As much as I agree with your statements about fixing old content...
I have to say your list of Deleted 50s reads like a whos who of some of the most powerful builds in the game.
Wavicle, Energy/Energy Blaster, dinged 50 in Issue 4, summer of 2005.
@Wavicle, mostly on the Justice server.
Yeah, the one I regret the most is the blaster. I used to have so much fun with him in warburg. He could stand toe to toe with regen scrappers and have a 50-50 chance of taking them out. Hit them with holds, melee till their status protection drops, then the hold stuck and you could finish em. Then the issue 5 toggledrop rates nerf went in. Overnight some of the most sloppy builds in the game could take him out most of the time. Didn't stand a chance against regens most of the time and pretty quickly stuffed him in the back of the closet. I've since forsaken blasters. I will not ever make another one and have deleted every one I've ever had. That's a seperate story though.
To NCSoft: I know how crappy digging through old code is, having to sort it all out and redoing it. I've done it before. It's a pain, takes a lot of time, is tedious, is time consuming. Did I mention it takes time? Sometimes, though, it NEEDS to be done. The cost to do otherwise can sometimes be even higher. That is the point I'm trying to make.
Debt is temporary, prestige is forever
My Screenies and Videos :: My Toon List
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As someone that did game design and administration for muds for six years, this attitude on this particular topic is unacceptable.
.
.
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Take a look at my list of Deleted level 50s in my signature if you would. Every single one of them was deleted because changes in the game made them unappealing to play anymore.
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*cough*
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*cough*
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Right Back atcha, bub. And I'm more of a tireless rebutter or pinko. With bong mixed liberally in too, of course. 
Debt is temporary, prestige is forever
My Screenies and Videos :: My Toon List
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*cough*
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Right Back atcha, bub. And I'm more of a tireless rebutter or pinko. With bong mixed liberally in too, of course.
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I say one more page of posts and until it turns into this.
Hm, that could be fun.
But derailing the thread that much?
Naaaaah 
Rather hang around and watch a bit more.
I still do the Eden trial. I stopped doing the sewer trial because it is just too painful. It's too hard to ask people to waste that kind of time, and bunny stomping it is just no fun whatsoever.
Sentinel
All I want is to honestly win the sewer trial once. Which requires, currently, 4 L36-40 characters and 4 people who are willing to go through three hours of abuse and then NOT click the "I Win" button when they're losing.
I want to play and win this part of the game. I'm not asking you to make it easier or anything... just make it autoexemp.
Mini-guides: Force Field Defenders, Blasters, Market Self-Defense, Frankenslotting.
So you think you're a hero, huh.
@Boltcutter in game.
I've been looking forward to these Trials for quite some time. I managed to get on an Eden team and enjoyed it.
When I hit 38 on my WP/Fire Tanker, I tried to solo the Sewer Trial. Well, that didn't work! lol Anyway, I waited until I hit 40 and tried again. Unfortunately, I had forgotten to lower my difficulty setting from the highest level. I still did fairly well, as I just ran out of time (everyone was a purple Boss, so I had to take them 2 at a time).
During the mission, I hit 41, so now I'm no longer allowed to get the mission! It seems a waste to have this exclusive high-end content that's available for such a short period of time. Why not make this available for levels 38-45 so that people could maybe at least stumble onto it at some point. I'd REALLY like to take another stab at this solo, as well as be part of a team.
Please try my arcs:
Arc# 63910 "Why Do Bad Girls Like Bad Boys?" (length=Long, levels 40+)
Arc# 401500 "How to Be a Successful Professional Criminal" (length=Very Long, levels 1-10)
Add me to those disappointed. The loss of the enhancements is not a big deal to me, by the time I get to those levels I'm more interested in the full power of an SO (or now an IO). But it's the attitude of "It's old content, so we'll let it fester".
Eden is one of the best trials in the game, but it needs some developer time.
First, the bug when forming. If the captain isn't within the range, the trial is immediately disbanded. As a level 50, I can start Positron, Synapse, Transcendence, Sister Psyche, first respec, Moonbeam, Hess, Citadel, Manticore, second respec, Numina, all without problem. But if I start Eden as a captain, the team is automatically disbanded. Second, there have been problems with people falling through the map on entrance. Third, the two Quarries may be Monsters, but they're not expected to be single team opponents. I've been on Eden trials that couldn't defeat the quarries and had to lure them into a hole, but had no real problem with the rest of the trial and had no problem at all with the Crystal Titan.
You WERE willing to go into them to close off earning XP from the lichen (and as usual, the solution wasn't to limit the number of spawns, but just say "OK, risk but zero rewards). But all these other problems have been left untouched.
I know the new stuff is sexy, the new stuff is fun. But I'm disappointed in this announcement, when doing something like this, how about fixing the problems with the Eden TRIAL first.
The Eden TRIAL does not give a Pool D TRIAL recipe. It gives a standard Pool C. Right now the only way to get a Pool D TRIAL recipe is the Respec Trial on the hero side.The Eden trial can not be started by someone beyond the level range.
To allow this to remain in its current, hard to use mess is a tragic mistake.
I'd like to see the rewards fixed, but I'd also like to see these Trials fixed so they're easier to access.The thing I don't like is that there really is no proportionate reward for the risk. It's really hard to get a team together for an Eden or Sewer trial anymore because you know you're going to get a lot of debt and not much XP and not much else. Eden is easier because at least the Titan is still worth a lot of XP, but the Sewer trial is dead to most of the population. I know about five people that have done it, but nobody else wants to touch it and I know why.The Eden and Sewer Trials are some of the best/most unique content in CoH. They are fun and have some interesting an unique maps. Instead of eliminating a portion of the reward, I would rather see the Devs take the time to fix and update the Trials.
Glock: the original point and click interface.
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The Eden TRIAL does not give a Pool D TRIAL recipe. It gives a standard Pool C. Right now the only way to get a Pool D TRIAL recipe is the Respec Trial on the hero side.The Eden trial can not be started by someone beyond the level range.
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That was changed to equalise availability redand blueside.
From patch note 5-24-2007:
Its the Woodsmans TF these days.
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Woodsmans Task Force (the Eden Trial) and the Maren MacGregor Task Force (aka the Sewer Trial) now have choice tables upon completion. Choice can be a Task Force recipe (i.e. a recipe from the Task Force pool), or the Multi-aspect Enhancement reward that these missions have normally given. Choosing the recipe counts as your once every three hours Task Force recipe reward for that character.
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@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
In light of the new tf change I feel that the devs are full of it. They choose to change TF/SFs all because some folks can run the cap sf really fast. They do that but dont even change one of the biggest recipe exploits in the game with the sewer trial. I have been on a team that did the exploit once and it was so fast that it even blows issue 9 speed Katie out of the water. So why isnt it fixed?
Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator
Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!
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All I want is to honestly win the sewer trial once. Which requires, currently, 4 L36-40 characters and 4 people who are willing to go through three hours of abuse and then NOT click the "I Win" button when they're losing.
I want to play and win this part of the game. I'm not asking you to make it easier or anything... just make it autoexemp.
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You dont need an autoexemp. Just find 3 people that feel as you do. Otherwise its a "mommy! make them play the way I want them to play!!!!!"
Lots of 50's yada yada. still finding fun things to do.
Cthulhu loves you, better start running
I�! I�! Gg�gorsch�a�bha egurtsa�ar�ug d� Dalhor! Cthluhu fthagn! Cthluhu fthagn!
You are in a maze of twisty little passages
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All I want is to honestly win the sewer trial once. Which requires, currently, 4 L36-40 characters and 4 people who are willing to go through three hours of abuse and then NOT click the "I Win" button when they're losing.
I want to play and win this part of the game. I'm not asking you to make it easier or anything... just make it autoexemp.
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You dont need an autoexemp. Just find 3 people that feel as you do. Otherwise its a "mommy! make them play the way I want them to play!!!!!"
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After you try the Sewer Trial a couple times, you'll be out of friends who're willing to try it with you, too.
Mini-guides: Force Field Defenders, Blasters, Market Self-Defense, Frankenslotting.
So you think you're a hero, huh.
@Boltcutter in game.
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All I want is to honestly win the sewer trial once. Which requires, currently, 4 L36-40 characters and 4 people who are willing to go through three hours of abuse and then NOT click the "I Win" button when they're losing.
I want to play and win this part of the game. I'm not asking you to make it easier or anything... just make it autoexemp.
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What do you mean by "three hours of abuse"?
You mean fighting while exempt?
People do that all the time voluntarily...
Wavicle, Energy/Energy Blaster, dinged 50 in Issue 4, summer of 2005.
@Wavicle, mostly on the Justice server.
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All I want is to honestly win the sewer trial once. Which requires, currently, 4 L36-40 characters and 4 people who are willing to go through three hours of abuse and then NOT click the "I Win" button when they're losing.
I want to play and win this part of the game. I'm not asking you to make it easier or anything... just make it autoexemp.
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You dont need an autoexemp. Just find 3 people that feel as you do. Otherwise its a "mommy! make them play the way I want them to play!!!!!"
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After you try the Sewer Trial a couple times, you'll be out of friends who're willing to try it with you, too.
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So you want to force others to play with you? Your way? that is essentially what you are saying. "if the devs fix this people will have to do it my way".
Lots of 50's yada yada. still finding fun things to do.
Cthulhu loves you, better start running
I�! I�! Gg�gorsch�a�bha egurtsa�ar�ug d� Dalhor! Cthluhu fthagn! Cthluhu fthagn!
You are in a maze of twisty little passages
um, he's saying he wants the trial to function properly
if that's 'his way' then I guess that's my way too
Wavicle, Energy/Energy Blaster, dinged 50 in Issue 4, summer of 2005.
@Wavicle, mostly on the Justice server.
In regards to Lighthouse's OP:
I have to agree with others here, that letting the problems with these trials go unfixed (inaccessibility and lack of autoexemp in the Sewer Trial, and the presence of Giant Monsters in the Eden Trial) is an error and is a disservice to the players and to the people who designed and programmed those trials in the first place.
Of course I cannot state with certainty that those are 'easy fixes', however I CAN state with certainty that it's a relatively small number of problems (compared to say, PvP balance, for example).
I think you should make it a priority to get those three problems I listed above fixed by the end of First Quarter 2009. That's certainly not Top of the List, but it's not 'Let Fall by the Wayside' either.
Wavicle, Energy/Energy Blaster, dinged 50 in Issue 4, summer of 2005.
@Wavicle, mostly on the Justice server.
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um, he's saying he wants the trial to function properly
if that's 'his way' then I guess that's my way too
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It functions the way it is programmed too. there is not bug. He wants a change of parameters for the trial.If the devs didnt intend for it to be that way they wouldnt have programmed it.
besids, this bug fix would affect about 12 people. They need to fix the toggle bug before they spend time on making people behave the way you think they should. Thats much more likely to lose them subscribers.
Lots of 50's yada yada. still finding fun things to do.
Cthulhu loves you, better start running
I�! I�! Gg�gorsch�a�bha egurtsa�ar�ug d� Dalhor! Cthluhu fthagn! Cthluhu fthagn!
You are in a maze of twisty little passages
Just something weird to me, but reading this thread, I get a lot of hate for Galaxy, Perez Park and Boomtown.
That's a shame, to me - I actually really like those zones, and happily take my heroes to them to solo, because it's an area where the kind of things I like to do are.
I don't know if I'm a corner case, but is it really that bad that these zones MUST be changed, when at least, to me, they're fine?
Well, I believe Galaxy is fine.
Perez and Boomtown could use some contacts though.
Wavicle, Energy/Energy Blaster, dinged 50 in Issue 4, summer of 2005.
@Wavicle, mostly on the Justice server.
I don't really want them having contacts. I like them as they are. Time spent giving them contacts is time wasted, to me, because the zones already give me everything I want: Jumbo-sized mobs of recognisable enemy types, with ordered resistances and defenses and specialities. Skulls and Hellions are about the same to one another, and the differences are in how you approach them.
Street-sweeping perez lets me gain XP at an appreciable clip without the onus of multiple zones (unless I'm planting a lot) and letting me feel like I have a gigantic tonker because I'm sweeping a hazard zone that scares everyone else away.
Maybe it's selfish of me.
See, I'd want them to add contacts but leave everything else as is.
You would still get your big spawns. I'd get more level 7-15 story arcs. A win-win situation.
Wavicle, Energy/Energy Blaster, dinged 50 in Issue 4, summer of 2005.
@Wavicle, mostly on the Justice server.
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See, I'd want them to add contacts but leave everything else as is.
You would still get your big spawns. I'd get more level 7-15 story arcs. A win-win situation.
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Full agreement here.
Lots of 50's yada yada. still finding fun things to do.
Cthulhu loves you, better start running
I�! I�! Gg�gorsch�a�bha egurtsa�ar�ug d� Dalhor! Cthluhu fthagn! Cthluhu fthagn!
You are in a maze of twisty little passages
Here's the part of this statement that irks me the most...
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However, we hope everyone can appreciate the history behind this older content and also appreciate that, in the larger scheme of things, we have our designers working hard to bring out exciting new content in a timely manner and not spending too much time optimizing the experience of dated content.
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As someone that did game design and administration for muds for six years, this attitude on this particular topic is unacceptable. This says to all of your paying customers "these zones are being abandoned, we might eventually get around to replacing them with something new, if enough people cry about it."
If your way of dealing with old content is to stuff it in the back of the closet and forget about it, my suggestion is you also REMOVE EVERY ONE OF THESE BADGES FROM PLAY. and also as prerequisites for any other badge, should they be required for any.
If you're going to refuse to address very real concerns about old content that all your changes to the game have caused to become broken, then you are directly neglecting the customers you depend on to keep playing your game. Ignoring a problem doesn't make it go away.
Take a look at my list of Deleted level 50s in my signature if you would. Every single one of them was deleted because changes in the game made them unappealing to play anymore. Not addressing problems within these trials similarly makes them unappealing to play anymore. And if you think I _ENJOYED_ deleting toons I spent hundreds of hours leveling up, think again. I did it because I couldn't stand not to anymore. Please don't similarly allow this game to get to a state where I can't stand to play it anymore. I love CoH/CoV.
(editted for speeling eroors)
Debt is temporary, prestige is forever
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