What is left to add after City of Villains?
By
13th_Stranger,
Posted on: 2005-01-10 13:24 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
MY 2 cents:
I say next Expansion should be...
CITY OF TIME
back story:
A chrono storm hits a New England City!
each zone is a different era, a pulp 20's zone, a Far Future city scape zone, A dino Zone, A zone with Pirates (ARRR!), and A WWII Zone. Issues could be limitless.
ATs could be Adventurers/Scientists exploring the Phenomenon. and as you go up in level you get different outfits (Access) to fit in with the zones.
I would add underwater, outerspace, low grav moons, alien planets, spaceships, historical ages...
Here's one sale!
Pulp for teh win! 
Sorry to burst your bubble Monkeybone, but the kind of game you are talking about does not exist yet and before you bring up Guild Wars please check out the restrictions of what players can actually affect and how long between updates. Minimum is 5 months, "Well guys we did all the quests and the story is over so now what do we do for the next 3 months before the next update comes out?" and even that game will still be using recycled quests.
The technology does not exist yet to make a game like what you were describing, only Neverwinter Nights comes close and it is not a true MMO since only a max of 64 people can play at once and that is if everyone has cable or DSL and each adventure the player DM comes up with takes months of plannig and putting together.
I think what you really want is a single player game tailored specifically to you. The closest CoH will be able to come is when CoV comes out and players can fight back and forth developing rivalries and throw in some RP'ing and thwart each others plans and so on
I fully realize that no other mmorpg does evolving player influenced content thus far, though the matrix game wants to. And i realize the collosal amount of work that it requires. and no i dont want a single player game taylored to me because i enjoy the dynamic of working with other people and i enjoy the social aspect of mmorpgs. However it depends on the extent to which the concept is applied. it could mean subtle things at first where the missions you do actually effect the villains on the street. Perhaps when you defeat a super boss in one area that villain group moves to a new part of town. which currently would reflect a constant shift in enemy locations, but as theyve made bosses tougher to reflect that they are supposed to the best of best(or worst of the worst) shouldnt they be a tad tougher to track down? maybe its too easy to find the archvillains. Maybe it should actually require some innovation from the player to discover some of the deeper content. It all sounds like an insurmountable task to balance it in just the right way to not exclude the casual gamer but still provide deeper content for the hardcore player, even to me i must admit i would not have a solid plan for its implementation, but its just a thought. i like games to bring out the best in people. i like to see a product that builds skills in the real player and keeps their minds working. i just enjoy good entertainment. and thats what theyve given me so far. and this is what i think would take it to the next level.
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Also keep in mind that when people ask for scrappers (or whatever archtype) duel wielding pistols ... Pulp is what they are really after.
Give me a Rocket Pack, a piece of chewing gum (to hold the Pack together) and a pistol any day of the week.
Ready to kick Ming the Merciless' butt,
Jolly Green Giant
Grey Gargoyle
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I'd love to see dual wielding pistols for scrappers. I'd also love to see us being able to customize our powers colors and particle effects, that way we could be that much more individual. Icing on the cake would be apartments for each of us so we could hang out in them using our aliases and vehicles. I'd love to give Knight Thorn a black motorcycle. The Matrix Online is pretty amazing in that you can walk into each and every room of each and every building or so I've read, if City of Heros were to adopt that one day it would be amazing.
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Wouldnt it be nice if at the higher levels, or even the lower levels if the devs want to put the painstaking work into it, the missions i did actually changed the story of the game? ...When you put the direction of the future in the hands of the players then you really do have almost infinite growth.
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Dear LORD, no! In the hands of the players, you mostly have infinite griefing. For every 3 players who want to build an epic storyline, you have 7 who think it would be cool if THEY were the person who made city hall explode. Players can safely have an impact on non-essential storyline points, but the overall framework should NEVER be impacted by them. This has been proven a number of times in player-influenced CCGs with storylines, and I imagine it would be far worse in the MMORPG world.
A dynamic world is possible however it requires a different approach than the traditional MMO. Wish, before it was cancelled, was quickly approaching that goal. The cost, however, is that the live content team needs to be as big as the development team. However, also, what tends to happen if the developers aren't careful is players start building reputations and ability in one adventure, get famous, become the obivous choice to do it big in the next, and so on and so on until you only have a few big names among much smaller fishs. Or on the other extreme, you have a city of world famous warriors (or many warriors spread across a big area). There needs to be some sort of actual risk and lose, as in the movies or real life, to make it happen. Why? Because if the world changes, so much the characters the player are playing. It's not fair or realistic if the world changes but the character populations exactly the same (barring skill advancement) as it was before hand. THe battles of middle-earth were enourmous and tragic, not neccesarily because of their scope or context, but because it was the small side of good against the limitless hoarde of evil; every death of the good guys was a bigger hit.
Mourning may be onto what Wish could not do, so maybe.
I am very much in favour of adding Pulp aspects to City of Heroes.
I will cast my vote of approval with my wallet, if need be.
The Slammer
How about...
City of Jurassic (Dinosaurs)
City of the West (Cowbay Days)
City of the 9 Planets ( Each of the 9 planets )
City of Middle Earth ( Earth's core )
City of the Wild ( Animals )
City of the Moon ( Earth's Moon )
City of Your Hero ( Customize everything about your characters, powers, animations, bases, vehicles, etc.. )
The next expansion will be City of Powerlevelers. Two new classes will be introduced that will increase the level cap to 100, but there will only be one zone.
When you go to your first contact, his mission will be:
"Greetings, hero: wait here"
Then he will zip off somewhere and you will start to get a steady stream of xp.
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
In one little corner of the universe, there's nothing more irritating than a misfile...
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Since I'm dying for a pulp-styled game to play, I've been thinking. Like many a poster has said, the comics have drawn an immense amount of inspiration from the pulps, and the two worlds are not dissimilar. In fact, mulling it over for a little while, I think a pulp-style COH could be effectively accomplished by just changing the way the world and the characters looked, with a little bit of mission-style alteration.
In the end, the stories are about heroes defeating evil, with the pulps exhibiting more of the whiz-bang! feeling than perhaps the comics were striving for. The essential drama and mechanics are the same, although pulps were generally based more on science-fiction or espionage aspects, rather than all-out super-human beings. In the pulps, if a man shot heat rays, it was probably going to be from some kind of device. (Probably an art deco device, at that.) But there were still heat rays, and still armies of robots, and switching COH from 'Fire Blast' and 'Clockwork' to 'Atomic Raygun' and 'Mad Scientist's Robotic Minions' wouldn't really be a stretch.
Reading old pulps, watching the serials, and listening to old time radio dramas is a hobby of mine, and every time I log into COH I can't help but think that the Shadow taking on the minions of the Voodoo Master is just a few steps to the side of White Volt blasting his way to Dr. Vahzilok. I think it would require new types of missions -- Doc Savage beat up a lot of bad guys, but there was plenty of detective work happening as well -- although by the time that a pulp version of COH got around to being feasible I figure that these missions would've been incorporated anyhow.
I really think that the major difference (aside from explanation of powers, etc.) is the feel of it. Think of a completely art deco Paragon City, bastion of hope and optimism, streamlined skyscrapers arching into the zeppelin-filled sky with the golden glow of the sun causing the 1930's cars to gleam. Newsboys on the corner hawking stories about the new 'Mystery Man' in town, right before the air-raid siren alerts your jetpack-wearing avenger to the giant robots marching through Atlas Park. All the while, something too hideous to describe is created in a dingy laboratory by foreign agents attempting to bully the US into WWII! The music swells! They must be stopped! And it's up to you, your jetpacks and rayguns, and your team of autogyro-flying cohorts to save the day!
Functionally, I don't see it as being all that different than the current COH. In terms of entertainment and overall experience, a whole new world of fun.
A guy can dream, can't he?
Not sure how this would work, but it might be kinda neat for our PC's, after they've maxxed level, to become the ones assigning TF's, with that PC gaining "Reputation" in some form as groups complete the given mission. Something along the lines of "As Hero-Z is known for his valiant efforts against the Outcasts, you and your allies must infiltrate Outcast base Y and meet with our mole", or some such. It's really an expansion on the existing SG's, but more interactive and rewarding for Team Mentors. I would also expect that there would be some form of loss (negative Rep, narrated loss of items, base materials..) for the Mentor that sends an inadequately prepared group to a mission...
And now that the juices are flowing, how about a Dangerous (tee-hee) Training Room in the SG bases, when those come around? Something that can use, oh, say, alien hardware-generated holograms, just as an example, to simulate a variety of environments and foes to practice against? I can see the benefits of being able to get a group together and practice a Reactor Room simulation before setting foot in Terra Volta!
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I would LOVE to do Pulp stuff...but would it sell? That's the issue.
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It would to me!
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I really think that the major difference (aside from explanation of powers, etc.) is the feel of it. Think of a completely art deco Paragon City
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I dunno about that other stuff but.....isn't that exactly what we have now? (To my annoyance. I wish there were more modern and post modern designs.)
Oh, you're right to an extent -- Steel Canyon is a good example of the deco skyscrapers -- but I think the game as it is lacks the retro-deco feeling and look. I guess I should've been more specific than 'deco.' What I meant to draw out was the deco-inspired retro-futurism of the 1930's, the fantastic extrapolation of the deco style, like the bel Geddes illustrations. (Or the Batman/Superman 1990's cartoons.) These were the completely impractical giant buildings, with bridges running between them, airships docking on top, etc.
Now, when I look at Steel Canyon, I think more of a 'realistic' 1980's streamlining of art deco, rather than the 'future of the past' as portrayed in some of the sci-fi pulps. Also, Steel Canyon (as far as I can tell) is really the only place that currently comes close to having that feeling, with the rest of the zones having a more run-down, industrial look.
I can understand not everyone looking for a pulp world to play in, which is why I'd hope for a separate expansion of some sort. Even if it costs me, it'd be worth it!
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Maybe A City Of Mayors Expansion! You Could Build A player Zone, Manage It, Keep Everyone Happy, Deploy Security Units To Dispatch Villains And Much More Features!
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City of Sims? Hmmm.... I'm not so usre about that.
"I am a Tank. I am your first choice, I am your last hope." -- Rune Bull
"Durability is the quintessential super-power. " -- Sailboat
There is one place that I don't think we have seen just yet, that deserves a good proper exploration by those brave and valiant dark and magical heroes, and the braver but less well informed science, natural, and mutant ones:
The Netherworld. Lots of Darkness powers content if I'm not mistaken issues forth from there. And where does the Envoy of Shadow come from?
...take the plunge. Express elevator to the Netherworld!
(yeah, I loved Feng Shui too.)
And the Chinatown thing would be pretty neat also!
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I would LOVE to do Pulp stuff...but would it sell? That's the issue.
Doc Savage. The Shadow. Agent 13. *shudders* Such great potential from the Pulp world.
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Great! Now you're talking, love Pulps. A Pulp AT or Origin would be great. More gadget type stuff would help fester this kind of character (since pulp heroes are non-super powered). Whips, revolvers, jet packs, vehicles of course, perma human and robotic Side kicks, disguises to fit in with minions at anytime, maybe a throw voice to distract a minion, added damage for attacking someone from behind, etc.
The Shadow was a little better written than Doc Savage, but Doc Savage had that formula that was injected into all the serials of the day than onto Star Wars and Indiana Jones. If you want to read something that reads like an Indiana Jones movie read Doc Savage everyone.
By the way organizing a Pulp SG was even harder than an all Cows SG go figure.
Don't mess with Texas!
--moo
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I would LOVE to do Pulp stuff...but would it sell? That's the issue.
Doc Savage. The Shadow. Agent 13. *shudders* Such great potential from the Pulp world.
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Pulp would be sweet, either through a trip to the 1920's or maybe some pulp inspired zones: a China Town filled with Tsoo, or a Flying Fortress manned by Sky Raiders. 
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... Best idea I've read all thread. Oh yes. Definitely. Striga is wonderful with a secret volcano hideout for the Council, but now everyone needs one. Think of is as a precursor/test to SG base raids in CoV.
What? No City of Contacts for a little custom mission and story arc action?
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I would LOVE to do Pulp stuff...but would it sell? That's the issue.
Doc Savage. The Shadow. Agent 13. *shudders* Such great potential from the Pulp world.
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Doc Savage is da man. I'd buy it.
Also keep in mind that when people ask for scrappers (or whatever archtype) duel wielding pistols ... Pulp is what they are really after.
Give me a Rocket Pack, a piece of chewing gum (to hold the Pack together) and a pistol any day of the week.
Ready to kick Ming the Merciless' butt,
Jolly Green Giant
Grey Gargoyle