FourSpeed

This is incorrect.

The Apocalypse is (for sake of this discussion) a simple enhancement, like
an SO.

Scenario 1
----------
If you drop an even level Dmg SO in the power you get a 33% Damage Boost.

If you drop two Dmg SO's into it, you get 66% boost. Three, ~95% (due
to ED trimming)

In this scenario, the power is 3 slotted and you have 3 Dmg SOs in there.

Scenario 2
----------

You drop an SO into the power for 33% boost.

You combine it with another SO to get a + enhancement and you get ~35% boost.

You combine it with another SO to get a ++ enhancement - the boost is
now ~37%

In this scenario, you are using only one slot. It has a ++ Damage SO in it.


Scenario 3
-----------

You drop an Apocalypse Damage IO in - you get 53% boost.
You cannot combine it with anything - it's a straight 53%. Done.
You cannot put another Apocalypse Damage IO in this build - it's unique.

You drop the Apocalypse Proc in. Your damage boost is still 53%, but,
you now have a 16% Regeneration bonus for your character, and every
time you use that power, there is a 33% chance that you will cause
Negative Energy damage to your target.

You add a Dmg SO into the power. Your damage boost, is now ~86%, and
you still have the Regen bonus, and the chance to do Negative Energy
damage each time you use this power.

Here, you are using 3 slots with two Apocalypse IO's and a Damage SO.

Each slot is independant of each other. For IO's (including purples) you
cannot combine them - that is *only* for TO/DO/SOs.

For Enhancements having like attribute boosts (ie. Damage), those are
added together, subjected to ED, to get the total boost for that power.

Slotting order doesn't matter, and neither do types - you can have IOs,
DOs, SOs in the same power and you'll get full benefit from each (subject to ED).

Hope that helps clarify things.


Regards,
4

I have a set of Apocalypse in my Stalker's Spirit Shark power (a ranged attack)
and, yes, I'm quite happy with it.

What that means is when I fire off my attack, there is a % Chance that
the additional Negative Damage will also occur.

As for the other bonuses, yes, they're just like regular sets in that regard.
Those bonuses (+Regen, for instance) always apply. In fact, they're better,
because unlike normal sets - the bonuses in purple sets apply even when
you exemplar down (to any level). Sets only exemplar down 3 levels.

Correct.
You can only have 1 each (of all of those IO's in your build - ie. a single
full set of them). Unlike normal sets where you could have, say 3 Bruising
Blow A/D IO's (1 in each of 3 different powers), for purples, each IO is
unique.

Check these out in Mid's - Putting the full set in an attack makes it pretty
good numbers-wise... I don't think you give up much. OTOH, you could
always frankenslot the pieces into multiple powers like you might with any
other set (that would keep you from getting the high slot bonuses, but
you'd get the regen bonus multiple times (up to 3X if you slotted them in
pairs in 3 three different powers if you had the other 3 IOs, for instance)

Well, they're definitely worth a pretty penny if you do sell them. As for
balance, no, the game's PvE enemies are balanced for SO's, so these are
for those folks who want to min-max they're power. In terms of boring,
that may be true for you, but another way to look at it is that you can
probably raise your difficulty slider above standard based on the improved
power of these (and other high-end IO's).

Mine, for instance, are on a PvP toon, so, the AI balance is a non-issue
for me. YMMV


Regards,
4

The short answer is: It depends.

Some things it depends on are:

A> What server you're on: Outside of Freedom, most other servers are
dead to PvP (particularly in Zones), and you can typically wander around
on any toon and not see a soul. In Freedom, Siren's and RV are usually
busy, Bloody Bay & WarBurg, much less so. The "regulars" in SC & RV are
usually L50, and most of them have solid (or better) builds and know how
to use them. Many of them I'd classify as "elite" builds (multi-billion inf).

A casual PvE toon there, is going to have its lunch money stolen early
and often...

B> What AT you're playing: Some AT's are intrinsically better than others
with less than optimal slotting. Stalkers, some Brutes & Scrappers can do
reasonably well with SO's or Common IO's. Others, like my BA/Ice Tanker
would struggle even with purples in it.

C> Built with PvP in mind: I'm not saying a "PvP Build" here - I'm saying
what, how, and when you pick your PvE powers can have a big effect on
how well it will fare in PvP... For instance, some folks may not take
Stealth on a squishy in PvE, or may hold off on certain toggles, travel
powers, or slots until later in a build. Depending on what PvP zones you
wander into, these choices can make a huge difference to your success.

Just having PvP in mind can help you choose better. If for instance, you
expect to use Shivans often - your powers & slotting <= L30 will matter
while you're in Bloody Bay trying to get them.

D> Learn the Mechanics: Powers behave *very* differently in PvE vs PvP.
For instance, Ice Patch (on my BA/IM Tank) is an awesome PvE power,
but completely worthless in PvP... Knowing what, and how well, various
powers work in PvP matters a lot, and that also ties in with Point C above.

E> Your Mindset: How you approach PvP matters a lot - a thick skin, and
acceptance that there's a learning curve requiring X number of deaths to
"get it" will go a long way to making the experience fun (or hateful) for you.


Certainly, I'd expect the dedicated PvP players to have L50 builds with
plenty of set bonuses built-in (whether it be through Frankenslotting,
PvPIOs and/or purples), and I'd futher expect them to own casual,
unprepared PvE'rs who wander through, pretty much all the time.

That said, "prepared" is the key - A knowledgeable player with a decently
thought out PvE build can do quite well in PvP for the most part. I've often
seen simple builds (in the hands of a good player) take down a high-end
build.

If you're interested, put your pride and dignity in a box for an afternoon,
throw caution to the wind and jump in for a bit. Actual experience is better
than theory (or a forum post) and will give you a good sense of how it all
works.

GL & HF!

Regards,
4

Well, I'm not sure how lucrative it would be.

That said, Stalkers are quite good at certain Tip Missions.

One possible drawback here is that getting Tips at all is, in itself a random
drop from mob kills, so if you only kill a couple guys, it may be harder to
get additional Tips quickly.

Along with Tips, there are lots of Ouros missions that are stealth friendly
as well which stalkers can run pretty quickly (though those won't help if
your sole goal is A-merits, but they can be nice for R-merits).

Also, one nice little perk with those, is the Day Job you get if you park in
Ouros. It gives a higher chance to get recipes for a short time.

In any case, your typical Stalker can run these pretty effectively, and I'd
add that most builds would be fine for it.


Regards,
4

And that, friends, is what we mean when we talk about player skill.

Nicely Done. Glad to see things working better for you - that's how you
improve as a player - more knowledge, better understanding, better tactics.

Learn, Adapt, Kick Butt...


Cheers,
4

I can't really give you a "short" answer on some of this stuff... I hope I can
shed a little light on the gist of what's going on.

First, a word about ED.

In the good ole days, folks used to drop a lot of SO's (say damage)
into a power (like an attack). Boosts of 150% or more weren't unusual.

This caused some balance issues between ATs, in PvP, sidekicking, and
more importantly, the future Invention System IOs (which were in design
and development).

Up til that time, it wasn't a huge deal, but with sets, it could get much
worse (from a balance perspective).

To solve that, they basically set a cap on how much you could enhance
a power (~100% for Type A powers like Acc, Dmg etc.), which amounts
to the standard "3 SO's of a type" for a power. ED seriously starts limiting
enhancement effectiveness as you approach or try to exceed that cap -
for instance, 3 SO's don't give 100%, it's closer to 95%, 4 SO's is only ~99%.

Back to Incarnate Enhancements.

An Incarnate enhancement works similarly to SO's with a few key differences.

* You can't get them until L50.

* Next, one Incarnate "IO", say Musclature (for damage), has the same
effect as if you could put a single Damage SO in *every* power that
would take one. So, it's just one "IO", but it affects ALL of your powers
that can cause damage.

* Finally, a percentage of that benefit does NOT get affected by ED...

So far, so good, and pretty darn cool to boot...

Quoting Adam Savage: "Now *there's* your problem...

The issue you're seeing on your toon is pretty simple (if unintuitive).

You're thinking that Musclature will boost your damage ... and it does ...
but,
Most probably, your attacks are already well slotted for damage (mine are
typically at 95%+). SO, your attacks are already being trimmed by ED,
most probably. That means the bulk of the Musclature buff is lost to ED,
and only the little bit that ignores ED is actually helping much - a pretty
small boost, all things considered (about a DO or so, for the Common Alpha).

You might notice it if you look carefully for it, but it's hardly earth-shattering.

But, how well are your attacks slotted for Endurance or Recharge? I'd bet
they have ~1 SO worth (or less), right? You slotted Acc & Dmg, and you
don't have extra slots for anything else in those powers if you're like most
people.

From an ED standpoint, you're well short of 100% in those categories,
right? Even in toggles, you'd typically only put 1 or two SO's in...

So, if you used the Incarnate "IO" Cardiac for endurance, you'd get the
full benefit from it since none of your powers that can benefit from
Endurance Reduction are anywhere near the 100% ED cap.

This is why a lot of folks typically go with Cardiac or Spirtual in their toons.

The Gist

Currently, the Alpha Incarnate slot is a real nice way to fill in *gaps* in
your toon's build rather than the core attributes (which you've probably
already maxed through normal slotting).

Basically, you maximize the benefit for attributes that aren't close to the
ED limiting caps.

Hope that helps to clarify things a little...


Regards,
4



EDIT: hehehe, you guys type too fast....

You (and your friends) are quite welcome.

I'm always pleased to hear that the guide helped someone. It makes writing
it worthwhile.

I'll echo the "Don't Feel Bad" part -- it isn't exploitive or harmful in the slightest.

The fact which people need to keep in mind is that we're dealing in
surplus here. Nobody can be deprived of a common recipe if they need
one (from the market tables), and these *could* have been vendored
by the supplier, or barring that, listed at vendor price, if inf was important
to the seller.

Since they weren't, it's reasonable to conclude that price wasn't the key
factor in the seller's mind when they were put on market. Most likely, it
was convenience.

Typically, the suppliers are probably high(er) level toons, who are already
slotted better than what those recipes will do for them (otherwise we'd
rightfully expect that they'd use them on their toon). They also typically
have enough inf that the price difference for their recipe isn't big enough
to concern them, given that they were listed for a bargain price.

Basically all we're doing is gathering those disparate recipes into nice, tidy
stacks, and transporting them to a vendor - for a decent profit (by casual
standards).

We're putting in effort that the seller was unwilling / uninterested in doing
themselves to maximize the price. Of course that's only a few K per recipe,
but, it adds up over time. Convenient for the seller. Profitable for us.

Win - Win.


Regards,
4


PS> I still use it myself on new/lowbie toons to get them past the initial
startup fund (I give 25M to all my newbies these days) and into the 100M
range where they can get nicely equipped with Frankenslotted sets.

PPS> With all the L50's running Incarnate content since I-19, this approach
works even better these days - those guys create a lot of surplus recipes.