Consolidated Thread: Statesman's Task Force
By
abnormal_joe,
Posted on: 2007-04-03 08:09 in The Market and Inventions
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Well, if you've got immobs you'll be able to immob him in place once Castle gets his fix in.
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they could just fix the AI so they dont spaz out and run round the whole map, scrapyard is a joke these days
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The whole "running around like a spaz" thing is supremely annoying. I can't explain it any better than to say it's just not fun.
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it wouldnt be so bad if they actually fought and attacked, but when recluse wigged out last night he didnt nothing but run round the cleared map while we whittled down his health, tedious and massively annoying but quite risk free. He also ignored the 3 tanks taunts.
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Stood around the boat and watched the various chat channels as well this evening and watched 8 different groups stream out of the helicopter. 6 were unsuccessful due to giving up after a 30 min to 1 hour fight with Mako. Of the two that were successful, one said they used shivans and yellows, the other seemed to have no idea why they were successful, said it was a tough fight but he eventually fell.
I noticed several of the toons had tactics in their build.
So I'm thinking shivans, tons of yellows or stacked tacics will get the job done and break through that elude.
Still think it's broken if these are the only ways to beat Mako, but at least its more information.
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Didn't need shivans for Mako, vengeance and Geas of the kind ones ftw, didn't have focussed accuracy, but suspect that's good too.
It's true. This game is NOT rocket surgery. - BillZBubba
The group I was in last night had 2 or 3 people with Tactics running and I was hitting Mako a reasonable amount of the time (probably around 40% of the time). Another scrapper on the team also had focused accuracy on top of that and seemed to hit Mako reliably. He wasn't easy but he eventually went down. To-hit buffs seems to be extremely helpful for taking him down.
One of our main problems at the end was trying to isolate either GW or Scirocco. They kept coming together and taking us down. We had sorta hit our wall at that point and then we all got mapserved and the mission was completely reset so we called it a night.
I'm trying to get a feel for what it takes to assemble a successful group, what ATs, what Powers (standard powers NOT temps) are preferable and certain Tactics/Strategies that have born fruit.
Please feel free to add-to or edit anything I may have missed.
ATs:
(not by any means suggesting a "perfect team" only what seems to have worked fairly well to date)
Tank: (Stone preferable) with constant buffs, maybe even a dedicated healer/buffer
Controllers: 2-3, any type (Emp/Rad/Dark/FF preferable)
Blasters: 1-2 any type
Defenders: 1-2 any type (see Contr)
Scrappers: 1-2 any type
Prefered Powers:
Geas of the Kind Ones
Vengence
Fallout
Tactics
(Shivans)
Tactics/Strategies:
Use the Temp Power on Aeon at beginning of fight, make sure the holder of power is aware they possess it
do NOT use "Avoid-type" AoE powers on AVs to prevent running
@ Lord Recluse, find and destroy the "Arachnos Transport Transponder" to stop Flyer and subsequent mob spawns from the Flyer
Ghost Widow: use ranged attacks to avoid her AoE heal
Maco: No "Avoid" powers, Vengence, Fallout, Tactics, Geas
Snipe pulling AVs has shown some success, as well as TPing the "sniper" back after the snipe to a safer location.
Sound about right to you all??
Oh! One additional question if I may? about how long did you take to complete the TF? I believe I've seen up to 5hrs
Travel Suppression is this game's worst feature, well that and MetaHumans riding mass transit like tourists at DisneyLand.
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Oh! One additional question if I may? about how long did you take to complete the TF? I believe I've seen up to 5hrs
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I ran it the first night open test started and my team finished in just over 3 hours. However, A LOT of that time was spent zoning, a few of our team members had slow loads.
Global Handle: @ Spacio
G-Force Knight GRAV/FF Troller ~ 50
Cosmic Knight. Peacebringer ~ 50
Tackyon Knight SPINES/REGAN ~ 50
SnailTortoiseHybrid STONE/AXE Tanker ~ 50
Morbid Maniac NECRO/DARK Mastermind ~ 47
TRIUMPH
Forgotten Legion
Pretty sure I was on that team Alphadog...my hardware faliure came at a bad time...and I couldn't get back in after the mapserve...sucks to hear that the mission reset...
Fire Brick - Fire/Stone Tanker
Plasma Brick - Fire/Fire Blaster
Dark Brick - Dark/Regen Scrapper
Electron Transfer - Kin/Elec Defender
Zeake Ferrari - PB
Mr. Rick - Inv/SS Tanker
Einsiedler - Bots/Traps MM
Ice Brick - Ice/EM Tanker
One man's paranoia is another man's engineered redundancy.
Cyyan, i don't know for sure about that stone tank preferance. Now, granted, stones are usually the tank of choice, but i'm seriously wondering about it for STF. There's a LOT of psy flying around in this TF.
Just from the ones i've seen so far:
Sands has psy. Korol has psy. Shadow Spider has psy. Viridian's got psy, i think.. maybe just he's a kin, and that could/would kill recharge speed even more. Barracuda's got psy.
Not to mention all the fortunatas and tarantula mistresses out there.
So i'm wondering, stone's got a choice: granite for tanking, or (spacing off. the shield that protects against psy) for the psy boys.
Doesn't ice have some psy shields in there? i'm wondering if they may be a little better. (granted, buffing and stuff will shoot this theory in the foot)
Also, once IOs get out enough and sets are built, there's some good chance psy won't be the murder axe it is right now.. i looked at the sets last night, and with 6-slotting the right stuff, could get at least 10% resistance to psy on my invul. yea, 10% is not much, but 10% > 0%.
@Death Conqueror
-Goal for 2011: Survive, stay alive, and continue to thrive.
I was running on a Fire Tank last night...granted I had great support, but I only went down fighting the last AVs...I'm not sure if it's a question of which Tank to bring, but rather how many to bring. If there had been another Tank, it probably would have been a little easier...just my two cents...
Fire Brick - Fire/Stone Tanker
Plasma Brick - Fire/Fire Blaster
Dark Brick - Dark/Regen Scrapper
Electron Transfer - Kin/Elec Defender
Zeake Ferrari - PB
Mr. Rick - Inv/SS Tanker
Einsiedler - Bots/Traps MM
Ice Brick - Ice/EM Tanker
One man's paranoia is another man's engineered redundancy.
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Cyyan, i don't know for sure about that stone tank preferance. Now, granted, stones are usually the tank of choice, but i'm seriously wondering about it for STF. There's a LOT of psy flying around in this TF.
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True enough. To the best of my knowledge only Dark is any help in regards to Psi dmg.
@Fire_Brick: ya, I was thinking that same thing, with 2 Tanks 1 could splinter off with a buffer and Taunt a couple of AVs away from group while main portion of team dispatched the other AV... or something to that effect.
Not too sure about Ice Tanks and Psi either, mines only lvl31 and haven't had to deal with it much to date, I'm sure someone more knowledgable will chime in.
Some folks are excited about the new Hammi, some about Inventions... I don't care about either, but this TF has really got it's meathooks into me...
Travel Suppression is this game's worst feature, well that and MetaHumans riding mass transit like tourists at DisneyLand.
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Cyyan, i don't know for sure about that stone tank preferance. Now, granted, stones are usually the tank of choice, but i'm seriously wondering about it for STF. There's a LOT of psy flying around in this TF.
Just from the ones i've seen so far:
Sands has psy. Korol has psy. Shadow Spider has psy. Viridian's got psy, i think.. maybe just he's a kin, and that could/would kill recharge speed even more. Barracuda's got psy.
Not to mention all the fortunatas and tarantula mistresses out there.
So i'm wondering, stone's got a choice: granite for tanking, or (spacing off. the shield that protects against psy) for the psy boys.
Doesn't ice have some psy shields in there? i'm wondering if they may be a little better. (granted, buffing and stuff will shoot this theory in the foot)
Also, once IOs get out enough and sets are built, there's some good chance psy won't be the murder axe it is right now.. i looked at the sets last night, and with 6-slotting the right stuff, could get at least 10% resistance to psy on my invul. yea, 10% is not much, but 10% > 0%.
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I ran it with my Stone. Granite's fine. Granite's more than fine. I only dropped it to travel places, and died twice - once on a team wipe to Aeon, once when Scirocco held me through Granite+Rooted. Wretch spawned with nothing but Fortunatas, and I didn't really notice much damage - it's just a pack of even-con minions, after all. Individual AVs that aren't Patrons or Aeon didn't take long to drop, psy or no, and so didn't last long enough to kill. And with our Empath jumping by periodically to renew Fort, and nothing else, I was able to keep Recluse and most of the Flier spawns completely occupied while my team killed all four towers.
The rule doesn't seem to be broken here. Unless you're fighting Carnies, Granite is the tauntbot of choice. Won't output as much damage as the other tanks, but it won't die, and sometimes that's just more important.
Ice has no Psy protection. Invuln has no Psy protection. Fire has the added protection of Healing Flames, but still nothing specifically for Psy. The only place a tank gets any Psy defense or resist is Minerals, and the only place a tank gets any +regen to help against things their shields don't block is Rooted. Stone's your best bet.
Jerk 4 Life
In brightest day, in blackest night/No evil shall escape my sight/Let those who worship evil's might/Beware my power ... Green Lantern's light!/(Meowth, that's right!)
My Arcs: #4827: Earth For Humans. #6391: Young Love.
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Cyyan, i don't know for sure about that stone tank preferance. Now, granted, stones are usually the tank of choice, but i'm seriously wondering about it for STF. There's a LOT of psy flying around in this TF.
Just from the ones i've seen so far:
Sands has psy. Korol has psy. Shadow Spider has psy. Viridian's got psy, i think.. maybe just he's a kin, and that could/would kill recharge speed even more. Barracuda's got psy.
Not to mention all the fortunatas and tarantula mistresses out there.
So i'm wondering, stone's got a choice: granite for tanking, or (spacing off. the shield that protects against psy) for the psy boys.
Doesn't ice have some psy shields in there? i'm wondering if they may be a little better. (granted, buffing and stuff will shoot this theory in the foot)
Also, once IOs get out enough and sets are built, there's some good chance psy won't be the murder axe it is right now.. i looked at the sets last night, and with 6-slotting the right stuff, could get at least 10% resistance to psy on my invul. yea, 10% is not much, but 10% > 0%.
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I ran it with my Stone. Granite's fine. Granite's more than fine. I only dropped it to travel places, and died twice - once on a team wipe to Aeon, once when Scirocco held me through Granite+Rooted. Wretch spawned with nothing but Fortunatas, and I didn't really notice much damage - it's just a pack of even-con minions, after all. Individual AVs that aren't Patrons or Aeon didn't take long to drop, psy or no, and so didn't last long enough to kill. And with our Empath jumping by periodically to renew Fort, and nothing else, I was able to keep Recluse and most of the Flier spawns completely occupied while my team killed all four towers.
The rule doesn't seem to be broken here. Unless you're fighting Carnies, Granite is the tauntbot of choice. Won't output as much damage as the other tanks, but it won't die, and sometimes that's just more important.
Ice has no Psy protection. Invuln has no Psy protection. Fire has the added protection of Healing Flames, but still nothing specifically for Psy. The only place a tank gets any Psy defense or resist is Minerals, and the only place a tank gets any +regen to help against things their shields don't block is Rooted. Stone's your best bet.
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Cue the rolling of stone/ tanks to resemble the want for /stone brutes in RSF. It makes me sad. 
My /dark brute would actually be liked in the STF if he were a hero, but alas I must plead and beg for a "pity" spot on RSF.
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Stood around the boat and watched the various chat channels as well this evening and watched 8 different groups stream out of the helicopter. 6 were unsuccessful due to giving up after a 30 min to 1 hour fight with Mako. Of the two that were successful, one said they used shivans and yellows, the other seemed to have no idea why they were successful, said it was a tough fight but he eventually fell.
I noticed several of the toons had tactics in their build.
So I'm thinking shivans, tons of yellows or stacked tacics will get the job done and break through that elude.
Still think it's broken if these are the only ways to beat Mako, but at least its more information.
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Didn't need shivans for Mako, vengeance and Geas of the kind ones ftw, didn't have focussed accuracy, but suspect that's good too.
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We did have much trouble with Mako. I think we had two tactics running, then RI and I laid down Liquefy from my sonic. The liquefy doesn't even have any defense debuff enhancement in it. We were having trouble with him till I did the liquefy.
Too many alts to list.
Two issues on tanks. Fire Brick, a fire/stone tank, did great up until the level 54 AVs at the end. With the likelihood of pulling 2 AVs, having 2 tanks would be great. Since the 4 AVs before Recluse seem to be the most troublesome, I would suspect a granite tank would be especially handy.
To my knowledge, of the 4, only GW is a serious psy contender and she'll hold you through any protections so it comes down to the damage the others do. Seems lots of smashing, lethal, energy and maybe toxic which is right up granite's alley. They'd need some support, but if you pull 2, you could have the granite delay one with minimal attention (occasional buff / heal) needed while the rest of the group focused on the other AV.
Scirocco seemed to throw around a fair amount of energy damage on top of his lethal and I think that energy damage can be pretty problematic. A sonic defender could certainly buff another tank set up pretty well and that may be a non-granite solution to the damage problem. A fire tank with sonic shields and maybe Tough would have pretty solid resists and a nice self heal.
Black Scorpion and Mako weren't the big problem for us (ok, Mako was tough but he eventually went down), it was getting tag teamed by GW and Scir that caused us grief.
What's with the cut-scene when going up against the multiple AVs? I got flashbacks of Freedom Force. Also, i couldn't tell if I triggered it or if the guys ahead of me did. We weren't all in the same zone. Not sure if some people got to see it, or if that's part of what slowed the slower systems down. Is that gonna trigger every time someone runs the TF, or just the first time for each player? First time per character?
I've often wished that cut scenes could play during the zoning, but also assume that would just slow down zoning even more. Anyone remember how, in the days of PacMan, that between levels you'd get a silly animation while you waited for the arcade game to get its act together for the next level? At the very least it'd be nice to see new zone pics every once in awhile. Something to break up the monotony.
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A fire tank with sonic shields and maybe Tough would have pretty solid resists and a nice self heal.
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A fire tanker with a sonic defender willing to keep close enough for the big bubble will be capped for lethal/smashing/fire(I know)/energy/neg energy. They won't need tough. Tough+ the distant shields will pass the cap.
We had an invuln tanker I kept buffed with my sonic shields and he had few problems.
Though if people catch on how well sonics boost damage against AVs, they are likely to be very popular in this TF. I mean just sonic primary on a defender will debuff resistance 60% on a single target. Nobody else comes even close. Add in sonic attack, and you will be capable of keeping up a 100% resistance debuff easily on that target.
Too many alts to list.
Granite is best, barracuda I tanked with minerals/weave rather than granite and she couldn't hit me. I died once on the whole SF, and that was after several minutes of fighting Aeon and all his clones alone.
Another tank is dead handy, what we did was to pull the patrons, we got all but scirocco, and I tanked Mako/Scorp while the rest of them killed GW. Then handed another over to the other tank and the rest of them.
Also I kept recluse busy while the rest of them dealt with the towers.
A bubbler is good to use the repelling bubble effect to keep the repairers away.
I'd recommend:
Stone Tank
Other non stone tank
Empath (controller or defender)
Bubbler (controller or defender)
Kin (controller or defender)
Scrapper or blasterx2
Another troller or defender
Mr Minotaur 50 stone/axe tank Freedom
It's true. This game is NOT rocket surgery. - BillZBubba
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Snipe pulling AVs has shown some success, as well as TPing the "sniper" back after the snipe to a safer location.
Sound about right to you all??
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Especially if invisible. I once pulled Mako by himself using only Taunt from a distance, but I was invisible at the time. The next time through I tried the same thing visibly, and got both Mako and Scorp.
I also saw someone mention that BS seemed extremely vulnerable to Sleep.
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Oh! One additional question if I may? about how long did you take to complete the TF? I believe I've seen up to 5hrs
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... felt like maybe 90 minutes? I'm not sure, but no more than that, maybe a little less. It was a pretty fast run. I don't have a very good estimate, sorry.
Please try MA arc ID 351455, "Shard Stories: Scavenger's Hunt." Originally created for the Dr. Aeon contest, it explores the wild potential of one of the City's most concept-rich but content-poor settings: the Shadow Shard.
For tanks, with the right Buffer/Debuffer Fire and Invul both are very good. Stone as always is good on its own, but the extra nudge wont hurt. The tanks left out in their cold are Ice. We're entirely defense on our own with a modest -Dam debuff. So, it kinda goes like this: swish swish swish swish squish. It takes a lot more buffs for an Ice tank to be able to 'Tank' the AVs without a sudden case of non-living.
Personally, and please remember I myself am an Ice tank, I would take in order of preference for 'Tanking', Stone > Inv or Fire > Ice.
=. .=
A sonic bubbler may help with that Tun.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
granites not need, sonic isnt needed,
Ran this sucessfully with my ice tank with no fighting pool and with a stoner who deliberately didnt use granite. Any tank can do this
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I'm trying to get a feel for what it takes to assemble a successful group, what ATs, what Powers (standard powers NOT temps) are preferable and certain Tactics/Strategies that have born fruit.
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Start a new thread, guides if you want to, this thread is too much all over the place to get an accurate feel for it. That said, I'll give you my take:
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Please feel free to add-to or edit anything I may have missed.
ATs:
(not by any means suggesting a "perfect team" only what seems to have worked fairly well to date)
Tank: (Stone preferable) with constant buffs, maybe even a dedicated healer/buffer
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Done well with a two tank set up (any build*provided they know their stuff*) or a single tank with dedicated *attention* (do not wish to enter the healer/buffer/debuffer debate).
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Controllers: 2-3, any type (Emp/Rad/Dark/FF preferable)
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Flame bait. Listing secondaries (of which dark ain't a troller secondary) as troller builds to look for is never prudent.
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Blasters: 1-2 any type
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And the hits just keep on coming. Again, flame bait. "Any old blaster will do . . " ought not sit well.
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Defenders: 1-2 any type (see Contr)
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Indeed.
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Scrappers: 1-2 any type
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ouch.
So wot yer saying here in your lil precursor to a guide is that we need a stone tank, some kins, some darks, some rads, an ff or two, and emps. Sprinkle with a blaster or a scrap or two for flavor.
Is that what you are suggesting?
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Prefered Powers:
Geas of the Kind Ones
Vengence
Fallout
Tactics
(Shivans)
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All have had some measure of success. I'm none to proud to admit that we used a *stacked veng* strategy this evening on Mako to make him die quick at the point of elude. No massive yellow popping, or stacked tactics or shivans. We sent a lamb to the slaughter, had 3 folks with veng cue it, another tp him back into the middle of them and BAM, dead Mako. Sad but true, broken is as broken does. My momma always told me . . .
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Tactics/Strategies:
Use the Temp Power on Aeon at beginning of fight, make sure the holder of power is aware they possess it
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After you have cleared the CoT and before you attack the vines is good time for a tender moment where everyone hugs and says "Good Job!!"
Then you can lay down the rules:stay away from teh southern part of the map (which is in front of the av) and kill any vine you see as quickly as possible. Again you can pause once the vine count is gone and hug, tell em that you love them. Tell them that whomever grabs the blinky behind the av will have to debuff the av in the next mish and has to have the timing down well, so if you don't know how to do it, pls dont grab it. *hugs*
*hugs* again just in case.
Provided the *hugs* didn't do the trick and someone grabbed the temp power that shouldn't ought've, then yah, yer advice works. Use the temp power just after the aggro of aeon is on the tank or pets. And be ready to use it again as soon as it is up and avoid aggro from the other crap.
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do NOT use "Avoid-type" AoE powers on AVs to prevent running
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Very much good advice, 'specially for Mako.
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@ Lord Recluse, find and destroy the "Arachnos Transport Transponder" to stop Flyer and subsequent mob spawns from the Flyer
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The flier can be a non-factor if the aggro of LR is pulled in the right place and towers taken down from red-clockwise.
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Ghost Widow: use ranged attacks to avoid her AoE heal
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avoid PA or other pets that tend toward melee
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Maco: No "Avoid" powers, Vengence, Fallout, Tactics, Geas
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Mako, btw. Yes avoid fear or avoid powers with him, he's a krak-hed. I believe he is broken presently and his elude with no rechrage means *normal* team tactics will not work to break through his 15% threshold. Stacking vengeance (bug to fight bug) or eating yellows, or stacking tactics, or spamming shivans or dmg toons with focussed acc or well slotted aim/build up will crack it until he is fixed. I ran enough debuff heavy teams that got tired after an hour of fighting Mako to be convinced that debuffs are not the key to beating him. I could be wrong.
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Snipe pulling AVs has shown some success, as well as TPing the "sniper" back after the snipe to a safer location.
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Or stealth+snipe and then tp to a reasonable distance. And wait. Depending on how far you tp, it might take a bit. But don't wait till the sniper dies. That is decidely not a *good pull*.
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Sound about right to you all??
Oh! One additional question if I may? about how long did you take to complete the TF? I believe I've seen up to 5hrs
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If it's taking more than 4 hours, you're prolly not gonna finish, taking breaks and waiting for someone to go buy new computer notwithstanding.
@Bonker Guide to Base Building for the Small SG
Present project: Solo Everything Project
Remaining: Lusca, Sewers, Eden, Kahn, States, HeroSpec2&3, Apex, Tin Mage, Moritmer Kal, Tesseract, Recluse, 'Cuda, Quarry, Stropharia, Thorn, Arachnos Flier, Deathsurge, Caleb, Seed of Hamidon (Villrespec2&3, Hami, CoP, Incarnates)
4 crazy trigger happy blasters
1 tanker
/rad troll
dark/ def
1 scrap
......
4 vengences
priceless fun
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@ Lord Recluse, find and destroy the "Arachnos Transport Transponder" to stop Flyer and subsequent mob spawns from the Flyer
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Where is this transport transponder, I ran this TF again today and couldn't find it.
Global Handle: @ Spacio
G-Force Knight GRAV/FF Troller ~ 50
Cosmic Knight. Peacebringer ~ 50
Tackyon Knight SPINES/REGAN ~ 50
SnailTortoiseHybrid STONE/AXE Tanker ~ 50
Morbid Maniac NECRO/DARK Mastermind ~ 47
TRIUMPH
Forgotten Legion
"Avoid" type powers might not be so much of an issue. There's a patch note specifically referring to AVs and GMs being "more courageous" when dealing with Avoid powers.
As for tankers, with the right support any set should be just fine. My Invul tanker is just fine fighting lots of psy using enemies even without much defender support as long as the team is smart about prioritizing targets. Versus AVs, as long as the defenders and controllers are doing their job buffing up the tanker and trashing the AV's offensive output, psy damage should be no concern.
Arc #41077 - The Men of State
Arc #48845 - Operation: Dirty Snowball
Stood around the boat and watched the various chat channels as well this evening and watched 8 different groups stream out of the helicopter. 6 were unsuccessful due to giving up after a 30 min to 1 hour fight with Mako. Of the two that were successful, one said they used shivans and yellows, the other seemed to have no idea why they were successful, said it was a tough fight but he eventually fell.
I noticed several of the toons had tactics in their build.
So I'm thinking shivans, tons of yellows or stacked tacics will get the job done and break through that elude.
Still think it's broken if these are the only ways to beat Mako, but at least its more information.
@Bonker Guide to Base Building for the Small SG
Present project: Solo Everything Project
Remaining: Lusca, Sewers, Eden, Kahn, States, HeroSpec2&3, Apex, Tin Mage, Moritmer Kal, Tesseract, Recluse, 'Cuda, Quarry, Stropharia, Thorn, Arachnos Flier, Deathsurge, Caleb, Seed of Hamidon (Villrespec2&3, Hami, CoP, Incarnates)