Have to admit it . . . GW2 may replace COH for me
By
Aggelakis,
Posted on: 2012-09-11 01:46 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Quote:
I was more trying to put across that there were still quite a few Sci-FI games in development (or had been developed). Hell, i hadnt even hit the mech games, the generic FPS's with online servers and so on.|
Originally Posted by JayboH
To be fair, if you are talking about the original Planetside, it is vastly different from Tribes Ascend and Global Agenda. Actually Tribes Ascend and Global Agenda aren't anything alike and I think they were made by the same dev house. Planetside 2 is almost nothing like the original Planetside when it comes to gameplay.
|
It is hard for when someone says "i dont want fantasy, i want Sci-fi" I try to find out what it is that they want from it.
Is it a change of setting, with the same combat system and progression as City of Heroes? Is it change all of the above?
There are so many things that need to be taken into consideration to find the correct game.
To be honest, fantasy is fairly easy to slip into, because so much of it can be "generic" and transferable. And I am just referring to books here.
Side note: The combat setting for TERA puts me off it, i am not a *huge* FPS fan, and i am picky of the ones that i like. Borderlands i can cope with because it has a nice sense of humour behind it, and the targeting was floaty enough for *me* to like.
Quote:
I think it's just a bridge between High Fantasy and Steampunk, really. It may eventually sort itself out into a separate genre, but right now it's basically just Epic Fantasy with a couple tech doodads for flavor. |
Originally Posted by Oedipus_Tex
IMO Guild Wars, Rift, and WoW all more or less have similar worlds. There are some specifics that differ but you could yank any of the classes or races from one of those games and place it in the other game and it would work just as well, with fairly few modifications. The world aesthetics are full of sweeping vistas littered with "Renaissance fair" towns that co-exist alongside improbable robotics.
I don't know what label to put on it. I'm tempted to just say it's its own style--the "WoW-ian magitech genre." Magitech is certainly not new, but IMO the.. uh.. "style viewport" of those three games caters to a specific flavor of anacronism. WoW is a bit "zanier" in its approach but its basically the same thing. |
There is a sub-genre of High Fantasy called "Hard Fantasy" which has really only started taking shape over the past 40 years or so. I suspect it's derived of two primary things: rules-based fantasy games and the fact that science works. Dungeons & Dragons and the like only work if you have hard-and-fast rules that everyone can understand and follow. Everything around us exists because of science. The confluence of these things results in weird mash-ups like Star Wars (space fantasy) and the WoW-GW-WH40k types which have fantasy science. It's not really a new thing so much as a slight remix of existing elements. (Which, I would argue, is really the only way we get new sub-genres anyway.)
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
Quote:
I was just going through the MMO's out there... not all the ones in that list have died either... some are still in development.|
Originally Posted by CatMan
Ummm... EVE Online is very alive and well. Not certain how you are trying to define died.
|
It was a follow on phrasing that i screwed up on. But yes, in general most of the Sci-Fi orientated MMO's seem to not do as well as Fantasy ones, quite possibly because they are the "sci fi" version of a fantasy game, and something doesnt just transfer over between the two.
Quote:
The reason for this is, that while you care about the mechanics of the game first and foremost, others care about the setting of the game first and foremost. If you're sick and tired of steampunk fantasy, then you might dismiss a new steampunk fantasy game out of hand. And settings-wise, GW2 is fairly standard fantasy these days, even if the game itself plays quite differently from most fantasy MMOs out there.|
Originally Posted by Moderated_IRL
What I find astounding is the amount of butthurt in this thread. Several people have said GW2 is just another "generic fantasy MMO." Which is pretty funny because it's not.
|
To some people, it doesn't matter that it's a functionally sound game, as long as it's a setting they don't care about.
And that's okay.
Thought for the day:
"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment."
=][=
Quote:
Yes, a later addition that I argued against since its original inclusion in the game. The first background of CoH was much more open and vague, allowing players to determine the source of their abilities. Over the years it has become more and more constrained and follows the lead of games such as WoW and GW with their magical source for everything.|
Originally Posted by JayboH
|
Annoying.
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
Quote:
Seriously, you are wrong about that. WRONG. The Dragons are NOT the magical source of everything.
|
Originally Posted by Ironik
GW with their magical source for everything.
Annoying. |
Quote:
What is Planetside 2 like? It's FPS, I assume?|
Originally Posted by JayboH
To be fair, if you are talking about the original Planetside, it is vastly different from Tribes Ascend and Global Agenda. Actually Tribes Ascend and Global Agenda aren't anything alike and I think they were made by the same dev house. Planetside 2 is almost nothing like the original Planetside when it comes to gameplay.
|
My issue with Global Agenda wasn't actually with the game itself. It was actually a really solid shooter game. Functionally and graphically, extremely well made. My issue with it was that there was no story. Practically no game, except the same boring three missions shooting robots over and over again. I get that it was predominantly a PvP game, but so was GW1. And the Gobal Agenda tutorial hinted at some really interesting story elements that just never got picked up again.
Thought for the day:
"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment."
=][=
Quote:
They are as similar as LotR and Shannara are. Every bit of lore you can point to underscores that. LotR takes place in an imaginary world of long ago, while Shannara takes place in a world after some apocalypse destroyed one similar to ours. These are minor details.|
Originally Posted by Feycat
Again, Ironik, you've clearly not played the game or delved into it to any depth. I played WoW from vanilla for about three years. I go back every now and then. I beta'd GW2 and am currently playing it. They are not alike except in the most shallow ways where they also share common ancestry with every MMO, including COH.
|
Look, I'm not trying to kill your cat with a spoon, so there's no need to get upset that I'm pointing out the obvious similarities of these games. If you like them, then great. More power to you. Of course there are subtle differences between the two, just as there are between Middle Earth and Shannara, but you simply can not look at the two things side by side and claim that the developers of GW did not take the inspiration of their game directly from WoW. There are simply too many points where they line up. Of course they changed the small details -- they don't want to get sued. But there's no way you can successfully argue that the races and professions in GW are substantially different from those in WoW. That's like saying because Superman is an alien and Shazam is a kid who transforms they are substantially different. They aren't.
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
Quote:
That's what the wiki says. /shrug
|
Originally Posted by Feycat
Seriously, you are wrong about that. WRONG. The Dragons are NOT the magical source of everything.
|
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
Does GW2 not have an official forum?, just wondered why I'm seeing so many threads about it on the COH forum. Will take a shot in the dark here and say as good as the game is, the community sucks.
Too many 50's to list here's a few you may know.
Slazenger, Area51, Area53, Area54, Erruption, Mind Plague, Thresher, Sheath, Broadside, Debt
Quote:
Yes you can, and I did, and Rian did. The fact you didn't bother to read our arguements doesn't make them invalid. It just means you're arguing in bad faith.
|
Originally Posted by Ironik
Of course they changed the small details -- they don't want to get sued. But there's no way you can successfully argue that the races and professions in GW are substantially different from those in WoW. That's like saying because Superman is an alien and Shazam is a kid who transforms they are substantially different. They aren't.
|
Quote:
The Well also inspired all the technology in CoH.
|
Originally Posted by Ironik
Yes, a later addition that I argued against since its original inclusion in the game. The first background of CoH was much more open and vague, allowing players to determine the source of their abilities. Over the years it has become more and more constrained and follows the lead of games such as WoW and GW with their magical source for everything.
Annoying. |
My new Youtube Channel with CoH info
You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom
Quote:
My own first impressions.
|
Originally Posted by Slaunyeh
What is Planetside 2 like? It's FPS, I assume?
|
My new Youtube Channel with CoH info
You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom
Quote:
This I think hits the perfect keyword. To dumb it down and hopefully to clear it up: I'm sick of "renaissance fair" settings. |
Originally Posted by Oedipus_Tex
The world aesthetics are full of sweeping vistas littered with "Renaissance fair" towns that co-exist alongside improbable robotics.
|
I would love to play in a setting dominated with skyscrapers and modern buildings.
I would love to play in a setting reminiscent of Blade Runner (I’d kill for Deus Ex Online).
I would love to play in a purely Victorian setting full of steampunk (pure not added)
I would love to play in a setting full of space stations and interplanetary space travel.
I would love to play in a post-apocalyptic setting like the one we see in Fallout.
I don't want more castles, keeps, villages or tribal/shamanistic encampments. I may make a slight pass on the castle/keep thing for a pure 100% pirate/buccaneer themed game.
So far I am thinking to give The Secret World Online a try, also to Star Trek Online. May give Pirates of the Burning Sea a try since it’s free to play.
Quote:
Yes it does. The reason it is being brought up so much here is two-fold: it is the hottest most recently released MMO that also happens to be under our same publishing house: NCSoft. I don't know what the community is like on the forums, but in the game so far they are very helpful and nice - as there is no such thing as kill-stealing and everyone is auto-exemplared based on the area they happen to be standing in, if they are on a team or not.
|
Originally Posted by Slazenger
Does GW2 not have an official forum?, just wondered why I'm seeing so many threads about it on the COH forum. Will take a shot in the dark here and say as good as the game is, the community sucks.
|
My new Youtube Channel with CoH info
You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom
I am a fan of GW2 as well, and have enjoyed a lot about it thus far. I am happy for those who feel it can replace city of for them should it go, I can respect those who dislike it as a fantasy MMO. I cannot respect those who only dislike it by association with NCsoft. (Wouldn't you be hurt if all the players of games like Tabula Rasa or Auto Assault bashed CoH and told others not to buy it because it was also an NCsoft game?)
But for me: Guild Wars 2 cannot and will not replace City of. I love both games for wildly different reasons, I originally got into guild wars because I needed a high fantasy outlet for my imagination that City of couldn't quite satisfy.
But there are still things I can only do in City of Heroes. Only in this game can I play the Frankenstein creature (Adam Frankenstein elec/elec tank) as a standup guy, classy doctor, and a very very bad actor, and then have him fall in love and get married to an alien woman host to a warshade.
Only in City of Heroes will I be able to make up entirely new races or run my own interpretations of certain mythological concepts ("The Necronomicon is 'Bound in human flesh and written in human blood'? What if it's not a book but instead a person?!") or enjoy venting out my sci-fi concepts.
Sure, Asura seem like that SHOULD have been in Mass Effect but instead crash landed on Tyria and decided to completely ignore they're suppose to be in a FANTASY setting, but I still can't make a beam rifle, cyborg, evil, adam jensen.
And even with Champions Online's MASSIVE costume selection or whatever the hell DCUO, or Marvel's own upcoming MMO will offer, I know I won't be able to make this in any of them:
And so, I do what I can to hope City of survives this. I repost on my facebook, vote on net polls, and pray to every force of divinity in the multi-verse. Now if you'll excuse me, I have my sister-in-law tied down and ready to be sacrificed to Lolth.
Click here to find all the All Things Art Threads!
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
City of Heroes is a game about freedom of expression and variety of experiences far more so than it is about representing any one theme, topic or genre.
|
Yes we get it, it's a great game yes got it, but right now threads like this maybe better suited to GW2 boards as to not antagonise core CoH players on their own forums, things far more important than GW2 are of more interest.
Too many 50's to list here's a few you may know.
Slazenger, Area51, Area53, Area54, Erruption, Mind Plague, Thresher, Sheath, Broadside, Debt
Quote:
I can see it. I would quibble with regards to GW2 and technology, that's a huge thing for the charr and asurans, but it sounds about right for high fantasy and thus GW2. The game does enough things differently for my tastes - boomstick toting warriors, breakdancing and/or gunslinging thieves, engineers with a weapons loadout straight from the MannCo Catalog - but its not going to be for everyone.|
Originally Posted by Starsman
A world dominated by magical creatures (don't have to be the standard variety) in a medieval-type setting (castles/keeps/forests/stone cities) where technology is either absent or the exception and not the rule. A world where travel is (most commonly, not exclusively) via domesticated creature mount or magical means.
A world where you fight dragons, golems, gods and magical entities (the later can delve into horror genre in a contemporary setting with the right approach, like TSW does) or perhaps other fantasy inspired races. |
And that'll be it from me for this thread as it devolves into Stop Liking What I Don't Like and Stop Hating What I Do Like.
Blood Widow Ricki * Tide Shifter * T-34 * Opposite Reaction * Shaolin Midnight * ChernobylCheerleader
Quote:
If you don't want to participate in the thread, no one's forcing you to. We're allowed to discuss other games on this forum now, and are doing so.|
Originally Posted by Slazenger
Yes we get it, it's a great game yes got it, but right now threads like this maybe better suited to GW2 boards as to not antagonise core CoH players on their own forums, things far more important than GW2 are of more interest.
|
And ALL OF US who're in this thread right now are "core COH players" and most of us are also participating in the efforts to save the city, even if we also play other games.
Quote:
Why can't you use GW2 boards? why should I have to go elsewhere to avoid threads about it?
|
Originally Posted by Feycat
If you don't want to participate in the thread, no one's forcing you to. We're allowed to discuss other games on this forum now, and are doing so.
And ALL OF US who're in this thread right now are "core COH players" and most of us are also participating in the efforts to save the city, even if we also play other games. |
Too many 50's to list here's a few you may know.
Slazenger, Area51, Area53, Area54, Erruption, Mind Plague, Thresher, Sheath, Broadside, Debt
Quote:
Because we're COH players and this is OUR board too, and we're allowed to discuss other games here and choose to do so.
|
Originally Posted by Slazenger
Why can't you use GW2 boards? why should I have to go elsewhere to avoid threads about it?
|
Quote:
OK, one other last note. I still have Twilight:2000, Megatraveller, and Jovian Chronicles books from my college days. Meanwhile, D&D is on, what, its 5th iteration now? I read a lot about fantasy and high fantasy in particular being overplayed, but, well, the bottom line is going to compare TOR and TSW to GW2 and Pandaville and even League o' Legends. There's the odd duck like EVE and World o' Tanks, sure, but boy howdy does the high fantasy still sell like hotcakes.
|
Originally Posted by Starsman
This I think hits the perfect keyword. To dumb it down and hopefully to clear it up: I'm sick of "renaissance fair" settings.
|
Blood Widow Ricki * Tide Shifter * T-34 * Opposite Reaction * Shaolin Midnight * ChernobylCheerleader
**** ** can't be bothered getting irritated by GW2 **** anymore.
Too many 50's to list here's a few you may know.
Slazenger, Area51, Area53, Area54, Erruption, Mind Plague, Thresher, Sheath, Broadside, Debt
Quote:
If you mixed it with a little Sci-Fi, I'd be for it.|
Originally Posted by JayboH
Yes this is true, but I must admit I can understand the resentment. The genre certainly is more popular than others.
EDIT: you know what we need more of? Country-western themed titles - I never did buy Red Dead Redemption but I was excited at someone taking another go at the genre. I think there is an FPS that came out a little while ago that was too, although I forget the name. Would there be any interest in an MMO of that type? |
I'd buy a Borderlands MMO in a heartbeat.
My new Youtube Channel with CoH info
You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom