[ QUOTE ]
In recent updates, the duration of all mez, PvP and PvE, have been reduced. Few mobs put you out of action for more than 5-10 seconds. While this is a long time in a fight, it is not really long enough to make a reactive stance on de-mezzing possible.
In order to un-mez someone, that person has to realize he has been mezzed, report it in the team channel, the un-mezzer has to see it, finish whatever he is doing, select the target, hit the button, and the power needs to activate. Assuming 1 second for each step (Clear mind takes 4 seconds, but assume 1 for the case of the argument), that is a delay of eight seconds. Eight seconds when few mezzes last more than ten?
[/ QUOTE ]
I've found that whenever teaming with a kineticists as a squishie, It's just better to let the stun take its time than to call out for ID. You'll just distract the kineticist from more important stuff, like keeping those Transfusions coming... 
[ QUOTE ]
Add to this that the people who die from being mezzed are meleists, those whose mez resistances were reduced recently. Reactive mez protection is pointless for them, as even 0.1 second of mez will drop their toggles, getting them killed. As they absolutely need enhanced mez protection on larger teams when facing (among others) Malta, these powers have to be used ahead of time.
[/ QUOTE ]
I guess that he reduction in mezz resistance might partially have been caused by the devs' datamining showing that the PITA of the mezz protections are large enough that they are not used. Thus they want to create more demand for these powers by causing their absence to be a PITA for the meleeists. A PITA/PITA balance, so to speak.
The problem is that isnt really working, since the meleeists' problem is their toggles dropping, not the time held, and only preemptive use can hinder that.
It's kind of how hover is being left too slow for meleeists to reliably use in combat, so that there will be an use for speed buffs - ignoring how rare those speed buffs are in the game. 
Remember when States said he was most happy with Defenders and they were the most balanced? Seems like its been steady downhill ever since.
As a storm controller, I think defenders should have stronger storm powers. Period. And even if defender storm powers > controller powers, I would think that storm controllers would still be stronger because of being able to hold or immobilize mobs inside freezing rain/ stopping knockback on tornado so it can do more DoT/ stopping knockback so that ls doesnt knock targets out of its range / hold or immobilize the snow storm anchor in the middle of a mob. Thats a huge deal. Who cares if Defender Tornado does more DoT? Controllers get much more damage out of Tornado by being able to immobilize. And Tornado's disorient being stronger? Ha. I have two disorient SOs in my tornado and it seems hit or miss, regardless of lvl. And with an AoE disorient, AoE hold, AoE immobilize PLUS I could have another AoE disorient from thunderclap...the tornado disorient being stronger really doesnt make a difference.
All im trying to say is that before _Castle_ posted, I would have thought storm controllers were better then storm defenders. After the post, I would think the same and then some.
Now, truly, is there any reason you want a storm defender over a storm controller? Something is definately out of whack.
On a different note, I would be borderline insulted by the comments on ff. Half your powerset being highly situational? More damage in force bolt balances this power from the troller version? Lol, are you kidding me??????
I know its the devs job to be pc and say the company line (which from other devs has ALWAYS been sing the virtues of ff), but come on!
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
* Quality of Life: Inertial Reduction, when expiring in mid-air, will drop all players like rocks, causing falling damage. (MadScientist)
[/ QUOTE ]
A partial fix to this is coming in I7. Can't say much more than that.
[/ QUOTE ]
I was wondering what the UI improvement listed in the press release was going to be, and was hoping it would be some kind of indication that a buff is about to expire. This raises that hope considerably - I cannot imagine anything else that is a "partial fix" to that problem...
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* Bug: All disorient powers cause enemies with flight to move away at rapid speeds, even while under its effects. Individual powers with this problem are noted within their sets below. I6 has made this less common, but it still does occur.
[/ QUOTE ]
Should be fixed.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hurray!
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* Bug: When Transfusion is fired off on an enemy that is defeated before the power activates, there is no heal, though the animation fires. However, if Twilight Grasp goes off on a dying enemy, it heals the recipients. There are also reports of the same issue occuring if the enemy moves out of Line of Sight during Tranfusion's animation time. (Rigel_Kent adds: To be more technical, this seems to be a problem with all AoE effects generated around the single target of a power. Illusion Control->Blind's AoE mez effect also has this problem; if the Blind damage defeats the target, the AoE mez will not happen. AoE's generated around the user don't have this problem.)
* Bug: When Transference is fired off on an enemy that is defeated before the power activates, there is no endurance regained for those in the AOE, though the animation fires. (Dark Pyroblast)
* Bug: If Fulcrum Shift is fired off on an enemy that is defeated before the power activates, you get the single 50% caster buff, but NOT the 25% effect from the dying mob OR any mobs around him. (Quason)
[/ QUOTE ]
I'll put this on the bug list. I think it takes animation time. See above for problems with that.
[/ QUOTE ]
This is something that really needs to be fixed. Technical reasons aside, the issue is that if a power is used, endurance spent, and recharge timer started, the effect should be granted.
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[ QUOTE ]
* Bug: Hurricane, when used to push an enemy who is under the effects of a hold by another player, sometimes pulls or pushes the enemy in a different direction than intended. (Theory: Hurricane repels enemies Immobilized by another player as if that other player (caster of the Immob) were the origin of the Hurricane.)
[/ QUOTE ]
This is on my buglist, but I've not been able to reproduce it. In any case, it is almost certainly a code issue, which means until I get a reproducable case, it is problematic that it will be corrected.
[/ QUOTE ]
This happens each and every time, and is very easy to reproduce. Team with a controller, and position yourselves so that an enemy is between you. Have him hold or immobilize the enemy, then you move in with Hurricane from the opposite direction. The held/immobilized enemy will be repelled away from the controller, rather than away from the Storm user. This also happens with Telekinesis, and presumably any power with the "repel" effect (not to be confused with the Repel power).
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* Bug: Flash Arrow gives a perception debuff. However, when the power is recast from within enemy's normal perception range, the Defender will be spotted, regardless of whether the second Flash arrow hits or misses, and regardless of how much time is left on the first Flash Arrow. (Voiced by Concern, several others)
[/ QUOTE ]
I wasn't able to reproduce this. Is it still happening?
[/ QUOTE ]
Tested this morning (2/1/06) and this bug appears to not be happening any more.
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* Balance: Flash Arrow, a Defender primary power, is no more effective than Devices/Smoke Grenade, which is in a Blaster secondary set, and has a toHit roll.
[/ QUOTE ]
Smoke Grenade requires a To Hit check. Flash Arrow has a greater base range, can hit 60% more targets and has a greater To Hit debuff than Smoke Grenade.
[/ QUOTE ]
Um, Flash Arrow also requires a To Hit check. Unlike every single other Defender accuracy debuff (not counting Twilight Grasp and attacks with secondary -accuracy properties, of course).
Also, when you say it debuffs more than Smoke Grenade, are we talking by 1% or 2%? Flash Arrow is nowhere near the effectiveness of other Defender -accuracy powers, and really should be improved.
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* Balance: As a general design issue, too many Trick Arrow powers have been balanced directly against similar Control powers. They are intentionally weaker than their Control counterparts. This makes it appropriate for a Controller secondary, but it underperforms as a primary in its own right. (Rigel_Kent)
[/ QUOTE ]
Trick Arrow as a set needs a bit of work. There are a few issues with making the desired changes at this time, but at some point in the future, we will be revisiting this set.
[/ QUOTE ]
Castle, I and the community are very appreciative of the time you're investing, but I don't really know how to take this statement gracefully. There were concerns voiced regarding the set when it was still on the Training Room, and those concerns were never acknowledged. To this day. The last word on the set was almost six months ago when Positron said the dev team would be keeping an eye on the set and making changes if it continued to perform sub-par. Since then, the set has proven itself to be the joke of the Defender archetype, yet no developer feedback has been given until now, and all posts and private messages on the subject have been ignored. Please pass along that "some point in the future" isn't acceptable after six months of silence. (I hate to put you in the middle like that, but as noted, all player-generated messages have gotten zero response).
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* Balance: Archery seems underpowered in groups due to lack of enemy debuff.
* Balance: Archery seems underpowered in solo due to low base damage compared to other sets, largely due to animation times and reliance on lethal damage.
[/ QUOTE ]
Archery has long animations so that it looksas good as possible while trying to keep the set playable.
[/ QUOTE ]
The animation times are very, very frustrating in groups. Too often, I'll fire on a foe and it will be dead before the arrow lands (or leaves the bow in some cases). This results in a power wasted (endurance used and recharge timer started, with no actual effect) and a bit of frustration for the archer.
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* Balance: Snowstorm's recharge debuff is more effective for Controllers than Defenders. ( It appears the defender version is 80% as slowing as the controller version, seems they were reversed. Dark_Pyroblast)
[/ QUOTE ]
Controllers AT modifier for Slows is higher than Defenders. I'll talk to geko to make certain this is by design.
[/ QUOTE ]
But Snow Storm is NOTHING BUT a Slow!
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* Balance: ThunderClap's disorient lasts the same duration for Controllers as it does for Defenders, and may crit.
[/ QUOTE ]This should not be the case. The Disorient value is the same for both ATs and the Controller has a 1.25 modifier, while the Defender has a 1.00 modifier. Controllers Disorient should last a bit longer by default.
[/ QUOTE ]
But Thunder Clap is NOTHING BUT a Disorient!
Are you honestly telling the Stormies that THE FUNCTIONAL ENTIRETY of two of their primary powers is simply WORSE than the Controller secondary equivalent?
It would be one thing if it was simply a status COMPONENT that was affected - in that case, I can see a case for Controllers being more status-y than Defenders - but when the Slow or the Stun is the ENTIRE POWER, then you have a seriously out of whack situation.
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Charged Bolts is a bit over twice the Activation time of Dark Blast. Mental Blast is ~25% longer Activation Time than Charged Bolts. All do the same base damage. Mental Blast, however, does Psionic damage, which is among the hardest to defend against in the game.
[/ QUOTE ]
That's cold comfort when your attacks resemble a dripping tap! Yes, the Psy damage may be relatively hard to resist in the early game, but that just doesn't balance out against the sheer grinding frustration of WUB WUB WUB WUB WUB PLOOT. If it did, people would slot and use Mental Blast. They don't.
Frankly, by the time we've got off a couple of MB attacks, the opponent could easily have been downed by swifter means, so the relative lack of resistance plays very little part.
Compare Mental Blast to Psychic Dart in CoV - the latter being a USEFUL power both for pulling and attrition damage. It recharges in a blink and feels good to use.
When STATESMAN HIMSELF says that the animation times of Psy are driving him insane, as he in fact did, then it's time to revamp them!
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Mental Blast also has a 25% longer Max Range compared to the other two sets.
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That really doesn't make any difference in practice.
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While few enemies are especially vunlerable to Mental attacks, comparatively few have defense against it, either.
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But those that do REALLY do. It's like the developers were so anxious to prevent Psy from being a magic bullet that they overcompensated. Eventually it feels like you end up attacking a tin elephant with a cheese knife.
First, thank you so much for spending the time to investigate the Defender Issues.
My first issue with the reply is:
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Knockback is not a Debuff, and Controllers have the same modifier as Defenders for this.
Quote:
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* Balance: Force Bubble has the exact same effect for Controllers as Defenders.
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Knockback and Repel are not debuffs, and Controllers have the same modifier as Defenders for this.
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To me there could be much discussion as to what is and what is not a debuff, or what or what is not a control for that matter. To me kb and repel could be control, control where your foe is, but a level 32 'signature power' like Force Bubble (coff coff, hairball) should NOT be more effectively used by a controller, because it's NOT a hold, mez, or immobilize.
Saying that Defenders with the Forcefield set have more damage in Forcebolt and Repulsion Bomb and should enjoy their inferior control is akin to passing flatulence and telling the defender that passing gas has no smell. Yes, that's a perfect comparison, insult with injury.
A hold is a control, a 'phase' like detention field' is a control, mezzes, too, an immobilize is a control, and slow is... harder to define. By the in-game description it is designated as -speed, "-" as in minus, speed as in buff. At the same time, I could conceive of the argument that immobilize is just a 100% -speed debuff. Where does this leave siphon speed? It seems like a clear debuff. Along this line, the antonym of a slow would be: speed boost. NOBODY I have heard has said that speed boost is a control. Clearly, the defender powers such as snowstorm, siphon speed, lingering radiation should be defender debuffs in my mind. I would think certain powers have slow which do seem controllerish. Tarpatch has -speed, but not -recharge with a side of -damage resistance. On the controller side, I would compare it to a power such as quicksand although the side dish there is -defense. There is a feature to snowstorm which seems controllerish, the -fly portion. I have no opinion where caltrops should go, but I am glad Controllers don't get them since they do damage and therefore 'smell' to most defenders.
...
Thanks to all the posters with the demorecords of the hurricane bug. I just wonder how it was investigated in the first place. The situation invariably occurs with my Ice/radiation controller teammate.
Triumphant Defenders Forever
Psylenz FF/Psi, ArticQuark Storm/Rad, Symon BarSisyphus Bots/psn, Max VanSydow Thugs/Dk, Cyclone Symon Bots/stm, Blue Loki Ice/Cd, Widow 46526
HelinCarnate:OMG it is so terrible. I have the option to take 3 more powers but no additional slots. Boo F'ing hoo.
[ QUOTE ]
Thanks to all the posters with the demorecords of the hurricane bug. I just wonder how it was investigated in the first place. The situation invariably occurs with my Ice/radiation controller teammate.
[/ QUOTE ]
Occasionally, a description of how to reproduce a bug just isn't sufficient to communicate how to reproduce the bug. I had the same problem getting across how to reproduce the "AoEs automiss moving targets" bug when it first surfaced in issue 3, but a demorecord got the idea across and it was taken care of, at least until something with bases reintroduced it to a limited extent.
Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
First off, thanks very much for looking into all these issues, must have taken a lot of time and effort.
Sad to say though that I found some of your answers disheartening re. defender/controller balance. It seems that they can get our primaries at a small enough decrease in efficacy so as to be unnoticeable and if it also happens to be a control effect they get it better than we do.
One would think that the balancing factor to this would be that we do better damage, but overall, our damage is pretty insignificant in large teams. Certainly not enough to make us an attractive team pick over a controller.
Shouldn't controllers be renamed to defenders? They do defend a team better than we do overall. Not sure what defenders would be called though...
Semantic question: How is a slow a control and not a debuff? The mob can still do whatever its AI dictates, it just does it slower. It's not held, slept, confused, feared or disorientated, it's just doing things slooooowly. I'm sorry, but that's a debuff, not a control.
I would gladly trade in the range of Mental Blast for a faster animation. Heck, replace it with Probe for all I care. I don't often get use out of the extra range - I do on occasion, but it's loss would not be sorely missed - but I do find the power a beast to use because of the horrendous animation time.
Plus, even in the early game, there is a ubiquitously common villain group which is HIGHLY resist to Psi - the Vahzilok - and Psi resists proceed to become more and more common from there.
Added to the fact that those resists aren't "Oh curses, I need to attack one more time", they are "Oh @#$#%&, I need to go beg on Broadcast for someone to come kill the mission entirely filled with wall to wall scary zombies/robots for me because I think my main damage on that one I managed to single pull was done with Brawl.." it becomes a real beast.
My Kin/Psi skipped the 20-30 magic contacts entirely because of an inability to fight Banished Pantheon due to their obscene resists. Vahzilok were done with great pain. Council missions often reduce me to tears when I discover them teeming with robots. Now i'm fighting Nemesis and find those missions loaded with robots, and sometimes my SG takes me on level 50 missions with them and much of that stuff is resist to psi.. and when it isn't, usually it's not resist to much of anything, so the martial artists and guys with swords are chewing through it with their blazing attack chains anyways. I want to think i'm useful when Paragon Preotectors pop MOG, but alas, I can't hit them when they do that. I manage to be effective because of my later blasts, but Mental Blast I took off my bar long ago.
Dominators hate it too. They note that their DPS goes down when they use MB on account of it's horrific animation time for low payoff; advice there is to skip it.
A no attack "Group-Friendly" Defender is like a "Team Friendly" basketball player who won't dribble, run, or shoot, under any circumstances. "I'm a PASSER."
Also want to note that Trick Arrow needs attention a LOT sooner than "some time in the future". It's been 6 months, and it is referred to by such lovely titles as "The powerset created so that Ice/Mace tanks would have someone to feel utterly superior to".
A no attack "Group-Friendly" Defender is like a "Team Friendly" basketball player who won't dribble, run, or shoot, under any circumstances. "I'm a PASSER."
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Dominators hate it too. They note that their DPS goes down when they use MB on account of it's horrific animation time for low payoff; advice there is to skip it.
[/ QUOTE ]
Exactly. Psy Defs cannot skip it, but Doms can, and they do.
I got thinking about the problem and it boils down to our secondary, which is gimped because Blaster secondaries are gimped.
From what I can tell, *every* other powerset is actually at 100%, modified by that Arch Types speciality.
So all debuffing/buffing sets are actually 100%, with Defender get their 25% bonus for buffing/debuffing and *controllers* getting a 25% bonus for the controlling aspect irrespective of primary/secondary.
Melee attacks are 100%, with Scrappers and Blasters getting a 25% plus bonus damage. They hide that Brutes and Stalkers are at about this level with Fury and the Assassanition tricks.
"Armor" powers are also 100% for Tankers, Scrappers, Brutes and Stalkers, with Tankers getting a 25% bonus for "self-buffing" (which explains Rage, BTW. As it is a self-buff, Tanks are supposed to be better at this.)
Ranged attacks are *not* all at 100% base, modified by a classes bonus. I can sorta see where Corruptors are hard to see, but they probably are at 100% or so of damage. Defenders are defenitely *NOT* doing 100% damage so we don't step on poor blasters toes, because a lot of blaster secondaries are not as good in many eyes. Blasters are doing 100% +25% bonus damage. I am not conversant with Dominator's damage to speak of.
All in all, just tagging things with a +25% effectiveness does seem to work on powersets that don't overlap much.
Buff/Debuff sets overlap a lot though and Control sets are *not* allowed as secondaries.
Controllers given exclusivity though powerset design, while Defenders are the anti-exclusivity by design. Everyone has 100% of debuffing/buffing/*controls* of their sets and can actually be better (controllers) or as *good* as Defender using the powers controllerish side.
Well, I'm off to work to ruminate more.
Still here, even after all this time!
It isn't resisted in as many mobs. In every mob that does resist it though, it is at a 50% value. It's obscene. Really, it's just sick.
...
Actually, my /psy Defender is reduced to tears at facing obscene resists much more often than my /archery Defender is. It's more painful to face one mob with 80% resist to your damage type than to face a couple mobs with 15% resist.
...
Now, in CoV, I cant turn a corner from lvl 1 - 40 without my Mind/ Psi toon meeting something resistant or highly defended against Psi. To make matters worse when something IS resistant it is usually VERY resistant.
If they really did give multiple groups the level of resistance that you guys say, averaging around 50%, then yeah, that's some BS right there. So essentially heroes can't defend themselves against Psy damage and the one who can actually deliver psy damage can't do that well either? Major BS then.
Level 50 is a journey, not a destination.
▲Scrapper Issues List - Going Rogue Edition▲
As a Bubbler, what it boils down to me is, I only have *4 powers* between my entire primary and secondary that function any better for me than they do for any other AT in the game with access to them (and several other ATs have such access). In return, my entire secondary is inferior in every way to the Blaster equivalent (I am FF/NRG - and we do not get any KB bonus or such with energies secondary effect). And several powers in my primary (Detention, RB) actually function *better* for Controllers than they do for me.
So show me *any other AT in the game* that gets hit like that. I can certainly point to other Defender sets in similar situations (Trick Arrow, Storm Summoning). We Defenders are just "lucky".
So... the fact that Controllers are better than defenders at using numerous defender powers is by design. So the only point in playing a defender is to have dramatically substandard blasts instead of holds?
It's looking like it's going to be easier to list what powers aren't better in the hands of controllers, than what powers are.
Can Defenders have some differentiation from Controllers like, say, more than one primary set that's not shared?
"Experience is the mother of good judgement. Bad judgement is the father of experience."
I am going to say, Castle, that I think part of the balance design methodology has broken down here.
I'm going to cut to the chase and make a declaration. The logic behind it follows.
Any "control" power in a Defender primary should work as well for a Defender as it does for a Controller's secondary, because a Controller should have superior control powers in their primary.
"Cross functional" powers in a powerset have an opportunity cost. If I choose a non-controller powerset that gets a substantial number of "control" powers in my primary, then those powers should not be such that, in a shared powerset scenario, the powerset would be better as another AT's secondary.
Taking an easy example, Thunder Clap is a Storm Summoning power which Defenders get as a primary power and Defenders get as a secondary power. All it does is disorient foes. By AT role description, Controllers are better at disorients than all other ATs. However, blindly ignoring the distribution of a power as a primary/secondary power has been given to an AT as a primary power creates nonsensical balances.
My recomendation is that, for "cross AT" powers given in a primary powerset, the powers should function no worse than that power would function for the "correct" AT as a secondary power. In other words, Thunderclap should work as well for a Defender as it does for a Controller, because a Controller should have superior disorients in their primary.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
[ QUOTE ]
Adrenaline Boost: This is a power that can only ever be used on ONE teammate at a time. With ED in the game now, it can not even be made perma on one person. Will you look at the recharge of the power and speed it up some so that we can at least use our 9th tier power as it was originally intended.
[/ QUOTE ]
A buff that only provided one person +recovery while stunning the caster for 20 seconds that every empath skipped since it was a worse version of recovery aura?
Arc #345863 - When The Bough Breaks
"Curse you Perry the Plata...wait, is that Love Handel?" - Dr. Heinz Doofenshmirtz, Phineas and Ferb
[ QUOTE ]
No other Defender set provides the level of Defense as a Force Field Defender. The built in Status Protection is invaluable, especially with Scrapper and Tankers Status Protections reduced. Also, Defenders are more than Healers -- consider your 'Healing' the fact that your team is taking considerably less damage as a result of your protections. I do know that many of you will disagree with this, but short of rebuilding the powerset completely, it is not likely to change in the near future.
[/ QUOTE ]
However, when you compare FF to Sonic, they two sets just don't stack up. Sonic has far more useful powers when it comes to utility, when you compare them to how situational most FF powers are.
On the matter of Mental Blast, Castle, I'm sorry to see what appears to be you slipping into buying the pure paper analysis of powers. I've always had a ton of respect for the fact that you have usually spoken from working knowledge of the powers and ATs you talked to the players about. I recognize though that you can't possibly be tackling all these AT problem lists by playing all the powersets of all the ATs.
That said, I can tell you practical experience says that MB is a problem on the weak side. I will assert that extended range is not a pratical benefit except except in a few, rare cases. Moreover, I can attest to the "gimp" feel of the power due to its animation. I had no experience with it until I built a Mind/Psi Dominator in CoV. I have a respec banked, and I can tell you that one of my primary reasons for using it (besides finally getting a travel power - darn holiday packs) is to replace Mental Blast.
Why do I want to replace Mental Blast? Because it is the slowest damage dealing power I have, and holds in my primary deal more damage than it does with lower animation times[/i]. In other words, activating MB is a disruption to both my roles as a control character and a damage dealer. I removed it from my power tray some time ago.
Please think about that. I saw activating this power as such a poor use of my time that I removed it from my power tray until I can respec. I'm only one player, but I think it says something about the power.
Also, please tell whoever told you that Psi resistance is rare to take a flying leap.
Every robot in the (pre-30) game is around 40% Psi resistant. (Well, except Clockwork, who aren't really robots). So right there about 35-30% of the troops in any given Arachnos spawn are heavily resistant to it. Vahzilok zombies are heavily resistant to it. I seem to recall Fortunatas being reistant to it. My Dominator isn't very high level, but just the robot part ensures a steady supply of foes that it almost doesn't make sense for me to use any of my psionic attacks on.
While these Psi resistances may make thematic sense they give Psi characters startling offensive weakness against these foes - weakness shared by no other ATs because Psi only exists as a secondary powerset. Assault Blasters and Sword Scrappers meet many foes that have high Lethal damage defense and/or resistance, but they also do significantly more damage to begin with. Hitting someone who's primary means of damage is their secondary powerset with extreme resistances to those powers is a serious double-whammy.
Psi protection is among the most rare of defenses for the players, yet it is both fairly common among mobs (it's easy on any given night of play to meet some) and when they have it, it is very strong protection. This makes the set highly unattractive and frustrates those who have it.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
Oh and one more thing...
If it's okay for scrappers to have two primaries... if it's okay for controllers to have two primaries... if it's okay for kheldians to have two primaries and tankers to have two primaries... even blasters arguably have two primaries in the numerical sense (but with few effective synergies and almost no self defense)... why don't defenders get two primaries?
"Experience is the mother of good judgement. Bad judgement is the father of experience."
_Castle_ ... why would someone choose to play a FF defender outside of concept?
What other set requires someone with a particular power, taunt, in order to use their top tier power?
What other primary has such thin slotting options?
What other primary is built around having so many situational powers?
And just what are the situations where the devs find value in the final three powers in PvE? Solo? In teams?
I appreciate the time and effort you spent in going through the list, but it seems ... I dunno ... like the requests of bubblers have fallen on deaf ears. Changing repulsion bomb was interesting, but, frankly, for power that does little more than knockback, a 3 second animation and 30 second recharge is laughably bad. I actually 6-slotted this power for the disorient in I5. But now? The disorient component is so weak it isn't worth slotting. The damage component is insanely bad.
Do you guys really want to make bubblers feel better? Make repulsion bomb, for defenders, tanker-style knockback and add a debuff component to it. Add a similar debuff to force bolt. Keep repulsion field as the keep-away power, but retool as a small version of force bubble. Turn force bubble in slow / recharge debuff. You won't need new art. FF would still add nothing to a team's offense. And FF would get some versatility without being overpowering.
I just have to say THANK YOU. This is the most inspiring developer I have seen.
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I am going to say, Castle, that I think part of the balance design methodology has broken down here.
I'm going to cut to the chase and make a declaration. The logic behind it follows.
Any "control" power in a Defender primary should work as well for a Defender as it does for a Controller's secondary, because a Controller should have superior control powers in their primary.
"Cross functional" powers in a powerset have an opportunity cost. If I choose a non-controller powerset that gets a substantial number of "control" powers in my primary, then those powers should not be such that, in a shared powerset scenario, the powerset would be better as another AT's secondary.
Taking an easy example, Thunder Clap is a Storm Summoning power which Defenders get as a primary power and Defenders get as a secondary power. All it does is disorient foes. By AT role description, Controllers are better at disorients than all other ATs. However, blindly ignoring the distribution of a power as a primary/secondary power has been given to an AT as a primary power creates nonsensical balances.
My recomendation is that, for "cross AT" powers given in a primary powerset, the powers should function no worse than that power would function for the "correct" AT as a secondary power. In other words, Thunderclap should work as well for a Defender as it does for a Controller, because a Controller should have superior disorients in their primary.
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While controllers escaberate the situation by actually be *better* with Defender Primary powers, having so many powers in the Primary set that are controllerish that everyone is "good" at very much blurs the distinction between a Defender and a Corruptor/Master Mind.
Basically, because most powers (77.7% at least) do not get our "class" benefit, it's very easy for other ATs to use our powers nearly as effectively as we can.
Dark Miasma has three powers that would be pure debuffing/buffing. Darkest Night, Twighlights Grasp and Shadow Fall. Every other power has at least one component of controlling within it. Be it slows, fear, holds, phase, immobilize or what. Several of those powers *only* do that.
Basically, 66.6% of my powers are going to be as effective as a secondary, where as less than 33% of my secondaries are even possibly as effective (and those are the mezzing powers.) The actual damage is incredibly low.
Still here, even after all this time!
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Quote:
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PSI IS NOT A RARELY RESISTED DAMAGE TYPE. IT IS ONE OF THE MOST RESISTED DAMAGE TYPES IF NOT THE MOST RESISTED IN THE GAME
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i'm pretty sure there are some assault rifle blasters, trick arrow and archery defenders who might want to argue this point with you.
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That's the problem. In the PvE game psi began as the most unresisted power but as more groups were added and changed from Issue to Issue more resistance/defense to the damage type was added. Now, in CoV, I cant turn a corner from lvl 1 - 40 without my Mind/ Psi toon meeting something resistant or highly defended against Psi. To make matters worse when something IS resistant it is usually VERY resistant.
In PvP though very few powers offer resistance to psi.
This dichotomy is frustrating to those of us who only take part in the PvE portion of the game.