual Blades are already made and already into the game. We just don't have access to them yet, but for all that matters, they are in the game. It's a done deal. Asking that the next addition be something more comic-booky I can understand. But from where I'm standing, Dual Blades are already part of the game, so rallying to poo all over them IS rallying to get the game change from what it is. And what it is is what I like.
I'm not going to raise my voice if I find someone asking that the future powersets in the game be more in-line with the comic book genre, though I will probably request that they have OTHER uses besides. That won't be changing the game from what it is and what I like, but would be deciding what happens next and what gets added. But that's not the case. If people could, I've no doubt they'd ask that Dual Blades be removed and something else added. And that's what bugs me.
Fine, lots of people are unhappy. I wasn't very happy with Electric Melee and Electric Armour. But it's here already. Instead of ranting about it now that it's here, we can look at what else needs to be added to the game from now on.
That regard also stems from seeing many suggestions like forcing me into using a secret identity, having missions where I'm depowered, having missions where I'm captured and someone else needs to save me and so forth. That may be all cool and dandy, but I don't enjoy being forced into genre-correct encounters that I don't like, specifically since I'm not forced into them now.
It's just a lot of things and more a statement of general regard that I've seen in parts of the community, not something someone said specifically in this thread.
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We're talking about web sites sthat published the "going gold" press releases: releases composed by NC. I'd say NC has a pretty good handle on what type of game it is. :P
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If those are statements coming from PlayNC, then those would count, yes. You said "site," which I read as fan sites that listed their own news and reviews. Information coming from PlayNC or Cryptic qualifies as "seeing it in writing," yes.
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Well that's good, then, if you and I are both of the mind that CoX should remain entrenched where it currently resides in its incarnation, then we're on the same page.
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Frankly, I like the game where it is and I certainly don't see any specific need to invent new, non-comic-book-specific powersets for it to make it complete. We already have all the melee weapons I can think of with weapon customization, short of staves and some more esoteric choices like ball and chain or scythes. I could still ask for a two-handed axe/sword/hammer but I agree we now have enough. We have a bludgeoning weapon, an axe weapon, a single-handed sword, a two-handed sword and dual swords. That's plenty with the new options, so no need to add more there for the foreseeable future.
I would still like to see more added in terms of firearms. Some kind of futuristic energy rifle akin to the Bots Mastermind primary attacks would be good. Maybe in terms of "a ray gun" to keep you happy 
Probably a single/dual handgun for the ranged ATs would be good, as well. More gadget-based powersets would be good, too. Flashbang, Web Grenade, Smoke Grenade, Forcefield Generator, etc. for Controllers and Heal other, Stimulant, Triage Beacon, Acid Mortar, Poison Gas Trap, etc. for Defenders.
That's the kind of stuff I want to see. I don't want to see gunblades, still more melee weapons or some kind of hideously specific powerset like Fish Mastery. But just as much, I don't want to see Shield Melee, talking to fish, super-weaving, shrinking to the size of an atom or what have you. I don't want corny or silly powers, nor do I want powers obviously taken from a single character because he's just so damn cool. For instance, I want shield defence, but I do not want it limited to a round shield with blue and red stripes with a white star in the middle. I want it to be selectable from an array of such colourful items, as well as more traditional medieval variants, plus a riot shield, an energy shield and so forth.
I'm against the game being turned into a comic book, not against it feeling like one.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I've been told a few times that what I like is "more WoW and EQ stuff and has no place in the game. Even thought it's already in the game a lot of the time. Catgirls have no place in the game (which puts Mynx/Bobcat in a difficult postion). Medieval knights have no place in the game. Elves have no place in the game. Orcs have no place in the game. Fairies have no place in the game. Witches have no place in the game. Just about every time I or someone else has complained that we can't make this or that costume, or that the pieces for this or that concept are somehow restricted while the pieces for other concepts are not, there's inevitably someone who feels we should shut up or go play WoW. Or the real kicker - go make our own MMO. I've seen that enough to know to expect it.
I may sound like I'm self-victimizing here, but the truth is that these things happen. There are a lot of concepts that some people feel shouldn't be made in this game and that if I want to make them, I should go play WoW/EQ/Whatever. I'm of the opinion that, pieces permitting, any concept and any costume can fit into the game, be it Neo, Wolverine, Legolas or Drizzle. Long as it's not a rule violation, I don't take well to people claiming certain concepts just don't fit.
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See I can't blame people at all for that. This is the one and only comic book themed MMO on the market, and this is a primary reason for play to many. Seeing them want to maintain that theme is no surprise to me at all, even to the point of aggression- I wouldn't support being rabid about it, but when gamers like a game due to theme, seeing others push to move their primary reason for being here off the map can be disconcerting, or at least move one to say "Why not go play a game which features that instead of trying to change the one we enjoy?"
For instance: obviosly WoW caters to a fantasy crowd, and the RPers over there are very fantasy-baded (and some so immersed in the WoW mythos it's scary) - imagine the reaction if a player got on their forums and starting pushing for an element of Post Apocolyptic tech or something.
The first response would be "Why?"
The second would be "But other games already have that."
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The problem with that, though, is that Dual Blades are already made and already into the game. We just don't have access to them yet, but for all that matters, they are in the game. It's a done deal. Asking that the next addition be something more comic-booky I can understand. But from where I'm standing, Dual Blades are already part of the game, so rallying to poo all over them IS rallying to get the game change from what it is. And what it is is what I like
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Actually, they're just on test
I think it's more simply just a complaint that dual blades are a continued sign of a mish-mash direction in the game and is inspiring some voiced objections. Some folks don't like the implications.
I know you see the game as "all inlcusive" of everything in its current form (at least that's what I am getting) but most see Neo and Drizzt as a bit of an intrusion on the classic comic book genre. Hey, Elfquest was a comic book - see what happens if you add its content to this game. It's discarding the genre, and that upsets a lot of people.
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Violent Flatulence
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Tier 9, Explosive Diarrhea!