Do you think Battallion should be minimum level 54?

One of the issues I've seen in Dark Astoria is that the enemies can be level 50. When you have full Incarnate shifts this makes them grey in missions unless you turn up the difficulty slider. With the Battalion coming soon, do you think they should be a minimum level of 54 (50+4)?

This would allow Incarnates to slide them up to level 58 (And I assume more Incarnate shifts are coming) and I think it would really help with the lore of these guys are pretty deadly (They are the Coming Storm, the people that have destroyed nearly a universe of different races and absorbed their power). It would also force new people to have incarnate powers before battling them.

I remember when they were first announced that it had required IO's to fight the Battalion. This was back in like Issue 6 or 7 when the Invention system was in its infancy and Battalion had a few screenshots.

My hunch is Battalion will be level 54 with varying level shifts (+0 through +4,+5,+6,+7,+8 ...) to challenge us with any other level shifts we get in the future.

I should clarify, this would be in the normal missions, solo content like in DA.

Honestly I don't know. It depends a LOT on what the goal is with Battalion in terms of story and gameplay. Are they intended as a sequel to the Praetoria/DA storyline with higher risk/reward? Will they be simply another option for progressing through the Incarnate system with the idea that a level 50 can choose to progress using either option?

Assuming that the idea is that Battallion is a higher tier threat that is more challenging but offer rewards unavailable through DA/Preatoria Incarnate content then I would definitely advocate making the minimum difficulty higher (although probably 50+3 so that they are even con to an Incarnate with the basic level shifts). However if the content just offers exactly the same rewards as the current content then I would say why bother? The last thing we need is more content that nobody runs since it requires more effort for the same rewards (as happened with several of the Praetorian Trials).

Since the Battalion arc is after the Praetorian arc, I guess we can assume that players should be 50 (+3) at that point to fight that new and greater menace. Hopefully it will reset the bar like at the beginning of the Praetorian arc and Battalion should be at the minimum level 54(+3). Naturally, I'm assuming the next Incarnate powers will grant level shifts to fill the gap between the players and Battalion.

It's not a bad idea... if you play scrapers/brutes/tanks.

But what about the defenders/coruptors/blasters? Often people (even those that use IO's) don't soft-cap them. Hell even my softcaped dp/traps has problems on +4/x8 in DA.

Honestly I think the devs kind of jumped the gun on how many level shifted enemies they dumped our way. Cuz there's kind of a glass ceiling between how many level shifts we have/can get and how big a difference the enemies can be with us.

I was just thinking about that earlier though, if they do another incarnate zone that's intended to be 'bigger badder tougher" and all the enemies are 54+.

With the new mobs in Dark Astoria we've seen the developers ramp up the difficulty and powers in mobs without raising their levels. The debuffs provided by the Banished Pantheon and Talons of Vengeance make them a threat in numbers to most builds, even being +3 to them.

It wouldn't surprise me if we see more of the powerful strategies used by players moved towards use in mobs and coupled with a few level shifts here and there. With a name like the Battalion, I can see the forces being numerous. If they play them like the Talons then there won't be much need to increase the level shifts for most players.

For future proofing they should be a native 58 with inherent Incarnate nullifying auras.

Some of this depends, too, on how far-reaching and pervasive the threat of the Battalion is. If it is a single strike-fleet or force of some kind that plans to attack a single target or a handful of multiple strategic targets, then your original premise in the OP makes perfect sense.

However, as we have seen during limited circumstances, there are occasionally exceptions to the game world's space and security level equals time mechanic. This is most often the case when something so large and devastating happens as to make an impact on the entire city or world. Such large events pierce right through the normal space/time mechanic and are perceived by our characters as happening in every zone presently.

From what we've seen of the Shivan threat, and certainly from what the Arcosians saw of it, I feel reasonably suspicious that the Battalion will target, well, everything. If that turns out to be the case, then I think it would be cool if there were a variety of enemies to fight, of a variety of difficulty levels. We don't know what to expect when an alien species invades, after all. Perhaps, like the Tyranids of the Warhammer 40,000 universe, there will be enemies that only Incarnates could hope to face, accompanied by countless waves upon waves of smaller enemies that would be just as capable on their own of overwhelming the world if it weren't for all the other heroes up and down the security level spectrum.

I guess what I'm talking about is the difference between a war between superior forces and an actual world wide war. The Praetorian war has mostly been an example of the former, although story arcs like Roy Cooling's and the revamped introductory Portal Corps arc illustrate how even in that case, the other heroes out there still come into play for important tasks.

But in the latter case of a large-scale conflict, every able-bodied person's participation would count (which means mission and event devs would need to give non-incarnates stuff to accomplish within their level ranges). We haven't ever seen an example of an actual world wide war outside of the first Rikti war, which was basically over by the time the game officially launched. Signs of that war still exist all around us. Devastated zones, war walls, Vanguard, the assimilation of advanced Rikti technology into Primal Earth's everyday life. Game events that were over within a few days (and did not impact mission arc storylines at all) don't count. We've certainly had some epic battles over the years, but those weren't wars.

Paragon Studios may not have the resources to produce a conflict on that scale, or maybe they do. That's none of my business. So, without speculating on details I have no access to, I'm really just indulging out loud in a bit of daydreaming. I wouldn't mind seeing a conflict of epic scale. It's been ten years in real time, after all, and that's a long time for a comic book universe not to have one.

No, just flat out no. The Battalion and all I-trials hereafter should have some entry level trials, for new Incarnates and fresh 50's, and then increasing difficulties that require more level shifts. Now I'm not against the Battalion getting even higher levels than we've seen, but these should not be set up in a way to force grinding the Praetorian Trials or DA just to get to the new content.

i expect them to con like the current invasions, as a set +X to your own level, whatever that is.

i expect them to attack every map at the same time, for an extended time, in addition to whatever story arcs and Trials to face their leaders and learn the story :P

i expect them to be archvillains and giant monsters [maybe not size, or maybe that too] at minion level.

i expect everyone to remember that debt exists, and then tell stories of how it used to be six or seven years ago.

i expect them to look AMAZING and have super awesome powers/attacks, and yes perhaps some incarnate suppression abilities.

i expect some sort of mindf*ck once we finally meet them.

i expect them to seem like there is no chance of winning or beating them but then somehow some tiny loophole exists or some tiny pophetic savior arrives.

i expect something cool and "lvl54+" wont even begin to describe it.




but maybe i aim to high?

I'm thinking....

-GM code (your level shifts don't matter - they con purple no matter what)
-Exponential threats (they buff each other; one might be a pushover, but 10 will be extremely difficult to overpower)
-Powerful debuffs
-Tactics required (eg, stay together, separate, stay away from the red deadly stuff, etc) for effective survival

I can see them being base level 52, but not 54.

At 52, they're still stronger than "normal", but a level 50 won't be entirely helpless against them. This gives you a reason to want to gain a level shift or two before you fight them, but it doesn't lock you out if you haven't done so.

There's also a possible limit to how far the Devs can push this. If pushing it two steps will do, why push it four and get to the limits that much faster?

This will probably be a really unpopular opinion, -but-

OMGs! This is the most horrible threat humanity has ever, ever faced! It will affect every man, woman, and child!!

Oh, sorry level 12 character. You're obviously not good enough to help out. Go PL until you're 50+. What's that? You're free to play/premium? Well, sorry, only VIPs can break the 50 mark. Both of you go sit at the kiddie table while this massive and world shattering event happens. Here, hold my cape so you can pretend to have something you can do that makes a difference.

Don't get me wrong, I love my incarnate. But shouldn't people less than Incarnates get to help save the world from the biggest threat humanity has ever faced? Because a level regular level 50 would be smeared across the pavement with one hit.